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#409347 04/27/15 01:18 AM
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I'm a bit of a "prepper". I am developing my weekend property to be a bit of a safe haven in the event that I should ever need to support myself for any length of time. I have recently had a 1/2 acre pond over 14 feet deep put onto my land.

So for my "prepper pond" i am looking to stock some fish that require no outside input except what can be produced on my own land (although I can't image what that might be). And of course do not require restocking.

I am not looking for trophy fish or even fish that taste amazing. I just need some fish that will survive on their own without my help. I don't want a pond full of dead fish when I need them. I am, however, willing to fish it as much or as little as needed to manage the population if necessary.

I can't eat catfish but was told it will do very well in the pond on its own so if that's true, I'd like to stock it for other purposes. But for extra food, what would be a a good fish or combination of fish?

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I'm probably not the best person to answer that since I am from Indiana, but Green Sunfish can live through about anything and need zero attention except removal as fast as you can take them out.

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It seldom works out very well. To be any good, an environment has to be managed. It's about like turning some cows loose on the land. Somehow, a bull is going to get in. And before long, the cows will have pretty much overeaten the forage and face starvation or will break the fence and leave. Ponds aren't a lot different than that.

When the fish reproduce they have to have a predator and the predator will also reproduce. Sooner or later, it will become over stocked, and quite probably, an oxygen crash will occur.

Your question isn't all that unusual. Lots of people want maintenance free ponds. They just don't seem to work out as expected.

That said, I would try green sunfish or hybrid bluegills.


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It is relatively easy to have fish survive on there own in a pond. It all depends on what you want. We pretty much leave our BG, RES, LMB pond alone and it provides a lot of BG for the neighbor, and a lot of fun for kids that want to catch fish. We have a "natural edge" on the pond that was started with planting the emergent plants that we wanted, and removing willows and cattails. We also have domestic water lilies. One can manage a pond for a desired outcome, or one can go with the flow. It is important to add fish of particular species in a particular order if you want compatible species. Otherwise, one species may result in another going extinct in your pond. I will leave it to Texans and other experts to give local advice. The most important thing is to enjoy your pond.

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I'm with RAH on this one.... BG,RES,LMB.

What Dave said is true in regards with balance, but you said you are willing to fish it for maintenance. You can monitor which ones to take out so you can keep it in balance.

HBG you should restock periodically. GSF will overpopulate and get stunted so for food they are not wise.

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I think the size of the pond plays a big role also, in determining how well or IF a hands off strategy works. It surely must if the pond relies upon angling pressure as a management tool. Too small and the pond can get out of kilter easily and quickly, and too large means the angler's efforts may not have any effect.

Maybe there's a Goldilocks' zone regarding a pond size? A half acre isn't that large, how much food do you anticipate being available in there?

A self-sustaining, perfectly balanced population in a small pond can be a tough row to hoe.


"Forget pounds and ounces, I'm figuring displacement!"

If we accept that: MBG(+)FGSF(=)HBG(F1)
And we surmise that: BG(>)HBG(F1) while GSF(<)HBG(F1)
Would it hold true that: HBG(F1)(+)AM500(x)q.d.(=)1.5lbGRWT?
PB answer: It depends.
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Originally Posted By: fish n chips
I'm with RAH on this one.... BG,RES,LMB.


Yep, Bluegill, Redears, and Largemouth is what I would do, I would probably stock with the intention of going LMB heavy as well. This would would leave good numbers of catchable 8" to 15" fish that could easily be harvested in a pinch.



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I too agree with BG, RES, and LMB. But some harvesting should be done annually. Definitely do not put catfish in if you are not going to be able to maintain the pond. They will probably not reproduce, but they will become monsters that become the top predators. And when they get big, they are darn hard to catch.

At some point, if you begin to see weeds appearing, it may be worthwhile putting in a couple of grass carp.


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I would still like to see the math. How many lbs of fish, how many times per week, over what time period is the desired goal?


"Forget pounds and ounces, I'm figuring displacement!"

If we accept that: MBG(+)FGSF(=)HBG(F1)
And we surmise that: BG(>)HBG(F1) while GSF(<)HBG(F1)
Would it hold true that: HBG(F1)(+)AM500(x)q.d.(=)1.5lbGRWT?
PB answer: It depends.
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I'm pretty new to managing ponds so my reply will not be so much as advice but more ideas that others with more experience can expand on.

If it were me and I had to be the one to eat the fish, BG and LMB with a few RES for grub control would be my choice. CC produce well in small ponds but from a sustainable preppers standpoint the issues already mentioned are valid. Since the assumption is "future emergency food" and not "current regular consumption food" I would also leave the CC out. BH would be a self reproducing catfish and are easy to catch, and might be a better choice for catfish from a preppers standpoint, but I also would not use them.

Although I am fairly new to managing ponds, as a farmer I have been around small farm ponds since I was a kid and have witnessed people fishing them for many years. The standard fare for farm ponds in this area are LMB and GSF. Not the most desirable fish from most anglers standpoint, but they survive with absolutely no management whatsoever and just about any pond you can find around here will have those two fish in them even if the pond has not seen human intervention for years. A fair chance there will also be BH.

One other fish that might be worth consideration strictly from a survival standpoint might be common carp. Everybody will immediately turn up their nose to that idea, but carp were as I understand it originally established in this country from Asia as a potential commercial food fish. Carp, although not an anglers choice or most peoples food preference fish, are a good source of protein and if pressure cooked are very much like canned tuna as far as eating them. My wife has prepared them that way back when we used to spear fish carp in local lakes as part of a scuba/skin diving spearfishing competition event. I think they are very much used as food in a lot of places other than the USA. They are definitely a source of protein that are easy to raise. What I am unsure of is how they might interact with other fish in the pond from a long term sustainability standpoint. The experts would need to weigh in on that issue. But carp can utilize sources of low protein food (like field corn, table scraps, etc) and turn it into protein better than game fish like BG and LMB. So carp might be a consideration from a preppers standpoint.

Something also worthy of consideration is how you are going to harvest these fish should you need to. The obvious first thought is hook and line, but in reality from a preppers standpoint and survival, something like fish traps or a seine may more fit into what a person might actually do if a person was dependent on these fish for food in a self sustaining survival situation. Then angling ease of catching the fish might not be much of an issue. The pond design or your proposed method of catching the fish might be more important. I have heard an old hand crank generator out of an antique telephone with two wires in the water will work, but that is just what the big boys tell me.......... no personal experience that I will admit to. I will say such a device will get a person kicked off the school bus when implemented in having a bunch of kids holding hands while cranking it.......... and one of the little sissies cries......... don't ask me how I know. grin

Last edited by snrub; 04/27/15 10:02 AM.

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I assisted a friend of my father's establish a few ponds on his property for "prepper" type purposes. I too agree with the LMB, BG, RES recommendations. Most original stocking numbers and species recommendations were for food and not fishing purposes.

The classic 500 BG to 100 LMB per acre numbers was from the 30's and the Great Depression when people were looking for food. It's a tried and true recommendation. Adding the RES to this is additional insurance.

For your purposes I'd stock 450 BG and 50 RES this spring. This fall I'd stock 50 LMB. Harvest mostly BG allowing the LMB to remain plentiful in the 10" to 12" range. This will lead to numerous food size BG and RES in the 6-9" range and numerous LMB in the 8" to 12" range for harvest for food.

My dad's friend also has a pond he raises common carp in. They actually produce the most pounds per acre of fish protein. He has multiple ponds to work with, if you add a second pond, I'd look at common carp as an option. The sheer pounds per acre that can be produced by common carp is nearly unbeatable.

Look at having a large seine kept on site for fish harvest. Fishing by hook and line is too inefficient and time consuming in emergency prepping situations. I'd also consider some gill nets which are often illegal but highly effective if SHTF.

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Your state of Texas allows Tilapia, and they shouldn't die off during your Winter months. You may consider Tilapia as your primary pond fish.

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Maybe give some thought to food prep and storage of these fish. A gill net will certainly do the trick, but may not be feasible if the goal is to harvest small amounts regularly.

If it were me, and it's not, I might consider a large harvest, and plan to store the finished/canned fish rather than try and keep them swimming long term. I don't know your goals, nor do I have an inkling of just what scenario you are preparing for. If it's doomsday, survival-at-all-costs, society is circling the drain, trumpets are sounding kind of thing, you're not going to want those fish swimming in a pond. You're going to need them smoked and dried, or sitting in a mason jar somewhere safe and protected.

You don't want to spend every waking moment watching your pond for leather-clad Mad Max wannabees, out looking for something to eat. Nor would I want to eat bluegills seasoned by a little fallout. grin

Course', if the scenario you have in mind is just for a few weeks duration, then that's different.


"Forget pounds and ounces, I'm figuring displacement!"

If we accept that: MBG(+)FGSF(=)HBG(F1)
And we surmise that: BG(>)HBG(F1) while GSF(<)HBG(F1)
Would it hold true that: HBG(F1)(+)AM500(x)q.d.(=)1.5lbGRWT?
PB answer: It depends.
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As mentioned, Tilapia is another fish to consider. However, I don't think they will make it thru a Texas winter and the reason they don't ( I think ) is because you are only allowed to stock a certain species of them that aren't as cold tolerant. Now you could keep some breeders over winter, and raise your own, but its a fair amount of work. I have been trying just this, and wouldn't recommend it for just anyone. I wonder how Tilapia compares to Carp to CJB ideas of the most bang per acre? The tilapia would go nicely with Spark's idea of a mass harvest once a year, in the fall. Something I am considering myself this fall if things work out. With the tilapia tho, you might need to feed them if you go with them densely stocked, which sounds like you rather not do.

I have a bit of a self-sustaining mind set too. Not because of the things Spark eludes to (He's afraid Yolk is after him, can't say I blame him smile ). My pond is stocked much the same way as CJB is recommending. The one difference is I stocked smaller numbers, but began with larger fish. So far all is going good. You still can adjust it and try things like tilapia, trout, and a few other types with out getting to bad. I have messed with these for fun, but has let me get ample table fare till the other species really get going.

With 1/2 acre, you could also consider pumping it down/out to make a harvest easier.

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There seems to be a majority consensus here: Largemouth Bass, Bluegill and Redears

I'm really excited to hear LMB here and I know my dad will be happy too. I had ruled them out initially because I've read here that they shouldn't be put in ponds smaller than 1 acre. But you guys all agree that my 1/2 acre, 14 ft deep pond can support LMB?

Tilapia are my favorite, but all the locals tell me they die out in the winter which is no good for me.

Carp was actually very high on my list initially because I've heard that are survivors! Is it not possible to throw carp in as a 4th fish or perhaps to replace the Redears?

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It's not so much the general idea of support that will be the issue, it's the NUMBER of fish it will support.

That's why you need an idea of the pounds of fish you intend to harvest, the frequency of the harvest, and the duration of the harvest. Cannot escape the math.


"Forget pounds and ounces, I'm figuring displacement!"

If we accept that: MBG(+)FGSF(=)HBG(F1)
And we surmise that: BG(>)HBG(F1) while GSF(<)HBG(F1)
Would it hold true that: HBG(F1)(+)AM500(x)q.d.(=)1.5lbGRWT?
PB answer: It depends.
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Originally Posted By: sprkplug
It's not so much the general idea of support that will be the issue, it's the NUMBER of fish it will support.

That's why you need an idea of the pounds of fish you intend to harvest, the frequency of the harvest, and the duration of the harvest. Cannot escape the math.


My dad said he will have no problem fishing out as many fish as needed. Knowing him, I have no trouble believing him.

As for frequency, I would guess at least 2 weekends per month. So if the only management that is required is to pull fish out, I think we got that taken care of.

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For the prepper view, I think this is all good advice. carp are a good choice but less fun. Should be a good fish to study on. If you guys are willing to manage the lake intensely maybe introduce the comm on carp after large predators are established . Is the black carp legal in your state?


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Originally Posted By: fishm_n
For the prepper view, I think this is all good advice. carp are a good choice but less fun. Should be a good fish to study on. If you guys are willing to manage the lake intensely maybe introduce the comm on carp after large predators are established . Is the black carp legal in your state?


Actually I hadn't even considered that a fish may be illegal! So I checked and actually only grass carp are legal.

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Common carp are not illegal in Texas. They are found in nearly every body of water in the state...

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Originally Posted By: The Griff
Originally Posted By: sprkplug
It's not so much the general idea of support that will be the issue, it's the NUMBER of fish it will support.

That's why you need an idea of the pounds of fish you intend to harvest, the frequency of the harvest, and the duration of the harvest. Cannot escape the math.


My dad said he will have no problem fishing out as many fish as needed. Knowing him, I have no trouble believing him.

As for frequency, I would guess at least 2 weekends per month. So if the only management that is required is to pull fish out, I think we got that taken care of.


Gotcha. My concern was not that the pond wouldn't be fished enough, but rather it's small size would limit its potential as a viable, long-term food source. I have apparently greatly misunderstood the prepper reference. I thought you were counting on this pond to supply a major portion of your food over an extended period.


"Forget pounds and ounces, I'm figuring displacement!"

If we accept that: MBG(+)FGSF(=)HBG(F1)
And we surmise that: BG(>)HBG(F1) while GSF(<)HBG(F1)
Would it hold true that: HBG(F1)(+)AM500(x)q.d.(=)1.5lbGRWT?
PB answer: It depends.
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Originally Posted By: sprkplug

Gotcha. My concern was not that the pond wouldn't be fished enough, but rather it's small size would limit its potential as a viable, long-term food source. I have apparently greatly misunderstood the prepper reference. I thought you were counting on this pond to supply a major portion of your food over an extended period.


I think you probably understood correctly because that is my goal. Except I view it more as a supplemental food source because there will be many other sources. But most importantly, my goal is sustainability over the long-term. I'd rather have a pond that provides a small portion of food over the long-term than a pond that provides a large portion of food temporarily. With that in mind, are you thinking that might not be a viable goal with a 1/2 acre pond?

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Originally Posted By: The Griff
[quote=sprkplug]
Gotcha. My concern was not that the pond wouldn't be fished enough, but rather it's small size would limit its potential as a viable, long-term food source. I have apparently greatly misunderstood the prepper reference. I thought you were counting on this pond to supply a major portion of your food over an extended period.


As for math, I think I am more of the thinking that I will take whatever the pond provides so I don't have a set goal as to how many pounds I want or need. I certainly don't want to overfish it and compromise the system.

I am, however, curious how many pounds the pond can provide. Can you give me an idea, using the math, about how much I can realistically expect from a 1/2 acre pond with No aeration and no feeding?

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I think a lot depends on your water. Different areas of the country have varying levels of natural fertility, which impacts how much biomass a BOW can support. If a naturally fertile pond in the Midwest can support 400 lbs of fish per acre, than a less fertile one elsewhere might only be capable of half that. So we do the math:

Let's say you're at the upper range on the scale, at 400 lbs per acre. 1/2 acre would then be 200 lbs of fish. Of that 200 lbs, you've got skeletons, entrails, and other non-consumable bits and pieces. Chop it in half again. That leaves 100 lbs of "meat". If your pond isn't that fertile, it drops considerably.

That's why so many add aeration, fertilization, and supplemental feeding. To boost those numbers. But, once you start artificial enhancements, then your pond (fish) may depend upon them for survival. Not good in a situation like what you describe.

I think in your case, I would look at a pond like I would a garden plot. Harvest comes due, you process it and store it. Then you plant again in the spring. A 14 ft deep pond will likely be a ***** to try and seine, but you get the idea. In the beginning, I would use my pond as a production facility, and restock as necessary until I have sufficient storage of prepared and processed food. Then stock with an eye towards self-sustaining productivity. Just an idea.


"Forget pounds and ounces, I'm figuring displacement!"

If we accept that: MBG(+)FGSF(=)HBG(F1)
And we surmise that: BG(>)HBG(F1) while GSF(<)HBG(F1)
Would it hold true that: HBG(F1)(+)AM500(x)q.d.(=)1.5lbGRWT?
PB answer: It depends.
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This might be a usefull link for you to get a generalized idea of food from a pond.

http://forums.pondboss.com/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=362400&page=1

AS for the "math", there is just to many darn variables, and the link above kind of touches upon that with their answers. Your pond size is set. Can't do much about that. But as you learn about ponds, mostly from your own experience with YOUR pond(will vary from others' ponds), you will know more on ways to push the envelope to get more production and holding capacity. Way to much to get into with a single post, or even thread. A few years ago I was at this point you are Griff, and I thought why can't I get a straight forward answer, but then with time, you will learn why the answer is so elusive. Spark only scratched the surface with his comments above.

Last edited by fish n chips; 04/28/15 09:19 AM.
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