Pond Boss Forums AQUATIC VEGETATION Balance of plants in the environment new vegetation vs craws & carp

I ordered some vegetation yesterday. Awhile back, fireishot posted a name in a thread here as to where some good pond vegies might be had. I made that call yesterday and ordered some American pondweed and eel grass (wild celery) and we will start planting in a couple of weeks. And I planted some Louisiana Iris and Blue Flag iris a couple of days ago. Placed them in 3" of water along the shoreline under the Wood duck boxes.
So crawfish are in and have got a good toe hold, but the CBLMB has not been stocked but are coming soon and I expect them to thin the craws back, but for now, the craws are denuding the shoreline. Will the craws wipe out my new to be planted vegies?
And I've decided to put on hold the GC for now till I get the good plants established but @ some point, they most likely will have to be added.
And I will fertilize again for a 2nd attempt of a bloom before the plants go in. So anyone have any suggestions here before I mess up.

Tracy

Tracy,

I am going to be planting vegetation this year as well. Please keep us up to date on how it goes. Of particular interest to me, is how you plant each of the species.

Bill D.

I recommend using GC as a management device - until you have vegetation issues, I do not recommend stocking them. Wait until they're needed, so good call there.

Yes, Craws can denude vegetation of all types if population is dense enough - lacking cray predation it sounds as though you might be in this scenario. It's reasonable to consider holding off on planting your new vegetation until they are knocked back a bit by predators you are stocking. Or, you could go ahead and plant now but I'd cage them well to prevent crays grazing on them. I'm guessing they crays would simply move on rather than dig under the cage to get at the plants, but I could be wrong. Safest bet is to hold off planting until you notice vegetation starting to grow again which would mean the cray population is getting knocked back - but the caging might also work.

+1 on caging.

I bet you will want to sink the cages as deep in the mud as you can get them, if the purpose is to keep crayfish out.

Wife went to a lot of trouble planting water plants in an aquarium that we were keeping some green sunfish and crawdads for the kids to watch when they were little. Crawdads excavated all the dirt and plants and generally made a mess of all of her work.

They are very industrious little critters. I would bet they would easily burrow an inch or two deep to get under a cage to get at a tasty plant they desired. Not to mention all the baby crayfish that will be able to go through the mesh of the cage and grow up on the new plants.

No experience caging plants here. Just what I can imagine happening.

Bill D. I contacted Joe Snow Aquatics in Argyle Texas for the plants and we decided to wrap each plant roots in burlap and would add rocks inside the burlap and that way I could just toss the plants to where I wanted them. Joe said it works well and plant would take root and grow. it sounded much better than climbing up and down the bank and standing in clay that forms a suction around my boots or slipping and falling in the water. so u might want to consider this type of planting if using American pondweed and or wild celery.

TJ, esshup and snrub, thanks for the ideas but I am wondering about how to or what to cage with? lol The mudbugs have really denuded one of the 200 yd shorelines. Crazy as it sounds. The CBLMB are going to have a field day when they are introduced. I can see it now with 2" lmb and having a 2" crawfish hanging out of their mouths.
I have a lot of plastic netting (deer fence). And I might come up with an idea on how it might be put together but sound like a lot of work, that they might just go around or under.

Tracy

Thanks for the info Tracy,

I like that plan!!

Edit: Are you putting any soil inside the burlap or just the bare roots?

Bill, as he described it to me the plants are in pots that are transferred to the burlap bags, so I am guessing there will be some soil in the burlap bags.

And TJ, my conversations with the fish suppliers of my pond, said GC should be added to a new pond here (before having vegetation) in E. Texas because the native vegetation will be harder to control if the GC are playing catch up and was told to me the first yr I stock the GC, they will not eat a lot. So I am thinking of putting in 4 or 5 GC in this 3.5 acre pond. Where the recommendations here might be 4 to 5 per acre. I am guessing "IT DEPENDS" ??
I don't know what or where to go with this lol

Tracy

Tracy, all that sounds great. If you like vegetation, and I personally really, really do, then getting an early start with something preferable to an invasive is important.

Dumb me had no clue that Iris were bog plants. T Overton was here last Monday, and specifically mentioned Iris. We have hundreds of them, so I'll hopefully move some to the ponds this week. I wonder if they pop up in late winter like other Iris'?

I'm glad Joe Snow could help. Now, if you really want me to spend your money, there's Creative Gardens in Garland (East Dallas suburb). They have a great selection of hardy water lilies. I'm making a trip there Weds to pick up some more.

Al, thanks for the information u put out there on Joe Snow Aquatics. He seamed to be a real nice guy and I look forward to meeting up with him. I am not sure about the hardy water lilies?? It has taken me a lot of time and research to pull the trigger with the American pondweed and eel grass (wild celery). Maybe someday I can make the drive up to your place and see how you are adding yours to the mix. Not trying to invite myself here lol I have a job running a few miles N of Sulpher Springs now, but unless they make a big discovery, it will be a long time most likely before the drill another wildcat up there, at todays oil prices. Tell me about the hardy water lilies. And the Louisiana Iris and Blue Flag Iris is doing great. I planted in 3 to 4" of water and the green color of the plant has gotten much greener and have already had one yellow bloom come out.

Tracy, you're doing it right. Take your time, because some plants can really get out of control with our long growing season. American pondweed is great, but wild celery can grow out to deeper depths with clear water, and get to be a handful. But, LMB love it, and it's made for fishing with weightless Texas rigged senkos.

I've pretty much abandoned lilies in the big pond. They will grow great for a few years, then a drought will whack them all. If, your water level stays pretty consistent, then they'll do fine, and spread very slowly.

I'll try to remember to let you know what I get, and thanks for the iris update.

Tracy, you're always welcome here. Our gate never closes for guests.

Al, I used to beat the water with spinner baits, buzz baits and crank baits, but, now that I am older (and wiser) and slower I fish the Sinko, weightless Texas style or Wackey style and still catch a lot of fish

Tracy

Ain't it the truth? I'm almost embarrassed to tell anyone how many pounds of Yamamoto senkos, Yum Dingers, and Jackall Flick Shakes I have. I have very clear water, and noisemakers just don't get the consistent results that a properly presented soft bait will.

Senkos and flukes will allow you to fish in almost any water, irregardless of vegetation or cover. Those are for sure my two best LMB culling baits.

Sorry if my advice on the GC missed the mark - I am thinking of Northern ponds, maybe. Up here, I never advise GC stocking until vegetation presents itself as an issue - which it may never do. If Al says stock em, rest assured you should stock em.

TJ, you are a "stand-up guy"- so often advice is given w/o consideration of regional differences and I believe that to be a major consideration.
Best,
George

TJ, I want to take this time and thank you for all the recommendations. After years of fishing and thinking I knew something about fish, I built this pond, only to find out, I knew little about ponds and fishies. Please never hesitate to make recommendations when we newbies ask it's up to me to ask the questions, do the research and then pull the trigger.

Tracy

Well, this is news to me, and I'm glad I learned about it. I try to never offer advice unless I've already failed at something multiple times, figured it out myself through trial and error, and only try to save someone else the headaches I earned from my follies. In my experience, hatcheries love to recommend GC stocking for us up here, in an effort to sell someone more fish. Most fisheries up here do not consist of GC - but again, that's up here. Again, up here, we stock GC only as a response to a vegetation conditions presented by the pond.

Since Tracy is trying to establish vegetation, and crays are already denuding the existing stands, is it wise to stock GC at this time? Wait and see approach is not recommended down South? Please, educate me - I want to learn more about this regional difference.

I love swimbaits, jerkbaits, buzzbaits, and spinnerbaits. They are beautiful, with lots of pretty colors and noisemakers. They sit in my tackle box looking pretty most of the time except when I feel like scaring away all the fish.

When I actually want to catch one, I tie on a $.50 Senko.