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#406326 04/01/15 10:19 PM
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Hopefully someone can help me with this.

My 1/3 acre pond was pumped dry and redug 2 years ago. The surrounding land which was to become my front yard was all regraded to prepare for seeding. The redo happened in June and by late August one night I heard splashing in the pond and saw a lone muskrat swimming back and forth. He/She didn't seem to care that I was watching and it was between dusk and dark. There was no vegetation, no fish so I assumed the muskrat was gone.

The yard went in about that time and had a very good 'catch' I watched carefully, no tunnels or holes.

Sometime the next summer we found a bank caved with a tunnel near the water edge but no sign of muskrat activity. We filled it in and late the in the fall didn't see any activity.

This past fall I thought I saw one other tunnel on the other side but no fresh dirt, no sign of the muskrat all day, or at night, even when I'm out there after dark.

By this time there are weeds and fish so I easily can see how they/he/she may have come back.

last spring we got our lab/aussie shepherd mix puppy and by this fall he is old enough to chase anything that moves. We have 20 foot long ruts where he is digging and chasing after moles, voles, mice who knows what.

He now is at these holes, he clearly smells something and is enlarging the entrance holes and kicking out a lot of fresh dirt as he digs. He hasn't found anything that I know of and if the muskrat come out during the day when he is on the prowl I think he would go after them. He is in the garage at night so they are free to do as they wish at night.

For whatever reason the pond is down quite a bit this spring (see pictures) I took the opportunity to try to rake leaves and big mats of FA out of the shallows which are now dry and now you can see more of the muskrat holes/tunnels then you could before. I'm wondering now if their whole existence may be coming and going under water and they may have been there much longer than I thought with no visible presence during any daylight hours? Could that be? I can see the pond easily from my front window so any ripples or swimming ducks, muskrat, etc I can spot right away. I haven't seen any sight of them in the past nearly 2 years!

Questions....
The dog might be smelling 'old smells' but if they are in the hole he is digging in, can he get to them? Are they in the tunnel just further under the pond bank? I don't want to know how much of my pond banks are wrecked now as I see the tunnels go way back!

Are they strictly nocturnal so that I won't see them?

Have they been feeding under our thick ice pack and heavy snow all winter and I was unaware of it?

I've read on this forum I need to trap them? Advice on which trap and if I need bait? I assume it goes right at the underwater portion of their main in/out run? I guess setting traps is the only way to know if they are still around!

I'm worried that the dog will get in the traps. He is in the pond constantly and has his nose everywhere. The best solution I can think of is to set the traps at night when he is in the cage and make sure I go and remove them in the morning before letting him out? Other ways to 'dog proof' them? Maybe put a tote over them or something?

Once water levels come up I imagine this may be harder to do?

If a muskrat is in one of these holes and I fill it in, maybe put some metal fence mesh over it to discourage dog from digging, will the muskrat be buried alive?

On a separate note, I'm sure it was good to remove the leaves and mats of FA but what an enormous job, my back is killing!

Every inch of the bottom in the shallows had a very thin matted coating of FA embedded in the mud that had to be scraped off and lifted up with a pitchfork, then scoop big scoops of FA and leaves into my trailer. I may not get a chance to do this again as the water levels usually cover this area that I'm working in. I know removing nutrients by the trailer full is great by way of removing FA but I seriously wonder how the FA ever goes away on its own? The dead FA supposedly floats but I have mats adhered to the bottom. I'm not sure aeration or even a outboard prop stream would break them up.

The kids had a riot with their insect nets and checking out what was in the water now that ice is out. They confirmed that a few nice size crayfish made it through the winter, several times the rake came up with a sluggish turtle that had been in the mud, also a few sluggish tadpoles, and lots of minnows. A few adult GSH are by the minnow trap. We also somehow had some goldfish offspring, we saw 8-9 4" goldfish. That may have been part of the 'bucket stocking' event that occurred by my helpful neighbor last fall smile


The tunnel branches near the bottom of the picture, this was under the water line, but then goes deeper under the bank of the pond. Some of the fresh dirt may be the dog trying to get in there:





You can see in this picture the pond is down about 10-12 running feet from grass line to waters edge. The dark at waters edge is me pulling as much heavy FA mats and leaves as I can and dumping it there to dry. The rest is dry leaves that had fallen in the shallows and are still embedded in the soil. You can see another large hole in the bank on that side.

Now that my pond is down this far I wish I had a loader and a big supply of limestone rip rap, or a couple skids of cement blocks to make some shallow structure. The bottom is slippery clay/sand and I can see that if I had gone around the edges now with pea gravel that in no time it would be covered up with leaves, clay, muck etc.

Water is quite clear on the other side of the pond where I'm not stirring up the bottom, the dirt/clay settles out pretty quickly.

A few heavy rains with the street runoff and the water level will be about 10 feet away from the base of the evergreen tree and then 3-4 days later settles down to about the edge of the grass again.

When it is up over the grass the toads and frogs love to lay eggs in the water logged grass smile


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Muskrats can absolutely remain active under the ice. I think of them like mice....if you see one, well, you get the idea. If the runs are active you should notice a lighter area of silt on the bottom. The run itself may or may not be muddy, but the light colored area against the typically darker pond bottom is a pretty good indicator.

Conibear 110's are the usually employed traps for rats. The dog is a legitimate concern, especially if he likes to get in the water and dig. Removing the traps every morning is doable I suppose, but it would be a huge PIA, and might spook the rats' into digging another burrow.

If you have a safe place to shoot, I would take a scoped .22 and find me a comfy spot that overlooked a good portion of the pond. Grab a beverage of choice and head down there about 30-45 minutes before dark. They tend to get active about that time. After a few nights keeping vigil, you should know if you have a rodent problem.

BTW, dogs usually LOVE to eat muskrat. I don't know what it is, but they will readily consume them.


"Forget pounds and ounces, I'm figuring displacement!"

If we accept that: MBG(+)FGSF(=)HBG(F1)
And we surmise that: BG(>)HBG(F1) while GSF(<)HBG(F1)
Would it hold true that: HBG(F1)(+)AM500(x)q.d.(=)1.5lbGRWT?
PB answer: It depends.
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Parsnip Muskrats love parsnip. Best bait next to apples.

You can see how they are digging up the grass? What they are doing is eating the roots of the grass.

Cheers Don.


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Sprkplug, That is the strange thing, I"m watching the pond every night at dusk and I never see a ripple. 2 years ago when they were there they were diving, swimming, making noise. I can't believe that all of last summer and fall we never saw them or heard them but maybe they are still active?

I agree, our dog would eat them if he could get to them, makes me wonder if they are there or not. IF their tunnel opening is now about 10 feet away from water edge would i still see the silt in the water as they get in and out?

DonoBBD, I think some of the digging in the grass bank is my dog making the hole bigger and trying to get to them, but clearly some of the tunnels going into the bank are small and are likely past or present muskrat tunnels.

Any way to kill them while in their tunnel/home even if I can't catch them out and active during day? Just fill in the tunnel the best I can and watch for new tunnels like you do with moles?

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With the water level being so low, they may well have left.


"Forget pounds and ounces, I'm figuring displacement!"

If we accept that: MBG(+)FGSF(=)HBG(F1)
And we surmise that: BG(>)HBG(F1) while GSF(<)HBG(F1)
Would it hold true that: HBG(F1)(+)AM500(x)q.d.(=)1.5lbGRWT?
PB answer: It depends.
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Hey there canyon watch out for those conibear traps all they got me was greif from the wife when she had to watch a duck flop around with its head under water that trap went in the garbage.cant remember what the trap I use is called but it works every time.its about 16 inchs long.6x6 with flaps on both side one way in either side no way out,dead rat' I feel your pain been watching one every day now for about two weeks went and got a pellet gun just finished sigting it in.just for fun.if I cant get him that way,Ill deploy the trap.good luck,they sure can make a mess.

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Derek,
Thanks for taking the time to help! Can you go to google and their image search and type muskrat trap and maybe you will recognize your trap there? Then you can find the link online and post picture or post back what you found? Did you put the trap in the water at the opening of their 'run'? Did you bait it or disguise it somehow?

We did see just this week a pair of mallard ducks in the early mornings. The dog wants to chase them but they keep coming back. I agree a flopping duck would get me an urgent call from my wife smile

I do think it is possible the muskrat are not there now but I need to be sure. I haven't seen any activity in the water unless it is only when it is pitch dark.

My banks are a mess by the holes!

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Canyon Cabela's and lots of other sports good stores have them too.mine is like the havahart two door live trap.And yes I place it at the entrance of the run in the water,so its not really a live trap in the end.

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What you could do is smoke them out or at lease see if there is more than one hole.

Tools. Hair dryer, potassium nitrate (saltpeter drug store), sugar, propane torch, toilet paper roll, duct tape, and some hydro.

Tape one end of a toilet paper center tube with duct tape.

Mix the potassium nitrate 50-50 with sugar mix well, place in a spent tube from a toilet paper roll.

Place just inside the hole and light the mixture with the torch. Push in deeper into hole after lit.

Pump air down the hole with hair dryer to force the smoke down into the hole.

A full tube will burn for about 1 minute with alot of flame so make sure she is in the hole as far as you can but still light it.

Cheers Don.


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There is a WEALTH of knowledge and experience in this forum smile

Do they still sell those little round colored 'smoke bombs' that you could get a fireworks stores?

I never saw saltpeter at a drug store, I should look more closely.

I have leaf blower that should work for non-A/C requiring air supply on a low setting.

is TP tube lying horizontal on its side or does it have to stay vertical while burning?

Something like this may work fine too.

passive trap

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Canyon you could ping Scott [Esshup] or Travis [CJBS] they are the resident muskrat trapping experts. I've had some success with colony traps - easier to deploy than spring traps.


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Originally Posted By: DonoBBD
What you could do is smoke them out or at lease see if there is more than one hole.

Tools. Hair dryer, potassium nitrate (saltpeter drug store), sugar, propane torch, toilet paper roll, duct tape, and some hydro.

Tape one end of a toilet paper center tube with duct tape.

Mix the potassium nitrate 50-50 with sugar mix well, place in a spent tube from a toilet paper roll.

Place just inside the hole and light the mixture with the torch. Push in deeper into hole after lit.

Pump air down the hole with hair dryer to force the smoke down into the hole.

A full tube will burn for about 1 minute with alot of flame so make sure she is in the hole as far as you can but still light it.

Cheers Don.


I don't have any holes or problems with muskrats but I want to build one of these Don!!

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Originally Posted By: canyoncreek
There is a WEALTH of knowledge and experience in this forum smile

Do they still sell those little round colored 'smoke bombs' that you could get a fireworks stores?

I never saw saltpeter at a drug store, I should look more closely.

I have leaf blower that should work for non-A/C requiring air supply on a low setting.

is TP tube lying horizontal on its side or does it have to stay vertical while burning?

Something like this may work fine too.

passive trap


Ho ya a cordless leaf blower would be the ticket!


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DonoBBD, what is saltpeter called in the drug store?

Is TP TUbe horizontal or vertical while burning?

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Saltpeter is potassium nitrate. I think they use it to hot blue gun barrels, at least they did years ago.


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Run down to Lowes and pick up a container of stump remover. Spectracide used to be the product of choice, back when such things held my attention. wink


"Forget pounds and ounces, I'm figuring displacement!"

If we accept that: MBG(+)FGSF(=)HBG(F1)
And we surmise that: BG(>)HBG(F1) while GSF(<)HBG(F1)
Would it hold true that: HBG(F1)(+)AM500(x)q.d.(=)1.5lbGRWT?
PB answer: It depends.
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Originally Posted By: sprkplug
Run down to Lowes and pick up a container of stump remover. Spectracide used to be the product of choice, back when such things held my attention. wink


Make sure to read the label or research first, there seems to be some stump removers now that are not suitable for such things.
Yes, I have been fascinated with making 'Holy Black', but have not tried it yet.

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Update... The holes in the bank go quite deep and I think some may even connect to some others. With the water level down I think the holes are abandoned, or may have been abandoned some time last year with the dog at them all the time. He must still smell them or want to see what is in there as he was always trying to expand the openings to get in there.

No muskrat activity..

I filled them in with left over rocks from my landscaping (2" egg shape) and tried to pack as far back as I could under the banks, then covered that with dirt. HOpefully the rocks will keep the dog from enjoying digging the fresh dirt back up again.

No rain in the forecast so I'm pumping up the water level with my house pump and soon these areas will be under water. We'll keep a close eye out for new holes.

I'd love to have my dog catch those rascals if they ever return.

I'm now hoping that the lack of turtles this spring isn't because the dog is always prowling the pond. I imagine turtles can't move quickly and the dog can chase them into the water too. They may have smelled the dog and headed to another, quieter pond. I hate to do it but with the dog dirty and wet all day I may have to put a loop of underground fence around the pond. I keep stalling as the dog loves wading and chasing anything that is in the shallows and he is great at chasing away GBH as well. Not to mention when it is hot (black dog) he loves to cool off.


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