Pond Boss Forums POND CONSTRUCTION Building a dam DavidV's Pond Project; Guy with a Water Bottle

I linked earlier in this thread to a publication from Texas A&M, written by a fisheries specialist extension agent for them, that specifically, very clearly, strongly recommends fertilization for Texas ponds. So I did not give advice that is irrelevant to Texas. To say you personally advise against it, is completely valid; to suggest I gave uninformed or faulty advice is not accurate. A series of cloudy days in a row without sunshine happens in TN just like it does in TX; and, we do get periods some summers in which we go for months with little to no rain, flushing or otherwise. If a pond isn't over-fertilized, as I already noted, it won't result in a fish kill. I almost had a kill once out of ten years. And in that time my bluegill averaged twelve ounces in one pond I was fertilizing, and fourteen ounces in another pond, and neither pond was fed, and they were common northern-strain bluegill, not hybrids or coppernose. I don't care much about carrying capacity; I fertilize simply because it makes my fish far bigger than they would be without it. I personally would rather have huge fish with a small risk of a fish kill under atypical, uncommon circumstances, than much smaller fish with no risk. But that's just me.

You just gonna keep arguing this until they bury you, Walt?

get an aerator; it takes much of the pucker factor away. I keep a bloom, but not always 12-18 inches due to water loss in summer. I feed pretty regularly, until one of my cheap feeders clogs or the coons somehow get to it and destroy/or submerge it.
In ponds an acre or under I think you need a combination of feeding, monitoring alk. and bloom depth, aggressiveness of fish at feeder etc. to get things right. I am afraid that too heavy of bloom, especialy if you have cover, will just perpetuate too many small BG. I like the saucer BGs. Right now, I havae 3 species which all frequent the feeder, I like it that way, the lower water has also caused weeds and some cover to be dry.
Problem is, I now have fish that turn their nose up at worms at times. Need to order Stubby Steves(or make a panty hose pellet fly).

Otto, so far so good. No leaks observed. How busy are you these days? May need some dirt moved.

Walt, Texas is loaded with Extension Agents, most of who are local or regional, usually one to a County. I'm not saying that you didn't read it, but doubt that the writer was considering the variability of Texas soils. Texas is divided by 7 or 8 different types of ecosystems, none of which remotely resembles the other. They differ by both climates, crops and soils.

Again, I'm not saying that you didn't read it but TPWD and TAMU usually are very careful to recognize the regional and ecological differences regarding any type of agriculture or husbandry. I know a couple of the TAMU Prof's and have, on more than one occasion, discussed the regional variables regarding fish and wildlife propogation. If TAMU is teaching and advising that one size fits all, they are making a huge mistake.

Walt, started thinking and editing/adding here. The requirements for being an extension agent is 1. having a degree in Ag or horticulture or.... 2. Desiring to get a job. Most of them know about cattle, crops and maybe gardening. I've only met a couple that knew anything about ponds. I once had a pond problem and TAMU recommended that I call my Ex Agent and ask him/her. Then if they didn't know the answer, they could refer it on to TAMU. I did and never heard a thing. So, I networked around and found the name of one of the Profs there. I called him directly, asked the question related to my problem and he had never heard of it. However, he did request that I call him back if I discovered the solution.

My current EX Agent is a nice young lady who knows nothing about ponds. The NRCS guys are OK but most of them have been there (local) for quite awhile. And, even they know a lot less about raising fish than they do cows.

I certainly did read it; it recommended fertilization without qualification. The extension agent, as I noted twice previously, is listed as a fisheries specialist. I'll go out on a limb here and guess that that means he probably has a degree in fisheries science; in Tennessee you can't get a job as a fisheries biologist with the state unless you have a degree in fisheries science, and I would guess the same is true in Texas. He's not listed as a cattle agent, or a crops agent, and I doubt TAMU would have a cattle or crops agent write a publication for them on pond management. And he's not just the average joe agent, he's one that TAMU obviously considered enough of an expert to write a publication that they put their name on as their recommendations on the topic of pond management. Unless you think TAMU, which is the university Bob got his degree in fisheries science from, is haphazard enough to allow anyone at all to write a publication for them, I don't see much point in your line of reasoning. I know I'm certainly tired of arguing the point.

The proper recommendation is to get your soil/water tested for pond purposes. Then you will know what if any limiting factor is present and can deal with it correctly. Then if your goals , as noted in the archive, are consistent with needing extra fertility you can decide on that option. Fertilization is a tool to be used in the proper situation with a full understanding of its application to your pond and goals. I would hate for any PB forum member to take a blanket fertilization recommendation and then call me to report a dense plankton bloom followed by a fish kill. Knowledge first then proper application of that knowledge to your situation and goals.

Thanks to you all for the fertilization discussion. TAMU is a fine institution with very qualified individuals to make recommendations on anything to do with agriculture related situations. My Alma Mater is a little south of TAMU and we beat them in football one year. Our fight song went like this:

e to the x dy/dx, e to the x dx, secant tan cosine sine 3.14159,
cube root, square root, BTU, lets drink beer, go Rice U!

It's pretty close, to the best of my fading memeory. The "lets drink beer" part I'm in doubt.

Fish are coming Friday from Todd w/ Overton. Will be sure to taks pics and post. I think I'll have him bring me some of those bulfrogs he advertises. I have a lot of frogs that get eaten by the bass. A few big ones would be a good addition I think.

Ahh, the much feared Rice Owls.

Well the big day came and went, sort of. Clint with Overton Fisheries arrived after noon to stock the forage base for my new pond. I had no idea that stocking forage in a pond would be such an adventure.

CNBG - 2700
RES - 800
Large (3"+)CNBG - 200
FHM - 35#'s

All the fish were alive and in good condition.

As a bonus, I got to pick Clint's brain for 6 hrs on fish and ponds and fertilization trucks and snakes and other topics.

The trip from Buffalo, TX is 135 miles. Well Clint made it 134 miles 5260 ft. The last 20' was just not going to happen as planned. Admittedly (by Clint)we should have listened to Ms. Boss on the proper route. (I don't know how many times I have heard it tonight and how many of her friends have heard it and how many times I will hear it again.)

The truck got stuck!!! And here is my better half saying "I told you so".



Well that didn't deter us from getting those fish out of the tank and putting them in their rightful place.

After trying the mule with winch, 8N with a fire hose (that snapped, knocking neighbor's doors( no one was home)and arriving to early at the barbeque smoker, we called out the big gun. Steve Tubbs w/ Tubb's Dozier Svc., the guys that built the pond graciously drove his tractor 45 minutes to give us a hand. Even brought some refreshements!

Overall, I was very pleased with the service provided by Clint and Todd with Overton Fisheries. Will call them in the spring for the predators, LMB and possibly HSB.

Here are some pics from today.

Unlodaing the "old fashioned way"


Where's the fish?


Afetr a little slight of hand. Here it is!


My little 8N didn't stand a chance pulling this behemoth out. The fire hose is history.


Help arrives.



Let's get it off that tree


Looks like we won't be camping tonight.


All is good at the new pond.


Overall, I had a great time. A little adversity is fun as long as you overcome. Thanks for all the input from you Pondmeisters out there. Will be asking for more in the future.

Great post, thanks for sharing...

It at least one thing doesn't go awry during a pond project then you're doing something wrong. Great stuff thanks for sharing.

An update. The new pond is full and water is running out the overflow. Inordinate amounts of rain in E. Texas this Fall.

Well I guess I didin't get rid of beaver. Dammed up the overflow of the exisitng pond.



Here is his home on the banks of old pond



Some pics of new pond. Note center of dam is lower. Reason being is that after consultation with those in the know, the dam builders deepened the shallows on the sides and put the dirt on the sides of the dam.




Just got a new "bridge" over creek in back.

My surveying wasn't too bad. Stick was at full level which it is now.


Does anyone have a beaver trap that they would sell, rent loan or come trap the varmit? Must be a pretty good size one as that cedar tree in the dam is 4" in diameter at the base. He has since built two other small dams to stop the run off from the overflow of the new pond. They just can't stand running water.

DavidV:

I've got a couple here that I could send down to you to use, but you'll need to buy a setting tool to compress the springs. Or, look below at the link on where to get them (the traps & tool). If you have beaver now, you might want to purchase a few (maybe even 3 or 4) because more beaver will find your place once these are gone. It's hard to play musical runs when you only have one or 2 traps and there are more places to set them, just ask Cecil.

DON'T set them on dry land. They will kill anything that tries to go thru them, no if's ands, or buts, even deer. My largest beaver that I trapped weighed in @ 70 Lb., and he was going slow, so the trap caught him right behind the head. Other than springing, the trap never moved, and neither did he. I prefer the #330 or #330-2 Onedia Victor Conibear for beaver. I set them in the underwater run as they leave the den and stabilize them with a couple pieces of #4 rebar or dead sticks. If their run is smaller than the trap is wide (10"), I'll switch size down to a #280. Be VERY, VERY careful setting and placing them, and don't forget to take off the safety catch, making sure that it doesn't catch once is starts to snap. If you educate the beaver, it will be a real bear to trap them.

I'll use a tool that I made to place them after the safety catch is off. (a hook on the end of a shovel handle) I'm leery of them, but have never had one go off on me. I did have my fingers pinched pretty good in a #110 (it hurt worse because they were cold), and I learned my lesson. Make sure that you get them wired to something solid as well, I've caught beaver across their hind quarters, and while they died, they sure tried to take the trap with them as they fought it. I can't imagine how fast they must have been going when they sprung the trap.
How to set a #330-2 Conibear Trap

Trapping Supplies (including traps)

Been out of the forum for a while. Economy is not the best. But here is a pic of some kids having fun. I think I will let the new pond be a BG pond. Many minnows and the "perch" are biting my swimmers. It is very entertaing. Biting men on the nipples. I feed twice per day.

Went out last weekend to sight in a TC Icon and the trampoline above was gone!! Found it behind the dam. The "tornado" broke the 1800lb test nylon mooring rope. A sight to see a 17' trampoline with extras flying over the dam.

David, I hope it was depopulated when it got airborne.

No one was airborne. But it really was a blessing in disguise as it would have been a b***h to un-anchor and haul that trampoline to the shore. No leaks or holes.

Didn't fit in the original packaging however. Imagine that.

Put 20 bass from the old pond into the new. See them chasing minnows at the shorline.

Bluegill are doing great.

Beavers still there

Ponds are doing well. Fish are growing. Erected a small pavilion last year in front of the original pond. Had a bad FA prob this year but put Cutrine to handle. Cattails have arrived, ugh. Had some rains this Spring which filled both ponds. We are enjoying our land and ponds. Here a couple pics.

Beautiful pavilion, the LMB looks healthy and it seems like the kids are having a blast! The tornado didn't damage the float at all when it went sailing?

No damage. Actually a blessing as it is hard to get it out of the pond. Had to pull the trampoline with a string across the pond. Clean it with a brush and then "kite" it back to a new resting position and drop the 75lb anchor. PITA! Got a cattail issue now, any suggestions?

If you want to kill the cattails, use an aquatic labeled glyphosate with a wetting agent like cide-kick. Cut the catkins off of them so the seeds don't blow all over the place and spray 'em. You might have to hit them again, but they'll die pretty quick.

I have Reward with cide kick. Man that stuff is scary. I will suit up and spray.

Haven't posted for a while. Would have liked to have attended the event at Lake Ray Hubbard but couldn't. Here is a fish that was 12" in my old pond 4 yrs ago that I put in the new pond. My wife caught it and she was thrilled with the growth.