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Joined: Jun 2008
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Ambassador Lunker
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What do you think?
"Forget pounds and ounces, I'm figuring displacement!"
If we accept that: MBG(+)FGSF(=)HBG(F1) And we surmise that: BG(>)HBG(F1) while GSF(<)HBG(F1) Would it hold true that: HBG(F1)(+)AM500(x)q.d.(=)1.5lbGRWT? PB answer: It depends.
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Joined: May 2013
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Joined: May 2013
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What a beauty!! Orange fin tips are beautiful, I'd love to have that hybrid in my pond! I see a hint of orange on the opercular flap. Mouth hmm... not GSF, a few blue spots on the cheek. I'm just learning but she (I hope it is a she?) is beautiful!
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Ambassador Lunker
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I should state that this is not my fish, It was caught by BBG member Steve C. and posted over there for I.D.
According to Steve, species present in the BOW that gave up this fish are BG, PS, GSF, and RBS.
"Forget pounds and ounces, I'm figuring displacement!"
If we accept that: MBG(+)FGSF(=)HBG(F1) And we surmise that: BG(>)HBG(F1) while GSF(<)HBG(F1) Would it hold true that: HBG(F1)(+)AM500(x)q.d.(=)1.5lbGRWT? PB answer: It depends.
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Be Brave Enough to Suck at Something New!
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Ambassador Lunker
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That was my initial thought, but that opercular looks very greenie to me, as does the color placement on the pelvic fin. I wonder if a GSF x RBS cross would account for the vivid red coloration?
"Forget pounds and ounces, I'm figuring displacement!"
If we accept that: MBG(+)FGSF(=)HBG(F1) And we surmise that: BG(>)HBG(F1) while GSF(<)HBG(F1) Would it hold true that: HBG(F1)(+)AM500(x)q.d.(=)1.5lbGRWT? PB answer: It depends.
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Joined: Oct 2013
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Joined: Oct 2013
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Not a very big mouth for GSF inclusion. What was the word Bruce Condello had for my hybrid.......Mutt??
John
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I see what looks like just a shadow of orange on the opercular flap and the blue lines on the jaw made me think PS is in there someplace. I have been looking at a lot of photos of pumkingills lately and many of those have that shadow of orange on the flap, but some have none. Who knows, may be a 3 way cross.
Last edited by Bill D.; 01/27/15 05:25 PM. Reason: Correct typo
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Moderator Ambassador Field Correspondent Lunker
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Until told otherwise, I'm leaning towards your ID Tony!
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Won't even try to guess, but a real beaut to look at.
CMM
CMM
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What would the taxodermists think about mounting and painting that beauty?
Last edited by Bill D.; 01/28/15 01:36 PM.
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BG male X GSF female and that fish is a male as are most Lepomis hybrids. No other sunfish species listed as being in that pond has coloration on the pectoral fins. Seeing all that orange will throw some off but many GSF populations have orange. I especially see this coloration in tannic waters.
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Yes, I have some HBG that display orange pects, it's the overall red coloration of the body that I find stunning.
"Forget pounds and ounces, I'm figuring displacement!"
If we accept that: MBG(+)FGSF(=)HBG(F1) And we surmise that: BG(>)HBG(F1) while GSF(<)HBG(F1) Would it hold true that: HBG(F1)(+)AM500(x)q.d.(=)1.5lbGRWT? PB answer: It depends.
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It is probably a post F1 hybrid, i.e. F2 or F3 etc.
aka Pond Doctor & Dr. Perca Read Pond Boss Magazine - America's Journal of Pond Management
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I think its a male mutt. Coloration is one of the weakest species attributes for iding lepomis. Many others are better indicators but still not conclusive. Here is an example of a CNBG with a different coloration pattern and morphological features than any other I have seen. This may help - lepomis id
Last edited by ewest; 01/29/15 03:09 PM.
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Looks like one of those California fish, Ewest. I've seen similar photos coming out of Perris and Skinner.
"Forget pounds and ounces, I'm figuring displacement!"
If we accept that: MBG(+)FGSF(=)HBG(F1) And we surmise that: BG(>)HBG(F1) while GSF(<)HBG(F1) Would it hold true that: HBG(F1)(+)AM500(x)q.d.(=)1.5lbGRWT? PB answer: It depends.
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Looks like one of those California fish, Ewest. I've seen similar photos coming out of Perris and Skinner. Ditto that,
Holding a redear sunfish is like running with scissors.
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Ambassador Field Correspondent Lunker
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Ambassador Field Correspondent Lunker
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Bruce, I can't believe ya just didn't retype that.
Do nature a favor, spay/neuter your pets and any weird friends or relatives.
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Ambassador Field Correspondent Hall of Fame Lunker
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The only sunfish species to have brightly colored pectoral fins are GSF. If the suspected hybrid has brightly colored pectoral fins, it's at least part GSF. For some reason that trait tends to be a dominant gene as well...
Yes, fish species can vary in coloration not just because of genetics but a number of other factors. I still guarantee you that hybrid has GSF in it and is very likely a simple GSFxBG cross. GSF are native to a large number of drainages. This has allowed a large amount of localized genetic isolation to occur. I see it more with longear sunfish which really vary in coloration from on drainage to the next. I believe you see it less in BG for two reasons. First, they aren't as colorful to begin with. Second, so much stocking has been done by man that populations are no longer as distinct.
Also, the above pictured sunfish is very rounded. Both RBS and in particular GSF are more fusiform. I would be highly surprised if it was a GSFxRBS hybrid. I see nothing in the coloration or morphology to indicate RBS genetics. I've also fished a lot of BOW's that contain both GSF and RBS and have never seen a cross between them.
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Ambassador Lunker
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Ah, the hybrid enigma. Absolutely agree on the GSF influence, and acknowledge the likelihood of BG genetics also. But as my other post today on the same subject indicated, I believe it's open to interpretation. If the biologists have to resort to physical examinations to make a determination, we're left with our best guess. Factor in that non-distinct population and the natural diversity influenced by different waters, and there you go. In the absence of gill raker or DNA evidence, of course.
"Forget pounds and ounces, I'm figuring displacement!"
If we accept that: MBG(+)FGSF(=)HBG(F1) And we surmise that: BG(>)HBG(F1) while GSF(<)HBG(F1) Would it hold true that: HBG(F1)(+)AM500(x)q.d.(=)1.5lbGRWT? PB answer: It depends.
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