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Thanks.

Actually cutting the trees is fairly easy. Outside of the sap being like Elmers glue (around the bark/wood interface), the fresh living wood cuts only a little harder than something like Ash. I have been cutting up some year old limbs from some trees we had to remove when we built the pond. They are partially dried out but still cut fairly easily and a sharp chain will last about as long as on any other wood. It is just when the wood ages it gets like iron. Seems like the older it gets the harder it gets. If a person was going to make lumber from a big tree I would guess the best bet would be cut the timbers and let them dry for a month so the nasty sap would not foul the lumber mill. But you would definitely want to turn it into lumber before it aged over a year or so.


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OK, I've been waiting on Mike to break out the big equipment for several months. He dug a couple of 6-8' holes a few months ago - seemed to be a good mix of mostly red clay and sand. I thought we were ready to start but I haven't heard from him since then.

Mike is a virtual genious. I learned more from walking the pond with him in that one afternoon than I've learned from everyone else combined including the local farmers. But, when you're good, you're in demand and Mike is certainly both. My little 2-acre project seems to have dropped off the radar. So, to all of you NE Texas pondmiesters, any suggestions for another good dirt guy in the area?


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WingNuts, what program are you using to design the pond concept??? I'm in the design phase and would love to be able to use something like that. Thanks




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Hi Beaux... I couldn't find a good topo program (that I could afford) so I did it the hard way. I grabbed the satellite image from Google Maps and pasted it into MS Powerpoint. In Powerpoint, I added the contours and features using the drawing options.


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Ok great. Thanks Wing, i think i can handle that




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In our bow shooting club one guy made his bow from Osage Orange also and before retiring as a model maker we used Osage Orange for some of our clay sculpturing tools.

Before my pond filled I used lots of rock, bricks & building blocks to make rock reefs in my pond. Lots of gravel and sand for spawning bluegills areas and a large rolled up farm fencing in one pond area. Nine tires tied together in a pyramid 4-3-2 with rock in the bottom four tires and hole drilled in the tops of the lower seven tires to allow the water to escape but not in the upper two so as to keep the unit upright while sinking to the bottom.
..O O
.O O O
O O O O

I set them on my the frozen pond and it sank upright when the ice melted. Also rift raft rocks in another area for crayfish.

Also a couple of 4'x 4' rafts with many upright 4' stakes and then these were sunk with rocks on the rafts.

Wingnut if you raise your island above the water you may want to put some rocks or even stacked sackcreat around the earth base to keep the earth from floating outward from the base over time. Your can just lay sackcreat in the bag and it will harden on it's own and become a big rock.


Last edited by John Monroe; 07/09/14 05:54 AM.

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Great ideas... especially, the sacrete. I hadn't thought of that. Thanks, John!


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Frig! I just took a bunch of fence to the scrap yard, all rolled up and squashed with my tractor bucket! Why didn't I think of that!

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OK, here's an update for anyone interested...

I found a young dirt contractor right down the road who seemed to have a good sense about pond building. Jay Walton did the dirt work for me and I've attached some photos of the finished dirt work. As expected, the pond is not exactly as shown in the concept drawings but the key features are there. smile

Starting at the upper end of the pond, there was an existing spawning area. I plan to throw some pallets into the upper end for FHM. We connected this spawning area with a trench to the deeper basin. I'll fill the trench with gravel and add brush at the end to form the first "fish highway" as suggested by Eric.

We didn't do anything to the old pond basin but we raised full pool by about 2 ft. So, this will form the deepest part of the pond at 18-20 ft. We added some peninsulas that weren't in the concept drawing. Between the peninsulas is a small ridge line that provides a little more structure between the old and new sections of the pond.

We created dirt mounds down the center line of the new pond area as shown in the photos. I plan to sculpt those with my track loader, add gravel on top and create shelves as described previously if it doesn't rain before I can get to it. We placed two large tree trunks between the mounds (not shown). Finally, we built a "shelf" along the dam where I'll place rip rap and brush in a crib type layout also suggested by Eric. The shelf along the dam leads to a second 2-3 ft spawning area near a very gentle sloping spillway forming a second fish "highway".

Thanks for all of the suggestions and input. wink More to follow, I'm sure...

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Old Spawning Area.jpg Old Pond Basin.jpg Dirt Mounds.jpg Shelf Along Dam.jpg

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Well done


It's not about the fish. It's about the pond. Take care of the pond and the fish will be fine. PB subscriber since before it was in color.

Without a sense of urgency, Nothing ever gets done.

Boy, if I say "sic em", you'd better look for something to bite. Sam Shelley Rancher and Farmer Muleshoe Texas 1892-1985 RIP
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Looks good and you seem to have it well thought out.

One problem I have encountered with all the structure I have in my pond. I've already lost one boat anchor because of it (still need to dawn the scuba and try to find it). I put a LOT of concrete foundation sections (1'x2'x6-10' long) cribbed up log cabin style with a cedar tree upright in the center of the crib. The multiple structures work well for the fish, but is a hazard for fishing lures and anchors.

The pontoon paddle boat I use catches a lot of wind, so is no fun on windy days to try keeping it in position fishing. An anchor tends to drag in the mud bottom then finally catch on something like structure and snag, sometimes permanently.

I'm getting to the point. Slowly, but I'm getting there.

My final solution (to the pontoon boat needing to be moored on windy days and anchors getting eaten by my structure) is going to be to get my scuba gear on, take some rope and small floats, and put permanent boat moorings attached to the concrete foundation pieces in strategic locations around the pond so I no longer need to use an anchor. Just pull up to one of several rope moorings and hook up. Where we scuba dive in the Caribbean it is very common to have permanent boat moorings attached to large screws screwed into the reefs instead of having anchors tearing the reef up every time a boat drops anchor (where I got the idea).

The point to this thread is, had I came up with this idea before the pond filled, it would have been much easier to attach the mooring ropes than what it will be to do so now.

You probably don't have a need for boat moorings in your pond. But if you do, now would be a good time to determine where you want them and where to attach them. Earth anchors in the bottom of a mud pond would work well if no sturdy structure is there (like my concrete foundation bars). Or if you want a floating swimming island (floating dock in the middle of pond), a good time to screw in anchor points would be before the pond fills rather than after.

Just a thought or three.

Last edited by snrub; 08/13/14 08:33 AM.

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Thanks Snrub... It's only well thought out because of the advice I've gotten from you and the rest of the Pond Boss gang.

I don't plan to do concrete condos but I'm thinking seriously about the tire pyramids that John suggests - would be great for CC. It's hard to see in the photos but one of the dirt mounds will be 2 ft above pool for an island and the peninsulas will be our "docks".

I'll be adding rock piles, brick and gravel over the next week or two similar to the concept drawing. I can't think of anything else to add ahead of the water. I'm building a fence around the pond area and clearing a lot of scrub trees so I'll add brush to connect the "highways" as I clear.

All good fun!


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Just a personal opinion here, but with CC being so inexpensive to stock, I'd rather control the CC population by catch, remove and restock than wonder how many baby CC survived a spawn.......


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Esshup, I'd like to establish a natural food chain. But, I'm not a professional so that's a tall order. blush I think it would be good to have the structure and cover to support it if it happens but I'm expecting to restock occasionally.

So, here's my plan... grin I'm bringing in some gravel / rip rap (hopefully, next weekend). I'll add stone piles along the shelf by the dam and place as much rip rap as I can around the base of the dirt mounds to support them (in lieu of sacrete). I'll try to sculpt some 'shelves' on the mounds. I'll place landscape bricks and patio stones (my wife wants me to get rid of) on the 'shelves' for cover. I plan to add a few small trees in strategic locations at a later date which, as you pointed out previously, will eventually have to be replaced.

I decided against the tire pyramid because I don't think I have enough room for it in the newly excavated area and I don't think the pond is big enough for much of a boat so I'll forego the anchors. frown But, both are a great idea for a larger BOW when I win the lottery.

I'll be working on it next weekend so, if I make progress, I'll post some new photos. Thanks again for the ideas and lessons learned... smile


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Latest photos...

I have to admit my plans were ambitious. A $500 load of rip rap just doesn't go very far. eek I still want to add more tree trunks and root balls if I can find some and I intend to add a lot of brush (cedar trees) in strategic locations. I took Snrub's advice and bought some metal posts to drive into the tops of the submerged islands for mooring points. I forgot to take photos of the spawning areas mad but I added gravel and brush to create a "highway" from the first spawning area to the old pond basin. I threw in a pallet for the FHM when the time comes. I'll do the same for the second spawning area next time around.

It doesn't look like much but, after taking some time out to finish a stretch of fence, I spent about 10-12 hours on the bobcat. And, there's a lot more open space I could have filled if I hadn't run out of materials.

It's football season so it may be a while before I get back to it but more to come later... smile

Attached Images
Piles along Dam (1024x768).jpg Rock-Brush Piles (1024x377).jpg Sculpted Dirt Mounds (1024x768).jpg Submerged Island 1 (1024x768).jpg Submerged Island 2 (1024x768).jpg

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I hope you have your brush and wood anchored down very well. When covered with water they will want to float like a cork. When the mud bottom softens lots of wood biomass (like stumps) has buoyancy and can pull out stakes driven into the bottom. Been there done that.

Last edited by Bill Cody; 08/29/14 09:00 PM.

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Thanks for the tip, Bill. wink I used a bucket without a grapple to pick up the brush so the brush piles have a lot of sand mixed in that I scooped up in the process. I'll add some more dirt and maybe push some rip rap over on top to keep the small brush piles in place.

The tree trunks could be a problem, though. They are big and heavy - hard to lift even with my T-180 track loader. Will these float? If so, any thoughts on how to anchor them down? I thought about pounding a metal post into the ground beside each trunk and tying them to the post. I could also dump dirt over one end but, as big as they are, I don't think that would hold them in place. confused

Any insights would be appreciated!


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I don't have any unique ideas to hold big wood in place. All I know if a lot of wood biomass even though big and heavy has a lot of buoyancy.


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Bill... you were right. Some of the logs are floating. cry Not much I can do about it other than hope and pray that a few of the bigger ones stay in place. Tire pyramids and cinder blocks would have definitely been a better choice.

For anyone interested... I've attached updated photos. I'm at about 1/3 to 1/2 full pool in these photos taken 2-3 weeks ago. With the recent rains, I'm hoping to see a 2/3 full pond when I drive up this weekend. smile

More background... besides the 5" rain we got a month ago, we drilled a 500 ft water well and I buried a 1 1/4" Sched 40 PVC pipe from the well, over the levee and to the pond. The water cascades over some limestone rip rap to aerate it a bit before it trickles into the pond. The pump is rated to 30 gpm. The well jetted 50 gpm for 2 hours after it was completed with about 7ppm total iron. eek After six weeks of 24/7 pumping, it started cavitating so I had to back it down. Right now, I've got it cruising along at about 6-8 gpm. cool I also tested the water after we drilled the well.

Original Pond - pH = 7.0; Alkalinity = 20
Well Water - pH = 6.5; Alkalinity = 60

It's holding water so far and I don't want to jinx it but guess I need to start thinking about stocking it now. grin

Attached Images
Copy of IMG_0487.JPG Copy of IMG_0488.JPG Copy of IMG_0491.JPG Copy of IMG_0493.JPG
Last edited by WingNuts; 11/06/14 06:08 PM. Reason: adding photos

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I think you're going to like it.


It's not about the fish. It's about the pond. Take care of the pond and the fish will be fine. PB subscriber since before it was in color.

Without a sense of urgency, Nothing ever gets done.

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This is like watching water boil... come on rain!! I'm hoping the mounds are under water when we visit for New Years. I can't wait to drive the anchor posts in the top of the mounds and get some lilies started around them for cover. Guess I'll need a boat soon... maybe Santa's listening! laugh

Pallets have stayed put (under water) in the spawning area with no weights or stakes. Most of the brush is holding - just a few logs floating. Overall, wish I'd used cinder blocks instead of rip rap because they are cheaper & provide cavities where forage fish and fingerlings can hide. I may still throw in some cinder blocks. I have a huge root ball I need to push in along the bank somewhere. A few cedar trees near the spawning areas should finish off the cover. So far, I'm pretty happy with the result. smile

I'll be stocking soon! - FHM, BG with CC and (limited) LMB later... grin

A few photos are in the attached file showing our progress from excavation until now. Enjoy and have a MERRY CHRISTMAS!

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PondProgress.jpg

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Happy New Year, PB'rs!!

I think this will be the last post on this thread for a while unless I can get some pictures this weekend. I'm waiting for Google maps to update so I can post a 'before' and 'after' satellite photo of the renovated pond. wink

In the meantime, here are some shots I took on Jan 3rd when the pond was about 1-2 ft below full pool. We were not running over the spillway but getting very close. As you can see, the submerged islands are almost completely under water. laugh I still need to throw in some cedar trees for cover and plant lilies on the submerged island. A few more pallets in the spawning areas and I think I'm done. smile

I'll be doing an electroshock survey when the water warms up in late February with the help of Walt from Overton Fisheries. I'll try to take some pictures. At the same time, we'll cull the undesirables, do some water tests, etc. With this info, Walt has promised a recommendation for re-stocking. If it's not too many pages, I'll post the report to the "Stocking a New Pond" forum for anyone that wants to read it. wink

This is too much fun!! grin

Attached Images
IMG_0512 (800x600).jpg IMG_0514 (800x600).jpg IMG_0515 (800x600).jpg IMG_0517 (800x600).jpg IMG_0518 (800x600).jpg IMG_0519 (800x600).jpg

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WingNuts, you going to be able to make it to the conference next month?


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Thanks for reminding me. I have a tight schedule that week so I need to clear some time. And, I need to register. Looks like it will be a blast!


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These will be my last photos until Google Earth updates. With the recent ~3" rain, all of the islands are now completely submerged. laugh The runoff from the recent rain is causing the 'muddy' look in the photo but I'm sure that will dissipate. I cut the spillway in just after I took these photos so the pond is now at full pool. I have a few finishing touches once I'm able to float a boat but I'm over to the "Stocking a New Pond" forum (or, maybe, "Corrective Stocking") very soon. If all goes well, I'll kick off the new thread with the electroshock results when the water warms up.

Something I forgot to mention for anyone that is thinking about doing this type of tank-to-pond renovation... the new part of the dam settled about 1-2 ft as the pond filled with water. eek We intended to have 2-3 ft of freeboard by design so we got very close to overflowing the dam when it settled. We built the dam during the driest part of the year. Just something to keep in mind. We've gone back with the dozer and added more clay on top of the dam. No signs of leaks or other issues so I think we're fine. Just a few more grey (or white, I should say) hairs. smile

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IMG_0522.JPG IMG_0530.JPG

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