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Originally Posted By: FireIsHot [/quote


Tony, that may have just been you hearing me scream. I just got back from getting the tractor out of the brood pond. Twice.

Now, I think next year I'm going to try an aerator on areas I seed. The clay should hold water, so I'm assuming the holes will keep the seeds wetter longer if they're raked into the holes, and help to prevent them from washing away. Rye or Millet should sprout in a day or two if they get a longer initial soak. It's at least worth a shot, because all it will cost is a one day tool rental fee.


A SOIL aerator! I've been trying to figure out how a membrane diffuser sitting on bare clay would provide any type of boost towards grass growth...I must be tired.

Glad you got the tractor out. Any casualties to man, machine, or macrochirus?


"Forget pounds and ounces, I'm figuring displacement!"

If we accept that: MBG(+)FGSF(=)HBG(F1)
And we surmise that: BG(>)HBG(F1) while GSF(<)HBG(F1)
Would it hold true that: HBG(F1)(+)AM500(x)q.d.(=)1.5lbGRWT?
PB answer: It depends.
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Al, if it's worth doing once, it's worth doing twice!! With practice, you're getting better at extracting it.

They make an overseeder planter for grass. The one that I used the other day has 3 drums with 1 1/2" or so 3/8" dia solid spikes on it. They poke holes in the ground thru the grass that is already growing, and the grass seed falls onto an angled plate, whick then directs it to fall on top of the first drum, which spreads it evenly across the ground. It goes on the 3-point behind the tractor. I overseeded at the rate of 100# per acre.


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Originally Posted By: sprkplug
A SOIL aerator! I've been trying to figure out how a membrane diffuser sitting on bare clay would provide any type of boost towards grass growth...I must be tired.

Glad you got the tractor out. Any casualties to man, machine, or macrochirus?

Tony everybody and everything survived, but I'll try not to do that again. Twice. I was filling a washout below a watershed drainpipe and the Kubota paddle shifter decided we would go forward instead of backwards. Twice.

Originally Posted By: esshup
Al, if it's worth doing once, it's worth doing twice!! With practice, you're getting better at extracting it.

They make an overseeder planter for grass. The one that I used the other day has 3 drums with 1 1/2" or so 3/8" dia solid spikes on it. They poke holes in the ground thru the grass that is already growing, and the grass seed falls onto an angled plate, whick then directs it to fall on top of the first drum, which spreads it evenly across the ground. It goes on the 3-point behind the tractor. I overseeded at the rate of 100# per acre.

Scott, that's exactly what I was wanting to do. I should have known there were commercial sized tools to do what I wanted. It just seems like everybody fights the same watering/evaporation problem when getting turf started. Holding more of the water you can put out, and keeping the seed wet longer, seems like a better way. I'll find out this next Spring.


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Originally Posted By: esshup
Al, as soon as I read the first sentence I thought you were talking about seeding and haying around the pond.... wink grin

Setterguy:
The pond looks good! How much water is in it now?? I'll bet you're going to need to talk to Rex (Rainman) about doing an alum treatment for your pond. It looks pretty turbid from the clay.

Got the Fatheads in there yet??


The clay is starting to settle a bit, but I suspect I'll need the aluminum treatment.
No minnows yet. Hopefully in the next week or two. Do I need to get a feeder going for fatheads?
Still at 5'+. No additional rain, but. maybe some today. Great, the straw isn't done.
The good news it, it's only dropped about a half inch in the last week or so.


9 yr old pond, 1 ac, 15' deep.
RES, YP, GS, FHM (no longer), HBG (going away), SMB, and HSB (only one seen in 5 yrs) Restocked HSB (2020) Have seen one of these.
I think that's about all I should put in my little pond.
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Originally Posted By: highflyer
PM me and I'll tell you about solar watering. It is easy, but it is some work. But I did get grass established. If you look at my older posts, its all in there.


I'm going to try and look this up. Hoping the wheat comes up pretty quickly.
Thx


9 yr old pond, 1 ac, 15' deep.
RES, YP, GS, FHM (no longer), HBG (going away), SMB, and HSB (only one seen in 5 yrs) Restocked HSB (2020) Have seen one of these.
I think that's about all I should put in my little pond.
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HAY SPREAD IT OUT AND IF ITS REALLY STEEP LIGHTLU DISK IT IN , I HAVE DONE A LOT OF AREAS KIH]KE THIS, IT WILL HOLD THE MOISTURE IT ,

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Quote: Do I need to get a feeder going for fatheads?

There are different opinions here on PBF about feed benefiting FHM and the smaller fish. I would guess it depends a lot on how much natural food there currently is in the pond for them. If your pond is really new without much chance for natural foods to have been established I would guess it would be beneficial. But I'm no expert.

I fed my FHM and fingerling BG, and I can tell you from experience, they will definitely eat the food well. It might take them a while to get started, but FHM are little eating machines. They are not long of this world, so they have to use every chance they can get to eat and reproduce.

I just hand fed mine. You might try that if you don't want to set up a feeder yet and if you are around the pond regularly.

Last edited by snrub; 09/20/14 02:58 PM.

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setterguy, you could feed, but it's not required. I wouldn't worry about it until the pond is full, you know it's holding water (although you could always use it as a deer feeder! grin) and you're stocking the fingerlings.


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I'll probably buy some fish chow, and throw it in when I'm up there.
Hopefully that won't do more harm than good.
It's bow season now, so I think I'll be up there pretty often.
Won't be real consistent though.


9 yr old pond, 1 ac, 15' deep.
RES, YP, GS, FHM (no longer), HBG (going away), SMB, and HSB (only one seen in 5 yrs) Restocked HSB (2020) Have seen one of these.
I think that's about all I should put in my little pond.
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I'd suggest feeding some Aquamax 5D01 fry crumble, or 5D02 (Purina's smallest pellet) if you put in a feeder. If you decide to treat with Alum, you'll quickly get a good growth on phytoplankton and macrophytes established from the good light penetration and freshly released nutrients from the dirt work.

You can expect a considerable amount of FA too in your first year or two. It will be a benefit in growing your young fish stock!



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Just stuck waiting for it to fill, but filling it will only add more clay, unless I get rain to get the wheat to kick in.. Rain will bring in more clay. It's a catch 22.
Ha, I will get some chow. Throw in a cedar tree or two for cover. I'm laying matts down on all the higher water flow areas coming into the pond, and putting down straw on the rest. If, and when it gets full, I will probably need to do the aluminum. Doing it before it's full, seems like a waste. Am I correct on that? It's not a quarter full yet.
It looks like it's going to fill, and hold water, but I'm not 100% sure of that. Whew...


9 yr old pond, 1 ac, 15' deep.
RES, YP, GS, FHM (no longer), HBG (going away), SMB, and HSB (only one seen in 5 yrs) Restocked HSB (2020) Have seen one of these.
I think that's about all I should put in my little pond.
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45 bales of straw, and it could have used more. Four 8' x 100+' of erosion control mats, 100s of pounds of fescue and wheat seed.. I'm finally ready for a bit more rain.
I should have rented some kind of straw spreading blower, or something. Doing it by hand was a long hard process.
Some of the wheat is already starting to come up. Should I let the wheat get to full height, and not mow it where I have the fescue mixed in? Won't it shade the fescue too much?
I'm sure I'm overthinking this again. Ha
Edit, so far, in the last two weeks, the water level has dropped about 1.5". Seem normal??




Last edited by SetterGuy; 09/28/14 07:57 AM.

9 yr old pond, 1 ac, 15' deep.
RES, YP, GS, FHM (no longer), HBG (going away), SMB, and HSB (only one seen in 5 yrs) Restocked HSB (2020) Have seen one of these.
I think that's about all I should put in my little pond.
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Looks really good, setter!! Yes, I'd say a 1.5" drop is very normal. Soils surrounding the pond are getting saturated, and you will have a good amount of water wicking into the soils above the pond.



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I'm assuming it is winter wheat, and mowing it so it will not get so big it joints might even help keep it from winter killing. If the wheat gets big enough it "joints" freezing weather will kill it. I've raised a lot of wheat for the last 40+ years but can't say I've had much experience mowing it, but I don't think it would hurt anything, just don't get carried away. Let it get some size before you do (six or eight inches) and mow it 4" high. Don't mow it at a half inch like a golf course or you probably will kill it. Keep in mind, winter wheat is often used for winter grazing of cattle, then the cattle are taken off and still raise a wheat crop. So judicious mowing should not hurt it.

Winter wheat will go dormant at freeze up and green up early next spring. One of the first things to green up. You can mow it then too, and that will keep it from going into reproductive stage (stem with a wheat head on it) and actually make it last longer staying green further into the summer. When hot weather gets here, it will eventually die off, as it is an annual.

The wheat will repress the fescue somewhat. You will think you have no fescue, because the stuff is tiny and at least at my age, I have to get on my hands and knees to even see the tiny, thin bladed stuff when it comes up. But it will likely be there, and when the wheat dies off, will finally start growing more. In the mean time, the wheat will at first support a good root system to help hold the soil in place, and later provide mulch to keep rain drops from displacing soil to get erosion started.

Last edited by snrub; 09/28/14 05:20 PM.

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Originally Posted By: Rainman
Looks really good, setter!! Yes, I'd say a 1.5" drop is very normal. Soils surrounding the pond are getting saturated, and you will have a good amount of water wicking into the soils above the pond.


Thanks. Hoping by spring, it'll be full, and still holding steady..


9 yr old pond, 1 ac, 15' deep.
RES, YP, GS, FHM (no longer), HBG (going away), SMB, and HSB (only one seen in 5 yrs) Restocked HSB (2020) Have seen one of these.
I think that's about all I should put in my little pond.
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Originally Posted By: snrub
I'm assuming it is winter wheat, and mowing it so it will not get so big it joints might even help keep it from winter killing. If the wheat gets big enough it "joints" freezing weather will kill it. I've raised a lot of wheat for the last 40+ years but can't say I've had much experience mowing it, but I don't think it would hurt anything, just don't get carried away. Let it get some size before you do (six or eight inches) and mow it 4" high. Don't mow it at a half inch like a golf course or you probably will kill it. Keep in mind, winter wheat is often used for winter grazing of cattle, then the cattle are taken off and still raise a wheat crop. So judicious mowing should not hurt it.

Winter wheat will go dormant at freeze up and green up early next spring. One of the first things to green up. You can mow it then too, and that will keep it from going into reproductive stage (stem with a wheat head on it) and actually make it last longer staying green further into the summer. When hot weather gets here, it will eventually die off, as it is an annual.

The wheat will repress the fescue somewhat. You will think you have no fescue, because the stuff is tiny and at least at my age, I have to get on my hands and knees to even see the tiny, thin bladed stuff when it comes up. But it will likely be there, and when the wheat dies off, will finally start growing more. In the mean time, the wheat will at first support a good root system to help hold the soil in place, and later provide mulch to keep rain drops from displacing soil to get erosion started.


Thank you. Lots of good info. If it keeps the soil in place now, and provides a little mulch for the fescue to get started, I'll be a happy camper.
I never did get any lime down. So, it's just seed and straw on clay. The wheat looks like it's going to come up, not sure about the fescue.


9 yr old pond, 1 ac, 15' deep.
RES, YP, GS, FHM (no longer), HBG (going away), SMB, and HSB (only one seen in 5 yrs) Restocked HSB (2020) Have seen one of these.
I think that's about all I should put in my little pond.
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Take a sample of the soil and get it tested. That will give you a starting reference for future liming.


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I am getting a bit more optimistic. Some of the wheat and fescue is coming up, along with the water level. Just 4' more to go.


The water is coming in so much more clear. It'll still need aluminum treatment in the spring, I would imagine.
Must be 13' deep in spots. (& holding..)


9 yr old pond, 1 ac, 15' deep.
RES, YP, GS, FHM (no longer), HBG (going away), SMB, and HSB (only one seen in 5 yrs) Restocked HSB (2020) Have seen one of these.
I think that's about all I should put in my little pond.
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Those pictures are a HUGE change from the end of July!! Congrats!


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Good job! Looks great.


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Originally Posted By: loretta
Good job! Looks great.


Thanks. You all know what a job something like this is.. Whew..


9 yr old pond, 1 ac, 15' deep.
RES, YP, GS, FHM (no longer), HBG (going away), SMB, and HSB (only one seen in 5 yrs) Restocked HSB (2020) Have seen one of these.
I think that's about all I should put in my little pond.
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Originally Posted By: SetterGuy
Originally Posted By: loretta
Good job! Looks great.


Thanks. You all know what a job something like this is.. Whew..


Piece 'o cake!! laugh


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Question guys..
You can see from my October pics, that the grass and wheat came up last fall.
I'm thinking of dumping a bit more seed down.
The question is; will I do something awful to the water if I also throw down some fertilizer on the new grass and seed? I was going to put down lime also.
Im not talking about a lot of fertilizer, but maybe a light broadcast of some starter type for lawns.
I just figure the stronger I can get this new grass, the better it's going to hold up in filtering the incoming water and stabilizing the banks.
I suspect when the guys farming the two alfalfa fields spray fertilizer this spring, some of that will end up in the pond also.
I'm getting ready to put in fish, I don't want to mess up the water..
Thanks,
Jeff


9 yr old pond, 1 ac, 15' deep.
RES, YP, GS, FHM (no longer), HBG (going away), SMB, and HSB (only one seen in 5 yrs) Restocked HSB (2020) Have seen one of these.
I think that's about all I should put in my little pond.
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Your pond, grass, etc. is coming along nicely.

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Setterguy, You should have plenty of residual Alum in the water to handle a considerable amount of fertilizer Phosphates. Absent a soil assay determining an exact application to target pH goal, Ag lime at about 3-5 ton per acre would definitely help everything water water terrestrial....

More seed would be a big plus, and add some in the soon-to-be-flooded pool area.

Even IF you get some FA growth this spring and summer, it is going to aid in growing your fingerlings we'll be stocking soon by providing oxygen and habitat for forage foods.

Consider using a low P or zero P fertilizer...

Last edited by Rainman; 03/14/15 01:37 PM.


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