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Hey Everyone,

I'm new to the forum but have been following it for quite some time in anticipation of beginning the construction of my pond. I just received my JD letter from the Army Corps and my builder is moving equipment in NLT the first of November. I just wanted to post some pictures of the before as well as the plot and see what you guys think! FYI, my builder is extremely reputable in my area and is digging the pond free of charge minus the environmental consultant I had to pay.

Thanks in advance for all of the feedback I'm sure to receive.

-Daren

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Welcome to Pond Boss and enjoy the journey...

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It looks like your house and outbuildings are both below the dam. Am I looking at it right?

What are your plans for emergency spillway?

Last edited by Bocomo; 10/08/13 07:46 PM.
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No, the house and outbuilding will actually be about 5 feet above. I'm not sure about the spillway. The pond builder I'm using has an engineer that deals with all of the technical aspects of the plan.


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The pond builder has officially started working this week. He's been out there since Tuesday and has made good progress for only being out there 2 days. I know it's early, but I'm excited to finally see the process start and I'm anxious to see what comes. I've attached some pictures of the very early stages of development.

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-Daren
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Excited for you Daren! Congrats!

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Nice surroundings.

Our pond was made in an open previous pasture and although it turned our really nice it would have been even nicer to have had some trees around closer.

I'm cleaning out a really old pond for my son now and his pond is going to have some old, large trees around it and irregular shape. It is going to be a really pretty looking pond. A lot more "character" than ours has.

Congrats and hope you enjoy not only the pond but the process of getting there.

Last edited by snrub; 10/31/13 09:40 AM.

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Thanks, snrub. I was honestly mixed on the trees at first for two reasons. First, I was worried about the excess foliage dropping in the pond and causing algae. Second, I wanted better access for wind to hit the pond. After seeing the land cleared and knowing my builder is leaving a 10-12ft drive all the way around the pond, I doubt I'm going to have any problems.

I'm really looking forward to the next couple of years!


-Daren
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What's the status of your project?

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Hmm...he must be out fishing.

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Well, after over a year of waiting, the house and barn are under construction. The original pond builder really messed things up and my new contractor is working hard to fix it. Overall, I've incurred about 10k in extra costs due to the mess ups. I'm not too happy about it, but am super excited to see how this materializes in the next few months. We're eyeing a completion time frame of around December for the house and pond. I'll have a lot more pictures to come as the project takes shape!

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-Daren
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I'm a relative new comer to the forum, but in the few years I have been here, there has been at least 10 or more bad contractors, bad ponds, expensive 'flops' to every 1 good experience. The cost is always shifted to the pond owner. It is disheartening to see all these pond misery stories.

Can't we compile a 'Angie's List' or buyer beware list for bad contractors?

call it the PB BBB (Pond Boss Better Builder Boys) or the Pond Boss 'Hole of Fame'?

Not to trash any excavators out there but only to help save money and give props to those who truly know what they are doing!

If only a small percentage of the money saved by folks digging their pond once and having it turn out correct was donated back to the forum to maintain this database of useful excavators, the site would be brimming with financial resources smile

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This is yet another reason why I am so glad I bought a property with a time tested pond already on it. Too many heartache stories compared to the number of first time try success stories.

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Part of the problem is that building a pond is a rather specialized field. It involves WAY more than just owning a backhoe or bulldozer and knowing how to use them!

Soil conditions -- especially PI index & clay composition -- are a vital consideration to proper pond construction. The core trench must be built well, or nothing else matters. Potential leaks must be recognized and dealt with on the site. The emergency spillway must be carefully constructed to handle extreme rain events without causing erosion. And so much more...

There are tons of folks out there who can move dirt, but knowing the ins and outs of pond building is another matter altogether.

I'm only a wizened veteran of exactly one pond, but I've been incredibly blessed to interact with TWO awesome pond constructors: Mike Otto (who needs no introduction here) and Mike Smelley, a dirt guy who operates out of Marshall, TX.

Mike Otto clued me in to the fact that the property's major selling point, a red clay hill, was in fact full of sand and iron. Very low PI, totally unsuitable for pond construction. After looking for six years, this was not news I wanted to hear about a pond property I desperately wanted. cry

Mike O didn't quit there, though. He came back with a local backhoe operator and dug some test holes down near the creek bottom. Lo and behold, glorious gray/white clay!!! grin Thanks to Otto, I went ahead and bought the property. Mike, I really appreciate your time & effort to help a stranger!

Otto's schedule was too full for me to hire him to actually build the pond, though. The realtor recommended someone he knew had a reputation for hard work, competence, and integrity: Mike Smelley. (Don't know why guys named Mike make such good dirtmovers...)

Now, Mike Smelley talks country. I mean REALLY country! But I quickly learned that he knew his business thoroughly. He came out to the raw land, looked at the soils, the topography, asked me some basic questions about what I wanted, and gave me a quote.

The quote, I found out later, was quite reasonable for what I wanted done. But I agreed more on the basis of a feeling that this guy, like Mike Otto, was a man of integrity who would do what he said he'd do. No cut corners here. And, remarkably, Mike S said that I wouldn't have to pay him a dime until after he was finished and I was happy. (I guess he felt I was a man of integrity as well.)

We had to wait six agonizing months because the ground was simply too wet for heavy machinery -- some of his spreaders run over 250,000 pounds when loaded. When it finally got hot & dry, though, Mike S and his sons/friend swung into action FAST. I came out to observe and was impressed by the rapid pace and Mike's knowledge of exactly what he was doing.

The job wasn't simple, as I desired an island at the end of a long peninsula. Mike pointed out that I was losing a lot of pond to the island, so we cut it in half lengthwise. He also explained about why he shifted the curvature of the dam so that the emergency spillway would dump extra water where it wouldn't create a problem. Bob Lusk, my pond adviser, came out and was impressed with Smelley's work. If Bob likes it, I like it!

Well, I could go on, but the long and short of it is that either of these Mikes will do good work with integrity. Smelley has never advertised and so is not as busy as Otto, but he loves pond construction. If I were advising a friend who wanted to build a pond in north or northeast Texas, I'd recommend calling either or both of these two gentlemen.




Last edited by anthropic; 08/09/15 01:34 AM.

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Anth this is a great review - and while not surprising considering with whom you're working, is still very valuable to the forum. Before I engineer another pond, Otto will be on site consulting - it will be a cost I build in for the client that simply isn't negotiable. If a client wants to cut corners and take risks to save money, it's not a project in which I'm interested. Thankfully I have a day job that pays the bills, and can afford to walk away from projects.


Many men go fishing all of their lives without knowing that it is not fish they are after. ~ Henry David Thoreau

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Originally Posted By: canyoncreek
I'm a relative new comer to the forum, but in the few years I have been here, there has been at least 10 or more bad contractors, bad ponds, expensive 'flops' to every 1 good experience. The cost is always shifted to the pond owner. It is disheartening to see all these pond misery stories.

Can't we compile a 'Angie's List' or buyer beware list for bad contractors?

call it the PB BBB (Pond Boss Better Builder Boys) or the Pond Boss 'Hole of Fame'?

Not to trash any excavators out there but only to help save money and give props to those who truly know what they are doing!

If only a small percentage of the money saved by folks digging their pond once and having it turn out correct was donated back to the forum to maintain this database of useful excavators, the site would be brimming with financial resources smile


Canyoncreek, I suspect we get to hear about a significantly high portion of the "problem" ponds here on PBF rather than all the successful ones. After all, if a person has a problem with a pond, what are they likely to do? Do a web search to see if they can find information that could help. What do they find? Pond Boss Forum. But how many successful pond builds are out there that never have reason to seek out pond advice (or don't know they need it) so don't ever discover PBF or report on their successful pond?

There have to be hundreds of ponds in the two closest counties around me, yet as far as I know not one owner other than I am on PBF. Closest PBF member to me that I know of has property probably 50 miles away and the next closest is likely half a state away.

My point is, we likely hear of the "problem" pond that is likely one in hundreds of relatively successful builds.


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Smart move, TJ. One thing I learned is that soil appearances can be deceptive -- that red "clay" hill was anything but -- and that without the right soil the pond just won't work.

Mike Smelley told me several sad stories about people who went ahead and built a pond despite being warned they didn't have enough clay. He has refused good paying work because he didn't want to build something he knew would be problematic.

Last edited by anthropic; 08/09/15 04:56 PM.

7ac 2015 CNBG RES FHM 2016 TP FLMB 2017 NLMB GSH L 2018 TP & 70 HSB PK 2019 TP RBT 2020 TFS TP 25 HSB 250 F1,L,RBT -206 2021 TFS TP GSH L,-312 2022 GSH TP CR TFS RBT -234, 2023 BG TP TFS NLMB, -160




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[/quote]
Canyoncreek, I suspect we get to hear about a significantly high portion of the "problem" ponds here on PBF rather than all the successful ones. After all, if a person has a problem with a pond, what are they likely to do? Do a web search to see if they can find information that could help. What do they find? Pond Boss Forum. But how many successful pond builds are out there that never have reason to seek out pond advice (or don't know they need it) so don't ever discover PBF or report on their successful pond?

There have to be hundreds of ponds in the two closest counties around me, yet as far as I know not one owner other than I am on PBF. Closest PBF member to me that I know of has property probably 50 miles away and the next closest is likely half a state away.

My point is, we likely hear of the "problem" pond that is likely one in hundreds of relatively successful builds. [/quote]

Good point, snrub. On the other hand, many ponds have reverted back to grass because they couldn't hold water, or the emergency spillway wasn't built properly. We don't necessarily see them, but they used to exist.

Even ponds that do hold water usually have issues such as weeds, loads of small underweight bass, algae, etc. Pond Boss can really help folks even when their pond is well constructed.


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I would agree with much of the above... people rarely come to a discussion board to praise a contractor. Rather, they show up looking for a place to vent about a bad one. In this case, the guy has constructed several ponds in my area, and they're all gorgeous. Now, he has several unfinished "pits" as he calls them. He recently lost several contracts which isn't helping matters. Instead of ceasing his projects, he's been going in, taking all of the valuable dirt, and getting out without finishing the job. That is specifically why my project was at a standstill for quite some time. The guy I have working now is quite knowledgeable and said he can fix it up nicely. See the attached photo for a snapshot of where we sit as of Friday. MODERATOR: Can we move this thread to the "New Pond Construction" area since it's a little better of a fit? Thanks!

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Finally got a chance to post an update for this week. We've come a long way on the grading portion of the project. The foundation pad is also getting built up nicely. Today, he started expanding the pond into the back of the property. I'm pretty happy with the progress.

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Last edited by USMC4Life; 08/19/15 06:19 PM.

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Good to see some progress!!

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Well... the rain in the southeast has finally stopped and has allowed us to make some progress on our house, barn, and finally... POND! The attached pictures will give a little glimpse of where we stand. I think he'll be sloping the pond in the near future and setting a final grade. My final product will include a +/- 1 acre pond at around 8-10 feet deep, a 2500 square foot 1 story house, and a 52X60 detached garage with 16 foot ceilings. Can't wait to see the project come to fruition.

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Exciting times...keep us in the loop!


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I'll try my best to keep updates coming. I stopped by today and there was significant progress with getting the barn formed up and ready for concrete. After seeing it formed, the 52x60 is seeming about right considering we initially planned for a 52x80.

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Looks good. The updates are great.

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