Pond Boss Forums GENERAL QUESTIONS Muddy water Trout and muddy water

After surviving an unusually hot summer, the trout in my spring-fed pond have had to endure the indignity of muddy waters twice in the past three weeks. The more recent and severe episode began Thursday night into Friday when almost 6" of rain fell here in Rockbridge County, Virginia.
The trout have withstood several mild muddy water intervals in the past, but this seems to be the most severe yet. Visibility is down to literally 2" to 3". My pond never used to sustain any turbidity, but a "neighbor" (maybe I should just call him an "adjacent property owner"?) cut a logging road right along the property line, just above my pond, almost two years ago. And now each heavy rain event brings at least a little silt and discoloration.
This is now the third day for this kind of suspended clay turbidity, the longest event yet. Anybody out there familiar with how long rainbows can withstand this type of muddy grief? The trout receive supplemental feed -- usually about three times a week this time of year.
Time for me to start thinking about gypsum or alum? Green hay, maybe? It's only a 1/4 acre pond.
I am also attempting my first try at adding photos per Photobucket -- but I have a Mac and am not sure if the directions I am trying to follow will work for a Mac. The three photos should depict: my pond when it's clear, and two very recent and very muddy views.
Sorry for the length of this post. Any advice and guidance re rainbows and mud flows will be greatly appreciated. -- Mike Smith, Lexington, VA

[/IMG]
[/IMG]
[/IMG]

There is this post about trout and muddy water:

pond boss forums

Many thanks -- that was a very helpful post, indeed. I'll sit tight for a day or two and see how the pond clears. All of my trout are well over 12" so hopefully gill damage will not be an issue. Re fixing the source of the silt, the landowner has assured me that upgrades will soon be made to the logging road -- which now has at least some gravel on it.
I'm thinking about getting a truckload of sand and have that deposited in a row along the strip of land inside my fence line to slow or trap as much silty water as possible. Just is case, I'm also going to locate a local alum supplier. Again, thanks for referring that post.

ML,

Having zero experience raising trout, I will yield to LRunkle's post as it leads to some very useful information from Cecil.

On the issue of your sand trap, current stormwater/runoff mitigation practices during construction, in our area, involve the use of fiber netting. Prior procedures incorporated the use of hay bales. Personally, I would not use a sand berm for fear it may compound your problem during heavy rains unless it was planned as a permanent fixture and seeded, as noted in one of Cecil's posts.

Thanks for posting pictures of your pond. They represent a textbook case of the adverse effects of uncontrolled runoff/siltation. Hopefully your neighbor will take the necessary step to remedy the problem.

Hey Mike,
I wonder if you could install some storm wattle (fiber log) along the logging road to reduce the sediment runoff. Although I'm just a bean counter I work with several large trenching & grading contractors in California. They use storm wattle (aka fiber log) along graded areas to reduce silt runoff. Here is a link to a product to give you an example of what I'm talking about.

http://www.bascousa.com/store/item.aspx?DEPARTMENT_ID=157&ITEM_ID=973

I don't have any affiliation with the company or product and don't know for certain that it would be appropriate for your application but I just thought I'd mention it. Maybe if you installed it along the logging road or between your pond and the road it would help cut down the silt runoff. If you do an internet search on "storm wattle" you will get a bunch of info.

I know it wouldn't help your current situation but might slow down the silt runoff in the future.

Russ and Jeff --
Many thanks for the input and suggestions. I'm really intrigued by those storm wattles and want to see if I can get some locally to try them out.
Visibility increased somewhat in the pond today. It's now almost 8". An improvement, but still not what I'm used to.
I tried my first limited application of aluminum sulfate today. I mixed in almost 8 pounds and distributed it as evenly as possible around the pond (canoes sure weren't designed for tasks like this!).
So, I'll start researching storm wattles ... and wait and see how the aluminum sulfate works over the next couple of days. Many thanks, once again. -- Mike

Just wanted to share this update. My pond is clear once again, and my neighbor has begun work on silt trap boxes below two culverts. For my part, I still have to place some straw bales -- and I may try a storm wattle, or fiber log, or two if I can locate some down in Roanoke (none in town here).
Anyway, this photo shows the chara beds pretty clearly -- one of my ongoing weed maintenance issues. I guess one "silver lining" of all the muddy water was that it slowed the chara growth!
Now that the water's cold and the trout are active, I'll try to snap an underwater photo or two to see if I can get a picture of them feeding. Thanks again for your help and suggestions. -- Mike

http://i85.photobucket.com/albums/k48/mlcsmith/013_13A.jpg

Don't know why the previous picture didn't open and display ... in any event, this is what the pond looked like two winters ago, after the chara dies back.

Can you use grass carp in Virginia? I'm going to be using them to fight chara in a guys pond. I'll wait for spring. It should start to die back soon.

Dave --
You can indeed use grass carp in Virginia -- they allow the use of the triploid fish, with permits.
Believe it or not, this little pond has 8 grass carp in it already. A former owner put them in. And they're HUGE. In fact, that's the problem. From the literauture I've been able to turn up, grass carp will indeed crop down chara ... until they're about 18"-20" long. Then, for some reason, they seem to lost their taste for it and switch to other plants. I have no idea what they feed on in my pond. But the very smallest is 30" if it's an inch! And they are all skittish as can be!
My best guess about their current diet is the little shoots at the base of cattails, beacuse I find an unually high number of cattail roots floating in the pond. But that's only a guess.
If I ever catch one, the very first thing I'll do is examine its belly to see if I can identify what they feed on. But I don't know how to catch them! I had foul-hooked one once about two years ago -- using a small fly, intended for trout, I accidentally hooked the caudal fin of a grass carp. WOW. A memorable, but brief "fight": it emptied my fly reel in about three seconds flat.
I may have to ask "catmandoo" from up in Hampshire County, WV, to come down and give me a lesson -- he caught a huge grass carp from his pond and posted a great picture back on Oct. 6. I've even contemplated investing in bow-fishing gear ... but then I think, we'll those big old things are sure fun to watch, and visitors from the city always mistake them for the trout I grow ... now that's really fun!

ML Smith, you can certainly hook up with a GC if you are feeding pellets by using pellet flies.
The problem is not in hooking them – it’s landing them on light tackle.
They go berserk when landing them and break of light leaders.

I solved that problem recently using my 10wt striper rod with 16 # test leader w/pellet fly, catching a 31.5inch, 14 pound GC.

“Freshwater Bonefish”

ML Smith, I have 2 of the darned things. They are about 36 inches long and do a great job of wrecking tackle. The only way I can think of to reduce their numbers is to shoot them. I'm not wild about that idea but, at that size, they are not doing their job. I'll be restocking one of my ponds and quite a few others next spring.

I originally put 7 in but 5 disappeared due to natural mortality. However, before they left, they pretty well cleaned up the pond. If I were you, and I realize that I'm not, I would keep a couple of them and get rid of the rest. Restock with some younger ones having higher meatabolism rates.

Dave, do you think you could shoot more than one GC before the rest of them become gun-shy?

I’ve thought about shooting them, as well as huge overstocked CC, but worried about spooking the fish?

I doubt you could get more than 2 by shooting without some serious time off in between episodes.

Heck, when I deer hunt I have to sit still for hours. I sometimes use a tower stand. It would take time but I figure you could get grass carp pretty quickly. You could probably pick off the cats with a feeder and a 22.

Actually, I would love to have a tall deer blind next to the pond. Just to watch.

George --
I feed pellets -- a 42% protein pellet from Zeigler Mills up in PA -- but I've never seen a garss carp come into feed. It's usually trout first in the chow line, followed by the dozen or so channel cats left in my pond, and then a few hybrid sunfish. But never a grass carp, that I have witnessed.
And, Dave, that deer stand idea is neat. I've been thinking about putting one in just for the purpose of fish watching and photography (and if it scares away the neighborhood great blue heron, well, that's okay too!). -- Mike