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#361729 01/02/14 11:08 PM
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I'm giving myself a 50th birthday present...a 60'x30' shed with a 20'x30' single shop bay in it. The 40 x 30 shed will have gravel (for now). I think that building this way gives me more room for additional bays in the future. It might end up completely enclosed, and/or have a 30x40 bay added to the right side (South).

I'll just throw a bunch of pictures up to get to where we are today.

I put this further out from the house than existing structures. Once it's up, I'll tear down a couple of buildings.



Planning ahead for a two-post lift.



And a bathroom, with shower.



Slab laid, before Thanksgiving.



This will be a building one day.



And these...at 540# each.



Got the poles set.



And today, I came home to this wonderful sight:






Mobilus #361735 01/03/14 03:39 AM
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Looking good.


You can pay more but you cant buy better.
Mobilus #361742 01/03/14 08:29 AM
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I bet the northern guys look at and say "that will never work, we would have 6' of snow on top".

Quite the difference of buildings going from the far south to way up in Canada and what loads they have to support.

We would need a little more slope on that roof here somewhere in the middle.

Will be a nice addition to his property.


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Mobilus #361743 01/03/14 08:54 AM
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Looks great.

Several years ago I built a pole building 24' x 24' and 12' high at the bottom of roof joists. It is for storing my larger toys.

I only put sheeting on only one side and on half of the back. It let's drop my tractor implements and other heavy items in positions where I don't have to move things to get at the implement I want to use.


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Mobilus #361753 01/03/14 10:44 AM
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Nice work ! I can appreciate this process.
















Mobilus #361759 01/03/14 11:35 AM
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covered space is always good...and it doesn't seem to matter how big you build a building it ends up not big enough. Looking good!


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Looking good!! Keep the pic's a coming.


"If you aim at nothing you'll hit it every time"

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Mobilus #361816 01/03/14 09:51 PM
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Thanks, I appreciate the good words.

About the pitch, or the lack of pitch...snrub, you've got it pegged...most sheds are pretty low pitch here, and we get very little snow.

cat, I've seen that on a number of storage sheds around here. I have a 34' long gooseneck trailer that I want to get under cover, so that will stick out a bit. I'll put bollards in at the back of the trailer slot. My boat goes in next to the GN, so that end of the open bay can't have anything else. I have a 16' car hauler that'll go in the center and I'll put pallet racks up across that 20' span...got them for hauling them away from Lowes about ten years ago when they were changing them out.

dlowrance, your point is very much valid. And one thing about a lot of storage space is that you always need what is deep behind all the other stuff. One of the auto restorer/paint & body guys here has multiple bays, none deeper than two cars. That is why I decided to make this a single slope...I can add another 60' to the south before coming off the front. Of course, the likelihood of that happening is pretty small...but better to plan as if it can happen.

I may end up with a "porch" in front of the garage door. We'll see how hot it gets without it. I'm having insulation sprayed in.

Again, thanks for the compliments and ideas.

Mark

Mobilus #361854 01/04/14 10:44 AM
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Looking good Mobilus!

There are plenty of flat or low pitch roofs up here. Just have to design for potential snow loads. I'm leaning that direction myself.

Mobilus #361914 01/05/14 01:05 AM
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Have any of you had a metal building insulated with spray foam?

I think I'll go ahead and have it done once the shell is complete (hopefully next week). My builder swears by it, says that it keeps the building tighter and less noisy in addition to the heating efficiency. I do know that if I don't do it now, it probably won't happen.

Looking at roughly 1600 sq ft, what is a guesstimate on cost?

Mobilus #361933 01/05/14 11:19 AM
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Go by the old saying, "You pay for insulation, whether you get it or not". Something like that.

I've heard nothing but good about the spray foam. I think it "Is" pricey but very good. Agreed, do it now.


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Mobilus #362140 01/06/14 10:39 PM
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Got all the steel work done today!







Looking forward to seeing the sheeting go up! And I will definitely paint that door!

Mobilus #362323 01/08/14 08:04 AM
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I'm also interested in the cost of spray foaming. I want to do the 20 ft shipping container that I bought. I have a card with the contact info of a guy in Bowie that does it but haven't done anything yet.

I bought the container to store my 4 wheelers after my others were stolen and was told that the extreme heat would be bad for the bikes.


It's not about the fish. It's about the pond. Take care of the pond and the fish will be fine. PB subscriber since before it was in color.

Without a sense of urgency, Nothing ever gets done.

Boy, if I say "sic em", you'd better look for something to bite. Sam Shelley Rancher and Farmer Muleshoe Texas 1892-1985 RIP
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I got a rough quote for doing a pole barn. 30'x40'x10' tall walls. One 40' side has a service door, an 18' wide and a 10' wide garage door. So, roughly 1,100 sq. ft. Spraying the walls only, not the ceiling. 2" thick would give approximately R16 and would be around $7,000.00.

I don't know if that's high or low. If any of you get a quote, let me know what it was because I'm curious to see how honest the guy was.


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esshup #362331 01/08/14 08:44 AM
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I'm not sure about foam insulation on the walls, but I know from experience that you need some type of barrier on the ceiling of a pole barn to retard sweating. I have two barns, both about 40 x 60, one with one inch foam pads under the sheet metal and one with nothing under the roof metal. The one without anything under the roof drips internal moisture continually during certain times of the year. At times it almost appears that it is raining inside.


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Mobilus #362333 01/08/14 08:50 AM
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Dave - Ive found that my 20' container doesn't get stifling hot. Part of it is probably because it is a very light grey, and it is shaded most of the time. In the summer it will get warmer than the out side temp, but not by much. But, then we usually don't have many days when it gets to even the mid-90s.

We built a new house about a dozen years ago. I don't remember the particulars, but I don't believe it was significantly different than fiberglass batt. Two guys with sprayers did the two story house, with finished basement, in less than a day. That included between the ceiling/floor joists.


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Mobilus #362335 01/08/14 09:05 AM
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One of my neighbors just finished insulating a 32X40 machine shed last week. He went with the old school pink fiberglass rolls, as they were right at 1/2 the cost of the spray in for the same R value. that was calculating material costs only, as he was planning to do either job himself. He did not factor in the extra time it took, which was considerable. I'd guess 3 times as long to install 'standard' insulation vs the spray in? Maybe 4 times?

Another consideration in his case was that he had a conventionally constructed shed, with 2X6 wall studs at 16" centers - so rolled insulation was a viable solution. In your case you'd either be going with the 4X8 sheets of polyethylene foam or the spray in solution. The foam sheets install easily, I've used them in several applications.


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Mobilus #362338 01/08/14 09:59 AM
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Dave, I'll ask the guy about your container when I hear from him and let you know. Wasn't that container red? A good coat of Sno Seal (I think that's what the stuff you can paint the top of a travel trailer with is called) might make a big difference.

esshup/cat, I have been looking on different sites and my observation is that the further north one is, the higher the price of spray foram insulation. Downright ridiculous in the northeast, from what I've read...also, it appears that Texas has some of the better prices. From your bid, that's around $3.50 sq ft/in. I'm hoping for half that...we'll see.

Bing, I've experienced the ceiling sweating in a 20x20 detached garage that we have. I used to work inside hardened aircraft shelters in various countries around the world, and came to accept the "inside rain" as a fact of life. Supposedly the spray on insulation will eliminate it.

dlowrance, I have had so many unexpected expenses this past year that I have just learned to take a deep breath and do it (whatever "it" is) because the options are limited, but all are expensive. You're right about my options here, and I think that the spray foam would be the better choice if I want to get to work "in" and not just "on " this shop.

Heck, I just got hit with a $2300 bill for the wife's truck and that is for periodic maintenance (timing chains, sprockets, phasers, and tensioners/guides)!!! But life is still good! Savings might be taking a hit, but that's what it's there for, right?

Mobilus #362352 01/08/14 12:52 PM
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Mark, I called the guy in Bowie today and left a message to call me. It's the typical red/rust color that is normal on the containers. Let me know if you hear from your guy.

Ken, it gets hot enough in the summer that I open the double doors and stand back away for a minute.

To illustrate the difference in our climates: In the summer, we can't leave on Friday after work to go there. Our mobile home(AKA Poor White Trash Trailer House) has a large 220v A/C in the front and a small 110v in the back bedroom. The 110 cannot cool the mattresses enough to sleep on them. So, we go on Saturday morning and one of my first steps is to turn on the A/C, turn back the bed spread and top sheet and close the door. Even then, it takes a couple of hours to cool the mattress. When I light the water heater, the burner doesn't start. The water is already hot enough.

If it's too expensive for spray insulation, I'll Kool Seal the top and paint the sides of the container white.


Last edited by Dave Davidson1; 01/08/14 12:54 PM.

It's not about the fish. It's about the pond. Take care of the pond and the fish will be fine. PB subscriber since before it was in color.

Without a sense of urgency, Nothing ever gets done.

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Originally Posted By: Dave Davidson1
If it's too expensive for spray insulation, I'll Kool Seal the top and paint the sides of the container white.

Some air vents installed at the top and bottom of the walls would keep the inside of the shipping container somewhat cooler. They are fairly airtight.

Mobilus, nice job on your shop. (aka: man cave/dog house)

Mobilus #362655 01/12/14 03:37 PM
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Thanks, gully washer!

I got the sheeting started! Well, the building crew did, anyway.

I had measured out what I needed in the closed "shop" portion and it will still be adequate for a single stall bay, as I planned....

but, the pad seemed small when there was no structure on it, then it seemed larger when the steel went up, but now that the sheeting has enclosed three sides it seems small again.





I know it is a visual thing, and will work just fine. Isn't it strange how perception of spaces changes?

Hopefully, it'll get finished this week. I still haven't gotten an estimate on the insulation. Once the builders are done and I have built up and leveled out the ground in the open part, I have to buy some gravel. Don't know about prices elsewhere, but it's pretty spendy here. I'm going to stain and seal the concrete...any recommendations on brands?

Last edited by Mobilus; 01/12/14 03:41 PM. Reason: add pic
Mobilus #362667 01/12/14 08:11 PM
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The shop is lookin good! Just wanted to mention, when your asking about spray insulation know which kind your getting a quote for as there are two kinds, open cell and closed cell. The closed cell is much more expensive and packs a better R value in a smaller space. Search google to learn other differences. I had closed cell installed on my old farm house because the walls are true 2 x 4 and I could get more R value in that space.


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Mobilus #362861 01/13/14 10:11 PM
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Thanks, Loretta!

I finally got a bid on the closed cell spray insulation for the shop: $2500. I want to check with some other installers before ponying up.

For those of you with experience, should I install electrical components (outlets, light fixtures, etc) before or after the insulation?

Mobilus #362892 01/14/14 01:18 PM
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Originally Posted By: Mobilus
Thanks, Loretta!

I finally got a bid on the closed cell spray insulation for the shop: $2500. I want to check with some other installers before ponying up.

For those of you with experience, should I install electrical components (outlets, light fixtures, etc) before or after the insulation?


Depends on how thick your going. I have seen guys put a bolt through the end of the chainsaw bar and use it as a depth guide to cut a grove to place the wire in when wiring the shop. Up here in Canada we put 3" closed cell spray insulation.

In my experience it is best to run the electrical first. If you have any water lines do not spray directly on them. They will freeze up here if you do that. Most people think spraying them with foam is the best thing to do but the foam will transfer cold even that it is insulation and they will freeze. Best to leave an air gap.

Cheers Don.

Last edited by DonoBBD; 01/14/14 01:18 PM.

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David, those shipping containers get real hot in the summer time. I have loaded/unloaded hundreds of them over the last 30 years and the temps get way up there.

We warehouse a lot of the spray foam products and it does work very well, but....once the interior gets warm isn't it still going to be pretty hot?

Have you considered building a pole barn type roof over your container? That might be a cheaper solution and also allow for creating some vents in the container.

Just my 2 cents worth of opinion.


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