Pond Boss Forums POND CONSTRUCTION Soil questions Bob, Is Rock a Deal Breaker?

I was wondering if rock means no dice on the dam construction. I took my dozer and dug a hole to see what the soil looked like, and to have one of the local contractors look at it also. I hit a bed of rock at about 4 feet. I took some digital photos of the hole today and noticed there was some water in a hoof print one of our colts had left in the hole. Not sure if that's good or bad. I do have good clay up on the hill. This site is down in a dry creek bed that runs water only during heavy rain. If I knew how I would send the pics so you guys could look at the hole.

Troy,
Wood explains how to post pic's here:
http://www.pondboss.com/ubb/ultimatebb.php?ubb=get_topic;f=19;t=000054

Troy, can you tell us what kind of "rock" and where you are located?

Thanks for the replies.

I live about 5 miles west of Willow Springs, Missouri in the Ozark Mountains. I have done quite a bit of research on this site, but nothing definate has been figured out. I have posted before, trying to summon the courage to build the dam myself, but smart enough to know I did not have all the answers.

How do I tell what kind of rock it is? Today I had one of the local pond builders come out and look at the hole and the rock. He said that there was not enough clay on top of the rock. I asked what the difference was from having some clay on the rock to pushing the clay down the hill onto the rock. He said that would not work. I am still a little confused about the difference. He said in passing that the rock was limestone. I do not know how thick it is. I am going to try digging in a spot down from my first hole to see if the rock is constant.

My research has included:

Some soil guys came out from the USDA and said my land had very favorable clays, but they did not like the site that my house overlooks. They too hit that rock with their little 3" auger. They tried to get me to build a pond about a 1/4 mile from the house.

I had a local pond builder come out and shoot the site. He said that the site below my house laid perfect for a nice lake, and that I would have 5 to 6 acres of water, and 20 feet deep at the dam. He told me to dig down until I found good material. He gave me an estimate of $8000 dollars, if the good material was there.

The local USDA office would not design the dam for me - the guy said the dry creek drained 160 acres, and he couldn't design one that big.

I should add that there are several dry lakes around this area. I don't know if it's the rock or the pond builders.

Needless to say, it has been very discouraging, but I refuse to give up my dream of sitting on the porch over looking my own lake.

Any other suggestions?

By the way, what is ho - hammering?

Thanks

Limestone is porous,just look at all the caves we have here in Mo. The ground water flows down thru them. The water in your pond would do the same. I suggest you pack a min. of 12" of clay over the rock and bring in clay from elsewhere on your property to make the dam.

Guys,

I think I did this right. Now you can see what my first hole looked like. Since then I have dug two more. The second hole was west of the first about 30 yards and hit the same bed of rock. The second hole however hit really good looking clay! Yeah team! I did go through some rock before I got to the clay though, and I am wondering if the rock in the first two holes is maybe just a ledge. The rock I went through on the last hole was about 6" thick.

By the way, my wife thinks I am crazy, and making a mess of her view. Anybody heard that before? I will try and post a pic of the last hole also.

Do I need to list my username and password for you guys to see the pics?

username is twolunger, password is vpower

Thanks

What about removing the rock where the core is at? I am going to try and find out how thick the rock is and where the boundaries of it are, so I can possibly go around it. Like I said my last hole was clay, and it looked good.

I will try and post a picture of it also.

Mr. Robinson,

I think you are misunderstanding my situation. If you read my post, it said that the contractor quoted me that price IF conditions were right. He told me after he looked at the hole #1 that it would not hold, and he would not recommend trying it. I am not disputing that statement, but am looking for alternatives. The lay of the land is such that the embankment while wide, would not be very long, which is why the cost seems low. I am not sure what rates are where you live, but here you can hire a man and a D7 for $70 an hour.

He said nothing about ho-ramming or anything like that, those ideas have come from the other posters.

Like I said, my third hole which is less than 100 feet from the other two, has good clay in it, but the clay is about five feet which is under the rock layer. Thus my statement about trying to figure out where the rock is and how thick.

I should add that there is an existing pond in the area that would be flooded that holds good water, but is just a small stock pond. It does have some fish in it, but you can cast across it pretty easy. My 160 acres has 7 ponds altogether, all holding water. All are small.

Mr. Wilson,

You still haven't mentioned the third hole with the clay. You are stuck on the idea that I am going to build the dam on the bed rock. This was only my first location choice, because it minimized the length of the dam, but not one that I am dead set on.

I have my own dozer, and I can move the clay from the other parts of the basin. Like I said it is less than 100 feet to the hole with the good clay.

So I am trying to decide whether to build the dam where the good clay is, or try and remove the rock (or key into the rock)where I wanted the dam in the first place.

The 8000 figure was an estimate to build the dam across the short distance of the basin if conditions were ideal. That figure is no longer valid, and he would not honor it now that the rock was found shallow.

I will try to post a picture of the third hole and try to put this into perspective this weekend.

Where's Mike Otto when you need him?