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#335247 05/17/13 07:38 PM
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Been a while. My pond is now 18 mos old. 1/2 acre in size, 12 foot in deepest parts. Initial BG stocking in October 2011 of 500 and 10lbs of tuffies. Followed with 50 LMB after BG spawn April last year (2012)
Been feeding Aquamax. BG are large and a lot of offspring and fry are everywhere including minnows. LMB are up to 12"-13" since their fingerling stocking last year. All is well, but I'm concerened that I need to start taking out some of the BG.
I feel the LMB are not big enough and numerous enough to harvest yet. I think my pond is at acritical crossroads. My objective is maximum size LMB and BG and I don't want to stunt any progress.

Do I start taking out some of the mid-size BG's now ? If so, how many and how often?

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Have you been keeping any records of lengths and weights of each fish caught? Noticing any that are not up to par?

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Largest BG are 7"-8" 1 in 5 caught are this size. The "avg" is about 6". I'm pleased with the BG growth & girth. haven't weighed any fish. The bass look good. 12" avg. some a little fatter than others. Again, none weighed.
I know the bass are feeding on small BG and minnows.

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"Not up to par"? I know there are some smaller fish from latter spawns, but all seem healthy.

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Go here and print the charts that are specific to your needs. The information in those will tell you what the quality of fish are compared to the norm. If you keep track of the weights/lengths, the pros here can tell you if your pond may be in need of some management. You generally will want to keep an eye on any size bracket that starts to fall below the norm.

I am sure there are other things the pros will suggest, lets see what they say....

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I would invest in a set of scales, preferably ones that convert to grams, a tagging gun w/ numbered tags, and a way to measure length. Print the charts that fish and chips sent you a link to, and start keeping records. You can cull the LMB that aren't at least 80% body weight. It will surprise you the info you can get from this. Greg Grimes at Aquatic Enviromental Services (advertises on Pond Boss) has a great kit w/ all the equipment you need to do this.


"I have not failed, I have only found 10,000 ways that won't work"
Thomas Edison
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I read (in some hatchery literature) that harvesting 20-25 LMB and 60-100 BG per-acre per-year is recommended. Is this a good "rule of thumb"?

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Harvest is critical in most ponds. Using your goals let fish condition be the major guide to how many to harvest.
















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My fish always seem to look healthy to me, but I let a neighbor fish, and he likes to eat bluegill. If I gave him a max number to take per year, he would likely stick to it. I am just looking for an estimate for BG and LMB that would be better than nothing. I did throw some food in yesterday and the BG were pretty persnickety about eating it. Only saw one foot long LMB and he just passed through without eating pellets or BG.

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Well, I've been reading a lot here and I like to keep things simple. Simple for me is to keep all fish under 12 inches, until I catch as many over 12 inches as under. At this time, we're still keeping all bass under 12 inches. And we don't remove BG at this time.

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Stan that will work. After all those #s came from the guy who wrote the book on fish condition.

Last edited by ewest; 05/19/13 04:37 PM.















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So leaving all the BG will do no damage to the LMB?

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I didn't know the man, but those of you who I trust, trust him.

By the way, we keep BG for forage production. Once we see bass in control we may take some BG.

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Since you have LMB, do not remove BG. If you had a BG only pond, then harvesting is appropriate.

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There is a lot of answers to your question RAH isn't there? One simple question and you just can't get 1 good answer! smile This is for sure one of those is all depends kind of things.

I have a 1 acre pond and I have BG / RES/ HSB/ and LMB. I am going on 3 years now and I have not harvested any of my BG or RES. But my LMB as Salex says will do a lot of that for you. Bass eat a lot even a 12 or 13 inch bass will eat a 3 inch BG so they will harvest some of them for you no problem.

Can you harvest some yourself in that middle range? I would say sure as some of the smaller BG will not get ate and will make it to being adults and replace the ones you take out anyway.

There is also this little tool called PSD not sure where I got this? I bet from the PB somewhere I am sure I can't take credit for it this is a long read but it works! You may have to read it twice to let it soak in though like I had to. smile


PSD how to size up and manage your fish.


It helps to make an educated decision about which fish to keep or release if you know the fish population structure: e.g. length-frequency distribution of bass and panfish. The index of size distribution is called "proportional size distribution" or simply "PSD."

Specific lengths of fish define "stock," "quality" and "preferred" sizes. For largemouth bass these total lengths are eight, twelve and fifteen inches: for bluegill these lengths are three, six and eight inches. The index is determined as a whole number as the proportion of fish longer than quality size in stock. If ten largemouth bass longer than eight inches are caught and two of those are longer than twelve inches the PSD is 20: if no fish are caught longer than 15.0 inches the PSD-P is 0. Angling is an excellent way to estimate population PSD of bass.

Tracking PSD is an excellent way to keep a running tabulation on the progress (or lack of) of your fish populations. PSD is a useful tool for a lake or pond manager to make decisions when (and which) fish to harvest.

However, size of bluegill caught by angling does not reflect fish population PSD because few or no fish as small as three inches are caught. People just don't fish for tiny bluegill. When six to eight out of ten bluegill caught are quality sizes the population PSD is probably between 20 and 60. Consider this a well-balanced population of those key panfish. When few or no bluegill longer than six inches are caught, the PSD is likely less than ten; fish are probably stunted with slow growth and high natural mortality. Only the smallest of age-4 survive to age-5.

The number 3.0 to 5.9 inches long can be in the thousands per acre. In several Midwest fishing ponds with a bluegill PSD less than 10, total weight of bluegill was three hundred or more pounds per acre i.e. carrying capacity for bluegill. With an increasing PSD there was a decline in bluegill standing crop such that when PSD was about 60 bluegill biomass was about 150 pounds per acre or 50% of carrying capacity.

With lower standing crop there is little competition for food in the fishing pond and individuals grow faster, live longer and some reach preferred size. Adequate predation by bass of quality size can reduce numbers of stock and quality size of the fishery down to hundreds per acre and a PSD of 60.

When the PSD of largemouth bass is less than 10 they may also be stunted and few survive to age 5. Their condition or index of well being called "relative weight" (Wr) is probably less than 90. This common fish population structure can result from a twelve-inch minimum size limit or a preference to keep bass of quality size. The PSD of such fish populations can be increased with selective harvest of bass less than twelve inches while releasing all bass of quality size. This process is called, "selective harvest." Maintain that selective harvest until the proportion of fish eight to twelve inches long is equal to those twelve to fifteen inches long. With these proportions the Wr of both fish size groups should be about 100, or the optimum value for growth efficiency: i.e. about three pounds of gain for each pound of fish consumed. When competition for food is keen and Wr is low, fish may lose weight or it may take five to ten pounds of prey for a bass to gain one pound. When there is a surplus of prey and Wr is well over I(X), growth efficiency is lower because excess protein is converted to fat.

All pond owners should spend some time keeping track of numbers and sizes caught by angling in their fishing ponds. Set up a spreadsheet in your computer and track each year's catch records by plotting bluegill PSD on the vertical axis and bass PSD on the horizontal axis. Both scales should be 0 to 100. Estimate bluegill PSD by subtracting 20 from angling PSD unless numbers are near O or 100. For the records just keep track of the numbers of bluegill shorter and longer than six inches total length. For example-if three bluegill less than six inches are caught from your fishing pond and seven longer than six are landed the angling PSD is 70 (7 divided by 10 x 100) and the estimated population PSD is 50. All fishing ponds with bluegill and largemouth bass will be plotted somewhere on this graph.

Decide your pond management objectives. If you prefer larger bluegill, protect more bass and be satisfied with a PSD less than 30. If you prefer to catch larger bass harvest those less than 15 inches long and catch and release those of preferred size.

When the PSD's of bluegill and bass in your pond is around 60, you have reached the balance of nature, the way these fish populations have evolved. About 40% of bass will be 8.0 to 11.9 inches long, 40% 12.0 to 14.9 inches long and 20% longer than 15 inches. Your fish population will be near carrying capacity for bass and panfish populations will be near 50% of their carrying capacity. In a typical Midwest fishing pond this could be 150 pounds of bluegill and 40 to 50 pounds of bass. This structure can be sustained by catch and release of all bass and bluegill.

You are likely to be dissatisfied with low ecological efficiency of mediocre fish populations of PSD less than 10 of both bass and bluegill. But, such fishing ponds are ideal to introduce your children or grandchildren to fishing. These hungry fish are much easier to catch than fish in well balanced populations.

Some of my favorite fishing memories are from a 35 acre private fishing lake in Boone County. Missouri. It was opened to fishing with a twelve-inch minimum length limit to prevent initial overharvest of bass. After two seasons, it was obvious there was a surplus of eight to twelve inch bass in the fishing lake. The regulation was changed to protect bass twelve to fifteen inches long, the first ever application of a "slot limit" on bass. Gizzard shad were also stocked, to help forage fish production. After two years, the Wr of bass of all sizes was over l00. Over the next five years the angling PSD of bluegill ranges from 50-90 and bass PSD ranged from 20 to 60. The regulation was considered a success for the fishery.

But, for those few years with bass PSD of 10 and Wr near 90, this lake was unforgettable for my family. My daughters were about eight and ten years old at the time. They were more into "catching" than "fishing." There was a hatch of black caddis flies (Trichoptera) and bass were behaving like trout. Any cast near a rise produced a strike. I didn't catch any fish that day. Didn't have time. Only had time to unhook and release what they caught. Those memories, too, are priceless.


RC


The only difference between a rut and a Grave is the depth. So get up get out of that rut and get moving!! Time to work!!

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