I am seeking suggestions on aeration of our pond. We purchased our property last winter, and the pond on the property is 280-300 yards from our home (electric source). It is a 3/4 acre pond and approx 14 ft deep. Was dug approx 20-30 years ago, and has never had any type of aeration, dye, etc put in it.
We seem to have healthy fish. 18-22 inch LM Bass and good size sun fish as well. And 5-6 channel cat that we have seen. There is very minimal algea/vegitation growth. The pond has raised banks and wind moves the surface of the water quite a bit on its own.
But oh the black muck is aweful! And after swimming in it this past summer we definately have a thermocline as well.
My question is since the pond seems to be doing a pretty good job of maintaining itself, can we simply use a windmill aerator? It would not create as much water movement or bubbles and an electric compressor, but I dont think that we need anything extreme. And since the pond is on a hill 5 out of 7 days of the week there is a strong breeze moving.
Or if we do go with an electric compressor, would it be best to run power to the pond, or keep the compressor at our house and run air line to the pond? At the moment we do not have any other intentions to construct or add anything else to the pond that would require electricity.
Just looking for some simple advice Thanks in advance!
Welcome to the forum. You have found the right place for your ponds future. 400 yds is a long way to run power to your pond. A windmill probably would be a good option if you have no desire to have power pondside for any other reason.
Thank you for you imput! The wind mill was our origional plan... and after doing a bit of research might be the most cost effective as well.
My only fear is that the pond has been self maintaining for a long time, and really doing a nice job of it, so a second question I have is would there be any 'risks' to aerating it?
It has only been used as a pond for fishing, which is our primary use of it as well, but we would like to be able to do some swimming.
What kind of budget you got for this project? Windmill would be inefficient unless your in the open with 10mph sustained winds I'd just save your money until you could afford diffuser aeration..
I believe in catch and release. I catch then release to the grease..
Hey Mackie, hopefully the aeration experts will chime in but I've learned (from PB of course) that the biggest risk in aerating would be inadequate aeration, to the point of better not to than to do it incorrectly. The downside with the windmill for aeration is that DO is at it's lowest just before sunrise and the winds usually diminish in the evenings, if DO is a concern. Echoing your comment on lack of control (timers).
I too will be interested in what the aeration experts have to say since your pond is so exposed to the winds and water movement.
Regarding electricity, I realize 400 yds is a long distance but if running a few power poles is an option, you would be surprised how often electricity will come in handy at the pond, especially if you plan on spending family and fishing time out there!
Here's a comment on a recent post regarding a new pond: "The pros here will be able to guide you in the right direction for what you need to look for and do. I bet one question they will ask is what would be your goal of what to expect back from your pond? Fishing, swimming, types of fish you like, etc.?
It's better to do nothing until you have all the facts. Too many of us are impatient like little kids and go overboard and find out later we messed up....Have fun....... Jim"
I couldn't agree more as I was one of those "impatient" ones!
Hey Mackie, hopefully the aeration experts will chime in but I've learned (from PB of course) that the biggest risk in aerating would be inadequate aeration, to the point of better not to than to do it incorrectly. The downside with the windmill for aeration is that DO is at it's lowest just before sunrise and the winds usually diminish in the evenings, if DO is a concern. Echoing your comment on lack of control (timers).
I too will be interested in what the aeration experts have to say since your pond is so exposed to the winds and water movement.
Regarding electricity, I realize 400 yds is a long distance but if running a few power poles is an option, you would be surprised how often electricity will come in handy at the pond, especially if you plan on spending family and fishing time out there!
Here's a comment on a recent post regarding a new pond: "The pros here will be able to guide you in the right direction for what you need to look for and do. I bet one question they will ask is what would be your goal of what to expect back from your pond? Fishing, swimming, types of fish you like, etc.?
It's better to do nothing until you have all the facts. Too many of us are impatient like little kids and go overboard and find out later we messed up....Have fun....... Jim"
I couldn't agree more as I was one of those "impatient" ones!
Hi Mackie~ From what I have seen in action, windmill aeration is very sporatic. You get some good bubbles going, then they stop. Few more, then nothing. I would be interested to see on going water quality data before windmill aeration and on going to see how effective they really are... I'm not knocking it, I just don't know. Electric is definately more dependable and can be counted on to destratify, raise dissolved oxygen and decrease muck if properly sized. You don't have to run electricity to the pond. You can have your cabinet at the house and run 1" PVC to the edge of the pond. If installed this spring, by summer your pond will be a much more pleasant swimming hole. Not that the muck will be gone by then, that could take a few years, but it will circulate the water and in turn release any bad odors caused by built up gases on the bottom. Your pond will quickly become a much healthier ecosystem.
We could afford to install an electric aeration system. Just debating whether we can get the same results on a smaller $ with the windmill. The windmill systems I have costed would be near $2200-2500 by the time they are complete. Koenders 24 ft, single diaphragm is the system I was leaning towards.
Can anyone using a Windmill system chime in? I have seen a lot of discussions on them, but the people commenting all seem to have some sort of electric driven system, or are pushing towards one (and there could very well be a reason behind that:))
As far as the purpose our pond serves us it is mostly for fishing LMBass. But we will occassionaly swim in it the few hottest weeks of the year. (And the swimming is really the majority of the reason we are looking into aeration, to make that a bit more enjoyable. Its no fun up to your knees in black sludge!)
I feel like the more research I do, the more I can not decide!
How much do you think it would cost to run power to your pond. Like Sue said you could run PVC under ground and pump the air from your house. Just have to make sure it's deep enough the condensation doesn't freeze. I have a koenders windmill and it got wrecked in 100mph wind storm. Then I ran power and bought a vertex system and would never think of going back. The windmill was way undersized for my lake of course but the moral of the story is research, research, and more research before you decide. If it were me I would run power to the pond because I am into lighting and bug light feeders and waterfall features. You have alot of options with power there and if you buy a windmill you might be farther away from affording what you really wanted like I did. All depends what you are into.
This kind of goes against my first post but I got lazy. Sorry!!!
What type of water quality data can we collect to help us determine what our pond may or may not need? DO of course, but anything else?
The water in our pond is pretty clear, not a whole lot of silt/sediment. I would say the thermocline is 4-5 ft below the surface. The pond if filled strictly with rain water.
blair5002, Before your wind mill came down, it was preforming? I know they will not preform to the extent of and electric system, but it was making a difference in you ponds quality?
There are hand held wind meters. You can buy them on ebay where I bought mine which can borrow free of charge if you buy a new battery for it. Windmills require more maintenance compared to an electric air compressor system. I have had both for 23 yrs. Ted Lea Forevergreen has both types of aeration systems.
From your picture it apprears the pond is shaped quite a bit longer than wide which indicates you should have two diffussers to get mixing at both ends. The windmill mixes only a small or partial length section of my small long narrow 0.3 ac pond (60x220ft pond size).
One can bury 1200 ft of black irrigation pipe (3/4"-1", most frequent is 1/2") as an air delivery tube from the power source to the pond. Larger diameters of air line cause less pressure and flow loss for long tubing runs. For long 1/2" dia air lines over 400ft a higher pressure compresssor is required. Compressor size, pressure rating and air line size are usually sized according to the systems needs.
Last edited by Bill Cody; 02/22/1309:20 PM.
aka Pond Doctor & Dr. Perca Read Pond Boss Magazine - America's Journal of Pond Management
I have added a few aeriel photos of the pond... shape and distance from house. The pond is south of the house... keep in mind that the pond is on quite a bit of a hill, so the trees really stop no wind from hitting the pond.
Bill, I think your pond size is very similar to ours, so this is great advide!
You can do an electric system for less than you said the windmill cost (equipment only ~ not power run). I think one diffuser in the center would do the trick, or you can have two.... Ted sent you a PM, what did he suggest? As Cody stated, he has a windmill and several electric units.
I have a client that has a couple of those windmill aerators, plus a couple of their electric cabinet aerators.
He also has a pond that only has a windmill aerator on it. It winterkilled last year.
I know that winterkill isn't a problem for you but just letting you know what happened because of the weather conditons. We had fog and heavy overcast for almost 2 weeks straight, and very little wind.
He also has a windmill going to another pond, with an electric diffuser in the pond as well. The diffuser that is run via the windmill has an open hole during the winter that is 50% or less of the electric diffuser. Same diffuser is at the end of the hose on the windmill as on the end of the hose from the electric compressor. He also pushes air 900' to one of the ponds via windmill.
I'd trench in the 1" air line and go electric if it was my pond.
**correction*** Just spoke with my husband on the phone... I could of swore he said 380 yards to the front of the pond. Turns out is only 275 to the center of the pond. Sorry about that everyone... I am slightly embarassed.
I think that if we go with the more effecient electric system we will actually get more use out of the pond. Going to research cost of burying electric vs burying air line.
There is of course a fine line to this statement below.
"I've learned (from PB of course) that the biggest risk in aerating would be inadequate aeration, to the point of better not to than to do it incorrectly."
I don't totally agree with this. If you have a pond that has a D.O. problem and it's bad enough I would have to say ANY air at that point would be better than nothing. Cause nothing is going to get you dead fish! I have even read of guys turning on their boat motors to help turn the water to get some D.O. in it. I believe there is some merrit to under aeration long term, but there is a fine line for this and your situation.
The only difference between a rut and a Grave is the depth. So get up get out of that rut and get moving!! Time to work!!
Buy the self weighted airline no matter what system you buy. It sinks to the bottom of the pond making install a breeze.
No doubt about that. Weighted line is the way to go for most folks! I used weighted line took all of about 10 minutes to row out to the pond and drop my setup into the water and bingo I had air!!
Last edited by RC51; 02/22/1302:10 PM.
The only difference between a rut and a Grave is the depth. So get up get out of that rut and get moving!! Time to work!!
Actually under aerating can be worse than doing nothing. If you don't aerate, chances are you have some dissolved oxygen in the top layer of your pond. Granted, you run the risk of a turn over if it rains, but atleast there is some livable space near the surface. If you underate, you mix the bad water with that surface layer with out enough force to bring oxygen levels up and bam! You have low oxygen top to bottom. We are conducting a case study from a lake on the west side of FL. The lake owners installed an undersized system and not only killed every living organism in the lake, but also birds were killed and people were sicked by the gases released. We had to come in and accurately map the lake, triple the aeration, and go gradually. We have some GREAT data from this project.
There is of course a fine line to this statement below.
"I've learned (from PB of course) that the biggest risk in aerating would be inadequate aeration, to the point of better not to than to do it incorrectly."
I don't totally agree with this. If you have a pond that has a D.O. problem and it's bad enough I would have to say ANY air at that point would be better than nothing. Cause nothing is going to get you dead fish! I have even read of guys turning on their boat motors to help turn the water to get some D.O. in it. I believe there is some merrit to under aeration long term, but there is a fine line for this and your situation.
RC51, I stand corrected on that statement, thanks! Reminds me to watch my wording more carefully, such as "the biggest risk", should have read "one of the risks.."
Regarding the weighted tubing, I ran non-weighted tubing to my homemade fountain 100' from shore. I then installed my aeration system running nearly 800' of weighted tubing. NO COMPARISON! Definately spend the extra $$ and get the weighted tubing. The stuff is amazing!
Mackie, I'm quite sure you can run the air line cheaper than the electric. Especially when you factor in voltage drop issue's. personally I would not want overhead lines just because of the cosmetic issue's. If you give me an exact distane to where the compressor would sit from your main panel in the house. I could calculate the voltage drop and give you a rough idea of material cost. You may want to consider wether or not you may end up wanting a dock or gazeboo or anything later that you may want electric to also. Good Luck. and Oh yea welcome to PB.
One thing you could do is run air line from house to pond and if you ever decide you want the power at the pond you could use that air line as conduit and pull power through it.
First, welcome to Pond Boss. You came to the right place for answers.
We are fortunate to have a number of aeration experts on the site, and Sue Cruz is one of the very best and knowledgeable in all of North America (we can't forget our Canadian friends). She is in the business of designing and selling aeration systems.
Disclaimer -- I have no connection with Sue Cruz, or her company, other than having known her for a number of years, and having heard her and her colleagues speak on a number of occasions about aeration and water quality.
One of the great things about asking for this kind of advice here on the PB site is that you will also get a wide variety of experienced answers from users -- from what works, to what doesn't work.
We have pulled wire 300 feet. I know utility companies pull alot further. We tied a plastic bag to fishing line. Sucked it through with shop vac. Then pulled a rope through with fishing line. Then pulled wire through with the rope. It was piece of cake and I know they are going further then we did but you could start in the middle and pull it in 2 shots. Mule tape is what our utility companies use it's rated for 2000lbs pull.
Blair, for once I am not trying to be a smart a--, but how would you get the wire to go 350-400 yds.?
(I see Blair posted while I was typing -- so I guess they do it the same up nort as we do it down here.)
I'm not sure how Blair would do it, but many times in my career I've pulled cable that far, and further, through conduit and stuffing tubes of all kinds. For long runs like this, I generally start with a strong industrial vacuum cleaner attached at one end, and a roll of heavy string at the other end of the conduit. Let the vacuum cleaner suck the string through the conduit. Attach a much heavier line to the string, and pull it back through. Securely attach the cable to the heavy line -- then start to heavily lubricate the cable and conduit. There are a number of different kinds of lubricants, for different conduit and cable jacket types, each with their own friction coefficients. A good electrical supply company can usually make recommendations.
Ken G.
Last edited by catmandoo; 02/23/1303:05 PM. Reason: Update
Ken, are you sure you pulled it 1200 or so ft. in the ground? A raceway is a lot different then the ups and downs that is due to unlevel surfaces. To go that far would you have to use 3 nu.6 copper wires or would something else work? Blair, you could do it in shorter runs. The electric companies here use 2 1/2 in. pipe when they bury the pipe but they usually just bury the wire as is. We have had 2 to fail on rental homes over the past few years.
Two ponds, 13 and 15 acres on the Mattaponi River.
I have pulled literaly 100's of miles of wire and cable over the years and really you are only limited by the size of your tugger and strength of your rope. The longest Ive been involved in was around 4000' at the UPS worldport Hub in Louisville Ky. Most in a tunnel on tray rollers into 6" conduit underground and up 80' to the roof. The tugger had a 460 Ford engine on it and the rope was a fiberglass core. when it moved an inch on one end it moved an inch on the other, No stretch at all. Which can be a killer on long pulls.
Ken, are you sure you pulled it 1200 or so ft. in the ground? A raceway is a lot different then the ups and downs that is due to unlevel surfaces. To go that far would you have to use 3 nu.6 copper wires or would something else work? Blair, you could do it in shorter runs. The electric companies here use 2 1/2 in. pipe when they bury the pipe but they usually just bury the wire as is. We have had 2 to fail on rental homes over the past few years.
I've contracted, and personally pulled wire and cable of many types through pipes, hose, conduit, stuffing tubes, and raceways. I've pulled under parking lots, under highways, in high rise buildings, and on many many small and large ships, including the USS Ranger, USS Enterprise, and a lot of others. I don't know what the longest runs have been, but many have far exceeded a 1000 feet -- many times in conduits that were already nearly full. It has not always been easy, but it can almost always be done. One of the worst problems includes kinks at elbows in small conduits that are already beyond capacity.
If nothing exists under a structure, road, parking lot., etc, you get a contractor with horizontal underground boring equipment from manufacturers like Ditch Witch, Vermeer, Flow Mole, etc.
That is good that it can be done easily. I have never done a long pull but have helped do some shorter runs which were not easy for us. Having the right equipment makes all the difference in doing any job. Definitely not the first time I was wrong about something this week,I am hoping I can hang on to be wrong way into the future. It was nice being schooled by you guys. Take care,Ken.
Two ponds, 13 and 15 acres on the Mattaponi River.
Thanks in advance!
![[Linked Image from i90.photobucket.com]](http://i90.photobucket.com/albums/k247/jmilczski/Fish/PBSubscribe.gif)
