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Joined: May 2012
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The Facts:
-South Central Kentucky
-New pond roughly 1/2 filled
-1 Acre Pond, clay with lots of Rock, ledges and SOME shallows.
-Deepest section is roughly 20 feet deep (roughly 1/4 acre of deep 20ft water)
-Runoff fed from several acres of pasture

The Goal:
-A Very Good Bass fishery (for me)
-A Solid Bluegill Fishery (for the kids)
-I've never stocked them, but RES would add something unique.
-No catfish

Help get me there fellas! Here's a couple of questions/comments I have, and need some great advice...

1) I would like to stock some forage this winter/early spring. Fathead minnows is a quite obvious choice, but what else should I stock for continued forage?? Gambusia?? Golden Shiners?? TFS?? Any other recommendations? Are crawfish worth it??

2) Should I stock the RES with the forage this spring?

3) BG this fall, after establishing the forage base, and bass the following spring???

Thanks for the help ya'll. Also, anyone have any recommendations for who to use in SC Kentucky? I would love some florida strain LMB's.....

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Welcome from an ex- ky. boy(Jackson Co.). No advice from me but there is good people here that can help you out. We have owned a farm there since 1995 but probably won't go back there to live. It is a beautiful area! Good luck.


Two ponds, 13 and 15 acres on the Mattaponi River.
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Howdy CH, welcome!
Sent you a PM on fish stocker in our area.

You're going to get some great recs here, my initial thoughts:

Do fatheads.

I'd put some adult RES in this spring, early if possible-great fish and they'll likely spawn this spring.

Sounds like you've got some good craw habitat-early spring craw stocking, with many of the craws carrying eggs, could really launch your forage base. Not crazy expensive, either. If you've got a great craw base when you stock lmb, they'll last a little longer going forward.

We're right on the edge of the TFS survival belt. I'm a little south of you and have had to restock after a really cold spell.

Think about HBG for the kids. In a new pond, with plenty of forage, they'll grow like Georgia Giants......

Remember, if you're going to do a traditional lmb/bg pond, your main forage for the lmb is going to be BG, and if you've followed recent threads, you've seen that one of the greatest threats to a fantastic LMB fishery is....LMB. So plan to stock accordingly, then harvest aggressively.

One possible plan for your pond for this year:

Get your FHM, crawdads, and RES [adults] in as soon as possible.

At end of May or June: Stock adult BG, consider HBG for the kids as an addition, but they won't spawn enough for long term forage for LMB.

Add LMB in very late summer or early fall. I'd do a very small number.

Are you planning on feeding?

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Thanks for the quick advice....

As for feeding, we are not likely to. May look at some feeders a while down the road, but as of now, no.

Also, no aeration in this pond....extremely far away from electricity.

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I have heard others say that TFS can get large enought that they become more of a predator than forage. Is this true? Also, any thoughts on gambusia in my area? (i know there are other threads on this topic) But for a LMB and BG/HBG fishery, nest robbing doesn't sound all that bad.....

ANOTHER question, can i just harvest crawfish from the creeks and transplant them? Could easily catch a couple hundred i would assume.

Thanks again,

Matt

Last edited by crappiehoppie; 01/29/13 03:05 PM.
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TFS will never get big enough to be predators....Gizzards can get really big, but are still not predators either.

I have Gams in all my ponds-with a healthy predator populaton, I can't say that I've seen any negative effects, nor posiive either.

As for craws-you certainly could harvest from a creek, but risk getting a species that might not do well in pond. Many different species/niches out there.

If you really want a great BG/HBG population, rethink the feeding issue.....

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So, for clarification for the new guy....

A healthy stocking of FH, TFS, Gams and crawfish along with a stocking of RES, together, late this winter (as in 2 weeks from now).
What about golden shiners? Suitable???

Would it be alright to stock 3-5" HBG and BG this fall, and then introduce 3" LMB next spring???

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Originally Posted By: crappiehoppie


The Goal:
-A Very Good Bass fishery (for me)
-A Solid Bluegill Fishery (for the kids
)
-I've never stocked them, but RES would add something unique.
-No catfish



I think for better help from the pros, you should be more specific in your definitions. We all have different opinions on what equates to good bass fishing, as in do you want large ones or do you want to catch alot as in numbers. I assume you mean large, but thats just me. Same thing goes for the BG for kids. For the size pond, I have always read that it is hard to manage both of these to be large in the same pond.

I have also read that the golden shiners are bait robbers when they get larger. That might discourage kids?

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Thanks for the reply!

I am not looking to grow 10 lber's or anything, it's just not that feasible in this area. I would be happy to catch (as 99% would) a fair amount of fish, with one occasionally pushing 6 lbs. I know this is realistic, since i fish in a non-fed pond here with this quality of fish.

I would just like to always be able to catch some medium sized BG or RES. Nothing monstrous, just something that could give a snoopy and princess fishing pole a good tug.

Thanks again.

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OK, so the sequence I'd recommend would be crawdads, FHM and adult RES early this spring, so the RES will pull off a spawn later this year. I'd avoid gams if you're going to add FHM-the gams will eat some FHM offspring, and not really add anything to the mix at this point. You can always add them later when the FHM are made extinct by your bass.

TFS will be stocked by your fish guy when they're just ready to spawn this spring, usually in March in our area.

Then, once your pond is full of FHM and baby crawdads [and maybe TFS], I'd add adult BG [and HBG, if you so desire]-maybe in late May, early June. There will still be time for a lot of spawning activity before fall, and you'll have some decent sized fish with which to amuse snoopy and princess this year. And you'll be ready with a great forage base for your bass.

Keep in mind that there are as many stocking strategies out there as there pondmeisters, and many different ways to skin a cat. A lot of folks want to stock only fingerlings, and grow their own fish up to spawning....it's all about what you want and how quickly you want get there, and how much time, effort, and money you want to invest.

The only real mistake you could make would be to stock Green Sunfish.

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what about golden shiners?? Any thoughts?

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At 1 acre in size, your pond is going to most likely be too small to support TFS. Generally, TFS need large bodies of water, say 4+ acres to do well. Ponds that have a good bloom as well. you are most likely too far north for them to survive the winters anyways. They often winter kill in the Carolinas and even parts of GA, so that should give you a base...

I would stock GSH(golden shiners). Get them in the water as soon as possible. You want many to survive and get larger and initially outgrow the mouths of the LMB that will follow behind them. These initial stockers will be your "breeders" for years to come. Generally, GSH do not survive long term in smaller ponds(less than 2 acres) with LMB present. However, if you do have shallow areas with the right habitat, it is possible they could hold on.

The FHM can be stocked immediately as well. They definitely will not survive long term with LMB present. After stocking LMB, expect them to be gone within a year, two at most. They will help get your fishery off to a great start.

If you are stocking BG, skip the HBG. The BG reproduce in larger numbers and will be the back bone of your forage base. They will reproduce 2-4 times per year in your area and that large production rate will produce lots of BG for your bass to eat. Stocking HBG, particularly in a pond where you are not feeding is a waste. One, they do not reproduce much as they are 95% male. Two, they are great in certain conditions, such as heavily managed(IE, fed, aerated, etc) ponds, not a pond that you are planning.

Crayfish are an excellent forage for bass. However most ponds lack proper habitat for them. If your pond does contain large amounts of rocky areas, you can stock am species suitable to your area and ponds. If papershells/calicoes are native, I would stock them. If not, you can consider northern/virile. Shy away from species that are big diggers or overly invasive like rusty crayfish.

I would stock your forage(FHM, GSH and BG) this upcoming spring. This would be a good time to stock the RES as well. Give them at least a year to make babies and grow. Then the following spring you can stock the LMB.

Keep in mind that a 1 acre pond even under ideal conditions can produce only 100 or so pounds of bass, with 50-75 pounds being more likely. Think about that for a moment... That doesn't add up to many bass when you start growing some decent 3-5 pound fish. The few bass you have will get darn hook shy and the quality of your fishery will be hampered. I am not saying you cannot produce a good LMB fishery in a 1 acre pond, it is just very challenging. Especially when no aeration or feeding is done. Keeping a quality bass fishery over the long term is even harder!

My recommendation for stocking:

This spring:
5 pounds of FHM
5 pounds of GSH
5 pounds of crayfish(papershell/northern)
750 BG 2"-4"
250 RES 2"-4"

Next spring:
50 LMB 2"-4"

DO NOT STOCK crappies, bullheads, GSF, gizzard shad, flathead catfish, blue catfish and a number of other problematic species.

Best of luck!

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CJB-do you think the 2-4" RES and BG will get big enough to spawn this year?


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CJB- thanks so much for the very comprehensive analysis. This is why i frequent here every day. And a big thanks to Yolk Sac also, but i am curious about his question.

I read that RES will produce in the second year...are 2-4" species of BG and RES in their second year???

Thanks for the help again.

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Originally Posted By: Yolk Sac
CJB-do you think the 2-4" RES and BG will get big enough to spawn this year?



Stocked at 2-4 inches this spring into an an empty/new pond in the south - yes they will spawn in 2013 ( late summer to early fall).

Last edited by Bill Cody; 02/01/13 12:12 PM. Reason: fixed spelling















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Does anyone else have a suggested stocking pattern for me? Maybe another opinion would help with my decision.

Once again, thanks in advance.

matt

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Okay - I see there has been a fair amount of previous discussion on this topic. But the general information still applies.
Everyone here including your neighbors and relatives with have all different suggestions for what to put in your pond. To best serve you, you should formulate or create some goals for the pond, BUT to do that you should do some homework here to discover all the options available so you can then make a wise choice / decision based on your knowledge. The better you understand a fishery the better you will know your goals, so do plenty of reading and learning. We can't decide goals for you, we can only tell you if your goals are achievable. In a newly filled pond it is MUCH better to let it sit fishless and develop a great food chain including phytoplankton, zooplankton and high numbers of all kinds of invertebrates ("bugs") while you learn about your options compared to stocking all at once and then decide "OOPs I wish I hadn't done that!"

There are lots of very good discussions here about stocking a new pond. Others may be able provide good information, but anyone that is really helpful will want to know your goals for the fishery. In my opinion be suspecious of anyone selling you fish and telling you what you need without first asking a lot of questions as to your long term goals are for the pond. Read this as a beginning to get some idea of questions you will likely have in 1-3 yrs:
http://forums.pondboss.com/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=319911#Post319911

Generally you will do not wrong to first stock some forage fish and let them reproduce several months to make 10s to 100s of thousands of minnnows as food for whatever sportfish you decide to stock. You can start by adding some fathead minnows - about 1000/acre as soon as the water gets to 50F. Do you have structure in the pond for good fathead spawning? If not learn about that and add good structure for their spawning until the stocking of fatheads.

Greatwhiteape mentioned to not stock crappie. I suggest that you subscribe to PBoss magazine and read my article about crappie in the Mar-Apr 2013 Pond Boss Magazine.

Last edited by Bill Cody; 02/01/13 12:15 PM.

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