Pond Boss Forums FISH & FISHING Show off your catch Fish still feeding.....

I caught a few more this evening...1.25 lb was the biggest, while the smallest was only 2ozs. less.





And, a female.....

Do you kill all the females?

I was just wondering kinda the same Jwwann.. Sprkplug what's your culling routine for gils..

For our ponds with native gills', I cull all fish that are under 6", both males and females. Male BG over 9" are returned to the ponds, as are females over 10". The males between 6-9" are either kept or released, depending on condition, (Wr). Females between 6-10" are usually culled or kept for dinner, but may be released if they are exceptional, which doesn't happen very often.

HBG on the other hand, are much simpler. Males are always released, provided they are healthy and display no abnormalities, or defects which appear to be impeding their growth. I do see instances of this from time to time, most often in the form of incomplete or misshapen dorsal or caudal fins, which doesn't seem to cause any problems vs. malformed mouth or "cheek" portions which are almost always found on smaller, thinner fish.

Female HBG were always culled in the beginning, but now I tend to release them as well, having observed no instances of successful recruitment, or at least no such fish bigger than fry stage have ever been observed or caught after four years of raising HBG.

My BG I keep everything under 8" and all females unless they display major helmet head qualities (only one in 2 yrs).. Occasionally I throw exceptional young males back it mostly depends on their forehead growth I'm kinda obsessed with it..

Nice, nice fish Sparkplg!

Sparkplug -- you continue to really get my interest. I'm sure I am not the only one here on PB. I'd love to have a day-long meeting to discuss what you are doing with HBG. I wish you would have presented at PB-V.

I've got a least a zillion questions.

First question -- how do you identify a male vs., female HBG? Each of the photos above look like males based on my experience with sexing BG. How many females are you finding in your populations?

Another question. Are your HBG living with native BG in the same ponds? And, that brings on even more questions.

Are you buying HBG fingerlings, or are you breeding your own?

I can't wait to see what my HBG look like next spring!

Thanks for all of your great hype-free posts about HBG.

Ken

Check the ear tabs Cat female is noticeable smaller..

Thanks Ken, I appreciate the kind words. I am most certainly not an authority regarding these fish, and most of what I think I know comes mainly from own observations, rather than clinical data. I will give it some thought, dig through my photos, and see what I can come up with regarding my interpretations of males vs. females where HBG are concerned.

I can answer a couple questions tonight however.

Our HBG live together with a few male BG, and a handful of mixed sex RES. And of course, a LOT of smaller LMB.

Up until now, I have purchased fingerlings from hatcheries. Curiously enough, I just posted earlier this evening over at BBG about my plans to try and obtain younger fish next spring... I think if I am to push these fish to two pounds with any sense of regularity, I'm going to have to get an earlier start, which means they need to be in my hands as soon as it's feasible. I feel I'm missing out on the all important early growth period by starting with older, (3-4") hatchery fish.

I'll get back to you on differentiating the sexes once I put it together.

The standard answer is 90% + of HBG are male. Some studies put it at 99% male.

How long do HBG live? I stocked 200 in 15 ac. pond and caught them many times on a 5/0 hook while catfishing but they were gone in 4 years.

Ken, mine lasted about 7 years until a drought got them.

I'm shooting for 8 yrs on mine. I wouldn't be surprised to find out that a steady diet of AQ500 might shorten that figure somewhat however. As far as males vs. females, I would say I see between 90-95% males. I'm sure I don't have 99% males, as I know how many fish I have stocked, and can compare that to numbers of females caught. Last spring I caught 8 females in a row, all from the same location in the pond, and all within a 20 minute time frame. Running the numbers still puts me well within the 90-95% range, but it does make you sit up and take notice.





Obviously, these fish are gravid which makes identification much easier. I still haven't found that one sure-fire technique for differentiating them that works every time, so I tend to look at a few different areas and make my decision after comparing as much as possible.

Males have a larger, differently shaped opercular flap, the same as native male BG do.

Our females tend to have a 'longer' appearance....Not as tall as a male.

The chest area on a male is dark brown, or sometimes vivid orange, while the females are yellow or golden...again, reminiscent of a native fish.

The females will usually have a more projected nose, while the males are often more squared off.

Males have a very pronounced hump on their chest...almost a short, vertical drop below the gills before transitioning into a rounded chest. On a female, this drop is much less pronounced, and the transition to the chest is more gradual.

Overall color on the females can be lighter, although this by itself is unreliable. I have noticed two distinct varieties of HBG in my pond, further complicating the issue. I'm sure it's not correct to do so, but I tend to think of the two types as being either BG dominant, or GSF dominant HBG. The BG dominant fish will have more of the classic saucer shape, being nearly as tall as they are long,and be darker, almost drab in body coloration. The GSF dominant variety will be longer, and much more colorful, almost garish, with lots of orange and yellow on their sides.

Naturally, they both change colors throughout the seasons, particularly during the spawn.

Man that bottom female is Cool looking.. FAT!! Honestly my males always seem bigger than my females but your female looks bigger than some of my males.. I'd definitely have a hard time keeping that one

So, the top and bottom fish in the last picture are females???

Yes, but the middle fish is a female also...just a northern strain female, not a HBG. I put her there for a comparison.

Holy crap. They are fighters even when little, I cannot imagine what these guys did!

SParkplug, where did you get your HBG, they are awesome. I don't feed but mine never got near that big.

Feeding is a major factor in his growth rates.. Impressive fish he's got me thinking about throwing a handful in my pond..

Those are run-of-the-mill HBG from a local hatchery. In my opinion, HBG will never achieve their full potential unless they are supplementally fed, starting as early as possible. They are sometimes misrepresented to be a fish that will grow to gigantic proportions under any and all circumstances, all without any input on the part of the pond owner. I have not found that to be the case, as with any fish they do require some form of management if trophies are the goal.

I do consider them to be among the easiest to raise, however.

Great information and great pictures! Good job.