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#305091 - 08/30/12 04:46 PM Re: Pike [Re: mnfish]
ewest Online   content
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Hoping for the best for you mnfish. The odds are with you being successful IMO. If not the good thing about ponds it's easy to start over and you get to keep the fish (pre-rotenone). Keep us posted on results.



Edited by ewest (08/30/12 04:46 PM)
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#305125 - 08/30/12 09:38 PM Re: Pike [Re: mnfish]
Bill Cody Offline
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If your small pond does not have a fairly large percentage of shallow weedy water (marshy - wetland type) it is very doubtful the NP will spawn successfully. If they do spawn lot of small panfish will likely eat almost all the eggs and fry leaving little or no recruitment.


Edited by Bill Cody (08/30/12 09:52 PM)
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#305127 - 08/30/12 10:02 PM Re: Pike [Re: Bill Cody]
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Its good to read that Bill. Time will tell.

I am putting together a data sheet and will post tomorrow. Looking for feedback to make sure I capture meaningful data on this pike experiment. Once it cools off, I am going to get a good baseline before they have been in there too long

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#305524 - 09/04/12 09:03 PM Re: Pike [Re: mnfish]
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For those following along...I stocked 4 more NP this last weekend for a total of 7 now swimming in the 1/4 acre pond. These fish were measured between 16-20" and tagged. This will be the final stocking for this year.

BCP with one person tagging no problem. One person tagging a NP is a whole different ball game. Had to call in a friend to help.



Cooling weather is coming so the net will be going out and a baseline sampling by weeks end.


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#305540 - 09/04/12 11:48 PM Re: Pike [Re: mnfish]
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This is gonna be interesting!
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#305550 - 09/05/12 05:57 AM Re: Pike [Re: mnfish]
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Certainly a well thought out document.
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#305556 - 09/05/12 08:40 AM Re: Pike [Re: mnfish]
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Originally Posted By: mnfish
For those following along...I stocked 4 more NP this last weekend for a total of 7 now swimming in the 1/4 acre pond. These fish were measured between 16-20" and tagged. This will be the final stocking for this year.

BCP with one person tagging no problem. One person tagging a NP is a whole different ball game. Had to call in a friend to help.



Cooling weather is coming so the net will be going out and a baseline sampling by weeks end.



I like projects and data. This should be very interesting. Do you have a start and end date or are you going to keep going until it feels right?
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#305561 - 09/05/12 09:32 AM Re: Pike [Re: mnfish]
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Calling information gleaners. I would like to see some data of stomach contents of larger pike 30+" long that live in a mixed fish community where the pike can be selective as to what they consume. I think most all previous studies deal with small pike less than 24".

Mnfish - Nice start for your project.


Edited by Bill Cody (09/05/12 09:34 AM)
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#305567 - 09/05/12 09:46 AM Re: Pike [Re: mnfish]
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Awesome!
Can you get us an angling report as well as soon as possible that shows what you catch when you go fishing for 30 mins or an hour?

To be as successful as possible you will need to fish for and remove the big pike and then stock new ones. continually putting and taking them. if you do end up enjoying that aspect of the mgmt plan I guess thats ok....

Also Im not concerned if the pike do happen to reproduce and stunt out at 16" hammer handles....

I do think the YP are gonna get hit hardest initially unfortunately. That makes me wonder- currently how is your perch population? how often do you catch them and what average size are they? how about the biggest ones, how big are they?

I think it would be helpful to set the baseline for each species in the pond up to this point based on your current knowledge gained or assumed from stocking and angling.

Then do the netting survey info and see how that lines up and then move forward from there.

One thing I assume is that with the absence of the pikes, currently the fish average size across the board is probably rapidly going down due to the absence of predators...
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#305572 - 09/05/12 09:52 AM Re: Pike [Re: mnfish]
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If I could have the perfect pond, it would have northern pike and bluegill. And maybe some yellow perch and walleye. Unfortunately, from my observations over about six decades, it just seems like NP need a lot more water compared to other types of fish to get to sporting size. I would love to see several people have great success growing NP in ponds smaller than an acre. Then, I'd want to try it too.

In my years on Pond Boss, I've seen the limits really pushed. I'm doing things I would have scoffed at 10 years ago. It is because of people like Condello, Cecil, George, Lusk, and many others. Other than Dwight, we don't have a lot of people with pike in small waters -- but, even Dwight's pond is larger than what the majority of us have.

As for retirement, I haven't had time to rate it. But then I've not had as much time to evaluate it as Dave D. I'm just a newbie to this life, but I like it.
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#305575 - 09/05/12 10:13 AM Re: Pike [Re: Bill Cody]
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Originally Posted By: Bill Cody
Calling information gleaners. I would like to see some data of stomach contents of larger pike 30+" long that live in a mixed fish community where the pike can be selective as to what they consume. I think most all previous studies deal with small pike less than 24".

The stick, Sargent Jeff and myself will be catching and cleaning Pike next week. They will all be at least 5 pounds (probably larger). They won't be from a pond, but they will be from a diverse fishery where they have many choices on the menu. We will examine the stomach contents and report back.

I am betting the fish they eat will be smaller (relative to body length) than the studies have indicated in those 24" hammer handles.
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#305586 - 09/05/12 10:38 AM Re: Pike [Re: Dwight]
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Dwight - I will run this experiment until we stop learning. Or until I have only one giant NP in my pond! smile I love the learning and exploring unchartered grounds.

Here's what I'm currently thinking with this project. I will execute the data collection, report the findings, and then have the experts on this forum interpret the data and suggest or pose new questions that need answers. My original goal: Produce a sustainable population of 10-12",.5-1lb BCP in a small body of water.

Nate - I will include catch rates and species in the data collection. No problem targeting NP with the fishing rods. The cool thing right now is those NP have so much food and with school starting and the hunting season begining last weekend, they will have very little human pressure.

As far as whats in the pond for species sizes and relative weights, haven't monitored this pond that close. Up until now I've used it mostly to run my aerator testing, catch 4-6" BG at will(kid friendly), enjoy my morning cup of coffee with the Mrs. The biggest YP was probably only 10" and I'm not sure how many are in there. The BG are abundent with most being 4-6". BCP the biggest was 10" with high abundance. BH...have no idea how many.

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#305587 - 09/05/12 10:45 AM Re: Pike [Re: mnfish]
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Your net sampling and angling catch records will provide a very good indication of density and size structure of the sampled fishes. I like to fish with a small hook, worm, and bobber and keep track of what species, sizes, and how many that I catch per hour. Those data can tell a lot about a fishery. Just keep the records and the data will show good trends as to how the fishery community is changing.
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#305630 - 09/05/12 05:29 PM Re: Pike [Re: mnfish]
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Examining NP gut contents, lots of slime, I love it. We need a limit of NP for pickling purposes anyway.
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#306661 - 09/16/12 11:01 AM Re: Pike [Re: mnfish]
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We cleaned our limits of NP. The largest of them was 32 inches and around 8 pounds. The limit is 3 per person, so the sample is small. The forage available to NP in the Alexandria lake chain is diverse and abundant. Oh, we also caught our limits of LMB plus the ones we consumed on the trip.

The stomach contents of the NP were small LMB and YP. The longest being around 6". These results cast doubt on NP eating large prey (33% -40% of their body weight), but as I said it is a small sample.

Photos to follow.....
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#306666 - 09/16/12 12:59 PM Re: Pike [Re: the stick]
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Originally Posted By: the stick
We need a limit of NP for pickling purposes anyway.


Pickled Pike is good eat's!

I have a project up north a bit that may get me into some. Internet seems to be a bit tight lipped on what's up with this BOW as far as fishing. Maybe the best thing to do is talk to the locals and hope they don't feed you a line. Really would like to hit WE, but the boat rental places are on bankers hours. crazy Find out what's up next week.

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#306850 - 09/18/12 02:45 PM Re: Pike [Re: mnfish]
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Update-
Earlier last week, I was told the count went to an even 10 pike in the 1/4 acre pond. I told my "helpers" no more!!!!! smile

Sorry guys, haven't had the time to set the trap or fish much. Last weekend was the opener of our archery season for deer. Hoping this weekend to set it out and do some BG,YP,BCP fishing.

We did, however, cast a few lines into the pike pond on Sunday. We threw a scum frog, black/silver rapala, and a five of diamonds spoon. 1/2 hr of fishing and not one follow up or strike. I think those pike are very happy in there. The rest of the fish...not so much


Edited by mnfish (09/19/12 10:57 AM)
Edit Reason: sp

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#306866 - 09/18/12 05:51 PM Re: Pike [Re: mnfish]
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I thought I was the last guy in the world who still pickled fish. I do it with bluegill and small culled LMB since we don't have a lot of NP out here.

But -- I'll be in Northern Minnesota and Northern Wisconsin in two more days!

Good eatn' is on the way!
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#306931 - 09/19/12 11:11 AM Re: Pike [Re: catmandoo]
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Ken, as you may already know, it's the opener of duck season this weekend in MN. Lay out blinds, a thermos of coffee, some birds in the air, and wildlife management talk with great friends...a perfect Saturday Morning to me. Followed by a gumbo, beers, and bs'ing with great friends...the perfect Saturday evening.

Where about's in MN will you be traveling?

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#306940 - 09/19/12 01:38 PM Re: Pike [Re: mnfish]
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We're heading to a family wedding that takes place on Saturday. The wedding is in Superior. The reception is in Duluth. (mixed marriage grin)

I expect we'll also get to Two Harbors, Minong, Iron River, and places in between for some good eats and visits with relatives and old friends. Breakfast, lunch, and dinners are already planned with cousins for Friday and Sunday. I'm sure we'll hit a walleye fry on Friday night. I'm hoping we can find a fish boil on Sunday -- if not, maybe just some good smoked fish somewhere between Two Harbors and Cornucopia.

Due to a short schedule, we're flying into Duluth, rather than the usual drive from the Cities to "Up Nort." So, unfortunately no stops at Toby's!
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#307055 - 09/20/12 05:14 PM Re: Pike [Re: catmandoo]
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What...All those types of prepared fish and no where on your list. The best prepared fish on earth.... lutefisk!!! sick

Hope your stay in MN is a good one. Have a safe trip sir.

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#307066 - 09/20/12 08:06 PM Re: Pike [Re: mnfish]
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Originally Posted By: mnfish
What...All those types of prepared fish and no where on your list. The best prepared fish on earth.... lutefisk!!! sick


It is so special we reserve it for very special holidays!

Living where I do now, and being Lutheran, I was aghast when I first moved there nearly 40 years ago! Nobody out there has lutefisk church basement dinners! Actually nobody even knows about lefsa.

Uffda!

We made it. We are in a room on the 14th floor, overlooking the Irwin and the Lift Bridge.
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#307068 - 09/20/12 08:26 PM Re: Pike [Re: catmandoo]
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Did you bring your long johns? It's gonna be cold over the weekend!
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#307114 - 09/21/12 11:51 AM Re: Pike [Re: esshup]
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I want to run an idea by you guys...

I am thinking about catching and sacrificing at least 2 NP this weekend to examine what they have been eating and how big the species are. There are 10 in there now so I think its worth the sacrifice. I will take lots of pics and measurements but I am wondering.

Is there any other non obvious observations or measurements that a novice "fishery want to be" would miss?

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#307119 - 09/21/12 12:59 PM Re: Pike [Re: mnfish]
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Actually it might end with nothing. Most of pikes caught in lakes by me were with empty stomachs. It doesn't mean that they had nothing to eat. Not at all. Simply they weren't eating for some time and after that they saw my lure...
That's about catching them with lures. If you plan to use some fish traps then results might be better.

Anyway, if you got a possibility to get another 2 pikes instead of these removed then have a try!

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