Pond Boss Forums AERATION Systems questions natural muck removal

Aaron, bz, Chip? Did we ever decide what is the best bang for the buck? How many CFU(billions) per gram, oz. whatever? BTW, I wonder who they get to count all those little guys?

bm,

I think I'll stick with the 10Billion CFU/gram product and let them work in a drum incubator out in the barn where it's warm. I'm gonna use about 5 pounds this time and add a cup of product to to 25 gallons of water; wait a day, then transfer it to the pond. I'll do this until I use up the 5 pounds.

Chip

what was the name of it, Chip? We lost the posts.
tnx

It's BactaClean - Pond Cleaner - HC
I talked to Jesse just a minute ago and he said they only sell the 10B cfu/gram in 25# units or larger so I'm checking with my neighbor to see if he'll split it with me, (It will store for up to 5 years if properly stored). Jesse said that 3B cfu/gram product was most commonly used for recreational ponds and is available in smaller quantities. I have the link here if you need it
http://www.enviro-comp.com/pondcleaner.html
but given the minimum order quantity you may want to look at other options.
Chip

I've been out of town for the last couple of days. Did we lose our previous thread? I don't remember the numbers but it seemed to me that where I was at is that the BactaClean appeared to have the highest content of bacteria per unit weight and therefore might be cheaper to use but I was wanting to find out the application rate. One would think that with a higher count you could get by with buying less of it. Or could you spend the money and put in many billions more bacteria and do a better job? I would think the more the better and you can't put in too much. I've already put a full dose of the One Flush in my pond and will wait a month to see what happens.

bz

I'm sure you mentioned it in the disappearing posts but I can't remember the size of your pond and the amount of One Flush you used.

I'd be really interested in your results.

Dan

Dan, my pond is about 1/2 acre and I put 12 packets in it. That's not as much as they recommend but I used the method subsribed to by many on this forum and recommended by the manufacturer. I mixed each packet with a couple of gallons of warm water and let it sit for 3 to 4 hours. They say the bacteria multiply fast this way and you end up putting much more into the pond than you actually bought. We'll see if it does anything.

The flush it (not one-flush ), http://www.flushitsolutions.com/flushit.htm show that it has 8 strains @ 5 billion aerobic and 4.7 billion anerobic per gram making it 9.7 billion per gram. http://www.flushitsolutions.com/flushit_side_2.pdf
It is priced at 46.95 for 24 half ounce dissolvable packs. That makes it about $63.00 for a pound of @ 9.7 billion per gram. That would still make it $1575 for 25 lbs. If I remember correctly I think that is what Chip said he was using (or was going to use half that lbs) per acre @ $1000.00. I am going to contact flush-it to see what a bulk discount would be for 10lbs without using the disolvable packs.

Chip,
what did you say you were paying for a pound? And how many strains were in your bio-cleaner?

Has anyone had any success with these products? I'm skeptical of how well bacteria grown under lab or factory conditions will survive being thrown into a pond w/ different temperature, pH, carbon sources (food).

I share the skeptic’s view of these products. Adding microorganisms to a brew can be essential if the substrate (the stuff for which change is desired) is not commonly found in the environment. An example of this is petroleum which has been released to form oil slicks at sea. Adding specific microorganisms might also be essential if a specific change is wanted. For instance, if you want your grapes to turn into wine, the organisms added should have as their “waste product” alcohol and not some smelly substance(s).

However, if the substrate is ubiquitous, (and, let’s face it, sludge is everywhere), then those organisms which metabolize it should also be found everywhere. If the result we are after is digestion of the sludge, then the very organisms we want will be favored by natural selection in our ponds to be the ones already there busily digesting the sludge.

Why, then, should we attempt to substitute for nature’s teeming trillians of sludge-eaters with our paltry dessicated cultures except as the means for transferring worldly goods from pondowners to culture suppliers? But, I can think of more effectient methods that that. Any of you bacteria buyers want to own a nice bridge? If so, drop me a line. How about some great investment land in Florida?
Lou

Points well taken heronblu, that is why I am going with less expensive and not targeted at ponds, but specific bacteria to digest the makeup of most septic and pond sludge, cellulose, fats, oils, and such. Realizing that bacteria are already at work on the sludge, but also learning that aerobic bacteria are far more efficient at digesting most of the bottom sludge and that upping the count will get things going, but that without a good bottom aeration program, you are wasting money.

Burgermeister,

Many septic related products are actually enzyme mixes which can be effective depending on what one's goals are (i.e. reducing the solids in the tank at the risk of sending them out into the drainfield). The bacterial products aren't harmfull but have never, to my knowledge, been scientifically shown to be effective.

I fully agree that aerobic bacteria are much more energetic at digesting organic matter. However, being a born skeptic, I'm not sure aerating the water in the bottom will translate into having aerobic conditions and an aerobic bacteria population in the bottom goo. Going one step further, if you can establish aerobic conditions in the muck, the aerobic microflora and microfauna will follow on their own.

Having never used these products I would like to hear about the success stories.

Thought I'd give a update based upon anecdotal evdidence. I put some One Flush product into my pond about a month ago. Unfortunately I was very concerned about getting my FA and duck weed under control so at the same time I also began ciculating my pond water through my neighboring bog. All I can say at this point is that the two things in combination seem to have made things better. I have noticed that the more hot weather the worse my problem usually gets. We have had a lot of hot weather this year and my FA and duck weed problem are not as bad as previous years. Unfortunately I can't say which solution is helping the most, sorry about that. I know that in order to be scientific about this I should only change one thing at a time but I couldn't help myself. I only ran my recirculating pump for 4 weeks which translates into about 1/2 of my overal pond volume being exchanged during that time. The weather got so dry I was afraid I'd lose too much water running it. Did it have a big impact on nutrients, can't say. I looked all around for a good and inexpensive test kit so I could test nutrients before and after but never found one. I intend to get one for next year so I can evaluate how well the recirculating system removes nutrients. Anyone know where to get an inexpensive test kit?

I am sorry I left my update in the Observation thread area. I will post here again soon.