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#297354 - 06/27/12 11:43 PM Chubs - are they invasive?
catmandoo Offline
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Registered: 08/08/06
Posts: 5691
Loc: Hampshire Co., WV
I live in a pretty unique geological area. This evening I went fishing in a place near the house where my wife would rather I not go. It has lots of springs, sink holes, caverns, etc. Nearly every time I go there, it is different. It is public property owned by the DNR.

I went there tonight to get some green sunfish to "can." I got them, plus several very nice LMB and some fat BG. My small cooler was full when I left.

I found a new sink hole that wasn't there a year ago. It was actually two sink holes with a common opening, divided by a rock ledge. The water level was at least 10 feet down from the ground surface. The rock ledge was about 8 feet down. The water was at least five foot deep on each side of the rock ledge.

On the "upside" of the sink hole were thousands of small green sunfish (1-3 inch). On the down side of the sink hole were thousands of what I assume are creek chubs, that were 3-6 inches. I brought home a bunch of the small GSF and creek chubs, which I've put into bags in the freezer. I plan to use them as catfish bait.

However, my main question for this long thread is -- are creek chubs invasive in ponds? I'll post photos tomorrow, but I'm fairly certain they were young creek chubs. It is possible they were young fall fish. In any case, I figure I could easily go there tomorrow morning and get hundreds of these chubs to use for bait in my pond and other ponds I've got access to.

Are there downsides to using chubs as bait in small ponds like mine? I'd like to try and use them to entice some of my now unwelcome and oversized channel cats that have become pests, and some LMB that just need to be taken out.

Thanks,
Ken

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#297355 - 06/27/12 11:58 PM Re: Chubs - are they invasive? [Re: catmandoo]
Omaha Offline
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Registered: 12/06/08
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Loc: Nebraska
I can trap 50+ creek chubs a day from our creek that runs by my future pond and inquired about the same thing a couple years ago. Chubs need running water to spawn and stay small so, to my knowledge, they are no threat to a small fishery, but also don't serve a viable purpose either...aside from what you're using them for. Bait.
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#297360 - 06/28/12 12:41 AM Re: Chubs - are they invasive? [Re: catmandoo]
teehjaeh57 Online   content
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Registered: 01/22/08
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Loc: Lincoln, NE
Agree with Josh - chubs are one of my favorites for bait, and can survive pond conditions, but need running water to reproduce. I don't think they'd impact your fishery at all. Can you post some pics for us? Been a while since I've seen a healthy creek chub!
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#297493 - 06/28/12 09:40 PM Re: Chubs - are they invasive? [Re: catmandoo]
CJBS2003 Offline
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Registered: 01/19/09
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Loc: northern VA
If they are in fact creek chubs or fall fish, then what has been posted is accurate. The only other issue I would bring up is, although they will not reproduce, if they survive and begin to grow they are predacious. As you know, when it comes to "minnows", creek chubs and fall fish have have quite large mouths. So they can and will compete for food with larger sunfish and bass in your pond. I had some fall fish over 18" long in a pond I had stocked them into. Doesn't take a very large bass to eat a rather long creek chub or fall fish though as they are so fusiform.
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#297514 - 06/28/12 11:52 PM Re: Chubs - are they invasive? [Re: catmandoo]
Omaha Offline
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Hold up. Are creek chub and fall fish the same fish? And, if so, you had some reach 18"?! 10" less than that is the largest I've seen. Travis, if different fish, can you elaborate, preferably with pictures? Are they similar?
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#297515 - 06/29/12 02:31 AM Re: Chubs - are they invasive? [Re: CJBS2003]
fishm_n Offline


Registered: 05/18/11
Posts: 732
Loc: Sturgis, SD
Originally Posted By: CJBS2003
As you know, when it comes to "minnows", creek chubs and fall fish have have quite large mouths. So they can and will compete for food with larger sunfish and bass in your pond.


Yes they do. The closest cabella's to me put some in there fish tank thinking that the bass would munch them down, but they didnt, and now those chubs pound the minnows the hardest during feeding time.

Here we have "Lake Chubs," very similar, they are border line invasive. They do work better for bait than shiners, but are soft fleshed and dont stay on the hook as well, and once the are frozen and unthawed, they really dont stay on a hook. but the fish love um!! it does not take much running water for these to reproduce either, and they travel up stream as bad as bull head and greenies.

I do wonder how similar lake chubs are from creek chubs. They call "lake chubs" an endagered species here ( a real joke ) and wont poison out a good trout lake with a horible wormouth population becuase of them.
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#297534 - 06/29/12 08:38 AM Re: Chubs - are they invasive? [Re: catmandoo]
catmandoo Offline
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I'm without an office at least through next week (building new "game" kitchen, and remodeling the old office in the basement), so it is hard for me to post photos. But, I'll try to get some up.

As for fall fish vs. creek chubs, they are very similar. I'm not sure how I'll know the difference. These are in an area where I fish somewhat regularly, and I've never caught anything over about 4 inches, so I strongly suspect they are chubs.

I'm not sure what the largest fall fish is that I've caught. But, like Travis, I've caught some pretty good sized ones on bass baits. Certainly, at least to 12 inches. When I lived on the Virginia side of the border, there was a creek near the house that was loaded with huge fall fish, small SMB, and lots of green sunfish.

My intent would not be to stock them, but to only use them as bait. I'm sure I could keep them for a number of days in a cage in one of my forage ponds if I decided I wanted to keep some around.

I used some dead ones yesterday, and it took no time at all for bass to grab them.

Ken
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#297549 - 06/29/12 12:07 PM Re: Chubs - are they invasive? [Re: catmandoo]
catmandoo Offline
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Registered: 08/08/06
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Loc: Hampshire Co., WV
OK. Here is a picture of what I'm assuming are creek chubs.



And, here is what happens if you put a dead one on the end of your line and throw it into my pond!


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#297661 - 06/30/12 03:24 PM Re: Chubs - are they invasive? [Re: catmandoo]
CJBS2003 Offline
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Registered: 01/19/09
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Loc: northern VA
That is a nice fat CC Ken!

Fallfish are the largest minnow native to eastern North America. They are similar to creek chubs but tend to be more silvery with less brown on their upper sides. They also don't have a spot at the front base of the dorsal fin like creek chubs do. Fallfish can reach over 20" in lenth, but a 14" one is large and a 16" one is huge. They tend to be found in waters a bit larger than creek chubs. Some of the largest ones I have ever caught were in PA at Raystown Lake where Trough Creek flows in to it. We have some nice ones in the creek behind our hunting cabin as well.

Fallfish are only native to the eastern drainages so they are not found in the Midwest.

Creek chub
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#297768 - 07/01/12 04:03 PM Re: Chubs - are they invasive? [Re: catmandoo]
txelen Offline
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Registered: 07/12/09
Posts: 271
Loc: Orange County, CA
I've caught creek chub on small spinners while trout fishing in spring-fed ponds. They definitely are somewhat piscivorous and get up to 10", but I wouldn't worry about them in a warmwater pond with bass present. Like others said, creek chub need running water to spawn and are good forage for bass.
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#297773 - 07/01/12 04:48 PM Re: Chubs - are they invasive? [Re: catmandoo]
Cecil Baird1 Offline
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Registered: 08/08/02
Posts: 20043
Loc: Northeastern Indiana
Yeah they've taken over some trout ponds in Maine I fished where there are inlets and outlets to the mountain ponds. Couldn't catch a brook trout to save my life but caught chub after chub.Warmwater pond as has been said they shouldn't be an issue.
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