Pond Boss Forums POND CONSTRUCTION Selecting a site Beaver pond woes

Wood ive been meaning to thank you for posting those instuctions, its imprtant for me to post pics , i was thinking it may give people a sense of where i should be headed with plans for this pond. as far as the trout .....well i stocked aprox 100 rainbows initialy about 6 years ago and the following year stcked 30 brookies and since that time never once had i seen a single fish rise! and im talking hours apon hours of observing the surface of that pond. Do you think its possible to have trout in that pond even after going 6years without seeing a single one rise to the surface?

Mtn, your welcome, I'm just happy I could finally help someone, I have gained so much from these people and don't have much to give back as I am fairly new to this and also a lot of the topics are regarding fish that don't live here. As for your trout, I also find it strange that you saw no risers. Even though they spend only 10% of their feeding time on surface, you should still see some. Evenings until sundown is when I see most action on my pond, it gets pretty boiled up if there is a hatch going on. Even with predation and normal mortality, you think you would have seen some. Six years is about it for pond trout from what I've learned, so they would be on their way out by now anyway. It seems you have a challenge ahead. Enjoy it, Wood.

Thanks Wood,this may sound corny, but ive been diggin woods and wild for as long as i can remember and challenges have always driven me!I have always been fascinated by waters.At times it almost feels more like an obsession....im not sure why...

There are times when i feel like i was born in the wrong century...

wow................heyWOW,how did i, little ol me......get to be a lunker? IM NOT WORTHY....IM NOT WORTHY! What an honor! i hope i can live up such high esteem!

mtnlobster, beautiful pond. i really liked the pics with the fog. very nice, i bet it is a nice retreat/peaceful. so you became a lunker huh? see my memory of when i, too, became a lunker under general questions "willow tree" question... what a wonderful day, huh?!! mark

10th post already! wow were does the time go??

well i appreciate all the favorable comments directed towards my little beaver pond! however what i would truely benefit from is somemore great suggestions as to what i could do with it , thanks to everybody!

Mark,
Mtn said he made it permanent (put in an earthen dam) 6 years ago in his 3rd post I believe. He's wanting suggestions as what to stock. Used to have brook trout, but water temps are too high now.
Mtn,
I don't understand why your water temp is so warm ie: 70 deg @ bottom. Was that in the 12 ft area? It sounds like maybe the problem is too much shallow water. Maybe the beaver have removed alot of trees that used to shade the pond? If deeping the pond is out of the question then I would stock SMB. Smallmouth are my next favorite fish next to trout. But first put in some fathead minnows & crawfish NOW. You'll have to ask one of the pondmiesters when to stock your preditor fish but I would think maybe next fall.
Ric

oops...my bad..i missed that one line about the earthen dam. sorry. i deleted the post.

thanks ric mark

Ric you are correct in that i did build a great earthn dam !I can drive a vehicle across it! however the way its set up now , there are two 24" culverts draining the water that goes over the beaver dam . The beaver dam is still intact and reguarly maimtained by two famlies of beaver .There dam is directly in front of my manmade dam.There is no spillway at this time .I feel if and when i put one in i can probably increase the overall depth of the pond 3 ft. Now as far as the fish.....i must come clean....this summer , July i guess i started stocking forage fish . i went to a nerby lake that is managed for LMB (and has been for many years) and caught up some pumpkinseed ( they looked to me like bluegill). any way i put some in that month the next month and some in early sept...a total of perhaps 140 fish, along with them i put in 5,5" SMB and2, 7"LMB. now you must know, for years before this summer, i had never seen a single fish in the pond and never seen one rise. Now i was a commercial fisherman for 20 years , so i know what a fish looks like when it breaks water. I tried fishing the pond as well ...to no avail...
Anyway in oct., i went up to do some work and apon arrival i took a look in the pond first thing.... i always do that out of habit...and to my utter amazment in the pond close to the shore were some tiny fish 50 or maybe 60. They were all about 3/8 to maybe 1/2 inch in length. I proceeded to check some other shoreline areas and found them everywhere. So i after observing this , i made the conclusion that it was most likely the forage fish that had spawned although after doing a little research i found out that pumpkinseed only spawn one time in early spring, and i stocked , or started stocking after the 4th of July of this year.
what do you guys think?

yes it was 70 deg in the 12 ft area, now that was in august during a year of extreme drought . i felt the same way you are thinking to much shallow area in the pond 4 or 5 ft warmed up the water to much

MtnLobster....I would quickly get a minnow trap (or a few of 'em) and throw them in the pond & see what you catch. Or try to net something.

I've read some conflicting info. about when certain types of fish spawn. For bluegill, I believe I read that they could spawn any time the water reached a certain temperature.

Those fry you saw could be from some fish that managed to live through the past cycles of your pond. Identifying them would seem to be very valuable to plot the next step.

Smallies all the way!!!!!!!!!! & BTW, great pics of your place.

Sunil

Mtn,
I agree with Sunil, try to capture & identify the minnows. If you are considering SMB read the posts under Types of Fish To Choose SMB in a 3 ac. pond by TYW33. Very intresting topic reguarding SMB & BG. If that raises your intrest search for posts by lakedoctor reguarding SMB.
I don't know why lakedoctor hasn't posted lately but he had extensive experience on the subject of SMB & contributed greatly to this forum. I miss him alot!
Anyway I get the feeling you haven't completely decided on your end goal with the pond and I would suggest reading up on SMB. Anyone can have a LMB pond especially if they listen to the instructions from the experts on this forum & purchase the lit from Pond Boss which by the way is a really smart investment!
I'm stocking trout with a back-up plan for SMB if it doesn't work out. I can go to any body of water around me & catch LMB. I have nothing against LMB .. love to catch them, but have always wanted to catch a very large trout or SMB. So .. I'm going to grow my own!!!
Keep giving info as to what you have & read on here as much as you can which should cultivate some pointed questions. Post them on here .. there is ALOT of experience here!
For myself .. I'm very thankful I found this site!
Ric

Iread the posts on SMB-BG as forage combination. Wow that really sounds like an exciting and in my situation very viable alternative. When do the smallies spawn? What time of year would be best time to introduce a good number of them...i think at this point if i dont get any winter kill i have a jump on my forage base...what do you think? I have seen crayfish in the pond naturally but not many of them .I really have no idea as to the extent of the population of crayfish presently existing in the pond.

mtnlobster,
Here's one of lakedoctors posts I saved:

lakedoctor
Lunker
Member # 422

Member Rated:

posted May 15, 2003 03:32 AM

To start from scratch on a pond stocked for smallies get a good forage base of crawfish then add some tadpoles,fathead minnows and wait 60 days.Then stock your bluegill and smallies.The smallies don't target the big bluegill 4to6" like the largemouth but they'll sure take care of the 2to3" to keep the population down, then you'll end up with a pond that will have some monster smallies and some monster bluegill and one hell of a fun place to fish.To get the Smb to spawn just make a creek bed.Put rocks and sandy gravel in 3to4' of water and there you have it.The thing that I do alittle different is put in a horizontal water flow thru the fake creek bed, not alot of flow is needed but a little bit makes a world of difference. DOC

I don't have a good source for crawfish but I remember Bill Cody mentioning a source for papershell crawfish. I'll have to find one soon since my pond is being built now.
Ric

Hey Ric, anybody know where i can purchase some geneticly superior SMB & BG stock. I wonder if there are any regulations prohibiting the transport of fish from one state to the next. I thought i heard once that that could be a problem i need to get the fish to New Hampshire. Imean we are talking about tiny fingerlings for stocking procedures ill have to research that somehow. Im thinking now of stocking first thing in the spring as soon as the ice leaves.

MtnLobster: I got my smallies from Keystone Aquaculture near Harrisburg, PA.
Call John Sproch at 717-834-6772.

I don't know if they are "genetically superior" but I'm pretty sure he gets them from somewhere in Illinois.

They can be shipped overnight. If you place a big enough order (say $1,000 to $2,000), they may deliver them for a fee.

As far as the crayfish, I frequently catch LMB in my lake that have fat angular guts and are spitting out half digested crayfish when you catch them. That's awesome. Can't wait to get a smallie doing the same thing.

Chances are if you see crayfish in your lake, then you probably have a good population of 'em. Make the rock beds, and they will come.

I haven't found a good source to buy bulk crayfish yet. If anyone knows of a place, please let me know.

There is one type of crayfish to avoid. I believe it's called "rusticus" or something like that.

Happy Thanksgiving!
Sunil

mtnlobster
If your looking for small mouths that you can stock and be happy with results try zett's fish farm in Pa. If not Bass hatchery Inc. in Mass. Small outfit all they raise is SMB's. Cray fish we can ship you in spring
Happy Thanksgiving

Phone # for Zett's is 814-345-5357. One person to ask for is Andrew. They're a little west of State College, PA.

Thanks Sun, Scott I tried getting the # for that place in Mass that only sells SMB and couldnt locate it any ideas?

The known is finite, the unknown infinite; intellectually we stand on an islet in the midst of an illimitable ocean of inexplicability. Our business in every generation is to reclaim a little more land.

Thomas H. Huxley

mtnlobster
I will look for number we are in the process of expanding the buiss. and paperwork is packed away. I believe the man's name is Frank Parsons INC. We stocked 6000 fingers 2 years ago in a dense lily lake and they did great their main forage was newts and bullheads. Most of the people around the lake also set up bug wips which is a site to see them feed at night.
Scott

Scott whats a bug whip??

we make them up here but you can find them on the market i think they have them in PBM. You mount them on a pole over the water and Bugs are attracted by the light and a weed wacker line rotates inside and knocks the bugger into water and instant protein for the fish. Do not use a bug light you will just end up with a pile of bugs that are not on the menu.If you use Bat houses there is really no problems other than bat's tend to fly around the light at night. If you have a slingshot and small marshmallows you can keep the kid's busy . If you have heavy frog population great method for thinning them out and feeding bass

Good Luck