Pond Boss Forums INTRO Questions & Observations Additive Fish

Dwight, your picture is exactly the conditions that we saw the year we got the big year class of northern pike in those gravel pits I showed you a few years back. It did not take much vegetation to let the pike bring off a big spawn.

Yes, I am going to add the SMB and WE in the late fall and leave everything else alone.

Knowing Bremer Pond as well as I do I expect the predator-forage relationship will evolve and re-balance in a natural way.

I will monitor everything and report the results over time in a thread starting on the day the new ones are added to the pond.

I very interested to see how a well established community of fish you have in your ponds will play with the SMB and WE. Will you be able to source larger sized fingerlings of sub adults or will you just have to hope smaller fingerlings make it?

They will be in the 6-8 inch range and yes it will be interesting!

You should have no problem getting SMB from any of your local rivers or streams...have you considered stocking advanced sizes from angling in MN? I think those fish stand the best chance of making it in your fishery. I wonder if they will compete well with the LMB considering it's such a Northern BOW? I know many lakes in So Ontario that have very few LMB but are dominated by SMB.

My preference is stocking certified disease free fish from a hatchery. Transplanting large fish(in quantity) would definitely blow out the predator/forage balance.

A percentage of the little guys and girls will hopefully survive and merge with the current populations.

I think the LMB will remain dominant since there are so many more of them and they are successfully reproducing every year. Who knows if either the SMB or WE will spawn or if they will just grow and eventually become lunker bonus fish?

In preparation for adding the SMB and WE this fall I have been looking at these holding boxes for acclimating the new ones to the pond. I plan to feed them FH in the holding box so they are strong and tough when they enter the pond unprotected. A PVC tubing frame to float the holding box can be fabricated (you know me and PVC fabrications).

Does this plan make sense? Has anyone dealt with this company? Holding Boxes

Dwight:

I looked into those when I wanted to have a few fish cages. It was less expensive for me to buy a 4' wide roll of mesh netting from Stoney Creek and make my own cages, but I picked up the netting, no shipping..... For only one cage it would have been cheaper to buy the pre-made cages, but for 2 or more making my own was more cost effective. I made my cages 4' square, but found that if the cage was only in 2 1/2' to 3' of water, LMB that were held in the cage (13"-16" long fish) would get their chins scraped up on the netting. There has to be a recommendation somewhere on the 'net for cage size vs. fish size/density to minimize stress/trauma to the caged fish.

Either route you take, don't forget to fab lids for them - fish jump and birds/mammals can get in from the top too.

I forgot. If you do go with the pre-made cages, and you plan on using them for more than once, get them treated with the net dip. I've used the green dip and it's held up very well.

Try to get them pellet feed trained (smallies anyway) if you put them in holding cages. It will make a huge difference in their growth rate, and thus survival.

nate if you remove them once they get to 28 inches how will you get real big NP??

I am pro Tiger Muskie. They are beautiful and really help with the population control. I had no idea that females were fertile.

The GFP stocks them regulary around here instead of addin NP.

I decided to go a little more conservative and add 100 Walleye and 100 Smallmouth instead of 200 of each. The Walleye are 6-8 inch and the Smallmouth are 4-6 inch. Both are the largest size available from a certified Minnesota supplier. I am also adding 100 pounds of Fatheads as a pre-winter protein blast. The fish will arrive late October - November.

Some will say this is an experiment, some an investment and some it is just fun. I agree.

Sounds like a plan - and fun.

It'll be interesting to see how many show up in your future catches.

Sounds good!

Gail bought another new couch today.

Gail is in the process of repainting the rec room and removing the cool border around the ceiling.

Both couch and paint job are perfect. They are out of style.

Gail is a having new ¾ inch wide board oak floor installed in the living room and the hallway going by the bedrooms and bathroom #1.

The carpet is perfect and under it is near perfect ¾ inch narrow board oak floor that have to be removed. Both are out of style.

The new fish join the old fish in the pond. There are no style concerns.

Every pond plan has a cost. Yours has a double cost factor. Without that extra outlay life might get rough around the house. Pick your battles wisely - even if its out of style to do so.

"If Mama ain't happy, no one is happy."

When we discuss things such as this it is more informational rather than seeking approval for the expenditures. We have been with each other long enough that we understand each others "hobbies".

Bremer Pond clarity is the least it has ever been since record keeping. Dwight said the 100 pounds of FHM go in before the WE and SMB to keep the exsisting fish distracted. I said I would like to see clear water on release so the new fish can high-tail it to cover. Dwight thought there would be less predation on the new fish if the water clarity was low. Do hatchery fish have any sense of predators or are they pretty slow since they have not had to deal with that situation in a rearing pond?

In my experiences hatchery fish raised without predators are pretty naive individuals regarding predation; similar to pheasants and quail introductions. Predatory behavior is not all that different between fish and wildlife game. Predators key on this weakness. 1. New stocker fish also behave somewhat different compared to resident fish. Odd behavior makes the new fish an easier target-prey. 2. New fish are not familar with what habitat is available in the new surroundings. Instinct often causes them to move into a shallow water refuge where larger fish have difficulty swimming. 3. New stockers are usually stressed, sometimes very stressed, and weak for various reasons; due often to mishandling, reduced water quality from crowding, and/or temperature stressors. 4. If the fish is a completely new species to that body of water predators will be attracted to the new behavior pattern. 5. Also new stockers usually have color patterns - hues that are different lighter or darker than resident, similar sized fish of the same species. All these features reduces the chances of survival depending on several things. An important one is amount of dense nearby cover. Predators often 'hang' in wait in these cover areas (habitat) which are designed to be fish attractors! Generally the larger the stocker the better chances of survival during the early acclimation period.

Look at the links below for ideas and answers. A lot of the answer depends on your current situation including the existing fish population. Standard answer is less than 10 % will live to one year in an existing pond with adult LMB population. But it depends.

http://www.pondboss.com/forums/ubbthread...=true#Post22246

http://www.pondboss.com/forums/ubbthread...=true#Post26019


See these for blocking net method. Works for BG and LMB.

http://www.pondboss.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Main=5690&Number=52295#Post52295

http://www.pondboss.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Main=5690&Number=52299#Post52299


See this also

http://forums.pondboss.com/ubbthreads.ph...=true#Post26019

Thanks for the info boys. Very interesting.

Late this afternoon a 100 walleye, a 100 small mouth bass and 100 pounds a fathead minnows are arriving in the fish truck. I will take plenty of photos.

Sounds great, Dwight! Can't wait to see the photo tour of the event!

I wonder how many pounds of FHM will be consumed in the next 24 hrs?