Pond Boss Forums POND CONSTRUCTION Creating habitat Mo' Bettah Bed Pix from SMB repro pond

SMB REPRODUCTION POND UPDATE

It's been a Spring/Summer full of doubt concerning my SMB reproduction project. This Spring I never noticed any fish on the beds, but many were so deep I would have had to scuba to verify. Another concern: Beds are so deep, could DO levels be too low at that depth to discourage pairing and spawning? In anticipation of this I created a few new beds in late winter in shallower water, stocked FHM and GSH and hoped for the best.

I haven't seen my adult SMB since early June, and Bruce mentioned he saw a dead 14" fish about four weeks ago. I've been throwing pellets a few times weekly and never seen a take - and the FHM and GSH seem extirpated despite multiple supplemental stockings. All signs pointed to me engaging in too complex a project with too little knowledge. My beds were too deep. I didn't stock enough forage. I didn't stock pellet trained adults to help relieve pressure on the forage. I didn't perform a SMB mating dance...all signs pointing to failure.










Walking the pond three weeks ago I was seeing some smaller 3-4" fish darting in the shallows upon my approach. I figured they were remnant GSH...tried pellets, not a take. Where are my adult fish? Where are ANY fish? Dejected, I decided to tie on a 1/80 jig and gulp maggot in a futile effort to at least catch one of those GSH.

I cast mid distance across the pond, so my retrieve would tick the edge of a stand of Amercian Pondweed...I figured the GSH would be hanging in the shade and picking off invertabrates there.

I bring the jig close to the edge, then rod tip down and allow a slow flutter into the shadows of the pondweed leaves....BANG - I'm on! Jeezo...this thing's a freak - shallow run right, deep run left, then four attempts to spool me running directly away if he only had the size. Rod tip up, swing the fish up and....








Good Gravy!



Another cast....POW!



Third cast - nailed it! Gosh, these fish have super low WR, but they're here!



Man it's a fun and quick trip from dejection to elation with a twist of swagger...Yep, I am one proud SMB papa! What's more, this is likely the only BOW in Eastern NE with a reproducing population of SMB - too cool. That's a feather in the Pond Boss Forum's hat - nicely done boys - dang we're good! Now that I know what I'm seeing, I try to estimate how many of these "GSH" I see around the pond...wow, there's hundreds!

Okay, now what? I have to get my babies fed and these WRs up! I'm going to be trapping as many FHM possible from my other ponds and transfer over the next few weeks. Each visit I'm trying to introduce AM 400 and 500 in an effort to pellet train. Thus far I've only verified a very few who are interested. Keep trying...keep trying. Any thoughts here?

Congrats all - we pulled off a pretty unique project, totally unknown in these parts. Thanks for the guidance and encouragement.

Get about 30# of FHM delivered asap. Keep at it with the feeding.

I agree. Seine some out and sell them or trade them for FH. All those SMB can't live and grow in the reproduction pond.

The need to breed is very strong. Its results often can endure many of our mistakes.

Less fish more food.

My FHM source isn't seining due to high water temps until early September. I'll go set traps and also collect some YOY BG, clip their fins, and include them. I have no idea how many YOY present - I'd say easily 500-1000 or more.

You sure you want to put BG in ?

Way to go, TJ!! Smallies!

TJ, find a different source. The bait shops still have FHM, right?

Let's smoke some cigars!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

You better not have gut hooked any of those smallies!

My initial concern may be unwarranted, but I know if LMB are overpopulated, and restricted in space that they will turn into wicked little cannibals. Will SMB, even with smaller mouth resort to the same treachery? Hopefully not so much.

If it swims, my SMB eat it!!!

Mine is in an aquarium though

I could be convinced to drive up there.....Maybe Banks or others need something to cover the fuel.

TJ, You might try NEMO Bait Co. See if they have a route through there. They have a minimum order of only 2# in St. Louis....delivered on a weekly route.

Rainman, if you get to where you feel you could come up I have a redear order for you. Somewhere around 1,000 fish needed total.

I'm gettin better Bruce and have your fish reserved. I went back in to A-Fib Tuesday again, but coughed my way back to sinus rythym again......the new CPR....If it keeps doing this, a pacemaker is next on the list.

Rex, if you do need a pacemaker, there's a whole new set of rules you have to adhere to. Dad has one, and a number of things he could do before it was installed, he can't do now.

Congratulations TJ that is awesome!

UPDATE:

Walked the entire SMB pond late afternoon yesterday, started throwing AM 500 in new places. Actually stimulated some feeding, got very excited, freaked out and proceeded to shovel more pellets at them than they could eat in a week. Typical TJ thinking...."If a little is good, a lot is great!"

Okay...so, good start - now I need to return daily and get them into a routine and try to temper my exuberance and be more efficient with the feeding. Also, set my traps last night...problem is I'm getting so many tadpoles they literally STUFF the cages and I have no minnows present. Those BF Tadpoles are pellet hogs. I'm going to need to refine my tactics somehow in order to move forage into the SMB pond.

Thought I'd share the good news. Will keep you apprised.

No, no I'm not. Spoken out of desperation I thought some YOY BG with clipped fins could help provide some forage. They will eventually be eaten or seined out anyhow...but still, not a wise plan, probably. Appreciate you staying my hand on that one - inexperience and exuberance on my part.

Have you received your bill for BISA dues yet?

The new surcharge of $1,500 per YOY is gonna add up TJ.

2011 SMB Reproduction Update PART I

Thought it was high time I provide an update on my SMB repro project. Pulled a nice spawn in 2011, but my rooted vegetation got the upper hand during the Summer and Reward treatment did little to improve the situation. In the Fall of 2011 we pulled the seine a few times but it was simply too difficult and we only collected a few fish. Reluctantly I decided to refill the repro ponds and hope for Winter survival and tackle things in early Spring of 2012.

We seined four weeks ago and it's apparent there was some serious cannibalism occuring, as I'd feared. Half the fish [150] were 2-3.5", the remaining were 7-8" with a handful pushing 9". Sold them all, and drained the pond down to inspect the beds and to get ready for 2012.

My original beds, pictured on this thread, were in pretty bad shape. Beds were silted in and the limestone walls were crumbling, too.





I needed to create a new SMB bed design in my clay ponds if I wanted to continue or improve spawning success. I tried to envision a design which used Eric and Bill's cinderblock prototype but also address the siltation issues I'd been experiencing. I looked for materials already on hand, and this is how things began to take shape.

Pallets provide elevation I need from the clay bottom plus allow silt to flow through and provides cover for YOY SMB. I needed to use cinder blocks on the front of the beds in order to keep them somewhat level:







I had concern the beds might, over time, begin to slide down the slope of the pond so I used stakes to keep them in place:





Needed something to hold the 2-4" limestone bed material in place and prevent it from falling through the pallets:



Always important to create a little privacy for magic time:

2011/2012 SMB Reproduction Update PART II



Bill Cody suggests larger rock to serve as spawning beds as it allows better oxygen supply to eggs and prevents a layer of silt from forming that might occur using pea gravel or sand:



Eric and Bill recommend using a log in order to provide some cover for YOY SMB. I thought the cinder blocks and pallets would provide plenty of hiding places, but I decided to use some 6-12" PVC I was utilizing as FHM spawning stucture and placed it around the beds - even though it might be overkill:





I had a lot of rock from my original beds slowly disappearing into the silt/muck. I paid dearly for that limestone, so I thought I'd try to make the beds appear a little more homey and authentic and also would help keep the PVC in place:







Here is the finished product, just waiting for the pond to refill:



Cue the romantic music...





I placed all 5 beds between 3-6' depth to offer some options for the SMB. Provided I'm successful, I hope these bed designs can help provide some ideas for those of you interested in pulling off SMB spawns, too.

That is awesome. Revolutionary even as far as SMB beds go. One question; at the front of the beds, did you put anything to keep the rocks from falling off the front of the pallet? Or you don't foresee that being an issue?

I have them slightly angled when it was possible to prevent sliding forward, but also placed larger, heavier stones along the front, although it's hard to see in the photos. I used 6" rock along the front as that was a concern of mine, too. If I need to replace a little rock every year it's easily done, unlike in the past, these are readily accessible and I can remove any FA buildup or siltation by spraying the beds and cleaning them off in a flash. Did a few trial runs and the spray nozzle worked like a charm - silt/mud ran right through the mesh and through the pallet. I'm pretty excited about the spawn this spring!

Who are we starting the romantic music for?