Pond Boss Magazine
http://www.pondboss.com/images/userfiles/image/20130301193901_6_150by50orangewhyshouldsubscribejpeg.jpg
Advertisment
Newest Members
Jeff Mouritz, Anthony Davis, Blaze, Clint Loveday, RCCPonds
15625 Registered Users
Forum Stats
15625 Members
36 Forums
35974 Topics
489368 Posts

Max Online: 1210 @ 08/23/18 11:01 PM
Top Posters
esshup 24029
Cecil Baird1 20043
ewest 19497
Dave Davidson1 13539
Bill Cody 12451
Who's Online
19 registered (snrub, bigpullerman, Dilley, NEDOC, Theo Gallus, Bob-O, Charles Crews, Alamoses, Redonthehead, Quarter Acre, Jim Wetzel, Bob Lusk, Dave Davidson1, RStringer, LeighAnn, Tom M, Pat Williamson, Brettski, willyfield20), 174 Guests and 445 Spiders online.
Key: Admin, Global Mod, Mod
Page 1 of 3 1 2 3 >
Topic Options
#219664 - 06/01/10 05:08 PM is glyphosate safe for around ponds with fish?
sadworld Offline
Lunker

Registered: 04/25/08
Posts: 62
Loc: michigan
i noticed it is the active ingredient in SHORE KLEAR and you can also by it at tractor supply under a different name and cheaper but i don't want to kill my fish.... i have trout.
_________________________
MY POND: 50'X100' (1/8 ACRE) dug in 2006. get's deep quick with a trench dug in the middle that reaches 17' deep. i have aeration. i stock bluegill, bass, trout, and perch and couple crappie.

Top
#219681 - 06/01/10 07:42 PM Re: is glyphosate safe for around ponds with fish? [Re: sadworld]
Dave Davidson1 Online   content
Moderator
Lunker

Registered: 01/04/06
Posts: 13539
Loc: Hurst & Bowie, Texas
Yeah, it should be OK. I used it a week ago and got it at TSC. What are you trying to kill? Some plants need a surfactant like Cide Kick.

I was trying to murder some yellow water primrose and, without the Cide Kick, it came back pretty quickly.
_________________________
It's not about the fish. It's about the pond. Take care of the pond and the fish will be fine. PB subscriber since before it was in color.

Without a sense of urgency, Nothing ever gets done.

Boy, if I say "sic em", you'd better look for something to bite. Sam Shelley Rancher and Farmer Muleshoe Texas 1892-1985 RIP

Top
#219684 - 06/01/10 07:46 PM Re: is glyphosate safe for around ponds with fish? [Re: Dave Davidson1]
Cecil Baird1 Offline
Hall of Fame

Lunker

Registered: 08/08/02
Posts: 20043
Loc: Northeastern Indiana
Originally Posted By: Dave Davidson1
Yeah, it should be OK. I used it a week ago and got it at TSC. What are you trying to kill? Some plants need a surfactant like Cide Kick.

I was trying to murder some yellow water primrose and, without the Cide Kick, it came back pretty quickly.


Ditto with what Dave said. I've had trout and had no problems with it. These types of herbicides break down quickly when in contact with organic matter.
_________________________
If pigs could fly bacon would be harder to come by and there would be a lot of damaged trees.







Top
#219729 - 06/01/10 10:07 PM Re: is glyphosate safe for around ponds with fish? [Re: Cecil Baird1]
ewest Offline
Moderator
Hall of Fame 2014

Lunker

Registered: 03/08/05
Posts: 19497
Loc: Miss.
There are several brands labeled for aquatic use.
_________________________















Top
#219765 - 06/02/10 10:20 AM Re: is glyphosate safe for around ponds with fish? [Re: ewest]
Brian75 Offline
Fingerling

Registered: 10/13/09
Posts: 27
Loc: Charleston, SC
The way your question is worded it sounds like you may be asking if any glyphosate product is ok. Shore Klear and other aquatic approved products will be fine. However, I wouldn't spray Round Up or other terrestrial products in the pond.

Top
#219766 - 06/02/10 10:23 AM Re: is glyphosate safe for around ponds with fish? [Re: ewest]
The Pond Frog Offline
Lunker

Registered: 01/25/10
Posts: 914
Loc: NorCal
I hate to go backwards here, but what plants are you trying to kill?

Also, there may be knock offs with the same ingrediant but you need to check the % of active ingrediant on the label.

Which brings us to Glyphosate. Not exactly the best pond treatment. Just is not made for underwater plants. More or less for the shore. You need to add other things to it just to make it effective for marginals. Off to work, Coontail, cattails and bulrushes on the menu today. And no gly for me.

Top
#219789 - 06/02/10 01:43 PM Re: is glyphosate safe for around ponds with fish? [Re: The Pond Frog]
Cecil Baird1 Offline
Hall of Fame

Lunker

Registered: 08/08/02
Posts: 20043
Loc: Northeastern Indiana
I know I'll probably catch hell for this but I've used Round up on shoreline plants with no problems but I did add a surfactant. The resident heron kills more frogs and fish than anything I can apply! shocked

I haven't applied anything this year and I've got hundreds of dead tadpoles in the biggest pond. It's either the smallmouth of 5 to 7 inches smacking them but not eating them as they are too big to swallow, or the bluegills on the beds don't tolerate them in the area. The dead tadpoles are the most numerous in the area where the bluegills are bedding, but the smallies like to hang out in the area too for some reason. They bgs are all males so it can't be because of bluegill fry.


Edited by Cecil Baird1 (06/02/10 07:00 PM)
_________________________
If pigs could fly bacon would be harder to come by and there would be a lot of damaged trees.







Top
#219805 - 06/02/10 04:41 PM Re: is glyphosate safe for around ponds with fish? [Re: Cecil Baird1]
sadworld Offline
Lunker

Registered: 04/25/08
Posts: 62
Loc: michigan
i have a couple issues but for the purpose of this thread, the stuff i want to kill is growing at the edge of the pond maybe a little in the water but mostly on the edge of land right at the water line... it looks like really tall thick grass, like cut-weed. about knee to waist tall.
also...
i also have a massive growth of underwater plants that are getting out of control and i think they are either large leaf pond weed or clasping leaf pond weed. they have a little stem unlike the rest of the foliage that sticks up out of the water a little bit. stem kinda looks like the bud of a wheat plant, only green. didn't know if i should look into chemicals for this or what, since i have delicate trout. thanks. matt.
_________________________
MY POND: 50'X100' (1/8 ACRE) dug in 2006. get's deep quick with a trench dug in the middle that reaches 17' deep. i have aeration. i stock bluegill, bass, trout, and perch and couple crappie.

Top
#219811 - 06/02/10 05:26 PM Re: is glyphosate safe for around ponds with fish? [Re: sadworld]
Todd3138 Offline
Ambassador
Field Correspondent
Hall of Fame

Lunker

Registered: 07/09/09
Posts: 3490
Loc: North Central WV
Matt, can you post a pic or two of your vegetation? That would probably help guide a more on-point answer in your direction.
_________________________
Todd La Neve


Click Here to Subscribe to Pond Boss Magazine

1.5 & .5 ac ponds - LMB, BG, RES, YP, GC, HSB

Top
#219815 - 06/02/10 05:39 PM Re: is glyphosate safe for around ponds with fish? [Re: Todd3138]
esshup Offline
Moderator
Ambassador
Field Correspondent

Lunker

Registered: 01/26/09
Posts: 24029
Loc: Grovertown, Indiana
I second the pics. Try and get at least one close up of the plant.
_________________________
www.hoosierpondpros.com


http://www.pondboss.com/subscribe.asp?c=4
3/4 to 1 1/4 ac pond LMB, SMB, PS, BG, RES, CC, YP, Bardello BG, (RBT & Blue Tilapia - seasonal).

Top
#219944 - 06/03/10 11:05 AM Re: is glyphosate safe for around ponds with fish? [Re: esshup]
The Pond Frog Offline
Lunker

Registered: 01/25/10
Posts: 914
Loc: NorCal
Hey, there are uses for a lot of stuff, I just try to use the right product for the right application.

If I have material I want gone fast and it is out of the water and above soil I use a roundup blend. Mainly Rounduppromax. It comes almost 50% gly. I combine that with Scythe, which is acid, Pelargonic and fatty. I'll go 2 oz RPM and 4 oz Scythe per gal. I get death action within minutes. I prefer the overkill method, as I hate respraying. The Scythe just makes the gly nasty effective, way faster acting and lethal in almost everything it gets on. It ain't Agent Orange, but it's a nasty good blend. Best thing is customer is visually impressed. It works well and fast for this hurry up I want results world.

Bear in mind I will not get near water, no marginals, no shorelines where overspray may hit water. Even the warning labels say that. Gly will breakdown on soil, in the air, but when it gets in water it might just hang around and accumulate. I tend to experiment in some aspects of my business, but with herbicides I follow all warnings.


Edited by The Pond Frog (06/03/10 11:06 AM)

Top
#219952 - 06/03/10 11:29 AM Re: is glyphosate safe for around ponds with fish? [Re: The Pond Frog]
The Pond Frog Offline
Lunker

Registered: 01/25/10
Posts: 914
Loc: NorCal
Short answer, I would not use gly on marginals or shoreline plants. It tends to bond with soil molecules, then is supposed to dissipate from there. In water, it does not, and can cause contamination. Trout, as well as most fishes have a lot of fatty tissues, which are like chemical sponges. They will soak up and store contminants, mercury, selenium, maybe even gly. Might not kill them, might kill whatever eats them.

We have a posted limit of how much Striped Bass you should eat per month out fo the Sacramento Delta. It's ounces. The toxic brew dumped into the water is the culprit, including mercury.

As far as your water plants, if you could take a live sample, still green, and lay it flat on a white sheet of paper 8 1/2 X 11, it helps a lot for the photo identification.

Top
#220007 - 06/03/10 04:37 PM Re: is glyphosate safe for around ponds with fish? [Re: The Pond Frog]
RAH Offline
Lunker

Registered: 05/17/09
Posts: 4215
Loc: Indiana, Boone County, 25 mile...
Glyphosate dissapes very very quickly in soil. Just use a formulation that is registered for use around ponds like Rodeo. Formulations contain surfactants (a lot like soaps) that are meant to help the glyphosate to stick to and penetrate leaf surfaces. Some of these are toxic to aquatic organisms. Glyphosate is the most widely used and most extensively tested (for safety) herbicide on earth. Just use the appropriate formulation.

Top
#220009 - 06/03/10 04:41 PM Re: is glyphosate safe for around ponds with fish? [Re: RAH]
RAH Offline
Lunker

Registered: 05/17/09
Posts: 4215
Loc: Indiana, Boone County, 25 mile...
I meant to write "dissipates"

Top
#220043 - 06/03/10 07:55 PM Re: is glyphosate safe for around ponds with fish? [Re: RAH]
The Pond Frog Offline
Lunker

Registered: 01/25/10
Posts: 914
Loc: NorCal
Supposedly Rodeo does not have the nasties Roundup does. However I am not very trusting of the big chemical companies. The same ones that said Agent Purple is harmless, Agent Orange is harmless, got busted falsifying lab results. Misrepresented Roundup and glyphosate both. DDT, dioxin, the list goes on and on. Even the supposed breakdown in soil varies wildly. From 3 day to 140 days to years. Same as in ponds, it can go away in days, or still be there in a year. They even had a lab pushing through all of the big companies pesticides. 262 companies used Craven labs, who blantantly falsified lab results to make the pesticides look safe. And yes Monsanto and Roundup were one of them. I don't use Rodeo. I don't put gly in water, near water or anywhere I might have groundwater. That's just me. They are going to ban 2,4-D. Even different countries, regions and here States have different banned stuff. There are over 100 banned pesticides and herbicides here in the US. Chemicals that were widely used, declared safe. Excuse my skepticism.

Top
#220047 - 06/03/10 08:27 PM Re: is glyphosate safe for around ponds with fish? [Re: The Pond Frog]
Tewks Offline
Lunker

Registered: 02/18/10
Posts: 82
Loc: Texas
Check to see if the products contain dicamba or/ 3,6-dichloro-2-methoxybenzoic acid. I mention this because cold water fish, specifically trout, are somewhat affected by this chemical. Nasty stuff those benzoic acids, causes burns and loss of appetite but that is of course at higher concentrations. Fortunately it usually just breaks down to water and CO2.

As with all herbicides, everyone throws a fuss because of bio-accumulation (as PF mentioned).
_________________________
If at first you don't succeed...look in the trash for the directions.

Top
#220050 - 06/03/10 08:45 PM Re: is glyphosate safe for around ponds with fish? [Re: RAH]
Cecil Baird1 Offline
Hall of Fame

Lunker

Registered: 08/08/02
Posts: 20043
Loc: Northeastern Indiana
Originally Posted By: RAH
Glyphosate dissapes very very quickly in soil.


Hmmm... must be an echo in here again. grin
_________________________
If pigs could fly bacon would be harder to come by and there would be a lot of damaged trees.







Top
#220078 - 06/03/10 11:30 PM Re: is glyphosate safe for around ponds with fish? [Re: Cecil Baird1]
The Pond Frog Offline
Lunker

Registered: 01/25/10
Posts: 914
Loc: NorCal
Except for the time it hung around 141 days in Iowa. Or over 2 years in a Swedish forest. Even 2,4-D tested side by side dissipated faster. And let's not forget Monsanto got sued and lost a false advertising suit stating Roundup was biodegradable. And left clean soil. Oops. Or the EU stated gly was dangerous for the environment and toxic for aquatic organisms. You leave the US corporate proganda machine things are much different. And when a major corporation like Monsanto loses a false advertising suit, how can people still sit there and say, it leaves the soil clean? Quickly?

Top
#220081 - 06/03/10 11:52 PM Re: is glyphosate safe for around ponds with fish? [Re: The Pond Frog]
Cecil Baird1 Offline
Hall of Fame

Lunker

Registered: 08/08/02
Posts: 20043
Loc: Northeastern Indiana
Links please. grin
_________________________
If pigs could fly bacon would be harder to come by and there would be a lot of damaged trees.







Top
#220082 - 06/03/10 11:56 PM Re: is glyphosate safe for around ponds with fish? [Re: Cecil Baird1]
Tewks Offline
Lunker

Registered: 02/18/10
Posts: 82
Loc: Texas
Does wikipedia count? :P
_________________________
If at first you don't succeed...look in the trash for the directions.

Top
#220084 - 06/04/10 01:39 AM Re: is glyphosate safe for around ponds with fish? [Re: Tewks]
The Pond Frog Offline
Lunker

Registered: 01/25/10
Posts: 914
Loc: NorCal

Top
#220086 - 06/04/10 01:53 AM Re: is glyphosate safe for around ponds with fish? [Re: The Pond Frog]
The Pond Frog Offline
Lunker

Registered: 01/25/10
Posts: 914
Loc: NorCal
"Roundup can be used where kids and pets'll play and breaks down into natural material." This ad depicts a person with his head in the ground and a pet dog standing in an area which has been treated with Roundup.

One of my favorite commercials back in the day. Stuff kills plants dead on contact yet person is laying in treated area and Fido is loving it also. Good stuff. And I thought cigarette commercials were bad. Don't see many of them any longer.

And people wonder why this late in my career I am getting away from herbicides as much as I can. I'd say 80% of my customers flat out state, no chemicals.

Top
#220089 - 06/04/10 01:59 AM Re: is glyphosate safe for around ponds with fish? [Re: The Pond Frog]
Cecil Baird1 Offline
Hall of Fame

Lunker

Registered: 08/08/02
Posts: 20043
Loc: Northeastern Indiana
Originally Posted By: The Pond Frog


Now be nice Pond froggy. grin It wasn't that I didn't believe you. Being a scientist at heart I never take anything at face value and I wanted to read what you have. wink

Got to hit the hay. I'm interested in reading the links though.

Later!




Edited by Cecil Baird1 (06/04/10 02:01 AM)
_________________________
If pigs could fly bacon would be harder to come by and there would be a lot of damaged trees.







Top
#220099 - 06/04/10 08:17 AM Re: is glyphosate safe for around ponds with fish? [Re: Cecil Baird1]
RAH Offline
Lunker

Registered: 05/17/09
Posts: 4215
Loc: Indiana, Boone County, 25 mile...
Everybody has to make a buck. Look at the sources in the links above. Some sell fear. To each, their own...

Top
#220151 - 06/04/10 12:05 PM Re: is glyphosate safe for around ponds with fish? [Re: RAH]
The Pond Frog Offline
Lunker

Registered: 01/25/10
Posts: 914
Loc: NorCal
Great attitude, everybody has to make a buck? Those sites are not selling fear, they are merely reporting scientific findings and court records. Records of law. You go to the local chain store and see who is still there making that buck. Monsanto, Dow, BASF. All the corporate chemical makers. They overcome piddly fines, retests, i's all a drop of toxic waste into the profit bucket for them.

And who is paying that buck? The consumer, up front and then the environment long term. The waterways and oceans are in the worst shape they have been in the Earth's millions of years history. The farmlands are getting drenched in toxic soup and eventually the weeds just adapt and you need more. The corporations collectively thank you and your who cares everyone has to make a buck attitude. And our future generations will be shaking thier heads in disappointment, how could we let this happen?

Top
Page 1 of 3 1 2 3 >

Today's Birthdays
barry
Recent Posts
Crazy idea - pen raised tiger muskie....
by snrub
0 seconds ago
solar aeration in the deep (hot) south
by Dilley
7 minutes 8 seconds ago
How to fish for tilapia?
by Theo Gallus
10 minutes 47 seconds ago
Hello from Central Texas
by Dave Davidson1
58 minutes 2 seconds ago
Texas Hunter Fish Feeder Upper Motor
by TGW1
Today at 08:01 AM
Some of my better pond bass.
by TGW1
Today at 07:23 AM
Sexing Redear Sunfish?
by snrub
Yesterday at 10:46 PM
Red/Brown Clouds In Water?
by scott69
Yesterday at 10:32 PM
Pond Boss Forum get together, Sept 22, 2018
by snrub
Yesterday at 09:30 PM
Too many LMB, no time to cull. Can a fish help?
by anthropic
Yesterday at 07:55 PM
Newly Uploaded Images
Vegetation ID
Our new pond
CNBG
My Best Longear so far
Help ID this fish
Crayfish monster.

2014 POND BOSS INC. all rights reserved USA and Worldwide