Pond Boss Forums INTRO Questions & Observations Bar Pits as fish ponds in south?

I want to buy 10 acres adjacent to my property that has a 1 1/2 acre sand bar pit on it. The pond/pit looks beautiful but after 2-3 feet of shallow bank it drops verticaly to 30 to 40 foot depths. (I know this becouse I watched them dig it and watched daily as it filled.) I know bream can reproduce anywhere but will it be enough to support a bass population in a standard bluegill/bass pond? Especialy if during low water levels that minimal shallow area for spawning doesn't exist? This is my first post on Pond Boss, or any site for that matter, so I hope I did it right. Any advice would be appreciated.

Very interesting question Oilman. Welcome to the forum and an expert will be along shortly to answer.

Oilman, nice to have you on the forum. I would recomend you contact this guy: http://www.davewalenaquafarming.com He has a fishery that uses a 50 ac 70 ft deep pond to raise fish. Im sure he can offer you advice and experience with this issue. He is located in Brandford, Fl. and his pond was a bar pit if i remember correctly.

Welcome to Pond Boss. Pit ponds are fairly common and a lot of people here have experience with them. Each one is different (like all ponds)so more info would help. You have raised good questions. A pic would help or a detailed summary of things like water source , level changes , fertility (dirt and water in the area) etc. Are there fish there now? What are your goals for the pond , balanced population , big bass , big BG , swimming etc.

The soil is typical coastal sand, which is why it was taken out. It packs well for roads, constuction, ect. Ground water supply, no watershed or well. Whole area is planted pines and digging was completed this winter so I cant be sure of water level highs and lows just yet.The pond is square shaped (approximately 390ft by 320ft)and currently has no fish at all. I am succesfully raising HBG and CC in my current 1 acre pond which runs alongside the one in question about 75 feet apart from each other. I would like a self sustaining bass/bream population in this new pond and not have to manage population like I do with hybrids and cats. Not that I mind I just want a variety. I have ability to increase pond size with a shallow area but just curious if I can get by with current conditions. Just a thought, would HSB and some kind of replaceable forage fish be moe suitable in such deep and open waters? There is absolutetly no stucture. Yet.

With minimal spawning areas for sunfish, you'll have problems with producing enough sunfish forage for your bass. This can lead to lower numbers of sunfish and therefore the ability to grow some nice sized BG(bluegill) and RES(redears or shellcrackers). It does make it more of a challenge to grow nice sized bass because of a lack of forage for them. If it is coastal sand, chances are the soil is not overly fertile. Are you looking to grow big bass, would you be happy with big sunfish but smaller bass?

I just want a pond full of fish for my 7 and 9 year old (and me). I like catching big bass but it's not my biggest priority. If I could catch a couple 2 or 3 pounders every now and then I'd be happy. Actually I do like the idea of raising big bream and shellcrackers, thats why I stocked the HBG in my current smaller pond. Growing some giant real deal bluegill would be awesome. I enjoy catching a big bream on an ultralight rod over other "sport" fish. I have been working with ponds my whole life, I've just always had older shallow ponds to deal with. Most big sand pits turned ponds that I've fished around here never seemed to have many fish. I suspect now that it was probably do to poor fertility and lack of management. From what I've learned reading PB and this forum, most any hole in the ground can create good fishing if proper management aligns with reasonable expectations.

Oilman,
Welcome to the forum. As has been suggested, more info is needed. If you have a solid perimeter of 2-3 ft water @ the pond that keeps water over year round, even in dry years, then you would be be OK. If you were shooting for large bass, you would probably want more spawning ground, but not so much to grow large bluegill. A 1 1/2 ac. pond is more suited to being a bluegill project in my opinion; so the odds are in your favor if that is your goal. If the bottom is sand throughout you may have an issue with extreme water level fluctuations and will most definitely need to add lime to adjust the water quality to allow fertilization. If the water level drops out of the shallow water before a successful bluegill spawn occurs, it will be detrimental. I will send you a PM if you would like to discuss in further detail.

-HH

Welcome Oilman!

Sounds like a most interesting project! That is "code" for saying it sounds tough and could be frustrating for a few years.

I'm in North Georgia and my pond is nearly the opposite - pretty shallow and has so much cover in it that you can almost walk across it on the timber.

But, think of it as a clean slate - you can sink some mighty big trees in there!

Since it was a pit, I bet you can back a dumptruck up to it pretty easily and dump a load (or 10) of big rocks to help with the food chain - probably get some crawdads going in it if you feed 'em.

Since it's so deep, maybe you could get some HSB going with an established forage base - after a few years. Or, maybe The Grand Poobah Boss Bob wants to try for the southern-most smallmouth fishery. ;-)

Thanks to all who have replied, I appreciate all the feed back. I may have made my question a little too general. Having a pond right beside the one I am asking about I believe I have a good handle on water quality issues and the like.(Not in any way implying I know it all) My real fear, so to speak, is what will happen if I have absolutely no shallow areas in the pond. HH, you hit my worry right on when you said it would be detrimental if the water dropped enough to remove spawning areas. That's what I am afraid of when trying to create a perpetual bass/bream population. Would I be better of trying some type of put-and-take fish combo in there. Like HSB and HBG maybe? HH, I apologize if I left out any info, I talk about my pond so much at home I sometimes forget there is anybody I haven't told yet!

If you like the idea of growing some real big BG and shellcrackers, I would go down that route... I agree with HoneyHole that a pond in the 1.5 acre size is more suited to growing nice sunfish than big bass. I personally think a pond with large sunfish and piles of stunted bass make the best kids fishing holes. There will still be the occasional 2-3 pound bass to keep it interesting... If you're willing to utilize a feeder and feed your BG a quality feed like Aquamax, you have a great possibility of growing some real nice fish. With you being in GA, you can certainly stock the coppernose variety of BG upping your odds of growing some monsters. I also think adding a few bonus HSB to this pond, particularly if you are feeding wouldn't take away from your ability to grow trophy sized sunfish. The lack of spawning areas for your sunfish and stocking more LMB than typical along with a feeding program will be a good recipe for success!

Sunfish are amazing in their ability to find places to spawn... Even with steep sides, they'll still almost certainly pull off some spawning success albeit less than normal. But in a trophy sunfish pond, this is a good thing. The bass will spawn too enough to keep a self perpetuating population in all likelihood. I wouldn't be overly concerned with a lack of spawning locations if you goal is trophy sunfish.

If it holds water it can be made to work for LMB and BG/RES with some work. From there it depends on goals as to how and what you do to reach them. Good info above. Does it have some shallow water now ? If so you can probably get a BG/RES spawn.

Fertility would be the biggest question. Recently I studied a 5 acre rock quarry in my area. It was shallow enough that I could see most of the bottom. I saw a lot of nice fish, but massive amounts of barren landscape, so to speak. I think it held maybe what a typical 1 acre pond around here might hold, or even less. Had it been deeper, it would have been more intriguing, as I wouldn't have been able to see exactly what was in there. The owners wanted a great bass pond, as was evidenced by many stumps pushed into the quarry. Still, had the property (not just lake) been a little different, I might have tried to buy it.

I fished a lake in Massachusetts that did not have much shallow water to speak of and very steep drop offs with a water clarity of 25 feet. Bluegills in this small lake spawned in 8 feet of water at a severe angle but they didn't seem to mind.

I ended up buying the property with the pond next door. As the water cleared I noticed that a lot of sand (mostly from my current property) had washed down in the pond at the corners. The pond is a near perfect square. I believe it created plenty enough areas for BG spawning. I fetilized and got a good bloom a week later. I did not lime however. Will this be necessary even if I get good algae bloom? I stocked 1000 2-3 inch BG and a few CC. Should I wait til next spring to stock LMB and let population explode or do it this May? How many LMB if I'm going for big BG since pond not big enough to grow large bass?

Check the alkalinity to see if you need lime. You can stock 2 inch LMB in June or wait until fall. One hundred per acre or 1/10 the rate of your BG will do for what you want. I would add some FH and a few RES also. Over time you will have a big BG pond with that combo - absent some odd event.

Welcome oilman!

You could quickly and easily bull doze some sand from one or 2 edges of the pond and build up shallow spawning areas. It's probably only 4 hours work with a good size dozer, because sand falls off a cliff very easily.

If your pond communicates directly with the water table, be careful what chemicals or fertilizer you put in it. It could contaminate your neighbor's water wells, if there are any shallow ones near by.