Pond Boss Forums STOCKING A NEW POND Creating the food chain Forage fish-How many varieties is "enough"?

Now that my 5 acre pond filled up I am seriously getting all relevant info lined up for its' initial stocking in the next couple of weeks. Is there an appreciatable advantage to stocking TFS and Golden Shiners along with CNBG, RES and FHM. Predators will be LMB & HSB, also stocked at same time. My goal is to have decent fishing for both average CNBG and eventually predators in the 6-8lb range. No feeding is planned at this time..du

You're going to stock them all at the same time? That doesn't give the forage base much time to get established.

Ya, you probably want to think about starting your forage base off giving them a head start before you put in predators.

The question: Same time? Is it ok if I use 3-4" forage and 6-8" predators? I didn't think the predators could eat that size bait. Is that incorrect?

Bass can eat fish pushing a third there own size if not larger depending on the species... It's tough to wait when your pond has finally filled up and you wanna get things rolling, but I'd put the FHM, GSH and tshad in this spring along with the sunfish. Then next spring stock the bass...

Yes man do yourself a huge favor and stock forage for a year before any predators. and if you want to catch big fish feeding is esential. I would never have a pond without feeding pellets. The whole reason to have a pond is to catch big fish. I mean for atleast 90% of us. Feeding does wonders for the fish. Ive owned my pond for 5 years and started feeding 3 years ago and i can tell now how much bigger and fatter everbody is. Yesterday i caught the biggest bluegill i have ever caught. This thing was massive. It looked like someone aired him up like a balloon. I mean every part of him was fat even his tail. I caught him on a chubby steve pellet.

David, the idea is for the forage to get several spawns over with before adding predators.

I've used this one before: When a bass can go to sleep with its mouth open and wake up with a full belly, it's time to stock them.

Another idea is to stock your forage fish now, evaluate this fall and stock more forage . In the spring stock more forage and your predator fish.

A lot of us don't feed so I wouldn't get all hung up on that. Many of us are absentee pond owners or simply don't want the on going expense of feeding. JHFV is correct though, fish that are fed will grow faster but IIRC the information that I've read here, ultimately they will not grow any larger than fish that are not fed. The "fed" fish will just get there quicker. (If I'm wrong, experts please feel free to correct me).

You really should give your forage base a chance to get established. Waiting a while to get your forage base up and running will pay dividends in the long run.

I must disagree (until the experts chime in).

Condello always says that "Mr. Opportunist" who eats both plentiful natural forage AND chows down on pellets grows bigger than "Mr. Natural " (who won't eat pellets) or "The Pellet Pig" (won't eat anything else).

Various Pros & PMs point out that fish have a finite lifespan, and while growth can resume following a period of poor diet, the growth that might have been attained during that time is lost for good.

P.S. If a non-feeding philosophy is right for your goals, desires, or situation, go for it. Your non-fed pond with beau coup forage could produce bigger fish than a fed pond with no natural feed. But great forage + feeding will produce the most or the biggest fish (depending on management) IMHO.

P.P.S. One must be much more careful of water quality when one is feeding.

Dang, that didn't take long. I sit corrected (it's too hard to stand and type).

Feeding will allow you to jam more fish into a smaller pond. Nothing wrong with feeding or not feeding... It really depends on what you're goals and personal feelings are towards it.

Well im not an expert on feeding fish by a mile but IMO there is no way a bluegill in my pond would get as big as the one i caught yesterday no matter how old he got without feeding pellets. Theres just to many bluegill in the pond for that to happen. It would take twice the amount of work and money to do it if it could be done, than spending 50 a month on aquamax 500. I caught a catfish last week that his skin was so tight around his fat belly that he looked like he was gonna explode. Im trying to get all the catfish out right now, because they just hoard all the pellets.

Thank you all for your helpful advise. First, at this time there will be no feeding(absentee, I'm tired of feeding feral hogs & raccoons,DO crashes associated with feed, etc) and I accept that the fish won't grow as fast. Second, I really want to put the predators in now and will try to persuade those folks that know I should wait. It's 5 acre pond with fairly muddy water. Here is a pic of the structure in the old creek before and after rain.





The forage should have great places to hide & muddy water. Does this sway the experts toward putting both forage & predator fish in at the same time??

Guys lets not change this into a feeding vs. non-feeding discussion. Feeding is a very complex question that we can start a new thread on. I will add that feeding (whether natural , pellets or both) does not necessarily mean bigger fish as it can just as easily mean more small fish to balance. Instead lets answer david u 's questions as he said no feeding for now.

david u the problem with stocking as you stated is the predators will either (1 eat up your forage base stocker fish (if you stock small forage and bigger predators) or (2 starve to death if you stock big forage they can't eat. There are examples (locations) where you can stock all at the same time 2 inch forage and predators if the forage #s are high and the predator #s low.

Five acres is big enough for TShad along with the BG , RES ,ect if you have fertile water. I am not sure of the dynamics of stocking GShiners and TShad at the same time along with BG and the rest. If I was going that route I would want the TShad to spawn before the first stocked GShiners could eat them or their just spawned yoy. My guess is I would wait until fall to stock the predators (2-4 inch) and adult GShiners after having stocked the TShad and small BG/RES/FH now. If you wanted you could try GShiner fry now with the plan above.

From what I have gathered on PB over the last couple of months, being proactive in establishing a strong self-sustaining forage base is important. As soon as we get some rain we are going to be stocking a new lake. Due to the size and ultimatley cost I think I am going to stock the forage over an 18 month time frame before I intoduce any predator fish. This should give the forage several opprotunities to spawn.

Brandon thats exactly what i would do if i was you. If i was building a pond right now i would have so many golden shiners and tshad stocked in it before the predator that the dang things would be jumping on the bank. But i like to catch fat black bass and HSB and other people have there own taste. Whatever floats your boat.

David that is an awesome looking pond by the way. Your not gonna have many problems with the pondweeds. Will you be able to caste from the bank to the island?

Just a reminder here that letting the BG get to far out in front creates its own risks. LMB recruitment can be seriously impacted and you end up with stunted BG and few if any LMB yoy.

I am personally a fan of stocking pure forage fish as in FHM, tshad, GSH in the spring, BG, RES in the fall and then the predators the following spring. It gives the pure forage fish a full spawning season to make lots of babies before even BG or RES could prey on their young. The BG and RES going in the pond in the fall give them a head start on the predators, but not too far a head start.

Ewest & CJ

Good points both. I like CJ's schedule. The key is to get those forage numbers up so they become self sustaining. It appears very difficult to stock forage into an already established LMB pond.

I too like what CJ is saying however you need to consider you lose an entire year of bass growth. If budget allows you can double up the forage and then put less bass in. We do our forage Nov-April then bass in June. We are getting some incredible bass growth this way. Comes out to be 50:1 bg/res to bass.

My optimum method is FH , TShad etc around March 1 , BG/RES (2 sizes 80% 2 inch and 20% 4 inch) in May and LMB (4-6 inch) Nov. 1. This is with supp feeding and a plankton bloom. LMB at 35 per acre. This is not applicable to northern ponds.

Eric two questions (to help provide David a stocking strategy):

1. How would you alter that stocking strategy if feeding were not involved? I'm asking this because David mentioned that he doesn't intend to feed at this time.

2. Since March has come and gone and we're already in May what timeline would you use to stock his pond this year?

OK, I am reading this am in the same boat with stocking as Eric. I however plan on giving the forage fish a year before inserting F1's. Mt pond filled with the last rains which lowered the Ph to 6.53. I think from what I have read that a Ph of 8 is prime. Correct? I need to add some lime to the 3.5 acre pond but not sure as to how much lime to add. Can I over do it?