Pond Boss Forums INTRO Questions & Observations Bird leg fish transport

It doesn't require thought at all. Brainless termites can build a complex mound with ventilation and escape tunnels. Leafcutter ants haul leaves from afar, and dump them into a pile to grow edible fungus. Birds can weave a swinging nest that humans would have problems learning to construct. My son plays PS3 and wins occasionally. All the above are examples of performing complex behaviors without a brain to speak of.

I learned a long time ago to never doubt nature. Every time I get arrogant and think I'm smarter than nature, I get put in my place. I don't necessarily believe that birds and fish stock ponds, but I have no doubt it's possible.

Speaking of termites, or maybe it was ants, did anyone see the special on TV where they poured concrete into a ground-based nest and let it cure for a month? Then they came back and excavated all the dirt from around the hardened concrete.

It was amazing; the thing was huge, and very complex.

WOW I can't believe I missed this. Obviously I believe it can happen. I also think that they can transport eggs in there beak. On of the mysteries of fisheries thats for certain.

Sunil, I saw the ant program, and it was amazing.

If anyone has doubts, all they have to do is watch this movie again:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UNTw7GH325U

Believe me, that bird is incapable of thought as we know it. However, when you have evolved for 100 million years, you pick up a few tricks to make a living and spread your genes.

Bobad, neat videos, as usual before I leave that site I stray off course and see ever thing remotely
related to the thing I came looking for - loved the duck eating a tractor.
PS - son and PS3

I don't believe that birds are a factor in any way of stocking ponds. However, I have no idea how gambusia always seem to show up in east texas ponds.

I think our springs must be strong (my lake has the best water level of all the lakes, also the most storm drains). A former lake chair said we have "Artesian (sp) Springs in the lake. Someone told me yesterday his fish died in his pond, we had perfect conditions here, but no fish kill. It must be the springs are providing oxygen? It is fun living with a science experiment in my back yard.

Usually groundwater is devoid of O2.

ok Theo,
That is good to know, sure was hoping for a fish kill, it just didn't happen. We are going ahead with the total fish kill soon, both MDEQ & DNR have issued permits. I will take photos and learn how to post them. I wanted low dose, stock predators, but that isn't going to happen, just have to be happy getting the money spent on my lake in this economy in this state.

Excellent points in you post! I like your posts here! However do you think a GBH would care if a male was sitting on a bed and would keep a GBH from wading through the bed?

Lynda,

I would bet a bass angler planted your gizzard shad. We've had many problems with avid bass anglers planting gizzard shad in reservoirs down here who think they are the panacea for big bass production. Trouble is in one reservoir I know of that had world class redear and bluegill fisheries, those fisheries collapsed. The gizzard shad also grew rapidly out of forage size. When I was a biologist aid one summer we gill netted gizzard shad after gizzard shad in the 14 to 18 inch size in one small reservoir. Let me tell you they get rotten really fast in a gill net overnight in warm water!

My point by saying the eggs are cared for by the parent was not meant to say a sunfish would scare off a GBH from walking through it's nest. My point was, should a sunfish egg somehow get stuck to a GBH's foot and be transported to another pond. That egg would normally be cared for by the male sunfish. Fanned with the tail to keep it aerated and silt free. So it would have less chance of survival than say a goldfish egg which has no parental care and probably would have just about as high a survival rate... If a sunfish can battle off a GBH, it would definitely have to be a RES though! HAHA

Thanks Cecil:
That is what we think about the GS, and we have an idea of who it may have been. They won't be happy to learn of the fish kill either, will throw a fit. It will be done quickly and efficiently and over with and will be quite interesting to see what improvement in water quality comes with the fish kill. Since the drains have been cleaned it won't be just the difference in the fish kill. Our Lake Co "Boys of Summer" (they are hot!)are doing extensive testing, and guess what? Our lake has over acceptable salinity something like 550 ppb while the lake across the street with zero drains had 48 ppb. Now we have data to prove the drain outside the sub is a problem. There is all this stimulus money available to do things like divert the drain, install storm drain vortex cleaning systems etc., and we were told falsely that the city had applied for this money. Just this past week our old city mgr. returned from Florida,(he took a job down there as a c.m.) he lives in this sub, could not sell his house here. Since we have made a stink in the papers and at the city meeting, I think the council people might direct him to take care of the problems here, (election next year) that would be cool!!!!!!!!!!!
The DNR guy said we will be AMAZED at how many g.s. are in here. We just have to Get Er Done.
Girlfriend LakeChair and I are looking forward to a 3 night conference at the MLSA on April 23 at Houghton Lake. Going up a day early to meet the DNR people whose conference ends the day before our starts. Then I go to the LAKE LEADER INSTITUTE THIS SUMMER, AM SO EXCITED, my applied project will be about my lake. tHIS IS THE COOL PART, THE PERSON IN CHARGE OF THE LLI, HAS JUST BEEN APPOINTED BY THE GOV., ON A 21 MEMEBER COUNCIL TO OVERSEE INLAND LAKES IN MICHIGAN, AS THE PERSON TO REPRESENT LAKEFRONT PROPERTY OWNERS, I WILL BE SPENDING 5 DAYS WITH HER, AND DOING A PROJECT ABOUT MY LAKE, HOW COOL IS THAT?
I will NEVER be in a position to be treated the way I was for 4 years here again, NEVER.!!!!!

2catmom, these guys sound like they need to be watched closely by you and Girlfriend LakeChair to ensure you are satisfied customers.

I suggest you take lawn chairs, binoculars, and sandwiches, and make a day of it.

Theo:
Let's just say GF and I have found our own stimulus package, amazing what great things are coming out of having a bad lake! I just can't stop smiling!!!!!!

I don't care who you are, that's funny right there.

Oh But JHAP:
It gets even funnier! Frankly I cannot believe my treadmill has not blown up! Now our lake is bad, really bad. We are now on the golf course schedule of treatments, 14 on our lake alone. But there 6 lakes, don't want to do them like a cookie cutter like the bad treatment guys did, so, our excellent Boys of Summer will be out here one time a week from April 23 to Labor Day. I even got them a picnic table at our access site. We have declared Our Summer of Fun in advance, all this work has to have a payoff of some kind.
Husband really wishes (in the worst way), he could take back "Not another ----dime in this house till you find out what is wrong with that lake!" And GF's Husband, well I am his worst nightmare.

Gotcha. True, much less chance of survival but not nilch. But all it takes in two fish of the opposite sex! I missed a puddle with rotenone the last time I drained down my pond. With just missing that one puddle (it was under some structure so i didn't see it) I ended up with a few thousand fry this fall!

Lynda,

You go girl! Be sure to take pics for us and post them. It should be really interesting all those gizzard shad!

2catmom,

On one of the rotenone samples that my school helped out on had about 70 20 gallon tubs full of gizzard shad in an area that was about 3 acres.

Thanks guys:
They are estimating 2,000 lbs of fish. Everything is set, waiting for the company out of Ohio to get an applicator's license, that is the last hurdle. They are biologists, the same guys that did the fish survey.
Finally, I have a customer/friend that is supposed to come this afternoon and set me up on posting pics, and maybe even get the fish logo on. I have to find all the stuff that came with my camera. Technology is not my thing, but am getting better, want to show you guys my buffer zone when it is in full bloom. The plants worked amazing well to hold in the sand, except for one spot where the springs are heavy on my frontage and the water went over the rocks. Looks like my water plants didn't make it, will get more. I have heard from someone that did have a natural fish kill in his small pond this winter, so the conditions were right for it up here, it just didn't happen here.
Then we will need input on what to stock.
What is it that triggers the fish to spawn, it must be water temperature? What would that be for gizzard shad, does anyone know?
THEO: I LOVE THE WAY YOU THINK!

Mostly water temperature, but photoperiod, moon phase and changes in water levels can also play roles depending on the species...

Gizzard shad is mostly water temperature, but I have also heard it is moon phase and in the local rivers, they seem to spawn a couple days after a heavy rain when water levels are just starting to drop...

Thanks CJ:
Friend did not make it to help with the computer, oh well, we will get it done eventually, I'm sleepy anyway, will grab a cat and take a nap.!!!!!!!!

About the tornado theory. I was in Atlantic Beach, North Carolina when a water spout formed about 5 miles off shore. Luckily, the funnel lifted off the water about a mile off shore and the storm went over the town. It dumped about 10" of water in just a few minutes. Moments after the storm, as the water drained away, I saw fish (plural) on the sidewalks. Because I was in the boardwalk area, I took some of them back to the ocean (alive). That was 1976, and I was there. Kerry Murphy