Pond Boss Forums STOCKING A NEW POND Types of fish to choose Cecil envy

Unfortunately I still only have one system. I have a second tank, but it wants to leak at the outlet and I'm currently trying to make it hold water a little better. I'd like to have at least four by next year. One for bluegill, one for yellow perch, one for redear sunfish and one for either largemouth bass or hybrid striped bass.

Bruce :

Shorty indicate in a post that your area had very cold temps. -2 if I remember last weekend. I was just checking to get the first cold weather report on the YP in the RAS.

= walmart special chinese

Here are some fact sheet links on southern RAS don't know if they help your project or not.

http://srac.tamu.edu/index.cfm?catid=24

It's been horribly cold, and the snow has made it impossible for me to visit the farm to check on the Po'Boy Chinese system. If I'm lucky, the roads will be passable tonight and I'll go check. Let's hope I don't have frozen solid perch!!! Good links, ewest.

Brrrrrrr!!!

It was -2 (actual temp) this morning with a forcast high of a whopping 9 degrees today. We also got another inch of snow last night. Burrrr....

Bruce, I hope your YP are doing fine. IMO A small space heater on low keeping the room temperature up a little bit would probably work well to keep things from freezing up. I base this on the homing pigeons I have in my coup, their breathing/body heat keeps their waterer from freezing up until the outside temperature gets below 20 degrees, this is with a hole in the wall so they can come and go out of the coup.

Are you interested in coming out to look at them sometime? My only concern with a space heater is the minor water spray/mist coming off the sweeper nozzle. I'd like to show it off to someone.

I would love to see them some time, especially your YP tank.

I'm looking for some ideas on how to grow out a small number of SMB to a size that can be stocked in our pond as a bonus fish. Finding SMB bigger than 2-3 inches has been tough. So tough that I have been kicking around an idea of building a SMB only pond with rock bass and orange spotted sunfish as prey, then moving some of the SMB to the bigger pond once they a 12" or larger. I have to thank Dave Willis for giving me some ideas how to spend my money.

My other options are to grow them out in tank or transplant a few wild ones from the Missouri River near Yankton. Seeing your set up my will help me make some decisions as to which direction I may want to go.

SHORTY, we may need some educated input from others, but I believe that smallmouth just don't grow that fast. A 12" smallie may be 2 years old (?).

Cecil should know about SMB growth rates as he does grow them out. I don't know what size he starts with though.

This spring, my fish guy is going to swing by Cecil's place and take a bunch of adult SMB off his hands (and maybe some other fish). Cecil commented on another thread that he had bigger smallies if anyone wanted them. If there are no other takers besides myself, I'll try to get all of them.

Heck, I think the 12" LMB's in our pond are on average are 2 years old, at ice out in the spring I typically see lots of 3-1/2" to 5" LMB in shallow. I was thinking a 12" 2 year old smallie might be big under natural growing conditions for our area. Here is what got me thinking about stocking some smallmouth:

http://www.bassresource.com/fish_biology/stocking_smallmouth_bass.html

BTW - I think I'm starting to catch both the Cecil and Bruce envy all at the same time! I might even have a little bit of Dave Willis envy too!

SHORTY - - My cell number is (402) 429-2912. I'm heading out through the frozen tundra to check the perch right now!!

I suppose that anybody who knows his physics, or heat pumps, or thermal budgets knows this kind of thing, but I just discovered something interesting.

We're in the middle of a really nasty cold spell, so I finally got out to the Morton Building and found the following temp. values.

General building--floor level: 32 F.

15 X 42 fish room with water tank--34 F. floor level.

Inside the insulated hood--41 F. floor level and 44 F. highest level.

Water in 150 gallon tank--54 F.

I was completely surprised that the cold building that was only insulated R-4 during a cold snap where outside temps are averaging about 5 F., did not have any impact on the tank. The heat energy in the well water was apparently plenty to overcome the cold air temperature.

Keep in mind that water is being injected at less than 1 gpm.

The yellow perch were in incredible shape and treated me to another agressive feeding, oblivious to the frigid outdoor weather. This is VERY encouraging!

Bruce (this may all be terribly obvious):

I'm assuming from the pictures that it's a newer building and is sealed pretty good.

I think as Winter goes along and the ground temp drops, the inside temperature will be lower and closer to what you expect. Inside temps in our horse barn (overnight, when all the doors are shut) tend to go down all Winter long. It's a lot like the bottom of a pond having a higher temp at the beginning of Winter due to the stored solar energy from Summertime, which slowly dissipates.

Bruce :

That is great news !! I was concerned that you would have YP popsicles. You might get by with out a heater but I am not sure about that if you get a long real cold spell. What is the temp. of the well water? Seems like I saw an aquarium heater that floats so that it won't touch the sides and does not get to hot. I will see if I can find the link. ewest

Theo--I'll keep checking the floor temps and post them throughout the winter if you're interested. I'm sure you are right on the money (as always ) but it will be interesting to watch. We'll also see what it does to the water temperature. On the good side, the air temps will likely never get much worse than they are right now.

ewest--find that link!

Bruce:

Thinking along the lines of a non-destructive heater for the tank, TSC (or wherever you got the tank at) should also have submersible heaters that are safe for plastic tanks ($20-$25). They are made to mount through the drain hole (which you are already using) but can easily be attached to the other side using a hole saw (or drill and file) to cut in a new one. I did this with our first plastic tank, the one my wife complains about not being able to take the heater out of for Summertime.

I think they are supposed to keep the water about 40 deg F, which would be more than sufficient to prevent perch-sicles. I can post a picture of one if you want to see what they look like.

Roger, that.

Bruce :

Here is a link. I think you can get (look under) a sub. heater and sub. heater module and together they will work as the outside of the module does not get hot. But check on that I am not sure exactly how it works . They also have a controler that has a big temp. range -30 to 100+. Also a lot of other options. It looks like some of the pond heaters would work also.

http://www.aquaticeco.com/index.cfm/fuseaction/listings.subsections/sid/38

Bruce:

Here are two similar types of submersible plastic tank heaters. In the side view you can see the adjustable screws which serve as feet to keep large animals from pushing the heating element into the bottom of the tank (for when your YP get REALLY BIG). These are both 1500 watt models.

I hate to admit this, but I still don't quite get it. Is this device secured to the lip of the tank? Or does is sit on the bottom?

You remove the drain plug or put in a second hole at the same height above the bottom of the tank. You unscrew the black flange from the right-hand side (in the above views) of the heater, put the heater inside the tank and pull the electric cord outside the tank through the hole. You rescrew the flange (with a rubber gasket like the drain plug assembly uses) back on to the outside to tighten both sides (red and black) together on the inside and outside, respectively, of the tank. The heater coil is inside, under the water, fixed in place, unable to touch the plastic sides of the tank. The electric cord is outside.

If this isn't clear enough Bruce, I can take pix while mounting the spare heater in the spare tank. Let me know.

Theo, that's pretty neat. I assume that the 2 long screws are adjustment and leveling screws to counteract the weight of the heater and to keep it level and away from the bottom of the tank. I've only used floating de-icers that are pretty trouble ridden.

Is there any way of thermostatically controlling it? I would think that controlling the water temp would be a big plus for Bruce.

I have not seen any user-controlled thermostat available on any of the lower priced tank heaters (that a cheapskate like me will buy). The built-in thermostats are supposed to maintain, say, 40 deg F. I have never had one that ran what I would consider "too hot," but have had one or two (see above photos) which may have been set too low (never did any checking, if they didn't keep the tank ice-free I replaced them). So it would probably be a good idea to test one for a little while before trusting it with fish. Bruce could probably do this in the back yard in town.

LOL!!! Floaters worked OK for us for 15 years in cast iron bathtubs, but I have not set a plastic trough on fire since I switched to fixed, submersible heaters.

DD :

As noted it is a cost issue. See the link below for a temp. controller for a heater at about $100. The link in post above has quite a few options including pond heaters which may work well for a small RAS but most inexpensive heaters are usualy set for a bottom temp. of 40 and only adjustable above that temp. ewest

http://www.aquaticeco.com/index.cfm/fuseaction/product.detail/iid/9207/cid/2214

From what I know of Nebraska winters, I dont think a thermostat or adjustable model will be needed. If necessary, he can use the timer running the heater.

BM :

You are right Bruce can get by with a space heater. Bruce , I think is concerned that the spray from the system will get on the floor and the heater plus eletc..... and bzzzzzt --no more fish no more Bruce. Plus an in tank RAS heater and controller will allow total control of the RAS temp. without heating the building.

I'm going out to the farm again tomorrow afternoon to check the tank. If the temperature of the water is still 54 degrees, then I don't think I'll need any auxiliary heating at all. That would be ideal. Luckily, yellow perch seem to grow pretty well at this temp. What other fish can you say this about? Bluegill maybe. By the same token, will the water stay really cool in the summer? One thought I had was to route the water outside for a couple of hundred feet through black garden hose to warm it. I'd like the summer temperatures to get up into the upper 60's or even low 70's. My ultimate goal would be to have 50 or so big healthy predator resistant yellow perch to stock in my pond every year. The rest I might even be able to just eat. Maybe for helping me I could ship some of you guys some tasty YP filets for Christmas next year!

Yeah, the water mists a little bit when the sweeper stream hits the surface of the water. That mist hitting my quartz space heater would make me a teeny bit nervous.