Pond Boss Forums INTRO Questions & Observations A challenge to show a pic of a female bluegill...

Can anyone show me a pic of a female bluegill with the black scale tipping that extends from the back of the head, radiating backward, that is confined to a small area under anterior part of the spiney dorsal fin? The black scale tips are a characteristic of a male, but i want to know if there are any exceptions out there.

The first person that can show me a bonafide female with this will get a free bluegill mount from me (I'm a fish taxidermist by trade).

I'll be waiting.

I've attached a pic of a male with the black scale tips. (Photo by Bill Cody - I think).



Here are the black scale spots on a lighter male. (Photo Bill Cody - I think)

I just looked through about 100 pictures and couldn't find one. Do they exist?

That's what I'm trying to find out. There could be an anomaly somewhere or a fish that didn't read our article.

BTW, the reason I noticed this black scale tip thing a few years ago is I have to paint them back in with an airbrush. And I've only observed it on males. If I wasn't a taxidermist I'm not sure I would have noticed it.

Cecil, I will look thru the BG pics I have on the computer at home (2 or 3 hundred of them) when I have time this week. I recall thinking I saw blacktipped scales on BG I believed were female. I certainly may have been wrong - probably 2 or 3 times in that statement.

I have been observing the prominent black scale tipping only on male BG for at least 23 years now. I use it as a primary character but not the only feature to acurately separate male and female BG. Often the black scale tipping will be faint in very lightly colored male BG and in BG that are collected in winter. I've stocked lots of male BG as a single sex species in numerous ponds. So far I have 100% accuracy.

Cecil how will you know if the photo of a female BG with black scale tipping is really a true female with viable ovaries? Not that I would do that, but I could send you a photo of a BG with black scale tipping and tell you it is a definate female. Cross my heart Where is the proof? For me, I would have to see the exterior features with the ripe egg sac attached similar to the photo of the YP I sent you showing egg development.

I want that female with the black spots disemboweled with the ovaries visible.

You're a sick man, Cecil.

OK, I think I found one.

Here's one of Theo's gravid female bluegill from last year. It looks to me like it might have the scale tipping youire looking for.

So if that truly is a gravid female who do I owe the free bluegill to? Bruce or Theo?

Wow it goes to show you in nature there are always exceptions. And of course Theo has a bluegill that is having sexual identity problems. It's a shemale!

i almost lost my dinner laughing so hard.......that sentence of english words....... only on pondboss

That's the best argument picture I found last night, Bruce. There are 3-4 more of what could be females that have roughly the same amount of black scale tipping, but that is the one that I feel surest is a female.

Not me. It's Theo's fish. I was just playing because it was a challenge.

I think Cecil wil be ordering a la carte.

Theo,

Contact me when you get a bluegill that you want mounted. It's on me.

I'm just glad somone found a picture. I was considering sorting and moving some bluegills to my male only bluegill pond based on mainly that characteristic as I was so confident that ONLY males had the black scale tips in that particular area, but not only does this show -- although rare -- a female can have the black spots, it could have resulted in me not having an all male bluegill pond!

After draining a million gallon pond, rotenoning it and all the work that entailed to have an only male bluegill pond, I sure don't want to mess up because I am impatient.

Of course Bruce and Bill Cody the bluegill experts told me I better hold off and look for two or three male characteristics vs. just one to be on the safe side. I will also be looking for sex products when they are in full spawning mode i.e. milt and eggs (bulging gravid female) and possibly egg sampling via a catheter tube.

My goal is to have a pond with only male bluegills and female yellow perch and the female perch are already in there. They were easy to sex during spawning season. I'm hoping it will also be so during bluegill spawning season.

Thanks, Cecil. Plastic wrap, wet towel, and then freeze?

Plastic wrap not necessary. Just a wet towel around the fish inserted into a tightly sealed plastic garbage bag is fine. Wrap tape around that. You can actually keep a fish in the freezer for years that way. One of my own fish -- I just couldn't get to -- kept just fine for 15 years that way. (My own fish don't pay the bills).

And you can ship a fish like this regular ground UPS or Priority Mail as long as you wrap plenty of newspaper around it to insulate it.

Just like Bruce's (and mine and ...)

I just spend $ growing and catching them ! -- --

Theo, Very interesting fish. Did you get them from Jones? I wonder what is the origin of their brood stock?

Cecil, Never say never when it comes to biology. For male BG stocking, that is why my BG stay isolated until I can verify 2 or 3 sexual characters. Patience, Grasshopper patience.

Yes, Bill, all my BG came from Jones. No idea about their origin prior to that. I do like their coloration almost as much as CSBG; about 20-25% have red eyes.

Red eyes? That's interesting. As a taxidermist and all I've never seen a bluegill with red eyes. Only smallmouth and Rock Bass.

A fair number of Lusk's BG have red eyes too. IIRC Bruce caught some like that at LL2.

Theo - Clues so far are suggesting the Jones' BG broodstock had southern origins. Jones' grandfather who started the family hatchery was from Kentucky. His broodsock likely came from locales further south to southwest.

Does anyone have a close-up photo of Lusk's red eyed BG?

Bruce may have posted a pic of one earlier, like after the conference last year.

I will try and upload one of mine and post it tomorrow, if anyone wants to see.