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#105124 01/17/08 01:35 PM
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It is not often that JHAP gets angry. Normally he is an easy going guy that enjoys life. But on occasion an event happens that spurs him into action. Yesterday such an event occured.

Out of the blue and completely unsolicited I began receiving a magazine from the "North American Fishing Club." I did not sign up for or in any way solicit or request this magazine. Shortly after the magazines began to arrive I started receiving invoices for "membership dues" to the North American Fishing Club." The tone of these invoices began getting more and more agressive. Finally in yesterday's mail I received a letter from the North American Fishing Club. In the upper right corner of the letter in bold type were the words "Collections Referral Notice." Here is the text of the letter verbatum....


According to our records forwarded to me by our Membership Director, you have not yet paid for your benefits in the NORTH AMERICAN FISHING CLUB.

You accepted our offer to become a Member of the Club about five months ago. In good faith, we sent you a full Membership Kit, validated your Membership Card, and started your subscription to our Members-only magazine North American Fisherman.

And we cleared the way for you to take advantage of a vast array of other benefits, many of which represent substantial privileges that cost a significant amount of money to provide.

Yet, despite our repeated requests for payment (this is the sixth), we still have not heard back from you. This has left us no choice but to refer your name on to our Collection Agency. To avoid our need to pursue formal collection efforts on your account you must let us know if you've decided not to become a Member by writing cancel on the enclosed invoice and returning it to us.

However, if you resolve this matter by submitting payment immediately, we'll be happy to reinstate your full Club privileges and welcome you back as a Member.



As I have previously said, I did not request this magazine or any membership information. In fact I do not know how they received my name and address. This was completely unsolicited. As you can imagine threatening a CPA with collections is not taken lighty - nor should it be by anyone.

I conducted an internet search and found several complaits on different venues related to this company for exactly the same tactics. I called the company and after wading through a menu driven answering system "cancelled" my unrequested membership. In order to "cancel" you had to select a cancelation reason. The first reason choice was "I don't remember signing up for membership." Obviously there so many people that call their "Club" related to their "membership dues" billing this is their number one cancellation reason choice on the automated system. I was not happy that I was not able to speak to a representative (the method above was completely automated) so I called back and selected several menu choices until I was able to speak to a real live individual. I told them in no uncertain terms that I wanted my unsolicited membership cancelled - which the representative claimed he would and that I can ignore any future requests for payment. I told him that I had better not receive any future requests for payment or any other correspondence from this organization.

But this still did not sit well with me. So I have formally lodged a consumer complaint with the Office of Minnesota Attorney General's office (this is the state in which the "North Americal Fishing Club" resides or at least lists as an address.

I am also researching the process of filing a US mail fraud complaint.

I am interested to hear if anyone else has received information from this organization.

Moderators: I have posted this thread for infomation purposes and as warning to other members of this forum. If you feel this post is in any way objectionable or does not adhere to the posting rules of Pond Boss please contact me.




JHAP
~~~~~~~~~~

"My mind is a raging torrent, flooded with rivulets of thought cascading into a waterfall of creative alternatives."
...Hedley Lamarr (that's Hedley not Hedy)
jeffhasapond #105126 01/17/08 01:40 PM
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This is a good post, and I've seen the exact same tactic used by the same magazine two, maybe three years ago.

Extremely sleazy in my book.

It's too bad when the pursuit of the almighty buck makes companies like this ignore all rules of basic morality. I wish there was some way to stick it to them.


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Feel lucky at least you got something to do with fishing. We and others here in Texas got a box of light bulbs in the mail and then started getting the threating letters that we would be reported to the credit agency if we didn't pay for our order.

I went shopping at best buy for christmas last year and the little gal at the counter said you want a free subscribtion to sports illustrated it's free with your purchase. I said sure why not. Only to find out that I had aurthorized them to start hitting my credit card for continuing service after the 6 months trail period. I had to go thru hoops to undo what had happened. Sorry to here you have had to deal with this kinda crap.

Last edited by rockytopper; 01/17/08 02:39 PM.


The road goes on forever and the party nevers end...............................................
rockytopper #105134 01/17/08 05:46 PM
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I think now is the time for the GSA to go into action. The NAFC will be no match for the GSA. Bring the power to bare. Let's go get um. I'm with you JHAP.


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heybud #105135 01/17/08 06:26 PM
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I've also heard of this situation by that company.


It's not about the fish. It's about the pond. Take care of the pond and the fish will be fine. PB subscriber since before it was in color.

Without a sense of urgency, Nothing ever gets done.

Boy, if I say "sic em", you'd better look for something to bite. Sam Shelley Rancher and Farmer Muleshoe Texas 1892-1985 RIP
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I had a membership with them many years ago but never had any problems like that when I cancelled my subscription.


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I was a subscribing member of that magazine (club) several years ago. I even got some of their books. However trying to get them to stop sending books when I was no longer interested was another story, and they kept pestering me to buy things. I never renewed my subscription as I find high pressure sales tactics a real turn off. They lost me.

Jeff,

I would also suggest filling out a complaint to their local BBB. If they get enough of these they may regret it. I did that with a bill collecting company that was calling me six times a day even though they had the wrong person. They had to send me a letter of apology.

Last edited by Cecil Baird1; 01/17/08 09:17 PM.

If pigs could fly bacon would be harder to come by and there would be a lot of damaged trees.






Cecil Baird1 #105176 01/18/08 11:38 AM
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Bruce, good point I have found that running a business with a high ethical and moral compass results in a sucessful business.

Rocky, I have heard of that light bulb scam before - amazing what lengths some companies will go for a buck. Did ya at least get the swimsuit edition?

Dave, it appears to be rampant. I have found complaints about them on several forums.

Brian, glad you had a good experience, perhaps they have more recently changed their tactics.

Cecil, good point - I'm going find our where their local BBB is and lodge a complaint.

In my research I have found out the following information related to mail fraund:

This is from the US Postal Services's web site:

Solicitation Disguised as Invoices:

Title 39, United States Code, Section 3001, makes it illegal to mail a solicitation in the form of an invoice, bill, or statement of account due unless it conspicuously bears a notice on its face that it is, in fact, merely a solicitation. This disclaimer must be in very large (at least 30-point) type and must be in boldface capital letters in a color that contrasts prominently with the background against which it appears.

The disclaimer must not be modified, qualified, or explained, such as with the phrase "Legal notice required by law." It must be the one prescribed in the statute, or alternatively, the following notice prescribed by the U.S. Postal Service: THIS IS NOT A BILL. THIS IS A SOLICITATION. YOU ARE UNDER NO OBLIGATION TO PAY THE AMOUNT STATED ABOVE UNLESS YOU ACCEPT THIS OFFER.


Since their mailing did not contain ANY of this criteria I am filing a complaint with the US Postal Inspectors office.

Heybud, I normally try to keep my official role as Chief Security Officer of the GSA separate and distinct from my personal life. Since the GSA's primary role is to promote and protect the reputation of the much maligned GSF and has nothing to do with magazine solicitation I can't in good concious divert GSA resources to assist me in this personal struggle. I will however admit that if in fact the GSA's star wars laser cannon was operational there would be a possibility that I would "accidently" enter the North American Fishing Clubs gps coordinates into the computer system, and perhaps while dusting the weapon activation panel I would accidently energize the transmodulator, and if I spilt coffee on the fail safe safety panel and, in cleaning it, accidently turned both activation keys to the ready mode and entered the 32 digit arming security code and then quite innocently and by accident press the flashing red "easy" button, well that would be a shame, a real shame.




JHAP
~~~~~~~~~~

"My mind is a raging torrent, flooded with rivulets of thought cascading into a waterfall of creative alternatives."
...Hedley Lamarr (that's Hedley not Hedy)
jeffhasapond #105178 01/18/08 11:46 AM
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Just when is the GSA "Death Star" expected to become operational?



"Live like you'll die tomorrow, but manage your grass like you'll live forever."
-S. M. Stirling
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Theo Gallus #105766 01/24/08 10:24 PM
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I started getting these after I bought my boat back in October of last year. Before that I had never even heard of them. I now get these "CONGRATULATIONS, You've been nominated to join" letters about twice a week.

This leads me to believe they are monitoring the credit reporting agencies because I don't keep casual acquaintances and none of my friends or family that I share my life with would submit my name to crooks like this. Might have been a similar situation if you've financed any major purchase that can be related to the sport of fishing. I wish I knew a way to stop this. Its the same kind of thing that happens when you finance a new house or truck, you get inundated with spam mail to sign up for an ARM or get 0% interest on factory reject Ford F150's (edit).

Sad as it seems, the only way to avoid these all together is to not finance any major purchases. Otherwise you are forced to jump through hoops because legal jargon and 4px fonts violate our right to privacy.

I've kinda learned, just by paying attention...usually to the fine print that only God, family and friends give stuff away for free. If its from a company...they expect something in return even if its just to get you talking. Bad publicity is still publicity to any business.

--
if I'm not fishing, I'm planning my next trip.


If I'm not fishing, then I just got back from the lake or I'm planning my next trip
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JHAP -
I own a small business, and we see this kind of scam from various companies many times every year. It always starts with a newsletter or a magazine, and then in about 6 months, a bill for a hefty sum of money. Ignore them, and they'll just keep sending increasingly threatening collection letters. Ultimately, it always ends with a threat to turn your "account" over to their collection agency. Then, we have to WASTE our time contacting the fools and threaten to submit to the state Attorney General before they'll quit. Some of the people, when you finally make it to a live person are STILL extremely high pressure and often quite rude. Most of them are obviously in a large volume call center overseas. Must be one heck of a big business... if you can stomach calling it a "business".


12 ac pond in NW Missouri. 28' max depth at full pool. Fish Present: LMB, BG, RES, YP, CC, WB, HSB, WE, BCP, WCP, GSH.
Weissguy #105801 01/25/08 11:51 AM
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Update and side note:

Ironically this past weekend I was watching TV and I found a fishing program on and was watching it. It turned out to be sponsored by the North American Fishing Club. It was a good show. It's too bad that they have to resort to such tactics as I described above.

Weissguy, I agree. I hate this type of scam. As a CPA I see this all of the time. Companies that send out mailers charging for filing simple annual stock statements for a large fee (when the actual form takes about 5 minutes and has a $10 filing fee.

Bad business in my opinion.


JHAP
~~~~~~~~~~

"My mind is a raging torrent, flooded with rivulets of thought cascading into a waterfall of creative alternatives."
...Hedley Lamarr (that's Hedley not Hedy)
jeffhasapond #105897 01/26/08 11:05 AM
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Jeff,
California has a consumer protection law for just that sort of scam. It says any unsolicited item that you receive in the mail is yours, it is free.
I had it happen with the Los Angeles Times, sent me a garden book and a 30 dollar dun followed a month or so later. I refused to pay and it went to collections, so I sent the Times a request for a copy of my "order" and advised them of the law, that stopped it for me. Never heard from either again and it never show up on my credit report. I did thank them for the book.


1/4 & 3/4 acre ponds. A thousand miles from no where and there is no place I want to be...
Dwight Yoakam

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