Pond Boss Forums STOCKING A NEW POND Types of fish to choose SMB in 3 acre pond??

Had to be able to identify 150 species in fisheries class but probably can't do it now.

Back to Devils Lake. I'm sure there were other species of baitfish etc. but the fathead restrictions keeps exotics out hopefully.

I still maintain if you exluded darters, shiner species etc. many species have been naturalized in this country from other areas.

Cecil - the white bass and crappie were probably introduced into the Devils lake by man. You are correct, ther are many natual landlocked lakes in Canada with very few species if any sport fish. Stream access to a lake diversifies the species.

There are alot of lakes that indeed have only one top-shelf predator, or two at most just a few hours north into Canada. There are also alot that WERE that way but 'visitors' to the lakes often take it open themselves to 'stock' their preferred game species. One and only one good thing I can think of about Quebec is that they severely restrict the use of live bait in many areas. Even there though I know of lakes that were Trout or SMB only, or Trout/Pike or Trout/SMB.. or other similar combinations that now are Minimal-Trout/Pike/SMB/LMB/B-Gill/Perch.... most of those lakes end up with very little in the way of Trout left. Other thing that happens in alot of remote lakes is that they get poached out. They may not have many people that fish them but often those that do pay no mind to the whole selective-harvest concept and just keep everything until there is little in breeding stock left. From what I know this was especially prevalent in the 70's-80's in north-west Quebec and north-east Ontario. Never enough game wardens around to look after busy lakes let alone those that are hard to reach.
(oops I started ranting...sorry)

Pottsy - The problem is fishermen cannot see underwater and they do not understand the concept of nutrient limitation and carrying capacity. Most think a lake is limitless in its ability to produce fish.

Bill -- you said a mouthful!! Amen.

Dave

There has been much discussion about LMB vs. SMB competition. I think I stumbled on a piece of the puzzel. LMB are estimated to produce 13,000 eggs/ pound body wieght. SMB are estimated to produce only 8,000 eggs/# body wieght.

But temp. should not be a consideration.
SMB
Spawn 58-62 F
Grow 50-70 F
Upper Leathal 95 F
LMB
Spawn 60-65 F
Grow 55-80 F
Upper Leathal Unknown
So as long as some of your water stays >70F you should experience optimal growth, but if your water never gets <95F you should be able to keep them alive.
maybe SMB lower spawning temp. puts them at a disadvantage against LMB. SMB should hit the spawning beds first, but maybe they loose established nests to LMB moving in to spawn just a few days later? Just guessing, but it would be and interesting study to do... I'm need to learn how to SCUBA.

Everyone here is making the assumption that the lake will depend on natural reproduction. With natural reproduction, certainly LMB will outcompete SMB in many conditions. However, the concept of put, grow and take is well established in many situations. With SMB, they need to be at least 8" in my experience to survive predation. We can do much more with our small lakes if we don't restrict ourselves to thinking we have to depend on natural reproduction.

Alot of people do need to depend on natural reproduction, me for example. My father and uncles (the land owners in my case) are not going to spend money on stocking 8" smb every other year, they would just assume go with LMB. Most amerature Pond bosses are not willing to invest that kind of money every year in a pond. But you are correct that put and take will gurantee you a smb fisery.

I'm with Norm on this one. I have too many lakes under management where bass reproduction is the biggest hindrance to bass production.
If predator fish didn't reproduce, and forage fish did, we could manage for size and numbers of those predators.
That's one reason I like hybrid stripers....they don't spawn. What you get is what you get.
If largemouth bass, and smallmouths, could be totally managed as a fishery that didn't reproduce, we could re-stock them from time to time to maintain "proper" numbers of a given year class.
Our length/weight ratios, relative weights could easily predict the need to restock predators. Predators couldn't get ahead of the food chain, (which, by the way, is the most expensive part of managing a fishery), and game fish could grow at refreshing rates.
And, at $.85 for a largmouth bass fingerling, or $2 for a smallmouth, $20-40 per acre, every other year seems pretty cheap to me, to have a lake with manageable numbers of predators.
But, fish spawn, and we do the best we can to deal with it.
So goes nature.
Fun, huh?

Many combinations of different species of fish can succeed with monitoring and management. Main differences are how MUCH management is needed for each combination to produce the highest quality fishery. Some are willing to do more to have a unique fishery.

Thank you Bob for putting some dollar numbers on this subject. I use the term "subadult" to refer to fish that are young but big enough to survive predation in an existing fish population. For bass, I think this is in the 8-10" range, often available in the fall.

There are two issues here. The first is money. Some people have little or no money to spend on their lakes. That's fine. Like many people, I read this forum every day. I'm amassed by the amount of money people are spending on their lakes. It starts with building the lake which runs from the thousands to tens of thousands of dollars. Aerators, fish feeders, fertilizer and hiring lake managers all take money. Spending more money on fish will make sense to many people.

If people accept spending money on adding fish just as they spend money on feeding them, they give themselves a very powerful management tool.

We can replace year classes that have failed. We can manage stunted populations of panfish by adding more bass rather than killing everything in the lake. We can have a species of fish in our lakes that probably wouldn't naturally reproduce. We can establish fish populations in new lakes much faster.

For many reasons, private lake managers haven't used this management tool as much as they might. It is a tool that we all might want to consider.

I think personal satisfaction is what it's all about. Some take pride in eating what they raise for free, others don't mind spending $$$ to maintain quality. The keys are management, knowledge, and how you use the resources you are given. I LOVE fishing, and have spent countless hours catching and relocating every fish that's currently in my pond, (excluding this years offspring). I will rely on the hatcheries to furnish the pieces I'm missing...but I "key" into the advice of others who have been there. Listen and read...but most of all, catching what satisfies "You" is what it's all about. After that, you get to decide which ones you're going to eat !

Hello,

COuld you please tell me where you are purchasing the fish to stock your pond. I have a pond by my housing edition that I put some LMB, Blue Gill, Crappie in. SMB would be nice. I would like to get a good forage fish to feed the bass. I can purchase crawfish at Westside Bait Shop. Any help would be appreciated.

Thanks.

Kingrichard

TyW33, another assumption we make is that our fish species have to be all or nothing. SMB don't have to be your only or major predator. You can put in SMB, walleye, wipers, etc. as money or access to fish allows. Then tell everyone that you will do great bodily harm to anyone that removes these fish. They can harvest the other species but not these.

If you have a sand pit, I've always wondered why you haven't stock it by now? Just because it is still being dug out doesn't mean you can't have fish in it. We are still digging out our lake but stocked it as soon as it held enough water to support fish.