Pond Boss Forums INTRO Questions & Observations online college biologist degree question

Online college degrees are becoming more and more popular. It seems there are many online degrees available now days that are every bit as legit as actually physically attending college. I'd like opinions from fishery biologists and such on this subject. I've always been interested in marine biology,etc. I drive a gas truck about 12-14 hours a night and dont have time to go to college. My only option would be online courses. If anybody has any knowledge or suggestions for me I'd greatly appreciate it. Also, how is the job market now days? I live in Cullman, Al (north alabama) Thanks for any help and/or suggestions.

I have a B.S. degree from Texas A&M in the Wildlife & Fisheries Sciences department. That degree was the Aquaculture Option. I have only held one or two jobs, but have been mostly unemployed my entire career. I love it, because a niche has grown up around my life. I have lots of clients who don't mind writing a check for what I know, and many buy fish through me to stock their lakes, when needed. So, I have a really nice income. But, I made up my mind a long time ago not to work for any agency or major company. Too risky. Work forever, maybe laid off, lose bennies, then what? So, being a bit of a maverick kind of guy, I have worked hard to carve a spot in the pond management business. While I think my degree has lent credibility, actually going out to create a game plan for a passionate landowner, then putting the plan into effect has been my ticket. Credibility may get you in the door, but results keep you there. Set some goals, think them through. If you aren't passionate about becoming a biologist, forget it. But, if you have a driving passion, chase it, now. It ain't easy, but it's certainly worth it.

Firstly, marine biology is salt water / ocean stuff. Freshwater stuff is limnology and often aquatic biology topics. A degree in fisheries can be either marine or freshwater oriented.

If you do this education on line you will miss out on a lot of neccessary laboratory interaction and many field studies. In my opinion, science degrees are not well suited for on-line studies. I would never hire a biologist with an online degree.

Most biologists do not make a lot of money at least right out of school. The ones that make the most money have been graduated a long time and usually work in unrelated fields. Long term biologists in the field have to love the job to be happy because most are not getting rich, unless you call happy at work rich.

Newly graduated Pharmacists and engineers who are competitive and knowledgable are often starting at salaries of $50K-60K+. Currently there is a shortage of pharmacists.

Good Luck.

Additonal to what Bill said there is a lot of competition for openings in the field. When I had my degree I found that there were people with bachelor degrees competing for technical postions, and people with masters degrees competing for bachelor level postions. Even PHD's doing labor postions just to get their foot into the door.

No offense but I doubt if you were taken seriously with an online degree in this field.

Another thing is there are a lot of politics and favoritism involved with some of the state positions. I was once denied a job due to my polticial afiliation. Some biologists actually get burned out too.

After reading Bill and Cecil's posts, I would be remiss to leave this out...as much as I love what I do as a fisheries biologist, the first 8, yes that's EIGHT, years, I was able to take very little money from my business. It was hell, financially. We lived hand to mouth, and had to borrow money every winter. Then, I would work my tail off in the spring to pay the loan. Finally, in 1991, I earned enough money to not borrow. Then, in my 14th year, I started earning slightly more than I needed to live. Now, 26 years into it, I am having the time of my life. I'll always remember the hard times, times when I probably should have quit to become a pharmacist or school teacher or something 'safe.' But, there is a burning flame deep inside that has always told me to quit whining, shut up and keep working. Really glad I did.

Good post Bob. Shows alot of character.

We're glad you stuck it out too, Bob!

Keven, Just my opinion. The answer might be that it all depends; What are your goals? There are some excellent fish guys that never darkened the door of any college. They learned on the job, at minimum wage. You could, maybe, do it while taking online courses with lab work being on the job. BTW, I've never seen an online degree that is as legit as a good University. Emphasis should be placed on good.

After 25+ years in the employment business, I haven't found a whole lot of people who come roaring out of bed every morning wanting to get to work. I've often asked "If you had it all to do over again?". Almost all of the satisfied ones have been, like Bob, self employed. Most say something about wife, kids, mortgage and not a lot of choices. If you find that you are passionate about it and have a way to live while learning, go for it and don't let anybody talk you out of it. The question you also have to ask is what you could bring to a potential employer or even to a potential client. You have to be unique.

Sign up for some classes and see if you really can't wait to get to the next book. You'll know.

Keven -- one of the difficulties with online courses is the problem with the "hands-on" type of information. I could show you a videotape of how to set and run a fyke net or gill net, but it's just not the same as doing it. So, I think that's the reason that online degrees are a little further behind in the biological sciences than something like business.

Kevin, I'm currently in school at Virginia Tech and just switched majors to Fisheries Science...a large part due to this forum and other things. I was in engineering, making good money. I even had a guaranteed starting salary of 30-35k directly out of college working with the state DOT. But after two summers of internships and realizing that I would be spending 35-40 hours a week sitting at a desk staring at AutoCAD, I decided that this wasn't what I wanted to do for the rest of my life...

Here's what I think...

I always here people talking about things they wished they would have done (ie they didn't go to college, should have went into a different career, etc). I don't want to end up in their shoes 20 years down the road, so my philosophy has always been to never get 'stuck' in this position. If there is something you want to do, do it, whether it's bungee jumping or changing careers. Meadowlark has posted several times about how being a pond owner/manager is all about the enjoying the journey - from stocking fingerlings to catching those big bass or reaching whatever goals you have set. Life is the same - enjoy the ride.
So my advice...ask yourself where you want to be in 10, 20, 30 years and what do you want to be doing? Then do it.


By the way is anyone hiring summer interns in a fisheries related job? If so, please PM or email me.

Bob, Great post. We are in our second year and you are right about living hand-to-mouth and borrowing from Peter to pay Paul and back again. I don't think I sleep more than 2 hours before I wake up in horror on what bill to pay next!

But it is great to work for yourself! Yes, I am putting in 60-80+ hours a week but just like you, I can see and feel that burning desire to make it succeed, mainly to help the pond owners out there that need the help to obtain their dreams.

Kevin, I used to work at Sea World of FL. I topped out at $7/hr because there were so many biologist that wanted to "work with Shamu". I left there and joined the US Coast Guard and worked directly under our Marine Science Tech. in Alaska.

When I got my discharge, I stayed in the biology field and worked for company in FL. maintaining lakes and ponds for invasive aquatic weeds, (15 years). For reasons I am unable to elaborate on, (review Bob's post and you get an idea) I was forced into starting my own company doing what I loved and did in Florida.

If I had just done that when I got out of the Coast Guard, I would like to think that I would be where Bob is now.

I would say if Biology is your love and calling, go to school for it. Once you are out, carve your niche and make a market for yourself. It will be difficult to start but once you realize that you are helping not only the environment with your "NEW AND UPCOMMING IDEAS" but you will be helping your fellow man as well, you will succeed!

Sepmer Peratus, Go Coast Guard!

Thanks to folks like Bob paving a road for pond mgmt the lean times were not as long as his. I put out lots of pinestraw the 2 years after getting my masters in Fisheries before I was finally able to work more in winter time on running my business. I showed ok profits after 5 years.

On the degree, I will probably not hire another employee unless they have one. It is not really for the degree as much as knowing they have desire to be in thes field. The passion is what I want b/c that will help drive up my profits. Make sense?

I persoanally learned more form wokring in the filed for 2 years both what worked and where I could improve the methods, etc. more than I did getting the degree. However the background of the degree is important as well b/c it helps in overall understanding of concepts applied everyday on job, so do not want to down play its importance.

Chris I will be getting another intern this summer, send me an email if interested in coming down to GA.

Chris,

Sounds promising with Greg. I've also send you something regarding a contact for Indiana's aid program via PM. Your email is not listed.

Good Luck!

Keven,

I will agree with Bob, Greg and Cary. This business takes time and nurture. Things don't happen overnight.

We are in our 4th year of business. Last year was the first year I took a paycheck in 5 years. Was it hard? Yes. Is it worth it. Absolutely.

Diversification has been key for us. Not only in the services we offer, but mainly in the knowledge-base we have. It's not everyday you run across a pond and lake management company who is also a registered engineering firm with the state, specializing in H&H, limnology and permitting.

Ultimately, if you want to work in this industry, you'll need to diversify your skills and knowledge.

I don't think that any one of us say these things to discourage you, but to give you a glimpse of reality. There will certainly be hard times, but the best times make up (notice I didn't say "outweigh") for the difficult ones.

Good luck to you and continue to pursue your dreams. Remember, anything worthwhile doesn't necessarily come easy.

Trent