Pond Boss Forums INTRO Questions & Observations Domestic Ducks and Geese for a large tank

Looking for any input on the type of domestic ducks/geese to get for a large 16 acre lake. The ducks/geese need to be winter hardy as I have an windmill aerator to keep the water open in a defined area. I will also build a small southern exposure shelter near the aerator on one of the islands. I hoping to get birds that will eat vegetation from the lake and live on some supplemental feeding during the summer and entensive feeding throughout the winter. I would like the ducks to remain on my property and not travel to the neighbors etc. Any help would be greatly appreciated in choosing the right waterfowl to enjoy around the lake with minimal work . Thanks

Rowly

Rowly, I have had excellent results with Rouens and Swedish Blues. They both are large non-flying domestic Mallard variants. We don't get very cold here, mid 20's at night in the "winter" so freezing is not an issue. I don't provide any winter shelter and they have done fine for 3 years. They are excellent foragers and on my 2 acre pond do an excellent job of weed control. When I used to live in the Northeast, domestic Mallard variants survived quite nicely in some snotty conditions. They are quite easy to raise from day old chicks that are available by mail. Having an island for refuge will cut down on predation. You will still probably lose one now and then to a Great Horned Owl, Racoon, feral cat etc. Although they will lay eggs and attempt to brood them, the chances of any surviving are slim. Racoons and skunks love the eggs and Bass love whatever happens to hatch. So, you may have to add some birds each year or collect some eggs and hatch them yourself, which is what I do.
Good Luck
Jim

Rowly,
I have two species of domestic duck in my lake right now, cayougas and giant white pekin ducks. Both of which didn't even seem to notice when it got down below 20 degrees and wouldnt fly off if I shot at them. The giant white pekin duck is both an excelent laying duck and one of the best tasting birds I've ever eaten. If you're not planning on ever eating them or thier eggs I prefer the cayougas. They are mostly black but with beautifull blue and beetle green heads with similar coloration on thier wings. Cayougas also dont leave messy white feathers all over the lake like the others can.
The only place I know of where you can buy ducklings and/or goslings is Welp Hatchery http://www.welphatchery.com . I've bought several species of birds from them and I do trust them.

good luck with the ducks
-Scott

Jim and jbrockey:

Thanks for your input and we are looking forward to getting our pekins, rouens, mascovys and embden geese on May 27/03. Jim, any tips on raising day olds eg. how long should I keep them contained in a small area under an area of a heat lamp before I release them into the lake and supplement their feedings daily? Are mascovys good ducks to have around as well? They can fly but will stay home if fed I'm told? Any advice on raising these day olds will be a great help to a new raiser who doesn't want to have them die before they can look after themselves somewhat. Please pipe in all you knowledgeable "ducklings" and geese owners. Regards

Rowly

Rowly, your new ducks are quite hardy but will need some attention for a while. It is recommended that you suspend a heat lamp about 18" above the floor of their pen, they will find the most comfortable temp on their own. You can start raising the lamp after about 4 or 5 days (I prefer a red bulb and should always have a spare). You should avoid drafts as much as possible You should have some bedding - I use pine shavings that I get from the local farm supply. Feed should be non medicated, broiler finisher works well if you are not going to use one of the commercial game bird starters, besides it is a lot cheaper. You should also add some pigeon grit to the food, they need that to aid digestion. They need a lot of drinking water! You will be amazed at how much, so while a small waterer will work for about 2 weeks, you will need a 4 or 5 gallon waterer. The ducklings grow very fast and need a fair amount of room to keep them calm, by 2 weeks they should have at least 2 sq ft each. I have a brooding pen in a garage and leave the door open during the day after the first week to begin hardening them off, they still can go under the heat lamp if necessary. They should develop most of their first feathers by 4 weeks, which is when I move them to an outdoor pen that has a small duck house. Baby feathers are not waterproof since there is no mother to rub oil on them, so avoid getting them wet. Mosts ducks are essentially full grown at about 8 weeks. Once they are outside and have their first feathers, they will enjoy pans of water and will forage actively in their area. I close them up at night to avoid possible predators. I continue to give my ducks cracked corn as adults, they love it as a snack and it keeps them bonded to me so I can keep track of how many I have. Putting them in the big pond will probably be quite traumatic for them. They may be afraid of the water and will probably stay close together. They will get over it but it can be a chore. Maybe releasing them on your island is an idea, I don't have that option. Since you don't have any mature ducks, they will have to learn on their own. A downside of having mature drakes is that they immediately rape all of the new hens - not a pretty site but everyone seems to survive it. I havn't got any experience with Muscovys, so I don't know how likely it is that they will stay. One thing I thing you will notice however is more wild ducks. Your natural decoys work really well. Hope this helps, ask on if I have missed anything important.

I have 4 of the muskovys in my pond and I cant get them to leave(The wife got em without my knowledge) and there are 2 fairly good size lakes behind our property.My fed them for a couple of weeks and they do go down to the other lakes/pohnds, but they come back every day! If you plan on feeding any fish, be prepared to fend off the ducks..They love the fish food a little too much!! I have to guard my feeding ring till the food is all gone or the ducks will eat every last bit and peck at the fish to make em leave!

The website on the link above also has information on duckling/gosling care if you need it.
I released my ducks onto my island when they were 9 weeks old. They stayed on or very close to it for about a 2 weeks untill they started gradually venturing farther out into the pond.
Monty is right, after a short while the ducks will learn to attack the fish pellets. My favorite method of keeping them away is either throwing tennis balls at them or shooting at them with a paintball gun (be sure it is tuned down to below 250 feet per second). They learn quickly to avoid the feed ring when anyone with a good aim is near but move in as soon as you turn your back.

-Scott

Rowly,

Have you ever thought about wild waterfowl. I keep several species of waterfowl in my pond ie. Wood Ducks, Mallards, Pintail, all of the North American teal (Bluewing, Cinnamon and Greenwing). It is pretty cool to have these birds around and the wild ones visit often. Just this morning I had two wild Wood Duck drakes feeding with mine.

These birds are very hardy and a permit is supplied with the purchase. By the way all of my birds (except the Mallards) are pinioned so they can't fly. Let me know if you are interested I have a few newly hatched Wood Ducks and Mandarins (Chinese Wood Ducks) that are beautiful. These birds give the pond a natural look and I get a lot of compliments.

Oh yea I meant to give you a solution to the ducks eating the fish food. Try feeding the ducks chicken scratch on the shore line before feeding the fish. After a while the ducks will come running to you and will leave the fish food alone.

If the ducks are on the shore eating instead of in the water they are not dropping waste in the water, thus not screwing up the water chemistry. Just some advice from someone that has been there.

Keep the duck numbers low, so that you will not run into the aforementioned water problems. By the way Geese leave a lot more waste behind than ducks do, so be aware of that.

Thanks guys for your knowledge. Jim great detail and I will try your suggestions. I will start out in my garage in a small tall fibreglass container a. 2' X 4' for the first week, then I will house my 16 ducklings in a 32 sq ft (8 X 4') area or an cardboard frig container for the next while. After 4 weeks or so,once they get their waterproof feathers I will move to the island. But it seems I will need to row there daily to feed as they may not travel to far the first couple of weeks? In the future, how do I deal with the egg production from the roeuns, muskovys, pekins and embden geese (each species has 4 birds)? What is the cost of a small incubator to help me along and how do I aid each species with their time lines before hatching. This sounds completed to start, but once I can develop a system I should be able to have a few good meals in time. Any help/direction would be greatly appreciated as May 26/03 is fastly approaching. Thanks again as I develop that needed confidence.....

Rowly

I wondered if the paint ball gun would be too much for em, I've been worried about killing them in front of the kids! We do have fun throwing pea gravel at them to keep them off, and trying the feeding on the bank stuff doesnt cut it when they know what fish food taste like!! I can feed the ducks before or after I feed the fish and as soon as they hear the food hit the water they take off after it! They are VERY VERY persistent in eating it too, you turn your back they dart in till you turn back around..Least the ducks we have are like this, I hope everyone else has better luck with them than I do!

Rowly, I would not recommend using a cardboard box. Believe or not, they will eat right through it once they are a few weeks old. I use a simple plywood pen 3' high and about 60 sq ft. As for the 4 week transition, why don't you make a simple chicken wire enclosure. I use 3' chicken wire loosely fastened to T posts which are just set about 9" into the ground. Easy to put up and take down and it beats rowing to the island every day. I would recommend that you get a copy of Storey's Guide to Raising Poultry, good info and reference book.
As to incubating eggs, now you are in a whole order of magnitude higher level of complication. When you have a random group of ducks, it is almost impossible to coordinate hatching times neatly. This means that you will have eggs of various ages in the incubator at any given time. The best type of incubator to use is a circulating air type with an automatic turner. You really don't want to get involved in having to turn eggs every day. Now the complicator, eggs must not be turned during the last 3 days and they require a higher level of humidity. That means a second incubator! I use Hova-Bators, simple, and dependable and cost about $140 US. There are usually some available on Ebay. A web site that will give you more data on incubators is mcmurrayhatchery.com. Unfortunately, everything in life tends to get more complicated as you delve into it:)
Have fun!
Jim

Jim, thanks for the added info.and here's my plans from the info.provided- I will house the ducklings for the first week or two in the fibreglass container in the garage, then build and move the growing ducklings into a chicken wire fenced in area of a. 32'sq. outside to the back of a southern exposed utility shed to continue their growth for another 3-4 weeks until ready for water. (Should I provide structure for shelter and what will keep the predators out). At what point should I release them to the lake and how... a. 1000' long and 750' wide with two small island 100' off the east side of the back portion of the lake and away from the house. This summer I will be building a floating "T" dock between the two islands and the main land. This past winter I have erected a 20' windmill and areator between the two island for winter and helping to keep the water open in this 3-4' depth. I will build a southern expose shelter for the ducks to go into during the winter if required. I would like to maintain some 20 birds on the water and surrounding slopes. If I can produce some dinner food from the offspring that would be good as well. I think I will see if the ducks can reproduce themselves but if they can't I will invest in a good incubator to hatch a few. My overall goal is to have some very nice ducks and geese living in the lake and attracting some wild ducks as well to view and create some dinner meals along the way as we enjoy their beauty. How am I doing so far?????? Any fine tuning needed on any of the aspects from the garage, to the pen and later to the lake where they can feed on the vegetation with some supplemental feedings until winter? Thanks

Rowly

Newbee:

I am interested in your wild ducks but I live in Southwestern Ontario some 1 1/2 hours from Detroit. I don't think I can import or could I? What are your prices.....I would like some variety with my domectic ducks of roeuns, pekins, muscovys and embden geese. Would they cohabitat well in a large body of water and their closeness in open water during winter near the windmill aerator? Thanks

Rowly

Rowly, it looks like you are doing real well. I would suggest a small enclosure for the young ducks in the pen. This allows them to get out of extreme weather like heavy rains or a particularly hot sunny day. They also have a very strong instinctual fear of large flying birds and would appreciate the ability to have someplace to hide when the alarm is sounded. It is very amusing to see them tilt their heads sideways to look in the sky. I wouldn't hold out a lot of hope for natural production. You might try providing nesting cylinders on your islands. These are made of chicken wire and straw. Make them about 3 ft long and 18" in diameter. You make a double roll of the mesh with straw sandwiched between the layers. Put a nice bed of straw on the floor of the cylinder to finish it off. They work extremely well at encouraging the hens to lay in them. Unfortunately, without adults to teach them they don't really get brooding the eggs. The foolish hens will also drop eggs anywhere they happen to be when the urge hits them. This includes in the water and randomly all over the banks of your pond. You should know that the hens lay their eggs only in the morning and normally by about 9 AM. Knowing this makes collecting the eggs a little more predictable. I doubt that you will see any eggs this year. You can expect to start seeing eggs in February.
Jim

Jim, thanks for your moral support as the duckling will be here in 6 days as 1 day olds. I will build a chicken wire cage area beside my shop and have a shelter built for them to go into at 3-4 weeks old depending on their growth?. Would a 4' by 8' shelter be big enough for 16 ducks. I will move this to the island for the winter near my open water and windmill aerator. Thanks for your help. Can I buy an incubator that will hold a very small number of eggs? I will try to buy one used and do the manual labour to have only one incubator as indicated by you in your previous posts during the last three days before hatching and air movement

Rowly.

Rowly, I think the 4 x 8 shelter will work. I have one about that size and it is being used by 15 Khaki Campbells and Buffs all about 6 weeks old. It will be used mostly for sleeping and they do like to pile up. You can get smaller incubators, do a google search for egg incubators and I am sure you will get a good idea about what's available. Ebay will probably be your best source for a used one. I have had a mixed results hatching this year. Turns out the thermometer I was using was 6 degrees off. Make sure you calibrate your thermometer when you finally get around to hatching! In the meantime I know of 3 nests brooding on my pond. A total of about 40 eggs. I have had this many times in the past and have yet to see a successful hatch, so time will tell. Pending that, I doubt that the young ones will survive the bass, I know I have some 5+ pounders in there and they are always hungry.
Good luck
Jim

Rowly, I just checked EBAY and there are a lot of incubators for sale, check it out.
Jim

Jim, will do. Updated thought, house the young duckling in the garage for 3-4 weeks then move them outdoors onto the island and warmer weather. Build a chicken wire cage with some assess to water with the shelter inside the enclosure. Feed the ducklings in the shelter to get them accustomed to it and at 6-8 weeks when they have their new feathers take down the chicken wire fence to let them bowse out into the waters around the islands. This may help to keep them on the island at night and if later they want to start to lay eggs they will do it on the island and not the shoreline where the predators will find them as "sitting ducks". I will feed them nightly and have them follow me back to the shelter on the island. How does this sound to you????? Is this a good idea to help train these ducks for the future and help to reduce the risk of being killed. Thanks for all your help.

Rowly

Rowly, I think that most of what you are suggesting will work. I think you have to rethink food however. They really need access to food constantly. I suggest you get about a 30Lb feeder at the farm supply for when they are past the baby stage. They must always have access to water also. If it is not the pond, then I suggest 5 gallon waterers also available at the farm supply. Think about the nesting cylinders as far as encouraging a laying site.
Jim

Jim,consider it done. I will purchase both in the near future. Thanks for your help.......

Rowly

i finally gave up on my ducks today. as much as we enjoyed seeing them on the lake, it has become impossible to keep them away from the fish feed. i might have been able to manage if i only fed in one location, but feeding at several places in the lake made it impossible. even if feeding at one location, constantly having to throw things and jump and cuss at the ducks took all the fun out of hand feeding my fish. sooo, my ducks are no more. i did have fun with the 12 guage though.

I guess my definition of fun would not include killing a bunch of domestic ducks with a 12 gauge.

let's not get personal...this is supposed to be both an informative and enjoyable site.

jbrockey;

I don't feed my fish so I'm hoping to enjoys the ducks and geese on the lake in their natural beauty. Hopefully they will not eat my shrubs and perennial plants along the buffer zone from the water to the uplands along a 200' of banks, that will still leave them some 6000' of linear shoreline to graze if required on vegetation?????

Rowly