Pond Boss Forums INTRO Questions & Observations Thoughts on a unique stocking plan

Hi All,

Sorry for the wall of text.

I’ve finally got my 1/2 acre pond filling with water. We’re currently using our well until we start getting some rain, but it should fill this winter. I’m in the foothills of California and have access to some unique native fish species, and I’m trying to figure out how to stock them. We’ve got a 40 acre ranch and the pond is mostly for swimming and eating out of, and I’d really like it to be self sustaining rather than requiring additional stocking. I’m hoping someone with more fishery experience can provide some input.

The fish are going to be Sacramento Perch, Sacramento Blackfish, Tule perch, mosquito fish and the non-native channel catfish. Sac perch are primary piscivores and they can grow, rarely, to 3-4 pounds. They are californias only native panfish, and almost completely displaced by introduced bluegill due to being much less aggressive on their nests. I’m planning to stock them at a rate between bass and bluegill, 100-125 in the 1/2 acre. These will be the primary catching and predator fish. The tule perch are the only freshwater surf perch and live bearers. They get to around 6-8 inches and due to being live bearers have been more resistant to displacement from non-natives. I managed to get a few (12) from a friends creek and planted them with the mosquito fish. These guys are essentially just for forage, although they taste like surf perch if large enough. The blackfish is interesting in that it’s the only species in its genus. They essentially filter feed for inverts and plankton, but people do manage to catch them by targeting them similarly to carp. They grow pretty large and are supposed to be very good eating. I’m a little thrown on the stock rate, since there really isn’t another commonly stocked fish in the same niche. I was thinking of doing 50, kinda similar to the stocking rate for channel cats without feed. Lastly I’d like to do channel cats since I really like catching and eating them. They’re non-native, but they don’t seem to co-inhabit a similar zone as any of the other fish. The largest will predate some of the other fish, but I plan on pulling and eating any caught. There are 3 spawning structures in the pond, and I plan to stock them lightly at 25. They may also help thin out the small/medium sac perch to allow for larger overall fish.

The blackfish and sac perch should be available this spring at the same time. The catfish can be gotten pretty much whenever. The tule perch aren’t commercially available so I’m kinda stuck with what I have, so hopefully they spawn this spring. I also planted 200 PK shrimp for additional forage. Thanks for any input on my plan!

Dylan

Welcome. Interesting plan. I would suggest you start by getting all the info on each species. Try FishBase as a source. You need to know fecundity, food items and possible interactions of the species. One-half acre is not large, so you need to focus on carrying capacity with those species in your water (productivity). You do not need many large (carp like fish) in a half-acre.

http://fishbase.org/search.php

Dylan, that sounds like an interesting and fun pond project!

(I DO NOT want to rain on your parade, but rather want to get you ready for the pond management project ahead of you.) There are many threads on Pond Boss, by actual management experts using well-documented pond species combinations, that require subsequent intervention to get the pond back towards the optimal balance.

I would love it if your pond was 100% self-sustaining, but I expect that will be unlikely. Get your good plan in place. Then do your actual stocking as close as possible to the planned stocking. (Recently the fish suppliers have not always had the species and/or sizes available that people needed for their ponds, so you may have to adjust.)

Then monitor your pond fish populations. Then make your adjustments as needed. Fishing and eating will hopefully be a big part of the adjustments. However, you may also have to add trapping and/or seining to cull some species. You may also have to have some supplemental stockings to improve the pond as it matures.

1.) Is your initial stocking going to be from fish suppliers or from friends' ponds and local waterways? If the latter, then make sure you are absolutely following the California laws.

2.) When the rains start to fill your pond, is it possible for floodwaters to introduce unwanted species from other bodies of water? If so, then that may complicate your management efforts if you get some unwanted species reproducing in your pond (such as bluegill or green sunfish).

Good luck on your new pond venture!

Interesting stocking and this will be a neat project to follow!

For right now, I'd recommend NOT having any spawning habitat in there for the CC. You can always put it in later, but for now I think it'd be better if you didn't have them reproducing in the pond - just so you can keep an eye on the other species without a commonly and easily available species getting out of hand.

Do/will the Sac Perch prey upon the CC? How large of a CC can they eat? That is my main concern about the habitat in there for the CC to reproduce. CC are the 2nd smartest fish in North America, and if only a few keep avoiding being caught, you can easily have CC in there that can eat any of the fish that reproduce in the pond. The CC turn piscivorous around 3# in size, and if there aren't enough predators in there to control them, they may become a problem.

Will you have plenty of spawning habitat in there for the Sac Perch?

esshup,

Does pellet feeding the CC make them less piscivorous? (Because their bellies are full?)

Or does it make the problem worse because the CC will grow so rapidly on a feeding program that they will more quickly be able to swallow the other fish in the pond?

I have CC reproducing some in my pond, I dumped several loads of commercial water main pipe in there, from 6" dia up to 16" dia, cut in 4' or less lengths. some must have landed in a way to let them spawn, I am regretting that I have created a spawning site for them.

Thanks for the responses! Lots of food for thought in here.


All species expect for the CC naturally occur together, so I think they are the only questionable addition. But I think you’re right that 50 blackfish may be a heavy load for a 1/2 acre. It may be better to under stock and see how they do.



Point taken on the self-sustaining aspect. I guess minimal input as possible is the goal. I don’t mind monitoring and adjusting, but it’s quite a drive to get these fish and they wont be readily available.

1) the tule perch came from a creek, but the rest of the fish are coming from a supplier. It’s still a little up on the air, but he thinks he’ll have a good crop of both the Sacramento species this spring.

2) no issue with introduced species. Thankfully we are on an elevated outcropping and the pond is from damming a small meadow area. There is a decent size runoff basin draining into it, but no creeks or standing water remotely close to it other than a half mile down the hill.




Also a good point. I’m much more interested in the native species than the catfish, I just enjoy them for eating. The Sac perch should eat CC, but would probably be limited to fry and up to a several inches. Based on their habits and size they probably would be equivalent to SMB, but maybe a bit more size limited. I’ll skip them for now

The sac perch have similar breeding patterns as BG and RES, hence the competition. I created a 50x50 cove that’s probably 3-4’ in depth that has a few inches of pea gravel. Hopefully this will be their spawning zone as it’s easily observed and has good cover.

FYI

Archoplites interruptus, Sacramento perch (fishbase.se)

Orthodon microlepidotus, Sacramento blackfish (fishbase.se)

Hysterocarpus traskii, Russian river tule perch (fishbase.se)

Yes , even though many species live together naturally that doesn not mean it is wise to stock them. Often one species can get out of controll and balance if the wrong numbers are present. The more you know about each species and how it interacts with others the better chance you have of making the best choice on specie , stocking #s and size.

On this forum we like out of the box thinkers and those willing to explore new stocking combinations. Please return occasionally to keep us updated on the progress of your pond.

Rod, unless someone is feeding to satiation, I think it makes the problem worse. (fish get bigger faster) BUT that is just a gut feeling, I have no data to back that up.

Thanks.

I know that would be a difficult experiment to run. However, if the "gut feeling" of experts is the best data available, then that should probably be our first order approximation.

Dylan,

I am NOT an expert, but I am a little worried about having CC in your pond. It might work just fine at the start, but at some point those CC are going to be large enough to eat everything in your pond except the largest Sac. Perch.

Maybe start your pond and add CC later if you decide they would be beneficial to your overall goals?

OTOH, if your main goal is a fishery for "trophy" Sac. Perch, then having the CC may be the perfect solution, as you noted in your OP. However, having that pond in a sustainable balance may be more difficult.

Keep posting, I think a lot of people are rooting for you to have success on your unique pond!

Fair point. I did run into a paper from UC Davis regarding a research pond they have that has mosquito fish, sac perch, and blackfish. They seem to be sustaining their populations without input. I may try to stock at a ratio similar to their sampling numbers. I'll have to do more research on the Tule Perch. I think at this point I'm scratching the CC.



I appreciate the encouragement, and I'll definitely keep posting. This site has been a really fantastic resource. For now I'll leave out the CC, but we'll see how things develop.

I am glad you found the paper on that UC Davis research pond.

Even if your pond doesn't develop in the same fashion, knowing some of their results can only help you manage your pond.

You can always easily add CC at a later date when you see the need. However getting all CC out once in the pond and causing a problem is a very, very difficult task.