Pond Boss Magazine
https://www.pondboss.com/images/userfiles/image/20130301193901_6_150by50orangewhyshouldsubscribejpeg.jpg
Advertisment
Newest Members
Shotgun01, Dan H, Stipker, LunkerHunt23, Jeanjules
18,451 Registered Users
Forum Statistics
Forums36
Topics40,901
Posts557,099
Members18,452
Most Online3,612
Jan 10th, 2023
Top Posters
esshup 28,416
ewest 21,475
Cecil Baird1 20,043
Bill Cody 15,110
Who's Online Now
12 members (esshup, PRCS, Boondoggle, Layne, Dylanfrely, nvcdl, H20fwler, Bing, Fishingadventure, Angler8689, Sunil, jpsdad), 709 guests, and 219 robots.
Key: Admin, Global Mod, Mod
Previous Thread
Next Thread
Print Thread
Joined: Feb 2017
Posts: 177
Likes: 5
OP Offline
Joined: Feb 2017
Posts: 177
Likes: 5
Has anyone seen any analysis on fathead minnows or other commonly stocked baitfish with respect to crude protein/crude fat? My trophy bluegill pond is heavily populated with fathead minnows and I've been supplementing high protein feeds. Since I expect fathead minnows to be the most readily available natural food source, I'm wondering if this drags down the net protein intake of the the CNBG based on the fact that my supplemental feed is around 40% protein/12% fat.


-Jason
Joined: May 2018
Posts: 1,882
Likes: 278
J
Online Content
J
Joined: May 2018
Posts: 1,882
Likes: 278
Just my take ...

A person will be hard pressed to find better food for BG than FHM. That includes ANY manmade food. What makes a better manmade food is the relative quantity of fish meal.

I would bet your fish are growing very well with minnows there, better than without them IMHO.

Can't say for sure but I've wondered whether the presence of small fish is required to grow really big bluegill, particularly in length. Many complain about getting fish over the 11" mark. To grow fish over 11" may require the abundance of small fish you have.

Last edited by jpsdad; 10/10/18 06:06 PM.

It isn't what we don't know that gives us trouble, it's what we know that ain't so - Will Rogers


Joined: Feb 2017
Posts: 177
Likes: 5
OP Offline
Joined: Feb 2017
Posts: 177
Likes: 5
Thanks for the feedback and I agree with you that my current condition is probably much better than the average pond for achieving solid bluegill growth. I started thinking about this topic as part of mentally preparing for the next 6 months. My CNBG currently have high quality food every where they turn. Fathead minnows, Aquamax/Optimal feedings twice per day, etc...But I expect that things are going to drastically change between now and next spring due to my recent introduction of largemouth bass to control BG recruitment. I expect the minnow numbers to drastically decline, which means I'll have to increase my supplemental feeding. I'm ok with that but it just got me thinking about how the minnow nutritional values compare to the higher quality fish feed. I have read about feed trials where caged BG showed impressive growth where presumably most of their diet was man made feed. Of course, the trials weren't trying to grow 11"+ fish. ;-)


-Jason
Joined: Jun 2016
Posts: 2,344
Likes: 101
Offline
Joined: Jun 2016
Posts: 2,344
Likes: 101
I am in a similar situation as my FHM base will likely be all but gone next year. They have helped my HSB go from about 0.1 pound to 1.4 pounds since the late April stocking and the HBG that went in are now 3 times the weight. Optimal feeds have also been available once a day.

I have not seen any reports, but I have read that a fish is 90% water. That only leaves 10% for proteins, fats, etc.

Anyhow, I suspect my feed rates to increase as well. It seems logical that the fish will continue to desire the same calorie/day diet, but may actually be able to consume more calories per day due to the lack of water content in the feed compared to the water content of the FHM. I think of it this way...

Pellet Feed = More Taste, Less Filling!

Whereas the minnows are likely more filling because of the percentage of water that they are made of. The fish may actually grow more if I afford to put the feed to them.

Feeding this year has been pretty weak which has got to have something to do with the abundant presence of minnows and crawdads. Next year I expect the feed demand to skyrocket and the FHM presence to fall off even further. We will see!


Fish on!,
Noel
Joined: Aug 2017
Posts: 411
Likes: 3
Offline
Joined: Aug 2017
Posts: 411
Likes: 3
I am basing this on what I did almost 20 years ago with LMB and its hybrid fed a range of forages involving minnows and crayfish. The forages where all about 60 percent moisture as consumed. On a dry weight basis, thee forage protein content ranged 60 to 80%. The higher protein percentage was associated with lower fat levels and higher moisture levels with the latter approaching 80%. The bass could compensate to a large degree for the moisture content in the forages to make so their dry matter consumption rate was near what you see with consumption of pellets. The bass could get really big bellies eating the forage but the real kicker is the bass appear to me markedly more efficient at converting forage dry matter into bass growth than they were with pellets. Pellets way cheaper though.

Bluegill will be the same.


Low fat content in forage, just theory, can be what really limits growth of the predator.


Aquaculture
Cooperative Research / Extension
Lincoln University of Missouri
Joined: Mar 2005
Posts: 21,475
Likes: 264
E
Moderator
Hall of Fame 2014
Lunker
Offline
Moderator
Hall of Fame 2014
Lunker
E
Joined: Mar 2005
Posts: 21,475
Likes: 264
BG eats lots of other things. See link below and be sure to scroll the items at top.

Also the type of lipid (fat) is key.


http://fishbase.org/TrophicEco/FoodItems...ies=macrochirus

Last edited by ewest; 10/11/18 01:08 PM.















Joined: Feb 2017
Posts: 177
Likes: 5
OP Offline
Joined: Feb 2017
Posts: 177
Likes: 5
With all the science behind pond and aquarium hobbies, I'm surprised how difficult it is to find nutrition information about commonly used "feeder fish". I did manage to find some "freeze dried minnows" that are intended as cat/dog treats. The analysis shows 60% crude protein. That is better than I expected and may explain why feeding time in my pond doesn't result in bluegill feeding frenzies. They are surrounded by a higher quality food all day.

https://www.amazon.com/Vital-Essentials-Freeze-Dried-Minnows-Ingredient/dp/B01HC1ZV58


-Jason
Joined: Feb 2017
Posts: 177
Likes: 5
OP Offline
Joined: Feb 2017
Posts: 177
Likes: 5
I missed some of the responses above before posting. @Jim Wetzel, thanks for sharing your findings. I guess it makes sense that fish would naturally be efficient "dehydrators" given the moisture content of practically all of their food sources. The more time I spend on this site, the more I understand the "It depends..."answer. haha

Quarter Acre, I noticed that you and I were starting our projects at about the same time so it will be interesting to compare notes over the next year. Is HSB your only predator? How long have they been stocked?


-Jason
Joined: Jun 2016
Posts: 2,344
Likes: 101
Offline
Joined: Jun 2016
Posts: 2,344
Likes: 101
HSB are the only fish predators. I have a GBH, King Fishers and coons too...lol. I put the HSB, RES, and HBG in the pond last April (2018)into a FHM, tadpole , and crawdad laden pond.


Fish on!,
Noel
Joined: Feb 2017
Posts: 177
Likes: 5
OP Offline
Joined: Feb 2017
Posts: 177
Likes: 5
Originally Posted By: Quarter Acre
HSB are the only fish predators. I have a GBH, King Fishers and coons too...lol. I put the HSB, RES, and HBG in the pond last April (2018)into a FHM, tadpole , and crawdad laden pond.


I found and added your pond log thread to my watch list. Your fish look great!


-Jason

Link Copied to Clipboard
Today's Birthdays
Bob Lusk, GaryK, GrizzFan, PhotographerDave
Recent Posts
Working on a .5acre disaster, I mean pond.
by Boondoggle - 03/28/24 06:28 PM
Relative weight charts in Excel ? Calculations?
by esshup - 03/28/24 06:23 PM
Fungus infection on fish
by nvcdl - 03/28/24 06:07 PM
Can anyone ID these minnows?
by Dylanfrely - 03/28/24 05:43 PM
1 year after stocking question
by esshup - 03/28/24 04:48 PM
Yellow Perch Spawn 2024
by H20fwler - 03/28/24 04:29 PM
Alum vs Bentonite/Lathanum for Phosphorus Removal?
by FishinRod - 03/28/24 04:23 PM
New 2 acre pond stocking plan
by LANGSTER - 03/28/24 03:49 PM
Happy Birthday Bob Lusk!!
by ewest - 03/28/24 03:37 PM
Paper-shell crayfish and Japanese snails
by esshup - 03/28/24 10:39 AM
Brooder Shiners and Fry, What to do??
by Freg - 03/28/24 09:42 AM
Dewatering bags seeded to form berms?
by Justin W - 03/28/24 08:19 AM
Newly Uploaded Images
Eagles Over The Pond Yesterday
Eagles Over The Pond Yesterday
by Tbar, December 10
Deer at Theo's 2023
Deer at Theo's 2023
by Theo Gallus, November 13
Minnow identification
Minnow identification
by Mike Troyer, October 6
Sharing the Food
Sharing the Food
by FishinRod, September 9
Nice BGxRES
Nice BGxRES
by Theo Gallus, July 28
Snake Identification
Snake Identification
by Rangersedge, July 12

� 2014 POND BOSS INC. all rights reserved USA and Worldwide

Powered by UBB.threads™ PHP Forum Software 7.7.5