Pond Boss Forums MANAGING AN EXISTING POND Corrective stocking New pond owner considering re-stock

Hello,

I am new to PB and am really thankful I have found this forum -- because I need some advice!

Some background:
I bought a farm with a 5 1/2 ac pond last spring. It is a 25 year old pond fed by runoff from two crop fields that are separated from the pond by about 250'grass and shrub buffer zone. Looks to be about 15' deep through most of the center. Usually a green/brown with a couple feet of visibility. VERY weedy on the bottom (slimy filamentous algae) but no surface vegetation at all. Grass carp were put in about 5-7 years ago and I did find a huge dead carp in the runoff this spring. Very silty bottom that stinks when you stir it up. Sometimes green algae floating on top in fine layer in low wind. My goal for the pond is managing for trophy LMB.

I was told there are some big LMB (6-8lb range) and was even shown some mounts by a neighbor of very large bass taken in the late 90's.

However, we fished it pretty hard through the spring and summer and I have only caught two LMB over 12" -- both about 16"-18" (see attached). Can't tell if they look stunted or not. Same neighbor says he has not been able to catch anything big all summer. I can catch ten 8"-12" LMB in a couple hours easily. But cannot catch anything on nightcrawlers / bobber. Looks like there are a few yellow perch and a few crappie (caught one crappie). My son caught one BG or perch by his description, but that is all. See a lot of minnows in the shallows, but can't tell what species.

I described this to a local fishery and they want me to stock this fall.

Here is the bid:

True Bluegill 4-5" 550
Golden Shiners 2-4" 60 lbs
Fathead Minnows 1-2" 60 lbs
Channel Catfish 8-12" 275

Total for this stocking including delivery along with 2% extra at no charge and a 7-day guarantee on the fish is: $2,002.75.

I am considering moving forward, figuring it couldn't hurt even if the LMB are not too out of whack.

But what do you guys think?

Beautiful place.

Those are some skinny LMB!

I wouldn't stock any of those fish. All but the catfish and the largest BG will be eaten immediately by the existing LMB.

One of the experts will post soon to give you some professional advice...just hang on a minute.

nice place I would not stock cc if you are managing for trophy lmb cause when they get to the 2lb mark they will compete for food with the lmb I agree with Bocomo they are skinny bass is the pond full of them that size? just my thoughts but wait for someone that knows more than me

Hello, H611, welcome to the forum and thanks for posting.

I can't see your pics, but will go with the assumption that Bocomo's correct, you've got skinny bass. The fact that you can catch so many smaller fish in an hour strongly suggests that you've got a pretty classic bass heavy pond, in which the LMB basically outstrip available forage, resulting in a large number of stunted bass. If this is indeed the situation, and your goal is trophy LMB, then the solution will be to drastically reduce the LMB population. It's just about impossible to correct this imbalance by adding forage, though targeted addition of BG larger than your bass can consume can help. If you read through the corrective stocking section, you'll find a bunch of threads, including quite a few from this spring, in which several similar situations and goals to your are discussed at length-it's pretty good background information.

Don't hesitate to post additional questions, however, and again, Welcome!

Thanks! It really is a beautiful pond -- a large reason I bought the place.

Those two fish are BY FAR the largest I've caught. Most are about 10" and skinnier than that. Both of those were caught in August.

The fishery guy told me that the CC would help to clean up the silty bottom. I like catching CC, but could easily do without. He also said the 4" - 5" BG would be big enough to avoid being eaten and establish a spawning colony.

I like the idea of instantly adding a bunch of forage to get em fed while I try and thin the heard. But I obviously want to get to balance.

One other factor -- my son is 11yo and is starting to get into the fishing. I don't want to kill and restock because I want him excited about catching bass (even if stunted) over the next 4 years before high school and other priorities take over. The need to take out a whole bunch of small bass sounds like an excellent father-son mission.

Thanks for the help!

Here ya go Yolk:

The LMB are on the skinny side. Probably like the pond out back here.






Nice pond!

Thanks, JKB!
Beatiful pond.
Looks like some seriously skinny bass...capable of eating hundreds of 4-5" gills, and staying skinny.

If you're going to spend money on stocking-go with larger BGs. Over the winter, if you stock 4-5" fish now, you'll lose the vast majority to predation.

If you truly want trophy LMB-don't even consider the cats. You've already got a forage vacuum, they'll only worsen it.

I'd go for some really serious father and son intensive fishing, as well as as many friends and family that want to be involved. It's very possible, likely even, that you need to remove 2-300lbs of bass to start bringing things into balance.

I know the idea of adding forage now is appealing-but you're seriously throwing your money away on the shiners and FHM, and almost certainly the BG, if you stock them. You'd be better off spending the $2000 on having a fisheries professional come out and shock out as many LMB as possible. You'll never get things turned around without seriously reducing the LMB population. Think about it-even if every BG you put in escapes and spawns, almost none of the YOY will survive the hoards of yearling and YOY LMB to reach a size that will begin to sustain larger fish.

Fixed the original post to show the images. Very nice looking place Harris!

Well,

If that is the consensus maybe I'll buy a jon boat instead and start hauling!

Should I cull all the bass I can catch or only the ones under 14"?

What about the crappie? I know they are in there since I caught one -- is there a risk of bringing the LMB into a better range and having the crappie explode? I can try and fish them out too, but from what I am reading on the forums their early spawn will out compete the bass.

Thoughts?

Thanks for fixing the photos

I'd take out every bass you catch at this point-it seems unlikely that you'll find any larger, fat, healthy fish upon which you'll want base your future trophy population. But you'll be able to grow them yourself, and quickly, as soon as the overpopulation of LMB is resolved and your forage recovers.

Have you considered a feeder or two for your BG? They'll grow and reproduce faster if you have a couple, and could be purchased for quite a bit less than $2K. Let us know if you need recs for brands/sources.

Crappies....one problem at a time. If they were really overpopulated at this point, you'd probably have caught more than you have. It would be a good idea to remove all you can, but short of draining, removing, and starting over [which I wouldn't want to do either if I had an ll year old to fish with], there's no sure way to say whether they'll be a problem or not.

Hey Harris,

Check out my pond thread (click below). When we started it was just like yours. We've doubled the average body condition of the fish in just one year by harvesting all the LMB we could catch, eating some, and feeding the coyotes with the rest.

Also, the crappie will be a continuing problem. Harvest every single one of them, even the ones too small to eat.

Additionally, the thing is, if you add all that forage now, the bass will eat ALL of it and still hardly put on any weight. LMB have to eat 10# of forage to gain 1#.

If you are willing to start over, you'll save money and reach your goals faster and with better results. The fishery won't take long to be fishable for quality fish either. If you start with advanced stockers, you can be fishing in a year and catching monsters in 4. I would retenone and start over.

I agree with what CJ said, but in the interest of keeping your son interested in fishing and the outdoors, I'd get a pond management guy out there to shock the pond, and take out all the under WR LMB and crappie that come up. I'd also have him do an assessment on the BG population. What he can find in one e-shock session will equal hours and hours of fishing. Plus, you will get to see fish that won't bite, and possibly fish taht you had no idea were in there.

But before you shock the pond, buy and read Bob Lusks "Trophy Bass" book that is available in the Pond Boss Store. That will give you an educated background to talk to the management pro about, and it will also help you see what steps will be required.

In the meantime, fish out all the LMB that you can, and realize that a trophy LMB pond ALSO means harvesting LMB. Ask your neighbor how many years ago those LMB were caught.

Well,

My son and I took 26 LMB out this weekend. A journey of a thousand fish begins with a single bite -- or something like that.

I am looking into finding someone to electrofish the pond. We will see if I can get someone out there in the next few weeks.

PM Shawn Banks-if he can't do it, he'll probably know someone good who can.

+1

Good work on the LMB removal, too, by the way.
Did you happen to weigh them? Sometimes it's easier to keep track of the wt of fish removed, rather than the number of fish.

Yes, we did measure and weigh. They ranged from 6" to 14", 4oz to 15oz. Most were 8"-10".

We will continue to keep track. It is a weekend place, so we are not out there all the time. My neighbor (who GREATLY helps me keep an eye on the place) also fishes there a lot. But he is -- how shall we say -- detail challenged. He's going to give me rough estimates of what he catches and I'll have to extrapolate a bit.

He has been catching and releasing bass, but taking "perch" out for catfish bait in the Mississippi for a long time. So, we are obviously reversing that. I also caught a couple big bluegill / sunfish, so we do have some level of forage population. The 8-10lb bass the neighbor had mounted were caught about a decade ago.

And I will reach out to Shawn. Thanks for the help guys...

Any photos of the BG/sunfish/perch? Knowing for sure what's in there now might impact your strategy somewhat.

Here ya go. Not sure exactly how to post these right. Someone can correct me if it does not work. [img:left]http://www.flickr.com/photos/103815033@N07/[/img]

Trying that again
[img:left]http://www.flickr.com/photos/103815033@N07/10026459614/[/img]

http://www.flickr.com/photos/103815033@N07/10026463614/

Hmmmm. To the FAQ's I guess...

[img:left]https://mail-attachment.googleuserconten...ouV6OLqaK8qMuAw[/img]

[img:left]https://mail-attachment.googleuserconten...1NY8kFhwMsZxtG4[/img]