Pond Boss Forums MANAGING AN EXISTING POND Evaluating and adjusting fish populations Really? Remove 30lbs per acre!?

Hey everyone,

We just conducted a weekend survey of our 10 acre lake by hosting a fishing derby. Our intention was to gather relative weight data for largemouth bass, bluegill, & redear. The lake is in St. Louis and other than these species the lake has a small population of channel cat and VERY few green sunfish. The lake has been stocked with 200 eight to ten inch bass annually for the past 30 years! Please, don't ask me why as I just took over management.

The fishing was kind of slow but we did weigh and measure about 60 fish, split almost evenly between bass, bluegill, & redear at 20 each.

Average bass was 10.73" long with a rW of 74%. Biggest bass was a single 12" fish.
Average bluegill was 7.67" long with a rW of 99%.
Average redear was 8.09" long with a rW of 95%.

Our goal is to have a more balanced fishery with a larger average LMB population. If we could catch some 15" bass we'd be very happy.

I found a recommendation online published by the MO Dept of Conservation that says we should remove 30 pounds of LMB per year to begin to balance things out. Considering our average bass weighs in at 8 ounces....that's 600 fish per year! An impossible task considering how little the lake is fished.

Is a total fish kill or electro-shocking for removal my only 2 options? Any and all thoughts are most appreciated.

If you started over you would eventually need to harvest again regardless.

30#/acre is a start! See link below for my story and how we're progressing on out culling project. How about some pictures of your place?

Our 15 acre lake (30 years old) was out of balance. At our biologist recommendation we have been taking fish out at this rate for about 6 years. Fishing is much better.

It is alot of work fishing that much (and consuming the requiset amount of beer that goes along with it) but someone has to do it.

This year biologist said he would probably cut us back to 15 pounds per acre this year.

An electroshock boat could certainly help in making the job easier. If done when the bass are shallow, as in during or near the spawn you can often shock up large numbers of bass. Remove all that float up...

The good thing about ES removal of LMB is you are not necessarily removing the most aggressive (fish that bite)so you help avoid a catchability problem. In addition you get to compare a lot of LMB at one time and can harvest based on a better understanding of condition and population analysis (status).

One issue to consider is how much a previously stunted LMB will grow after the overcrowding issue and forage base issue are addressed.

A stunted bass has simply lost it's best growing years in most cases. However, they will still grow if the crowding and forage base issues are addressed.

Also, the ease of draining or drawing down your pond is a major consideration in starting over. If it can be drained or drawn down easily, then the fish kill is easier, cheaper, and more thorough. BUT, you also have to consider your water source.....how long will it take to fill back up?

For now, you should remove almost every LMB that is caught, or at least every bass under 11" or so.

Did anyone fish with live bait (minnows, shiners) during the derby?

Who was the biologist ?

Not going to second guess him/her without seeing all the results. I will point out that maintaining balance in lakes like yours is like balancing on the edge of a knife blade - hard to maintain. There is a strong tendency in southern waters for LMB to overpopulate. With that in mind I would tend to overharvest LMB rather than under shoot on the #s. Any negative change in RW or condition of LMB should result in you taking more out than 15 lbs. Stay ahead of the curve !

Southeastern Pond Management.

They did send a different guy this year.

Not sure of his credentials. The previous biologist they sent has done our evaluation since we started about five or six years ago.

I may have misunderstood what he said. I will wait on the official report and post results.

30 pounds is not to hard to acheive so I would just as soon stay at that.

We took out 60 pounds during electrofishing.

Thanks for all the feedback guys. I found an ex-fisheries biologist near my lake in Missouri that will do ES removal much cheaper than I would have thought. I am going to continue my rW analysis through the summer and fall then have him come out and remove fish next Spring - if the powers that be will comply. I will probably have to get a MO Dept. of Conservation written endorsement of my plan.

I think we'll hope to pull 30 lbs/acre and see what that does for us. If we need to pull again we will.

Good work guys.

SEP is a good outfit. I have used them. I think I would wait on the report (please post it here). If it says 15 lbs then I would go with 20 lbs and see the results.

How much are you paying for ES removal? Is there a particular amount of time they ES for their fee?

Isn't Shawn Banks in the MO area? Jeff Slipke is with him now too.

It's worth checking them out also.

Yes that is right. http://www.midwestlake.com/

Our lake is in Warrenton, MO so we are talking with Dan Colby with Lake Management Services in Marthasville, just a few miles away.

His estimate is between $500 and $600 to ES the 10 acre lake and remove around 300 pounds of bass 13" and less. Which equates to about 600 bass for our lake.

One potential hitch in the plan. I have a note for a conservation agent - from a few years back - that says our lake's pH is to high to shock. The massive valley our lake sits in has a strong limestone base and she concluded that ESing would be futile. pH high = too basic, I believe. I may have it backwards. In any case, could it be that ES isn't an option because of my lake's pH?

Talk to Shawn at the link above. He designs and constructs ES boats for state , fed and private fisheries guys. He knows ES from the inside out and will be able to help you.

$500-600 for what? The entire 10 acres?

Sounds like a great fish fry for that size of bass.

Yes - for the whole 10 acres!

We do have an issue with low conductivity water - bur I spoke with Shawn and he's got ways to get around that "old school" problem. The MO Dept of Conservation agent I spoke with said Shawn, and his company, are known coast-to-coast for their ingenuity in the realm of electro-shocking. Definitely THE leader in the field.

Thanks everyone. Our plan right now is to shock some fish out next Spring - as many as we can. Hopefully 300 to 400 lbs, add some nursery habitat in the form of shallow vegetation (of which we have none), and hold a major fish fry!

Was this a state-built lake? I'm wondering what "say" MDC has over your water if it is private. If the original stock was supplied by the state, their only control is over adding "new" species to it.