Pond Boss Forums POND CONSTRUCTION Selecting a site Wolf Creek/Bass Lake

My Dad and I have been scouting out Camp style properties. I've always been interested in digging dirt ever since I was a little kid. I started asking my Dad about creating our own lake, and then building a cabin on it.

I mentioned if I ever won the lottery, I would embark to find the perfect lake site, buy construction equipment and dream big.

Matter of fact, for a business, I've even considered buying land, creating a small lake, and then selling off the property. Imagine building lakes for a living!

When I first got interested, I didn't know very much, just like with anything in the beginning.
Of course with Pond Boss, you learn quickly.

I like when people post their pond projects from start to finish like Eddie's Project. http://www.pondboss.com/ubb/ultimatebb.php?ubb=get_topic;f=20;t=002357

It's very helpful to beginners to see the problems that arise...I plan on taking tons of pictures, and document every possible question that will be helpful to others...No stone un-turned. (I also like sharing the creation to get your help as well.)

So, my Dad and I have found a great property in the Tug Hill Region of Upstate New York.

I've named it Wolf Creek after the Horror Movie that was currently released.

We're going to take pictures today, and then I will post them. I'd love to get into the details but I'll wait until I can post the pics...

Justin,
...just sent ya a PM.

The first thing to do is get soil samples and have them analyzed prior to buying the place. Also get a history of the place to be sure there are no surprises like buried wastes. Then find out what is going on around the land esp. up stream in the water shed. Much more before you commit to buying the property, but that is a start. Good luck with the project.

Also take a real good look at the neighbors.

Justin,
Where's Tug Hill region?
I have been consistently working near Clyde, NY, about 35 miles west of Syracuse.

Hi Bob,

Tug Hill is about 1 hour North of Syracuse, right near the Adirondacks. Tug Hill is known as the Snowiest Place East of the Rockies, and holds the record at 6 feet 6 inches in a 24 hour period...

Dave,

The Neighbors are literally about a quarter mile down the road...135 Acres....

We'll the sellers accepted our offer, and we are know moving forward. I have a lot of pictures to post, especially Aerial photos..

Hang tight, it will be a cool project to check out!!

...Justin wins a critical battle:
Great news!!! If the pics are a day or two away, prime us up with dimensional spec's and topo. description.
Good for you...this will be a fun one for the rest of us to grow with (if you let us :rolleyes: )

The driveway winds down to the cabin for about a 300ft stretch.



The cabin sits on an embankment a good 11-15 feet above the existing pond area. There are are high elevation areas as you move behind the cabin as well.









The existing pond was built by beavers as there are several beaver homes. The pond has already has trout, and because it is spring-fed does not completely freeze in the winter.

Does anyone know how to rotate a picture in photobucket? Actually if there isn't a quick fix, I'll put them in a design program rotate them and then add them to photo-bucket.



From the North of the tip of the pond is the cabin. You can see that there is not a lot of de-forestation needed which contributes significantly to the cost. When I can I will outline a couple different outlines of the proposed pond area.



The property has roughly half a mile of stream frontage. Rainbow trout 15-17 inches big. Unfortunately, I don't have the best pictures yet of the total amount of property, but we took pictures of the stream today.





I'll have to stop here, but I will post much more, with pictures of the spring which originates from the East side of the property.

Be sure to give your suggestions as you see them...Thanks!!

Wow...talk about secluded, eh? Better hope you don't need to borrow a cup of sugar.
It sure looks like a heavenly place to complete a pond. What kind of issues do you anticipate regarding drying it out for the dig? Sure hope the guv'mint dun't give a hoot, re; wetland...? (or maybe you don't give a hoot, either ) This is gonna be an interesting project, worthy of progress pics and updates. Lookin' forward to taggin' along. Congrats, Justin!

Justin- Just hit the edit button above the photo. A new edit page will appear. Leave the name the same and look at the bottom of the page and you will see rotate image. choose 90 or 270 degrees to rotate. Thats it.

I need some advice on the quickest on most cost-effective way to build some recreational trails.

I estimate the trails will at least be 2,3,4 miles in total.

Please give me advice with or without machines...

Thanks....

If your talking clearing underbrush (less than 2" in DIA)a good brush hog on the back of a 20 hp or bigger tractor will make short work of this. If you don't own one you can rent it. My son and I created trails thru some of the worst brush and brior ticket known to man. My son went out a head with a chan saw to clear larger trees in the path. I ran the tractor in reverse so the mower was in front of me because the brush was so thick I could not drive fwd. We made about a half mile trail and camp site in less than a hour.

I just finished watching the Ray Scott Video...
I was curious; he mentioned his 55 acre pond was not fed by any streams or creeks, only run off water. He mentioned he built a Dam, but it looks like he excavated his bound instead of creating an impoundment. Not all ponds need a Damn right?
My pond site currently would be fed by a spring so I realize I need to have an overflow pipe.

I don't necessarily need a Damn though right?

Justin,
A dam is nothing more than a strategically placed pile of soil to create a levee, holding back water where it is needed. If your plan is to excavate downward to create a "bowl" that will fill up with the spring water, and then entire perimeter of the bowl-zone is high enough to contain the water, then a dam is not required. This is alot of work, tho. That is why some of the best and most cost-efficient ponds are constructed on a site where the majority of the pond perimeter is naturally high enough (like a valley) and the only areas that need to be corked up to hold the water is where a dam would be placed to tie into the existing valley walls. The digging down to create the bowl is not really required. M Nature provided a bowl with an edge busted off. The dam fills in the busted edge. The soil to create this dam is usually scraped out of the inside of the bowl, close to the area to be corked up.

Brettski,

That's what I thought...My pond site is kind of unique because there are 3 sides to the bowl that are created by high mountain type areas, but then (you can see from the aerial picture)
the opening however is very large which would require a large Damn. I'm estimating at least 300 feet. Basically, instead of coming together the mountains split off so the Dam would need to big. All I'm saying is that I could dig out the area so that there is enough dirt for digging out the Damn. Maybe what you're saying is that it is easier to have a bulldozer push up a lot of dirt in order to create the damn instead of digging out 5 Acres worth. I have two things going for this pond project. Number 1: Not a lot of heavy timber to remove Number 2. The ability to dump dirt very close by to avoid the trucking time. One tricky part is that around the pond perimeter are some beautiful pine trees that would surround the pond. If I created the Damn behind the pine trees, then ultimately they will be killed. If I build the Damn Wall in front of the pine trees, it may look a little funny, but I guess it would be better.

Brettski Take a look at the aerial photos. Near the cabin is very high ground, up a good 14-15 feet. The Damn would basically be a 300 foot curving impoundment wall. But I would plan on doing some of the work myself.

Let me know what you think? I know there are 31 ways to skin a cat...Oh wait that's ice cream...

Bretski, Actually why couldn't I just start the bull dozer from the pond area, and keep pushing outwards to create the huge 300 foot wall. Then the pond is being dug out a little deeper and the dirt goes to build the Damn. The pond is spring fed, so it doesn't need to be that deep to avoid freezing. The small existing pond is only about 4 feet deep, and there are plenty of trout that are living in there...

Even if the Damn wall was only 6-7 feet high it would make for a good Large Mouth Bass Pond...
I'd rather have it larger than deeper...

After thinking about it a little more. I would almost have to Excavate vs impound. Because even if I create a huge wall the water would have to go high enough near the mountain of trees. One section is a very gradual steepness to it. I would need to raise the water to get the depth of the lake to just 4 feet which would result in the waterlogging of a lot of the trees.

Oh, well, I've always dreamed of running an Excavator...

A 300 ft long dam is average. My project is about 5 ac and the dam will come in around 325' long, about 15 feet high at the center. There are guys on this forum that have dams in the 500 - 1000' long range.
WRT the trees, you have to make a decision. Trees and dams cannot occupy the same space...period. If you want to leave them within the pond basin, this if fine. It will create structure for the fish and a natural appearance for the pond. Make sure, tho, that this is asesthic appearance that you are looking for. Now is the time to get ALL this stuff rite.
It sounds like you are working with a standard impoundment pond, requiring only a suitable dam. This is good news. The rule of thumb in pushing dirt is "less distance, the better". Ideally, your dam soil should come from within the pond, nearest the dam. Assuming you have the clay soils required for proper dam construction, you will want to push it out of the basin in front of the dam and create some depth for your pond. Based on your geographic location, you are gonna get some hard freezing action. In order to create a zone for proper fish protection, 8' deep may be an issue. There are others on this forum that will be able to kick in the guidance about proper winter depth and DO levels.
Make no mistake. If you can create a 5 ac pond with a 300' long dam, you will NOT opt to create an excavated pond instead. If all your stars line up (proper soil, springs that will not reverse, proper construction technique), build the dam; the water will come.

Brettski,

I think the one side of the bowl is not as high as it would need to be to build a Dam. In other words, if the Damn was 10 feet, then on the other side of the bowl would need to be 10 feet. It's a very gradual steepness, so by the time I got to the 10 foot height, it would drown out a huge pine tree section which is one of the prettiest sections of the property.