Pond Boss Forums STOCKING A NEW POND Types of fish to choose Tips on stocking a smallmouth pond

I am working on building a small 1/4 to 1/3 acre pond which i intend to eventually stock with smallmouth bass. I live washington state, on the olympic peninsula. I have a good construction plan, but i am unsure about which species to stock for forage. I want to go with the common Fathead and golden shiner combo for a full year before introducing bass, but i am unsure if the shiners would thrive in a pond in my area because temperatures rarely exceed 80 degrees for more than two or three months. although winters arent that extreme, and i have no idea about what water temperatures would be like. Is there any type of forage other than golden shiners that i could stock here that might do better in the temperate climate? should i stick with shiners and see how it plays out?

Turtis21, welcome to the PB forum, lots of good info here.
Golden Shiners have done well in my pond and the winters here are long so I think they would do well in your area.
More people should be along to give you info.

I would definitely go with the FHM & GSH for initial forage.

Crayfish would be good IF you can get a native species that does well in ponds - no idea what that might be in Wash state.

Other fusiform (torpedo-shaped) fish could be a good addition, especially if they have the potential for long-term forage. Can you stock YP out there?

There are several lakes and ponds in this region with Yellow Perch, but would they be too productive of a fish for a small multiple species pond? Will they just end up taking over and then stunt there own growth and the growth of the other fish? I thought about them but wasn't sure.

I had a 1/3 acre mud bottomed pond with SMB, YP and GS-FHM. It worked well until it was contaminated with BG and GSF. YP, SMB and GS ate pellets. FHM were always rare in occurrance. There are a few pond near me with just YP and SMB as mostly natural balance without pellet feeding. No major problems with YP stunting so far providing weeds do not become abundant. Sept-Oct 09 PBoss mag will have an article about fish combinations, food item additions to improve the food chain, and management ideas when using primarily SMB as the main predator.

Search the internet for freshwater inland crayfish species that inhabit teh WA area. Look for those species with natural histories that are primarily pond dwellers. The locate natural sources or bait dealers and stock some of those species. Often pond dwelling crayfish will thrive in medium to large sized rock piles located is several shallow areas around the pond perimeter.

as far as crayfish go, i was thinking about just taking a few from the crayfish trap we have in our local lake, would this be a bad idea??

Turtis, I think golden shiners(GSH) will do fine in your pond. Fathead minnows(FHM) will be a good start as well. In small waters you will often find that the predators just simply out eat the reproductive capacity of their prey...

Theo is right about crayfish being a great alternative. I am not sure if you will even be able to find a source for native crayfish in your area. You may want to try trapping some yourself. Set out a couple crayfish traps baited with rotting beef liver or something else stinky in a couple local ponds. Any native crayfish should be suckers and then you can transfer them to your pond.

As far as alternative species to stock in your pond besides GSH and FHM... Your biggest challenge will be finding a commercial source to purchase them from. Washington State is not exactly a aquaculture mecca, but being so even if you lived in Texas or Arkansas where you have numerous hatcheries to choose from, few sell anything more than you standard GSH and FHM anyways.

Other commerically available species I have heard of or seen are goldfish which I wouldn't recommend. Banded killifish which I would recommend, but you would have to have them air freight sent to you at a high expense if they would even be legal in your state. Brook silversides which isn't even an option for you. Mosquitofish(gambusia), I doubt they would do well in your colder enrironment. Bluntnose minnows, no source near you as well...

So this only really leaves you one option and that is to collect fish from the wild to transfer to your pond. Unfortunately, the Olympic Peninsula is not teaming with native forage fish diversity. There is only one specie I can think of that would be adapted to pond life. The Olympic mudminnow, Novumbra hubbsi. The Olympic mudminnow is closely related to the central and eastern mudminnows and prefers a similar habitat, backwaters with plenty of vegetation. They maybe a good alternative forage species for your pond as both eastern and central mudminnows have been used as forage fish in the past. There are a couple other species found in your area, but none are adapted to pond life.

Whatever you decide to do, I would establish plenty of cover for your forage fish species so you have a shot of maintaining a self reproducing population that can handle predation. This may not be possible in a smaller pond though. Or you need to source feed trained fish to help alleviate pressure on your forage fish.

The addition of yellow perch would add to the difficulty as they are another set of mouths to feed. Smallmouth bass(SMB) may have a hard time keeping their numbers under control, but if you manage them through egg strand collection and fishing you may be able to have them as well. Bill Cody is very knowledgeable in this area and perhaps he will share his opinions on this subject as well.

Best of luck!

I see Bill Cody weighed in while I wrote my response so no need to wait! HAHA

thank, you for the insights, i think im going to trap crayfish from my local lake, and not stock yellow perch because, that just seems to rowdy for a small pond environment. also, im selecting to collect crayfish from the rocky areas of my local lake beacuae i will have at least a partially gravel bottom, is this a good idea??

Catching crayfish from the lake is a good place to start. Next step is to identify what the main species is in the lake. There is likely only 1 or 2 species that will be common in your traps. See this site for a start to finding information about crayfish present in your WA area or region. Once you know the species reading about its habits will help decide if it is a good candidate for like in your pond. Chances are if you catch it in a lake it is primarily a still water dweller and okay in a pond. The main thing you want to avoid are species that crawl out of the pond and dig into the banks away from the shoreline.

While trapping for crayfish in the lake also note the species of minnow/shiner that you catch. Good chances are they spawned in the lake and would also spawn and thrive in your pond. Research their spawning habits and see if those conditions are available in your pond. Is so stock them. Sometimes the minnows don't read the book and one if lucky can get them pond spawn even though it is not typical for them to do so. Let us know what you are able to collect or if you need help identifying what you catch. Some of us may be able to help out or at least provide advice.

YP can always be added later. You will know the need for YP if the SMB stay small and always keep eating up all the forage fish requiring you to continually add more to keep some forage fish present.

I help a few pond owners with several 0.2-0.5 acre ponds near me that have only SMB and no other fish species and the bass do just fine. They just don't normally get very big (12"-13"). No major over population problems seems to occur. But, if one fed them a high protein pellet like Silver Cup or Aquamax Carnivore the SMB only pond would do great and one could produce SM bass up to 4-6 lbs.

well, my family traps crayfish in our lake for bait uses, and there are always minnows in the trap but they are always salmon fry. the lake isn't a true lake, its fed by a river and empties into a river and most of the fish species are andronomous.

Check some other inland lakes with your traps. You will probably find a lake dwelling minnow/shiner. Any beaver ponds near you to trap? Another idea is to check with bait sellers for minnows. Especially check the bait sellers that collect their own minnows. They, a game warden or a college biology or fish squeezing professor may know of some lakes with natural minnow populations. Do some homework and you will find something.

Here is the link to finding more about crayfish.
http://iz.carnegiemnh.org/crayfish/iaa/index.htm
see their links for more crayfish info, contacts or possible experts in your region.

like several hundred beaver ponds, i live in the olympic national rainforest. but i fish these regularly and i find nothing but hundreds of native cutthroat trout, and when we pump there stomachs, just bugs and trout fry. there are a few alpine lakes though i haven't tried those yet.

Turtis, as I said your area is pretty lacking in native forage fish (cyprinid species). Peamouth and longnose dace are the only two species found on the Olympic Peninsula. Both of which require running water to spawn successfully... I think the mudminnow may be your only local option.

See the link to crayfish info above. I would try trapping some of the more pond-like beaver ponds compared to pond with more moving water. You might get lucky and catch a few minnows.

Where do you catch the YP? If it is lakes try trapping there.

im thinking for forage i'll just rely on FHM and GSH. I really like the crayfish idea though, and i'll definitely look into that. what type of habitat do FHM and GSH need to spawn? could they do well in a gravel bottom pond??

Search topics here for lots of info on FHM and GS spawning needs.

Try this

http://www.pondboss.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=92626#Post92626

i'm liking it, thanks for the info, its really made me consider alot of things, my pond plan is now radically different thanks to your advice