Pond Boss Forums POND CONSTRUCTION Creating habitat My Pond Project

Unfortunately the best I could do on the slope was 4:1 down ~7ft to the clay layer.

I tried a steeper slope but got my dozer stuck on the bank, the tracks just spin in the loose soil at a 3:1 slope, luckily I had my excavator to help pull it up.

Will a 4:1 slope all the way around the pond create vegetation problems for me? I don't want cattails, etc...

Latest pictures: Rear Banks

The normal rule is if the sun's light can penetrate the water and hit the dirt something will grow. A little steeper might have been better but if the dozer was already getting stuck you did all you can do.

OttO

Well, this water gets really clear, so I'm probably going to have a fight on my hands with weeds.

I'll have to manage them I guess.

I would like a steeper slope, but then I'd have to use my excavator bucket to spread the clay out with, that would use a lot more fuel and take a lot more time to do...

You need to be proud of the work you did it looks great. Your weed problem will not be as bad as you think.

otto

Hi guys: I have a 3/4 a. new, muddy pond with zero structure except for a large rock ledge slmack in the mniddle of the pond. Basin is about 12-14 with most of the depth at about 7-8 feet. I am beginning to add structure this weekend. I am putting 6-8 10 ft. cedar trees in cemented buckets,wired together and standing upright. I have 3-5 20 foot cedars to lay on their sides with cinder blocks to keep them down. In the shallow end I have spread 15 tons of creek gravel, and plan to put wood pallets weighted down with large boulders, in that area. I also have about 75-80 basketball (or larger sized rocks from the property to dump (hopefully strategically) into the pond for addl structure. Question: Should I drop a large oak into the pond or will the tannin acid be too much for it to handle? Any other suggestions will be greatly appreiated. I plan to begin stocking this fall, but will put some baitfish in shortly. I am shooting for a bg, red ear, lmb pond.

jd, if I recall correctly you want to aviod putting an oak in your pond if it is still fairly green, if it's been dead and dried for several years you should be OK. Hopefully someone else with some expierence using oaks will chime in.

JD I use oak a lot. We have a running debate here if green oak will cause problems. I say it is ok if you have adequate alkalinity , some others say it may cause a problem.

Having said that , I don't think you need any more structure than you have described in your post. The general rule is one or two pieces per acre is enough. It sounds like you have about 10 times that much.

I will never again put freshly dead oaks into a pond. I did it and poisoned my water for a couple of years. I finally pumped it dry. That's a huge thing in arid North Texas.

Try something. Cut a piece of the oak and put it into a bucket of pond water. If the water turns black, don't do it.

Don't take the chance like ewest said you have enough.
It would still be interesting to see if the water turned black like Dave Davidson said. Try that experiment and let us know.

Otto

OK guys - I'm a little out in front on this one. I cut a one foot piece from a freshly cut black/post oak, put it in a clear plastic tub and within 6 hours the water was turning black. The next morning the water was real black. NO OAKS in this pond unless they are root wads 1-2 years old. I'll back off some of the structure. Sounds like you guys think I may have too much. I'll cut it back and add if I need to later on. Thanks for the help fellas. JD

Those post oaks must be different. Never had a problem using red , white ,black jack , or any of the other 20 types around here. No post oaks here.

I am having a problem with black water , alkalinity of 55, and ph of 63. Already put 6800 lbs of lime in. U of A at pine bluff is checking my soil tomorrow from the pond. They are already saying I will need much more lime. Guess what? the pond is loaded with red oak, white oak, and pin oaks. does that answer everybody's question about oaks?

When I did it, I stocked to see what would happen. It killed everything within hours. Next, I tried experimenting with bleach. I added a couple of drops to a jar of the water and it cleared beautifully. Then I went to a swimming pool supply place and bought 10 pounds of chlorine, enough to sterilize 2 Olympic size swimming pools. Nada. 175 pounds later, I had changed the color slightly. I then pumped it dry and let Texas summer cure my problems.

I've seen it several times. Live, standing timber that floods doesn't cause a problem. Older, dried oak doesn't cause a problem. However, the tanins in fresh cut or pushed oak is a deadly toxin. It is used in tanning hides and, if I recall correctly, a tiny, tiny bit goes a long way.

Lusk once told me that in certain soils, the alkilinity is such that it doesn't cause a problem. I just don't remember the specifics.

My wife is the director of aquatics at our local indoor facility which hold 480,000 gal of h2o. With her degree in chem., minor in biology, and 7 years experience balancing alkalinity, ph, acidity, etc., I've got a built in "expert". All she needs to know is how all that relates to a "pond" with fish, instead of a "pool" with a bather load of 400-500 people per day, hee hee!! I think she'll make the transition well, cause she's my crappie fishin buddy also. We are going to begin water testing this weekend and as we make progress, and add chems etc, I'll give yawl some feed back, for what it is worth. Feel free to jump in with suggestions. Gonna be fun.. JD

jimmydee

This is great. Keep your wife on the case for us.

Bring her to the conference with you.

Otto

My pond thread has been hi-jacked!

Happens all the time around here.

Etd, I am in gasport NY and have a small 3yr old pond and have the same water depths as you. I am in the third year of my stocking plan and I am seeing great growth rates and my fish are very healthy. I started with fatheads as feeders and allowed them the run of the pond for a year to get established. We can talk about the structure I added for a new build so the minnies have a place to hide if you want. The second year I added LMB and Yellow Perch I added them at 3-5 inch fish and they the LMB are to 8-14 and the YP are 9-13. I hand feed twice a day and suppliment with 2-3 lbs of minnows every two months. I just put in 30 sunnies to breed feeders for the established preditors. I am not a pond pro like most of the guys on this board but I am in your area and so thought this info may help. Buy the way your concern about winter die off is not an issue I have not lost any fish to a winter dieoff the herons are the only fish killers you will have to worry about.
Hope this helps
Scott

to keep the herons out stake a white ribbon 1 inch thick around the perimiter of the pond right at the waters edge, stake it every 20-30 feet or so. ive heard this works

Chris
let us know if that works White ribbon is cheep.

Otto

I had herons come as soon as I started stocking fathead minnows. Four or five a day. I bought a heron decoy from Bass Pro Shop and have had One heron in six months. I was told they are territorial. Worked for me.

My decoy looks very real and seemed to work for a few weeks, but now the herons aren't fazed by it. I've seen them standing within a few feet of it. I've been told I should move it frequently, but...I guess I'm too lazy.

You did get the model with heat-seeking laser blaster, didn't you?

There's a falcon decoy that flaps its wings and screeches. It's supposed to be very effective, but pricy I would think.

hey Schreoder

My decoy has been sitting in the exact same spot for 6 months and only one heron challenged it. Mine came from bass pro shop for about $36, maybe yours didn't look real enough? I don't know, but I live in an area that is infested with fish eating birds, maybe it is the detail on the decoy.

I'm almost done digging, and I want to get some seed on the island and perimeter after a bit of landscaping to help with erosion next spring.

What should I plant?

It won't be mowed for a few years probably, especially the island...

Here are some progress pic's The first pic shows how little digging I have left.

Almost done digging