Hey guys,
this spring I'm gonna do some stocking on my 5 acre pond, right now it has some awesome sized bluegill, decent bass, and supposed channel cats but I've fished many times for them and have never got a bite. Also I will be adding a feeder aswell. I like pan fishing the most and I like to eat what I catch (except the monster bg) so I would like to add another breed of panfish. The bass I have in the pond are good sized but not huge there has been a few mounters taken around 8lbs but most are in the 2-4 lb range. I live in illinois about 50 miles west of st. Louis and the lake does get well frozen over. What's u guys thoughts I thought about some hybrid panfish but I heard they don't reproduce aswell as regulars. I'm open to all opinions and just want to be able to catch plenty of fish and not have to worry about hurting the population. I might do a few bass aswell because the numbers seem low and I don't want my panfish getting stunted.
Thanks always
bluegiller

Also what size should I add how many and what time the year is the best for stocking

Check to see if RES survive in your area. I think they do but be sure first. With adult LMB already in the pond you will need to add adult RES ( 6 inch) to avoid predation. Start looking now for them as they are not easy to find. If you place the order far enough in advance your odds will be greater. 50 adult RES (make sure you get both males and females) should be enough but up to 100 would be ok. There are people here who could help. Contact N8ly http://www.hbpondmanagement.com/ , Rainman http://www.tilapiastockers.com/ or Shawn http://www.midwestlake.com/ to see if they can help.

There's a guy down the road that sells fish I see him go by everyday with the fish truck lol

I'd prefer RES over the HBG as well. An 8# LMB from that area is doing pretty well!

Pumpkinseeds would do well in your region. They're a beautiful sunfish and fight very hard, and from what I've seen on bigbluegill.com they seem to grow almost as large as bluegill up north. Cecil on here turned me on to a hatchery in NY that sells them up to 6":

http://www.smithcreekfishfarm.com/id1.html

I didn't know if pumpkinseeds would make it this far noth

PS do well up north but they are not a true substitute for RES. Several of us have looked and we find no evidence of any reported cases of RES overpopulating and stunting. That is just the opposite of PS who regularly overpopulate and stunt. They do both eat snails and are beautiful fish. If bigger panfish are your goal then PS would not be a good choice to add to a northern LMB/BG pond IMO.

I'll let you guys know when my PS's reach 12".

I think i will go with the RES. What do you fellas suggest for a 5 acre pond. And when should i add them and at what size..

Only one 8.2lbr caught but two over 6lbs caught. And i found one dead that was over 8 im guessin i could easily fit both fist in its mouth it was big. Last year i didnt really fish it hard for bass but the ones i caught were never over 3 4 at the most. I just want just enough bass to keep my sweet bluegills under control. I want a 3lb bluegill on the wall for 2011 im hopin this feeding program really pays off next year.

You need to stock adult fish, preferably in 6" or bigger. You can stock smaller fish, but you'll have to stock a large number of them to see some survive the heavy predation they will no doubt endure in your pond. As others have said, get on the phone now and start securing a source for this spring. You can stock them in your area any time after ice out, but I'd wait until water temps were in the 50's. As far as numbers, I would stock about 20 per acre if going with 6"+ fish and stocked at least 100 per acre if 4" and 200 if under 4"...

Please do let me know, and what your overall PS population is looking like.
Thanks

Guess i better start saving my money tell spring aswell lol..

Here's a photo of an 11.25" pumpkinseed caught from a public BOW in New York state, which of course is further north than St. Louis, significantly so:

http://bigbluegill.com/photo/2008-ny-citation-pumpkinseed

There are multiple other photos on the site of pumpkinseeds over 10" that were caught up north. Here's a publication from the Wisconsin DNR that states that part of their original range was Manitoba:

http://dnr.wi.gov/fish/pubs/pumpkinseed.pdf

As opposed to the native range of redear, the northernmost point of which is near the Kentucky/Illinois border:

http://www.dnr.state.oh.us/Portals/9/pdf/pub317.pdf

The MI state record for redear is 1 lb. 15.5 ounces, while the record pumpkinseed for that state is 2 lbs. 2 ounces. Missouri's state record redear is 2 lbs. 7 ounces. They don't list a pumpkinseed record. Iowa's record redear is 1 lb. 9 ounces, less than the record pumpkinseed for Michigan. So there would seem not to be a big difference in the two species' potential in northern areas, other than the fact pumpkinseeds are native much further north, which is why I recommended them. Considering pumpkinseeds take pellet food better than redear (which seldom take it at all), I would tend to think they have more potential in a pond in the region in question.

Guys, he's in mid-Southern Illinois. He's not gonna have any trouble keeping Redears alive, or having them outgrow Pumpkinseeds, there.

Ive caught RES all around here including Hybrids in great numbers and size. Im more worried about the stunting tendacy and over populating of the PS. Also the feeding is more for the bluegill so they dont have to compete with the RES. I have big bluegill honestly bigger than most ive seen i just want them bigger lol. The RES would be for eating and the bluegill would be for looking.

So anyways is PS and RES my only other good panfish stocking options? Thats all the conversation has leaned towards any other options out there?

You could certainly stock YP, although with LMB present, the population may likely need periodic (think every few years) restocking to continue.

There are other sunfish species that can be stocked into ponds. Sourcing them from hatcheries is the issue. Longear sunfish and redbreast sunfish both do fine in pond although they prefer streams. They don't get as large as BG, topping out around 10" but are both very pretty sunfish. Redspotted sunfish are also another option, but they reach a maximum size of only about 8".

Here's some interesting links:

PSK state records

BG state records

RES state records

and for Rainman :
BT state records

I'd put a few bucks on the odds that the South Carolina PS, is a pumpkineargill.

PS, RES, and BG in S. Carolina must grow in magic water.

Maybe like the magic water that Cecil grows the YP in?

Down in the southern range of PS they seem to prefer rivers over lakes. There are some really pretty ones in the acidic coastal rivers by my future in-law's house in southern NC. Some real nice sized PS and you can catch CNBG right with them!

Did some checking on PS vs. RES in the Il and Id area from Carlander 77 , Handbook of Freshwater Fishery Biology ( the bible of fish statistics). In that area for the oldest age fish the mean and avg size RES was substantially larger in TL at 250 mm +- (9.84 inches) than the PS at around 160 mm +- (6.30 inches).

At least one of the records listed from the secondary site referenced above, is not accurate - here's the current record, straight from the state DNR:

http://www.michigan.gov/dnr/0,1607,7-153-10371_10402-227125--,00.html

That is one giant pumpkinseed! Interesting that the record for RES in Michigan was also broke this year...

I think I'm goin with RES, anyone ever heard of opels fish hatchery it's like mile from my house in worden il. Thanks for all the input guys. Anymore suggestions are welcome

Thanks, Walt. That is one big PKS!! I don't have worlds of experience with them, but it sure seems that anything over 8 inches is a true trophy around here.

O.K. after reading this thread you have all convinced me I should stock both!

Not sure you would like the results James. RES would be a better option in your location. Several studies indicated lees than good results for PS when they were in ponds with RES and either BG or GSF.

My state of Indiana does not have a record category for pumpkinseeds. We also don't differentiate between a hybrid bluegill and a regular bluegill for the state record. I know the biologist that witnessed the 3 lb. 8 oz. state record for Indiana and he said it was definitely a hybrid.

AP I agree with you on the pumpkinseed photo in NC most probably a PS/BG hybrid. Looks obvious to me too.

PS are not native to FL and I am not sure they would do well in FL even without RES being in the pond...

ok what about tarpon? I went fishing in a guys one acre pond last week that had tilapia and tarpon. I hooked a thirty five pound tarpon on fourteen pound test using a floating rapala bass lure. quite a fish story I know. He told me tarpon could live in fresh or salt water. Has anyone tried stocking tarpon?

I would imagine the only place tarpon would do well in a pond would be where the pond was far enough south to stay above the tarpon's lethal temp limit. I am not sure what it is, but I am betting it is well into the 50's if not above 60 degrees. Not many ponds other than southern FL and far southern TX will stay above 60 year round. A larger pond may have a better chance of doing it. How many tarpon did this guy have in his 1 acre pond? It wouldn't take many tarpon to quickly go above the carrying capacity of a 1 acre pond. Even tilapia in an enclosed body of water like a 1 acre pond would have a hard time keeping up with the predation of tarpon I would think? There are a number of "saltwater" fish who can adapt fine to freshwater. Red drum and needlefish come to mind... They may not be able to spawn but that may be a good thing. If you had a pond in the 5 acre range in southern FL, tarpon/blue tilapia/striped mullet would be an intersting combo to try...

Sorry to get off topic this will be my last post here. I know that I am in a climate that would not support tarpon but we have some readers that are far enough south that the tilapia in their ponds survive the winter. I don't know how many tarpon were in the one acre pond but I hooked one and saw two others in an hour. It was exciting enough that someone in the south may want to explore the possibility.

I don't know where you could source the tarpon? I guess wild caught fish and then transfer them to the pond. It would have to be a fairly small fish. If the location the tarpon is caught isn't freshwater, but brackish or ocean then special care will have to be given to adjust the fish to its new freshwater home...