After much research I have decided to stock Tilapia next spring. Problem I'm having is finding a source locally. Best option I've found so far is to buy online and have them shipped which is very expensive! Seems like the prices can be all over the place. The best I've found so far was $100 for a 100 1" fingerlings delivered. I have the room in my basement and have thought about ordering these around January and growing them out to a larger size before releasing in the spring. Right now that seems like my best option unless I can find somewhere close by?

Talk to Rainman here on the forum.

Rainman is the man for stocker size fish.

There is a place that sells Tilipia north of Kansas City a ways but only the fingerlings. You can do a google search and find them. There are actually a couple different companies but I question if the fish don't come from the same source. One is more of a retail outlet and sells on Ebay and such and the other looks more like a wholesale (with prices accordingly) outlet. Been a year and a half since I bought any from them though. (Edit: I looked for the wholesale one and could not find it).

Was kind of a strange deal. Sent the wife and daughter after the fish (with their obligatory shopping stop in KC) and they met a kid at a gas station for the fish. Makes me think they do not have a retail store and deal mostly on line.

Do a search for White Brook Tilipia farm. I did the hatchery choice and got mostly blue and some white. I was just experimenting. Putting in fingerlings in the early summer gets harvest-able size by fall but little to no algae control because they really just get big enough to reproduce about the end of the season. For algae control a guy needs to see someone like Rainman or raise them over the winter to breeding size for spring/ early summer introduction to the pond.

I did look at rainmans website and that was one option I was considering.

That is the best one for known quality fish from a guy that knows Tilapia. The fingerlings I got seemed to be ok too, but I would have sure got them from Rainman had it been feasible. I was just too far away and too small of an order to be viable.

Slurp, Tilapia are not legal to stock in Iowa without a "Special Permit". Contact Alan Johnson with Iowa DNR and discuss with him your situation. 2 years ago, Iowa denied a species, then after the owner agreed to keep the DNR informed on things, they approved the stocking and special permit. Alan Johnson is a reasonable man!

Prices vary because most fish are not what is claimed...most are mutt hybrids, and overnight shipping is expensive, period.

$100 is dirt cheap.

I am aware of the permit needed. Doesn't really make sense to me with a fish that will die off each winter since there's no chance of them taking over a BOW. However if my pond could be used to help support the Iowa DNR and there decision towards Tilapia in our ponds i would be all for that. Tilapia farming is becoming a very ligitamate business in the state it sounds like. I do believe (not certain) it is legal in an aquarium? I know tilapia use in aquaculture is very popular which is what gave me the idea to grow them out in my basement. I already grow tomatoes and peppers hydroponically over the winter as a hobby so it would be very easy for me to incorporate them into that. Yes $100 is cheap compared to other prices I have seen. I won't step on anyone's toes, others can do there own research, but I feel that this seller is selling a quality of fish that is perfectly acceptable for my intended use.

Slurp, let me know if you obtain the permit from the Iowa DNR. I live in Iowa too, and I would like to put some Tilapia in my pond also to help control the fila algae and also provide "food" for my predator fish.

I have bought fish from Rainman before and it worked out great. Maybe we can work together on a Tilapia shipment to Iowa this upcoming late spring from Rainman. I'm also kicking around the idea of adding some paddlefish to help with my pond's water quality. Got that idea from a recent article in the PondBoss magazine.

Brad

I have contacted a guy I met in the DNR to see what I can find out. Unfortunately his area is in the county my pond is located at and they seem to only be concerned with the nearest lake which is Rathbun lake. Glad to hear you had good results dealing with rainman. Where about are you located? Would definitely be interested in getting together on a shipment! PM me if you're serious. I've also been interested in a couple paddlefish, I can remember catching them out of the river when I was younger.

Rainman I contacted Alan Johnson the other day. He says he has never approved a permit for Tilapia in Iowa. He said he has only had one other request for tilapia and that was denied. He did however seem very receptive to the idea and wanted more information regarding the benefits of tilapia. I offered to make my pond a test bed for any research they might want to do. I am going to start another thread asking for information from others. Please take the time to check it, who knows there could be some more business coming your way!

Anyone from Iowa that would be interested in putting tilapia in your pond please contact Alan at alan.johnson@dnr.iowa.gov and express your interest. The more we bug him the more likely it is to happen! As mentioned he is very receptive to the idea and will get back to you VERY quickly.

I sent you a private message and would be willing to also provide tilapia to Iowa DNR for demonstration uses if they'd like also.

Brad, I am partnering with a man here that raises paddlefish

I would be interested in a couple paddlefish as well. PM me details on what it would take to get some

FWIW My understanding is paddlefish feed primarily on large amounts of zooplankton. I would be careful stocking them in a smaller BOW. The reduction in zooplankton at the bottom of the food chain might negatively impact your other zooplankton dependent fish/spawn and, subsequently, the fish that feed on them....

Once they are in there, how do you get them out if you want to? Snag or shoot?

I have been tilting at this same windmill since last summer. I did (again) call my local fisheries Biologist for the Iowa DNR, Paul Sleeper, on Nov 29th. I didn't reach him (again) but did have a nice long chat with one of his assistants. We reviewed the whole tilapia issue in Iowa (as nicely outlined above). I also volunteered my pond as a 'test site' for tilapia use on FA control in Iowa. My pond's outflow is to grass strip between two huge fields and runs for almost two miles before (potentially) running off into a small creek. Set aside the fact it was -1 degrees Fahrenheit last night and my pond has 4 inches of ice on it already! BUT, I will also shoot an email to Alan Johnson as noted above. And I will add my name to the list of tilapia 'wanting' folk from Iowa...

Originally I thought Paddlefish filtered phytoplanton, however, according to a little research I just performed, Paddlefish instead filter zooplankton as primary forage. So what's their role in a pond, since zooplankton is important forage for many YOY species? I don't see increasing competition for zooplankton as desirable, especially considering Zooplankton utilize phytoplankton as forage helping control blooms. Something that helps manage phytoplankton blooms certainly would be of interest to me...just not sure that Paddlefish fit that niche?

Interesting thoughts TJ. Thanks for that info.

It was news to me...I thought they were planktonic algae filter feeders, apparently not. Unless I have something wrong, which I often do, seems Paddlefish would help increase phytoplankton blooms by reducing zooplankton...one of the primary foragers of plankton?

Could improving zooplankton habitat, such as providing appropriate preferred vegetation, potentially increase zooplankton colony size and possibly result in a decrease in phytoplankton? Do ponds with substantial vegetation potentially have more robust zooplankton colonies and typically have less issues with phytoplankton blooms?

TJ, how do/can they do that? Seems to me that both zoo and phyto would be ingested. But then, I know zero about paddlefish.

In doing some searching for additional information on tilapia, I came across this new article. Doesn't help with the tilapia as FA control issue, but does show another use of tilapia...
https://www.thesun.co.uk/living/2395670/...-new-treatment/

That's interesting Doc.

1. If Zooplankton utilize phytoplankton as forage helping control blooms, could improving zooplankton habitat, such as providing appropriate preferred vegetation, potentially increase zooplankton colony size and possibly result in a decrease in phytoplankton? YES IN THEORY ALTHOUGH THEORIES ARE NOT ALWAYS ABSOLUTE ESPECIALLY IN NATURE. THUS - IT ALL DEPENDS
YES THIS ACTUALLY HAPPENS IN MANY WATER BODIES WHERE THE WATER IS NOTICABLY CLEAR (VIS 5-20FT) AND USUALLY SUBMERGED LITTORAL PLANTS FLOURISH. Submerged plants will compete to often reduce phytoplankton and create clear water. The more the higher plant competition generally means there are fewer phytoplankton and clearer the water.
FIRST THING TO REMEMBER IS ZOOPLANKTON IS COMPOSED OF PROTOZOA, ROTIFERS AND CRUSTACEA. MOST THINK IT AS PRIMARILY CRUSTACEA SINCE THEY ARE THE LARGEST INDIVIDUALS.

THEY WILL ONLY HELP CONTROL ALGAL CELLS OF BLOOMS IF THE ALGAE BLOOM CELLS ARE EDIBLE (CONSUMABLE) BY THE ZOOPLANKTON SPECIES. THE MANY PHYTOPLANKTON SPECIES HAVE A VERY WIDE RANGE OF CELL SIZES (0.3MICROMETER TO 1000UM OR MORE). NUMEROUS FACTORS OR THINGS INFLUENCE ZOOPLANKTON DENSITY - ONE IS GOOD HABITAT & THE BIG 1ST OR 2ND INFLUENCE IS TYPE OF PREDATOR AND WHAT IT IS ABLE TO EAT. ONE OF THE BIG CONTROLS OF ZOOPLANKTON DENSITY IS PROPER FOOD PARTICLE SIZE. PONDS WITH NO FISH PREDATORS OR WITH PREDATORS HAVING LIMITED ZOO PREDATION ABILITY USUALLY HAVE THE LARGEST ZOO SPECIES. AS THE ZOOPREDATOR FILTERING EFFICIENCY & INDIVIDUAL DENSITY INCREASES ZOO COMMUNITY TENDS TO have more SMALLER individuals.
https://www.casqa.org/asca/dynamic-internal-controls-eutrophication-lake-elsinore-role-%E2%80%98bottom-%E2%80%99-and-%E2%80%98top-down%E2%80%99-limitation

Top Down vs Bottom Up management - Biomanipulation
http://www.lmvp.org/Waterline/fall2005/topdown3.htm


2. Do ponds with substantial vegetation potentially have more robust zooplankton colonies and typically have less issues with phytoplankton blooms? GENERALLY YES, NOT ALWAYS. DENSE BEDS OF SUBMERGED VEGETATION GIVE THE LITTORAL ZOOPLANKTON LOTS OF REFUGE; PELAGIC ZOOPLANKTON NOT SO MUCH OF THE PLANT REFUGE IS UTILIZED. REMEMBER, ALGAE SPECIES CREATING A BLOOM IS OFTEN A MONO-SPECIES AND OFTEN A LARGE CELL SPECIES. WELL BALANCED WATER BODIES RARELY HAVE NUISANCE BLOOMS. MANY OF THE NUISANCE BLOOMS ARE DOMINATED BY INEDIBLE ALGAE SPECIES. THIS ADAPTATION ALLOWS THE ALGAE TO FLOURISH DESPITE WHAT ZOO SPECIES ARE PRESENT. Nutrients are usually driving the phytoplankton composition and density. Reread the Biomanagement in link above.

Thanks Bill! Extremely interesting topic to me. Even learned a new term, zooplanktivores, from your link. I have a whole new appreciation for the little guys at the bottom of the food chain and how seemingly small changes by a pondmeister can have huge impacts on overall pond balance. I think I will be more thoughtful before I reach for a herbicide or introduce a new fish species in the future.

Good question, Dave. I don't know why all the research checked noted them as zooplankton foragers...they don't spit out the veges, do they?

IIRC it has to do with the size of particles the paddlefish gillrakers can filter. They filter out the "larger" zooplankton while the phytoplankton is typically too small to be retained and passes thru. So I guess you might say, in a round about way, they actually do spit out the veggies.

I also think some of the small zooplankton will pass through - size filtering selection based on the paddlefish filtering mechanics. Particle size retention by paddlefish has probably been researched. Don't forget protozoans and rotifers are also part of the zooplankton community.

I sent an email to Alan Johnson, as suggested above. Here was his response:

"Dear Mr Perrin,
To write a response to your question about stocking tilapia into your farm pond in Iowa to control filamentous algae I have consulted Fisheries Chief Joe Larscheid and my supervisor Jay Rudacille. We understand the temperature tolerance of tilapia. However Joe stated that stocking tilapia into Iowa’s waters will not be allowed under any condition.

There is a lack of scientific data on the effects of tilapia as a management tool for farm ponds. Digestion of the filamentous algae will release the nutrients bound in them, likely causing more single-celled algae to bloom causing water to become green. Tilapia may diminish the filamentous algae then turn to other food sources which could compete with the other game fish in the pond, example would be consumption of zooplankton important to larval bass and bluegill. If the tilapia did result in a population of large bass, when the tilapia die there would be no forage until tilapia are restocked and spawn again.

Use of the bass and bluegill system with removal of bluegill by angling can result in the large bass you seek. Contact your local fisheries biologist to discuss pond management techniques further.

Sincerely,
Alan

J. Alan Johnson | Natural Resource Biologist
Iowa Department of Natural Resources
P 641-647-2658 | F 641-647-2690 | 15053 Hatchery Place, Moravia, IA 52571
www.iowadnr.gov"

It was curious to see that Fisheries Chief Joe Larscheid stated
"stocking tilapia into Iowa’s waters will not be allowed under any condition." Doesn't seem very scientific. Must be some political issue here I am unaware of. I did also send an email to Iowa State University, which has a wildlife R&D department (and fisheries program), regarding research on tilapia and FA. I await a response.

ok, I got an email about the research just after posting. Here was the response:

"Good morning!

Thank you for your email. I will pass it along to our scientists. I’m also passing it along to our Fisheries Extension Biologist, Allen Pattillo. Allen is out of the office on vacation at the moment, so he won’t respond immediately, however he can be reached at pattillo@iastate.edu or 515-294-8616 when he returns.

Have a great day!

USGS
Iowa Cooperative Fish & Wildlife Research Unit
Iowa State University | 338 Science II | 2310 Pammel Drive | Ames, IA 50011
coopunit@iastate.edu
www.cfwru.iastate.edu"

A bit more hopeful response here. I will try and contact Allen Pattillo as well. I would suggest another other Iowegians with interest in this topic might contact him as well..

Appears that the Iowa Fisheries Chief is talking in absolutes by saying "not be allowed under any condition". Before making such a strong statement, too bad the Iowa DNR can't approach it with an open mind and at least research/look at the other states that do allow Tilapia. Their decision doesn't totally surprise me though, especially considering the invasive species (zebra mussels, asian carp)that they are dealing with right now.

Brad-
I wrote back to Allen J regarding that exact perception. I also asked him if the Iowa DNR had ever discussed this with neighboring states that DO allow tilapia, to learn from their actual experience. I would have to defer to Bill Cody and others regarding his premise about algal blooms resulting from tilapia, but it seems a weak argument.

But what about those BOW with an established forage base, like mine, with BG and BCP? Another topic of research: comparison of (new) pond lacking established forage base vs. established pond with forage base, and the effect of tilapia as FA control on other algal species growth..

Umm... not so sure about the removing BG part to get big bass.

Agreed Bocomo.

I've wondered the same thing regarding digestion of algae....don't tilapia poop? And it seems there have been a few posts of late regarding the absence of floaters after the water cools. How can one be sure that all those dead tilapia aren't decomposing on the bottom, out of the reach of terrestrial predators, releasing all those consumed nutrients back into the pond?

Are Tilapia a solution that once implemented, need to be continously stocked from that point on, or do they ever get "done??" With the job?

I think Tp are like most everything else, +'s and -'s. Last year I had a pond full of them and could catch them using a fly rod around the feeders. I thought they were good eating with out that strong fish taste that some fish have. But this year I did not have so many in the pond and I did not catch a single one this year.

Sprkplug
I think TP are just another tool in the toolbox, potentially. I could see them as a way to break the viscous cycle of FA, by having nutrients in the form of FA converted to TP instead vs just having FA die and sink to the bottom, only to start again. Like Tracy says, pluses and minuses to everything. I don't really have a dog (? fish) in this fight, but the science (or lack of it) has my curiosity peaked. There are some really awesome, detailed threads in this forum on biomass, which is part of what this discussion is coming down to.

So, I got a response back from Iowa State University, regarding tilapia research:
---------------------------
"Mr. Perrin,

Your email came to me from the Iowa COOP unit for possible input.

There have a been some studies done on the use of tilapia for filamentous algae control as well as alternative prey base for largemouth bass in southern states. While the smaller tilapia have been able to consume the algae, complete control has not always been possible due to the inherent fertility of the pond as well as algae’s growth rate. In addition, complete algae control will not in itself cure the pond fertility issues as other forms of plankton or vascular plant can still take place as the nutrients will remain in place. Tilapia use as an alternative prey base has not always been successful for a number of reasons.

As for Tilapia not being legal in Iowa, agency staff are cautious about possible impacts of non-native fish on the native ecosystem. Some state agencies have not shared this same concern. For myself, I did my earlier graduate work on grass carp for vegetation control in Texas. At the time, we were informed that this fish would not be able to reproduce in Texas streams due to salinity and water flow requirement. Unfortunately, this species has been able to reproduce in waterways not considered as spawning opportunities based on earlier research. Thus, some state agencies have taken a very conservative approach to the use of any non-native species in management due to unforeseen consequences.

Sincerely,
Joe

Joseph E. Morris, Professor – Natural Resource Ecology and Management (NREM)
Director – North Central Regional Aquaculture Center (NCRAC)
339 Science II, Iowa State University
Ames, IA 50011-3221"
----------------------------
Another rather tepid response. I get the impression they think I am looking for tilapia to be a 'cure all' for FA. When I wrote him back, my response was that tilapia could be part of a complete plan for FA management. But, given the above responses, I think I'll just let this issue go.

Wow, I haven't checked in here for a while! Good to see other Iowans are interested and taking the time to reach out to the DNR. I find it interesting that Alan reached out to his supervisor, must be getting a few more questions about Tilapia lately! It's too bad Joe Larscheid is basically saying it'll never happen. It seems the Iowa DNR just isn't what it used to be. Not sure if it's political or financial pressure but I used to consider us one of the best in the country. I, and hopefully others, will continue to contact the DNR and try and do our part.

sorry Dr. Luke you have to deal with such non-sense.