This is really lookin' like the year that D-ski and I take on constructing a real place to stay at the LNP project. We've already shared and explored some of the details of this next development step within the Our Pond Home thread.
Since this is going to be a pretty big step for us, it's gonna get a a web page on our LNP website. This will be where we maintain and keep the updates as they occur. I don't want to have to keep 2 identical journals on this phase, so I'll use this thread to keep those that might be interested up to date. As the web page is updated, I'll post progress summaries here.
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The project isn't really anything particularly special, or that big of a deal, except that we plan to DIY a very large portion of it's construction. You get to watch us make stupid mistakes. You guys know me; I won't let you down. I hope and plan for a few victories along the way, too. We'll see what these two middle aged hearts, minds, and bodies can dish out to get us there.
As always, we remain receptive to thoughts and ideas.
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Come join us, won't you?
LNP garage-apartment web page

The sooner you get started the sooner the real fun will begin, not kidding. Even considering the frustrations that will arise, it will be a blast.

I don't know if this work for you, but...

The first thing we did was build a shed type building to store materials in. The first was open on 3 sides, second was open all around. We used them as a shop to fabricate various parts of the project as well. Having a level concrete floor, lots of electricity and materials centrally located were big bonuses.


We also used them for shelter during brief thunder showers and for shade. They became kitchens and bars at the end of many of the work days.

We planned all alone to turn the shed into another use structure when the house project was completed. The first time was a garage the second was as a party/bbq spot.

The project is special and is a big deal Brettski cause like it or not you're one of us (pond boss pond meisters). I read your new LNP page - good stuff.

What are you gonna contract out and what are you going to do yourself? (Inquiring minds want to know).

Definitely the concrete flat work; I'm lousy on finishing slabs. Maybe the footings and walls too. If we elect to pour the footers and walls ourselves, we will contract the excavation work from a guy that we have worked with before. He already has all the equipment, works by the hour at a reasonable rate, and is cheaper (and more convenient) in the long haul than renting DIY excavation equipment.
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Past that, its D-ski and me against the world.

Look out, World.

Here we go again. Can you say OBSESSED?

Brettski, Be happy in your work.

Honey...I think my ground just broke...
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Not much time right now. We're in between trips to LNP and runnin' ragged. I don't know when I'll see the time to update the website, but rest assured that there was no goofin' off today.
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Just exactly how money do you have?

Brettski:

Were you the one wondering if a metal roof would conform to a radiused roof? If so, or if it's anyone eles on the forum I have some pictures of how someone in the area re-roofed their radius roofed barn.

not enough to avoid this

I posted this on the wrong thread; should have been here.
I'm seeing a PB party for 2010 in the making. I'll be bringing the Top 5 SMB lures.

Wow BSKI - you are a man with a very progressive vision. I say it's far more important to save your funds for projects like this than spending it on Costa Del Mar blades!

Since Burger is inviting, color me there too - I'll bring the top five....um, I'll supply the booze!

It's only the start, but it's on. The last 4 days have been non-stop manual labor. Dski and I are WAY beyond exhausted. I knew we were in for a ride when my excavator told me that we were not only going to cut the hole on Friday, but we were going to set the iron and pour the footing that afternoon. That day just set the pace. Donna-ski has been a dynamo. From slinging 40+ lb forms around to flipping 3/4" x 20' rebar to running the concrete stinger. Truly an amazing woman.
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Do you have to have your footings inspected before pouring the mud? Do you need a permit to build in your area? I've never seen a foundation that could pass an inspection without the inspector being able to see into the hole. Some will actually measure how deep and wide it is, but most just look and say that's fine.

Eddie

Oh yeah, a building permit and footer inspection was routine. It was an extraordinarily relaxed and low-tech procedure for both, but I'm accustomed the working with Cook county(Chicago). The difference in pressure and requirements is night and day.

It's looking great Brettski! When this is done all the hard work will be well worth it. A sincere congratulations on the ground breaking my friend.

By that statement I'm guessing that there wasn't a fat unmarked sealed envelope required for the inspector? I heard from a good friend in the business that Dolton is even worse.

The work really does look great!! As always.

Otto is up early as usual!

That's because dirt never sleeps and therefore a dirt mover must be ever vigilant.

Or he has insomnia.

Or perhaps he is up late.

Maybe, and this is merely a theory, Otto is in fact an earth moving vampire or were wolf.

Lusk said he went to bed after the news the 6 o'clock news.
No time for fair and balanced for this guy.

Dski and I left the house at 5:30 am and returned at 10:30 pm. We got the entire foundation stripped and all the forms re-loaded back onto the trailer.

WOW Bski. It's looking great!

Details of phase 1...
Drop down on the link to "Concrete Foundation"

A detailed description up to your usual journalistic standards, Bski.

Funny how excavators never seem to forget to take their good laser level with them.

Bski, WOW ! Nice job on the foundation.(and a great write-up) Take a short break.... Tom

What a job ! That is tough work. Glad no injuries were incurred.

60 tons of pea gravel, 2 days of heat-advisory level oppression, and the will of a pondmeister driven to save a few bucks.
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Ramset the expansion joint to the walls, set the bar chairs under the mesh, and we are ready to pour the garage slab.

Hey man that is looking great! You are really not gonna want to leave when you have your place finished.

Bski, great looking project and documentation (as usual).
Approx, when will it be finished?

It's gonna be a slow go. We brought in a couple of hired guns to help us with the concrete flatwork, but after that, the construction crew is D-ski and me. It will be a slow-but-steady process. We hope to have the exterior shell completed and weatherproof before the snow flies. If we are ahead of that goal, YeeHaw! If we are behind that schedule, everything is normal.

Our next trip started on Sunday. D-ski and I finished prep'ing for the first slab pour. I pitched those crummy masonry and cut nails and used a ramset to attach the 1/2" x 6" expansion joint to the exterior walls. We set a small form to preclude one small corner area from the pour. Lastly, the bar chairs are installed.

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As mentioned, I hired on 2 guys to manage the flatwork pour. It was a good decision. I enjoyed being the go-fer for once. They earned their pay.
They arrived at 8 am the following morning; the first crete truck was there before 8:30. Everybody was gone by 2.
Slab pour #1 complete.

Coming along very nicely...

Brettski,

I'm not familiar with your foundation. It reminds me of how we did it in California, but I'm not seeing all of it. Does the rebar tie into the footings? What is the spacing of the rebar? What size rebar are you using?

It's nice to see that you are using chairs. I have a pet peeve against those who don't use them and say that they just pull up the rebar to the middle after the mud is poured. I don't believe it and have seen them try to do this, but fail every time. Never will I do a slab without chairs.

Do you have a county inspector that lives close by? I'm alaways waiting around the the inspectors to show up. Sometimes it's a couple of days, and that's in the city limits!!!!

I think that I'm more impressed with how quickly you can get your inspections done and move on to the pours then I am with your progress.

Eddie

Brettski,
You are almost at the part I liked best, the framing. Everything before and after seemed soooo slow.

I helped my father in law do the framing on his house, he is a tool guy, and it was overall a breeze. He had a nail gun for every portion of the job.

The hardest part was the floor joist for the second floor. It was a lot of work and slow for two people. A third person to carry the joist and cut the blocks and backing would have helped a lot.

I must admit, I do like sitting here with a beer watching you work.

There is much more detail and pics on the LNP website; link is on my first post that kicked off this thread.

We are spending a little more $ to try to improve the 2nd floor overall. We are going to clear span the entire 28' with some substantial engineered I joists. I am hoping that this also moves things along a little quicker.

My Chumpon jobsite foreman; damn glad you're aboard, sir.

Bski, when you are planning to clear span the entire 28', remember that when they are being designed to code (L/360 or higher, hopefully) that you could have up to an inch of deflection in the entire span, and still meet code. You may want to reconsider such a long span, so that you have a stiffer floor.

Impressive use of steel. I've never even used 3/4 rebar. I'm not even sure if my supplier has it!!!! Most homes around here are done with #4 and #3, but like you, I prefer to upgrade to the next size in the footings and critical areas.

Eddie

Brettski,
You can count on me to be here, beer in hand, for as long as the job requires.

I used 20' glulam joist for a garage deck and was pleasantly surprised and the lack of trampoline effect.

I am guessing that the rebar is to support some really heavy duty toys later on?

Almost forgot, what with the responsibility of keeping an eye on your job and all, but I promised you some pictures of the 5 foot cantilevered balcony. I'll get on that first thing tomorrow.

My parents had a lot of concrete work done around their house recently. The contractor balked at the idea of using fiber reinforced concrete along with steel reinforcing, but the pours that he did using it haven't cracked yet, where the pours that he just used steel have cracked in places that weren't supposed to crack.

Brettski: If you want to keep stains off of the concrete floor, I've used Kure-n-Seal 30LV and gave the new concrete 2 coats a day apart, with the 2nd coat having a quart of shark-grip mixed into every 5 gallon container for anti-slip. My neighbor uses it (minus the shark-grip) on the floor of his trans shop and it's kept the oil from staining his floor. He re-coats it with Kure-n-seal 25LV once a year on the high traffic areas.

As it was mentioned before, if you are going to drywall the ceiling, you have to over-engineer the floor/ceiling joists to prevent the drywall ceiling from cracking when the beams deflect from the load.

The project is coming along nicely!

Thank goodness, I thought I was going to have to stand while enjoying an adult beverage.

Dang Bski, doing great work as usual. Did you know this much about construction before this started?

Thanks for the heads-up, bbjr. I'm working with a Georgia Pacific engineer. The product we will use will exceed L/480 with the planned load. I have also nix'd the hot tub and grand piano.

esshup,

Did the contractor say anything specific in regards to fiber reinforcing? Not my area of the country, but I have made my living in fiber reinforcement for the last 20 years. I always like to get info from contractor perspective.

When pressed further, he didn't like it because it needed more time/effort to finish when steel trowled so the fibers didn't show.

I worked in Ca. doing concrete repairs, and always thought of fibers in the concrete taking care of the small cosmetic cracks, and the steel taking care of the structural integrety of the pour.

I don't give a dang about the grand piano, but


NO HOT TUB???

I figured you had taken it into consideration already, but I just wanted to post in case you overlooked it while thinking about everything else. I almost did the same thing this year on my house. I needed a 28' span, and was going to go with floor trusses, but at the last minute, I calculated my deflection and couldn't stomach it.

Even at L/480, I think the defelection is somewhere around .620" when under full load. If it were my actual house, I might be inclined to reconsider. For a garage apartment, it is well beyond acceptable. Thanks again...

How far apart are the "engineered I-joists" going to be?

Are you planning on insulating the outside of the garage area? The living area space's floor above the garage? Wall between the garage and the downstairs living area?

16" o/c

If you're happy with a projected -.620" deflection, 'sawright. How much would that be cut down by adding 33% more I-joists and placing them every 12"?

(I think I'd take 0.620" deflection myself.)

Alex, gimme 'sawright for 50....

The project really looks great. Thanks for keeping us posted.

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Back to epoxy in the remaining slab dowels, spray foam touch-up on holes/cracks/seams, set rebar grid, and pour.
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I forgot the schrader valve air chuck, so I could not pressurize the system. That will be first job when we return.

Brettski:

Lookin' good! The weather is cooperating finally. For an emergency air chuck, most of the time you can just shove the quick disconnect end of the air hose over the schrader valve and it'll work.

If you ever do any Pex installations that use those copper drimp rings, I've got the crimping tool that will do 3/8" - 1".

What will be the source of hot water?

Milestone #1 surpassed
If I never see another concrete truck...
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Brettski: It is going to really really make you not want to go home when you are finished. Looking good!

Brettski:

The cement trucks ain't so bad, wait 'till you start sanding the seams on the drywall ceiling!

Looking better every day!

Good tapers don't sand (much)
(I'll wear a mask)

I would expect nothing less--- it looks great

I am amazed at good tape and bed guys. My seams can get pretty obvious. Must be poor quality material.

One thing I have noticed about good tapers and bad they spend the same amount of time sanding.

Where Jeff lives they learn their trade in prison.

I really don't have a problem with the screw holes and seams, but the corners give me fits, even using a corner tool. Luckily, the ceiling is done and now it's all walls.

A friend of a friend is in his late 40's and has white lung from sanding without a mask, and he's still drywalling.....

Brettski, when you going to start framing?

Totally undecided at this point. The room with the radiant floor heat is (kind of) planned to be a shop area, but who knows how that will play out over time. My only immediate concern was to install the Pex now to allow all options later on.

I'm oiling the Porter Cables as we speak text.

Brettski,
"install the Pex now to allow all options later on."

Great planning, might consider under grounding pipe to the main house site for electrical, commo and av later, yes I know you already have, sorry, I will shut up and sip my beer.

It's looking great Bski! Thanks for continously posting updates, it makes us all feel like part of the process (without the aching back and complaining wallet).

Oops, a snub,

I said I was sorry for not responding to your post for almost a year!

No big deal Rad, bean counters are use to being ignored, it goes with the territory.

Brettski:

I hope you have your board straightner tool! I've made sure to pick straight 2x4's and 2x6's and a day later they look like a dogs hind leg!

A couple years ago, we executed and documented a PB quality experiment on lumber selection, twist and camber potential, and secure bundle maintainance.
The results: There is a avg 25% rejection rate as a result of propellerization and camberizing. The best practice is to purchase stock that can be returned for credit and up'ing the shopping list by about 25%.

I never really put numbers to it, but now that I think about it, it sounds right. Luckily, I'm done buying lumber for a while, but I'll file it away for the next project. Lowes is the closest store, and the next time I'm in there I'll ask them about their return policy on lumber.

I woke up with wood...
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A couple days of framing by 2 middle aged ham-and-eggers. My mind is having some difficulty convincing my body.

Before long you'll have a roof! Looking good...

You should keep the window the view is beautiful!

We are using 3 day weekends to attack the framing. With the travel time to and from, combined with the time to set up and tear down, we are probably gettin in a good 2 days of production. Maybe 2.25 days....and they are very long. Both Dski and I have been reminded that the 10 years since we took on a project like this have ushered in significant and noticeable differences in our physical abilities. It's hell gettin' old(er).
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This is a feel for the downstairs shop area. The wall that will separate the garage area from the shop area will go along the control joint in the concrete that runs just behind the plastic bagged Pex tubing bundle and controls. This zone is 15' x 28' wide; 6 windows. Ewest's simple logic to put alot of glass on the pond side landed 4 windows 36" x 60" on that wall. We broke construction tradition by pushing the tops of these taller windows above the normal exterior sight line. This will put the bottoms just above a comfortable workbench height.

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At the end of the day (weekend #2 of framing), one part of me is disappointed by the progress and another part is digging the results. Since we are moving slowly, we take great pains to thwart water damage to the work already completed. We also install panels into the window cutouts on the prevailing wind side. I have to juggle the schedule a bit before we can get serious about installing windows. In the meantime, the house wrap is a good protector.

That is one incredible job you guys are doing. I love that 7-20 pic of the pond from the shop. Windows and light really help.

When its all done and you can sit and watch put a mineral block about half way between the house and the pond and enjoy watching the deer.

We are nearly overrun with deer. Funny you mention it, but when I awoke on Mon am in our tiny 120 sq ft home/shed, I stepped out the door into the crisp early morning forest air, rubbed my eyes, and took 2 steps to the corner of the building. I came eye-to-eye with a doe, maybe 35 feet away. I was still sleepy and this caught both of us a little off guard. 1/2 step more to see around the corner and 2 junior bucks were right behind her. We all went into a stare down until she snorted like a freight train and they bounded off into the woods.

Thinking along those lines, very impressive so far, Bski.

Quit whinning Bski this is only the garage, you still have a house to build in the next 10 years. Looking good...........

Looking great. Considering the plans that you have for the place, you better start hitting the gym on the 4 days that you are home to get ready for the big project! You're only as old as you feel, and I'll bet you are feeling older after every weekend!

Very nice Brettski! Looks like you build things the right way.

I would expect nothing less.
Great job!!!

Why do all my progress estimates come up short? Is it just me, or that another "guy thing"? Dski has it down to a science; she takes my time estimate and doubles it.
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End of long weekend #3. All the 1st floor framing is complete and wrapped. The last production day was a perfect example of another Bski lousy production time estimate. Started at 7:30, took 30 mins for lunch, and finally took our pond bath at 8:30 pm......then drove back home. Even my toes are tired.
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just ended the long day....finally

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Brettski:

Looking good! It's not a guy thing, it's more of a 2 person job thing. Don't feel bad, it's even worse when it's a one person thing!

Personally, I think you've accomplished a hellofalot for the time that you've spent on the project.

...oh yeah and BTW
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I've always used the plain roll of foam for sill sealer. It's a pain since it is nothing more that closed cell foam with very little backbone to hold it in place. Now, there's a new sherrif in (my) town.
I am sold on this stuff. It's a sill sealer made by Protecto Wrap. You experienced construction guys are likely well aware of it.

Since I had alot to do with finishing the top of our concrete stem walls, and the surface may have been less than perfectly consistent, I wanted to make sure I used the best sill sealer product available. That's when I discovered Protecto Wrap. For the record, I will likely be using their window seal tape, also.
Anyway, this stuff is in a roll 5-1/2" x 25' long. The closed cell foam is 3/8" thick and it has this thick, flexible, rubbery, sticky black adhesive coating on one side with a wax paper protector. Man, does it stick. When it's a little warm from the sun, keep your fingers away or you'll be pulling hard. The beauty is two fold: The seal at the top of the foundation stem wall is complete AND it stays where you put it as you roll it out. When it comes time to stand up and set the wall, and you have to pound it this way or that for alignment, the sill sealer will not move....period.
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what did you decide to use for your flooring? I have put the vinyl that looks like wood in several rooms and really do like it. It looks like wood but wears like iron and is impervious to water. The really good vinyl that comes in planks is not cheap but does not have all of the problems associated with wood.

Hey James...
The first floor will remain concrete since it is planned as a garage and workshop. We will pretty up the shop area with an epoxy paint or something similar. The jury is still out on the garage floor; TBD.
The second floor is all living space, and that is where most of my attention (and whatever remaining budget) is focused. You and I PM'd this subject a bit when you were building your castle, so you already know that I am a Woodie. Wherever possible, I prefer the real McCoy. I am right now in the midst of laying in some 800 sq ft of prefinished natural Ash Bellawood hardwood flooring at our primary residence. It is absolutely gorgeous, and at $3 per sq ft, is pretty hard to say "no" to. In my heart of hearts, I would love to have something similar in my pond garage/apt. To tell ya the truth, my ultimate goal would likely be natural hickory. Whoa!

Here is my take on the subject. We put wood on the first floor and have already had to replace one of the boards due to water damage. I still think a cabin should be as low maintenance as possible. Here is the wood floor it does look good. Here is the vinyl. The vinyl is almost indestructable. Can I change my mind later?

They have some really nice stains for concrete these days that might be a good option for your shop area sense I recall it will also be guest bed rooms for a while before it is a work shop area unless you have changed that idea. I'm not sure how well the impregnated stains hold up in a shop area compared to the thick epoxy coatings but it sure looks nice in residenial sittings. A close friend just had a 40x50 shop done in stain and had bowties cut in the main garage door openings and stained them a darker color than the rest and it looks awesome. He has a stable of classic show cars that he likes to display and doesn't do much as far as shop work so as I say not sure of the durability of the stain in a real life shop environment oils, grease, dirt etc........ The stain is easy to apply for a DIY guy like yourself might be worth considering. The color he selected is very similar to the vinyl flooring James posted above.

I think a stain would hold up if you were able to coat it with a clear sealant. Something like Kure-n-Seal maybe?

WARNING If you have installed foam insulation around the perimeter of your slab (typical for a Pex radiant heat installation), Kure-n-seal will melt it down like ice cream on a 98 degree day.

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Fortunately, we performed this test moments before we used a sprayer to apply KnS to our newly poured slab with the foam perimeter. Just as fortunate, I was mindful enough to prepare another contingent application method by bringing a paint roller to the jobsite....Justin Case. Whew!!!
Even the roller requires great care during application. Stay at least 2" + from the insulation and don't lay it on dripping wet when this close. The KnS can easily run over to the melt zone.

We used the Rust-Oleum Epoxy Shield garage coating on our shop floor. It is a two part epoxy that you mix together and then roll it onto your concrete. We put it on fairly thick and then used the "paint speckles" to liven it up. It was easy to apply and looks great. We used the grey epoxy with the blue, dark grey and white paint speckles. With new concrete you don't have any of the surface prep problems associated with old concrete. The product can be purchased at Home Depot.

Am I the only one concerned about the fact that James Holt is performing some strange medical proceedures at his cabin?

Jeff,
We used the same stuff when preparing our first (and current) living quarters. We also used the little plasic chips, but now regret it cuz it makes it difficult to spot creepy crawlies like ticks, spiders, and ants.

True Bski, but what you don't see, you don't know is there.

Well that leaves out stain as an option if it has already been sealed.

Brettski:

That's good to know! Thanks. To be honest, I think I would have found out after it melted. I like the look of the KnS rolled on vs. sprayed.

Yeah, I thought it was kinda weird that my generic 1/2" nap roller core withstood the K & S solvent just fine. I expected it to collapse, also.

We gettin' 2nd floor serious...
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I call my truss guy and lay out a plan to deliver the framing stuff for the 2nd floor. This weekend is going to be opressive heat and humidity, so I'm thinkin' it won't be conducive to high productivity. We do have a limit. With that in mind, I don't want to burn up vacation time, so I wanna keep my plans confined to Sat & Sun. My truss guy says Friday is good, but Sat is gonna be a dely premium. We work out a fair price and I tell him as early as possible on Sat so we can beat the heat. He tells me that the driver should be there about 7:45 or so. Dski and I leave Fri night and stay overnite in our spartan 10 x 12 cabin.
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I wake up with the daylight, or somewhere shortly thereafter. Because we are so deep into the woods, daylight is more like ambiant morning light. Anyway, I pop outta bed at 6:00, drag on my canvas work drawers, and step out into the humid and somewhat cool morning forest air. I'm still half asleep as I saunter over to the building site and my mind slowly shifts into think mode as I start talking to myself to decide where to have the truck roll off the 28' long I-joists and other floor framing stuff. The only sounds are me mumbling and Mother nature's bird and BF chorus. Then, way off in the distance, I hear a faint "beep, beep, beep, beep"...the kind that heavy equipment sounds when backing up. Huh? I wipe the sleep from my eyes and stand there, listening, as it stops and things get quiet....for about 1 minute. Then I can hear the unmistakeable sound of a truck coming thru the woods to our place. Jeesh; it's 6:15 and I haven't even combed my hair or brushed my teeth. Then, this full sized truck and trailer comes winding around the last turn into view. I mean this is a full sized tractor trailer. I had no idea that they would send a rig this big. My mind is doing flip flops trying to figure out how I'm going to not only get him in, but turn him back around to get out. He pulls up and stops and I look at the load on this long truck. He's got everything, including the roof trusses that I did not want yet. Crikeys; only me. I share all my concerns with him as he looks around for travel options. I ask him if that's a 40' trailer. Nope....50'. (rolleyes!) Anyway, he made this rig twist, turn, and jackknife into unbelieveable configurations and flipped it around and backed it into the last 100 feet of driveway. Incredible job of driving....absolutely incredible. To top that off, he was able to split the load and drop the roof trusses in a different area to keep me calmed down that they arrived unannounced.
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It took 1 hour and he was gone at 7:15. I woke up Dski and we started moving the stuff to storage inside the structure. We won't get into it for a few days and rain is forecasted for the next few days. Then, it will be a little bit easier to work with staged on the concrete slab. Dski tore it up. The I-joists weigh 140# each. The LVL's are 240# and 210#. I brought all kinds of contingency equipment to move the stuff, 1 pc at a time. The wheel barrow, a 2 wheeled hand cart, anything to give Donna a chance to handle the load. She shunned it all, put on her leather gloves, and told me to get my ass in gear as she hand carried each and every pc, each of us at each end. Absolutely awesome show of power. That's my girl.

Always fun to watch what you're up to. You guys are machines. Non-stop machines. You don't still still much, do you?

Any pics of the work done ?

B'ski I appreciate that let's just man up and do this. I do that myself and sometimes regret it. However a bit of wisdom for your age. A slipped disc will put you behind schedule about a year at least. Please tell D'ski I said that. Use the tools you have - that is why you have them.

Enjoying the building trip with you guys.

Not much progress from last weekend, except the last section of 1st floor framing; the column between the garage doors. We started early this morning and I had to cash it in around noon. The heat and humidity...we can take that. Add the unobstructed sun and we were toast. The next trip will be 2nd floor stuff. That's gonna be a big nut to crack.
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I see blue tarps carefully staked out!

I drive past a pile of trusses every morning on the way to work. They must have been setting there for 10 years now. They are just as gray as the concrete they were placed on. (sigh)

ditto

I third that.

Nice progress.

Was there going to be something downstairs other then open space for cars and tools? I'm confused from your earlier plans and don't remember if you are going to have bedrooms and a bathroom downstairs or not? If not, will you be freespanning the entire distance witht he second story floor?

Eddie

Coming from a guy that does this kinda stuff for a living and would likely already be working on the roof, I think you are being too kind...but thanks.

Confused from my earlier plans??? How can that be? (tongue firmly implanted in cheek).
The second floor framing will be freespanning. We worked directly with an engineer at Georgia Pacific on the entire design to achieve L/480 min for live and dead load. This will allow anything to happen in the first floor area. For right now and the foreseeable future, 2/3 of the first floor will be a large 2 stall garage and 1/3 will be separated off as a work shop/hobby area. All the living space will go upstairs. This will serve our needs well for the next 10 - 15 years, as planned.

Brettske:

With the weather such as it was, I'm amazed that you got that much done. It was brutal out there! This weekend is looking a bit better. How are you planning to get the trusses lifted in place?

Yeah, it was brutal in the midwest. The guys in Texas still think we're wimps.
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The trusses weigh: 4 pc @ 83#......28 pc @ 98#. I plan on muscle, but maintain the option of hiring in our dirt guy. He has a 30' truss pole adapted for his rubber tired backhoe.
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The real pain will be the engineered I-joists at 140# each. I hope to be able to muscle those up, too. The 240# LVL's will definitely get the boost from our wall jacks.

I know it's more $$ out of pocket, but I'm getting to the point where I'd rather spend some $$ and save my energy for the project. Just with the trusses alone, you'd be lifting about 3,000# and walking part ways up a ladder with it just to get them in place, not counting the I-joists. Would it be possible to plan ahead and get them all in place in one day if equipment was used? (Trusses and I-joists?)

If you need an extra hand, the offer still stands.

Absolutely agreed and very much on the budget radar. Placing the trusses with the joist hoist would take all of a couple of hours.

I gotta ask, is that your time estimate or Dski's?

ok...double it

and add 30.

This was more of a heavy lifting weekend.
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The engineered I-joists are 28' long and come in at 140#. They were the easy part.

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The big mamu's were the LVL beams. They were 3.5" thick x 16" tall. One was 23 ft (345#) and the other 28 ft (420#). They're not THAT heavy...until they are suspended over your head. Should be no problem for you average husband/wife construction crew.
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ALL JACKED UP
For the shorter LVL, we put the wall jacks back to work.

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The longer beam at 28' was a bit trickier. Because it is longer than the space within the wall framing, we had to jack it up until it bumped into the bottom sides of the wall top plates, shift it over through the garage door opening to allow it to continue upward on the opposing end. Then, continue jacking up only one end to elevate it high enough to clear the top of the wall, shift it about 8" laterally while on an angle at 9' high, and continue jacking up the other end to meet the first. Yeah, quite a few pucker moments as this 420# beast stood at 9' high precariously perched atop 2 pc of 2 x 4 legs. Sorry; no time for pics during the actual raising process.
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We finished on Sunday evening at dark o'clock, so no final progress pics. Only this mid Sunday progress report.

Looks like you were busy in the cool weather this weekend! I see you took Theo's +30, added it you your estimate and tripled it! It's looking good!

Years ago Dad and I made a laminated beam for the garage door at the lake, and it sagged. When I worked for that steel company, I bought an "I" beam to replace it. We used cribbing and a bottle jack to get it in place. You're right about the pucker factor once it gets up above your head!

I am glad everything went up and went up well, and STAYED up.

Putting a 420 lbs object up overhead is not a task I would recommend many people that I actually like perform. You and Dski are exceptions.

Great progress ! Need to get floor 2 up and a roof.

As always. First class!!!

Sunil could have done it single handedly.

Brettski,
Those are impressive feats, seriously speaking, they border on incredible. I would have hired a stinger, small crane, and though I had done well to accomplish what you and Dski have.

It appears that you are wearing long sleeves. Is it not hot there?

That day, it was low 90's and extreme humidity. Oppressive would be a good adjective. Dski and I both have skin issues with the sun and are VERY careful. Preparation every morning includes a thick coating of SPF 50 on all exposed surfaces, including shoulders, upper back and front torso, and arms....even though they are covered with long sleeved shirts. Top it off with the Rocket J Squirrel hats and we do a pretty good job at thwarting alot of the UV.
It is normal for me to lose 10# on a 3 day weekend in that type of weather.

It would make more sense if one of you wore the Rocky Squirrel hat and the other wore a Bullwinkle hat. It's all about balance.

Dski had a baby shower to attend on Sunday, so I let her off the hook...for one day. We worked all day Sat, but never got anywhere near what I wanted completed so I had to go back on Sunday by myself to wrap it up. Way too much driving.
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We had to stuff all the joists with the proposed mechanicals. Now is the time since it will be impossible when the end walls are corked up and completed. None of it is assembled since I really haven't decided what and where, but having it in place will allow us to tie it all together when that time does come.

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Having the Georgia Pacific engineers go over my plans to design the second floor joist framing yielded an unexpected addition to our plan. Since we used such a narrow wall at the corner (adjacent to the OH door openings), I had to add a Simpson tie strap around the corner. It runs 10 feet in each direction. It's pretty hefty and was a bear to install. Worse than that, since it is so thick, I had to route a relief behind the OSB panels that are installed to complete the outside walls. Man, what a pain.

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At the end of my solo day, we are very close to installing the 2nd floor decking. If the weather holds (and the W-man is predicting a beaut' this coming weekend), I hope to apply a 3-dayer to finish sheathing the OH door area and start pushing 4 x 8 subfloor panels uphill.

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I am really burnin' out on this phase. I need new inspiration, so getting up to the second floor should be a buzz. Also, and more importantly, the subfloor decking that will be installed is a special weather resistant product that will create a roof to protect all the work underneath. VERY important for a 2 person crew slowly working thru the process on weekends.
I stood on top of an 8' ladder. held the camera over my head, and tried to sneak a peak at what it might look like from the back end of the structure. Like I said....inspiration required.

At least the weather gave you a break from the temps this weekend. It's coming along nicely, and the view will be tremendous! Hopefully you had the clouds all weekend that were here.

Wow nice work. I am pulling for you on this one I check this thread after each weekend. Very impressive progress for a husband and wife team. I would be excited If I were you after seeing the last picture. Waking up in the morning to that view will never get old. GOOD JOB AND GOOD LUCK.

Excellent.

I appreciate those OH doors, installed just for those of us from the Buckeye state, no doubt.

Great work Brettski, and Blair said what I believe we all feel, we are all pulling for you Bman. Just be careful and stop standing on the tops of ladders.

That being said I can just picture you in the morning with a cup of coffee looking out over that pond view. It's going to be sweet.

N O - W O R D S - N E E D E D !!!





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I've been an OSHA disaster looking for a place to happen my entire life. If the tops of ladders weren't meant to be stood upon, why did they make it look so much like the other 6 tops I used to get there?

I must agree with jeff stay off the tops of those ladders.Just be careful and stop standing on the tops of ladders.

I bet he pulls the tags off of matresses too.

That's just un-American!

About 2 weeks ago a ladder got me or I got myself. I was trimming a tree at a rent house. Its limbs were on my house and a neighbors. I had both an extension and a step ladder. I finished cutting everything down in my yard and put the extension ladder and chainsaw into the neighbors yard. I got up on their house and cut back limbs that I could reach. However, there was that I couldn't get to from the top of the house. So, I went down and put the ladder at a goofy angle on the tree. I had to do it to keep the limb from falling on me. I knew I should have used the step ladder but..... I went up and cut the limb off and took a step down on the ladder. It started going sideways and my first response was to throw the saw away from me. I figure that increased my inertia heading to the ground. As I was descending I remember telling myself to not try to break the fall with my hands. I had broken my right wrist previously due to an error in judgment involving a dozer. I pulled my arms in to my chest and hit on my chest and right hand which was balled into a fist. It hurt. I laid there about 2 seconds and tried to get up. I made it to my feet on the second try but had knocked the breath out of myself. I hurt from my sternum to my backbone and figured I had broken a rib. Broken ribs are something else that errors in judgment has given me experience with. When I got my breath back I started for the gate to go home and apply ice or go to the Doc. Then I noticed 2 back yards full of limbs. I couldn't leave things that way. So, I spent about an hour slicing, dicing, bundling, tieing up and hauling to the curb. Then I went home, took a shower, and applied ice for the next 8 to 10 hours. I figured out that the ribs weren't busted because I could breathe and cough without crying. The next day I went to the Chiropractor to get ribs put back where they belonged. I've known him for 20+ years and is a pretty good guy. He asked me to give him all the details leading to my visit. A moment or so after my recitation, he started laughing. He said "Boy, I wish I had seen that". His next statement was something about his appreciation on helping to pay his daughters college tuition. My Wife got home later and didn't share his sense of humor. By now, the discoloration has almost completely disappeared and I'm only a little sore.

I have some pictures relating to this in an e-mail. Any ideas on how to get them on here?

Ouch, glad it wasn't worse.

Dave

Glad you are feeling better..
Next time call me and I will come and help..

Otto

A good friend of mine died hanging Christmas lights about ten years ago when he fell off of a ladder. It was only a one story house but he broke a rib which punctured a lung which put a blood clot in his heart. Dave you were lucky not to have been hurt worse.

Going up?

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I calculated 3 days to finish sheathing the 1st floor and installing the 2nd floor subfloor. I only missed it by 1 day. Since this 2nd floor decking is actually my temporary roof, it was critical that we completed it's installation for rain protection. As always, Dski delivered another memorable construction performance.

The view of the pond just keeps getting better.

Coming along nicely, sir! How long is that sheathing rated for exposure to the elements?

300 days

Oh heck, the real roof will be on LONG before then!

Plus one!!!

Good stuff Brettski.

I stand up there and think to myself "hmmm...what about a 1200 sq ft screen house?"

Not so good in February.

What about a Conservatory stuck on the end???

Of course then you couldn't throw stones.

Now you understand why I said "windows man windows".

Not to late to add a couple of bay windows - they add view space and are great to sit in on sunny days.

+ 3 on the view.

Just don't get spell bound while you are up there and take a wrong step. -

2 pc 2 x 6 x 16'
2 pc 2 x 6 x 20'
some screws
a hunka rope
1 panel carrier
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the 1st one is the trickiest...

Dang Brettski, you're a clever monkey.

Remember those cast iron wall jacks that I picked up off of Ebay for cheap...???

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Then, they turned into beam jacks?

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Well, we ain't done just yet...

Then there'd be a place for Col. Mustard and the lead pipe!

How would you ever clean the windows up above?

Knowing Brettski, he would clean the windows by standing on the top of a ladder.

...with a candlestick

In my neighborhood we have a service that does that, Monsoon and Monsoon. They are not perfect, but they are cheap.

I haven't used Advantech materials yet, but I'm seeing it more and more. Mostly on commercial jobs like banks that are springing up everywhere. Do you have to tape the edges to get the waterproof seal? I just installed some 3/4 T&G subflooring two days ago and it was $17 each. How thick was the Advantech and what does it cost? Usually I just buy a thing of plastic and put it over the subfloor too keep it dry. Then after putting up the walls and getting the roof on, I just cut out the plastic and leave what's left under the sill plates. It's cheap insurance and pretty common around here.

Did you use pressure treated sill plates on your walls? Going with untreated lumber lets you use standard anchor bolts, but then you risk rot or bugs ruining them. In some older homes, I've found that they really go after those sill plates and then work their way up the walls. I've repaired quite a few homes that were built without pressure treated sill plates and find it to be cheap insurance to prevent, or at least, limit the potential for this damage. Did you put down any other type of sealant or barrier under your sill plates?

Congrats on your progress. It's always interesting to see how things are done in different parts of the country.

Eddie

The lumber yard/truss mfgr that supplied the 2nd floor framing system and the roof trusses gave the Advantech as an option when they quoted the 2nd floor subfloor. I had never heard of it before, but was aware of the weather resistant products out there. I expected it to be ultra-expensive, but was pleasantly surprised when it came in at $22 sheet delivered. It is 3/4" thick, T&G on the long edge. I googled and researched it and could not find one bad story about it. Everyone seemed to rave about it. I called Advantech and talked with their tech support. It is similar to OSB, but the glue is an epoxy resin product. It is not a coating, but consistently water resistant throughout the mass. At $22 per sheet, it was a no-brainer.

Absolutely, and 3-1/2" coated deck screws to attach it to the studs.

Protecto Seal....amazing stuff!

Thank you. It is very slow and arduous, but it's the best that a couple of ham-and-eggers like Donna and I can do when we have to travel a significant distance to get to the jobsite.

Any updates ?

When we got the 2nd floor decking completed last weekend, I was really relieved. It really helps to cork up and protect all the work we did beneath it. We even made a quasi-frame, caulked, and blue-tarped the stairway opening. Then, I had to make some decisions.
The one facet that continues to weigh on all my decisions is sands in the hourglass. We are really running outta time, or so it seems. We have to get the 2nd story framed and roofed and all the siding installed before the snow flies. I know, I know...it's only the beginning of September. It still stresses me a bit, particularly when the leaves are beginning to fall, the days are shorter (this is a biggie). We will just press on.
So, one part of me wants to get moving with the framing up to the roof, but the reasonable and calculated part of me says to get the doors and windows installed on the first floor. Heck, they have to be installed before you can apply the siding anyway. Why right now? With them installed, the bottom garage area will be secure. This will allow me to store all the tools and junk that are required when we are ready to rock. You see, it takes about an hour to get everything transferred from the storage shed and set up for production every time we go to work. Then, before we leave to go home, same story. If we could just flip a couple of switches and turn a key, and leave all the stuff right inside the structure, we gain alot of time and flexibility.
So....
The decision is just that; install door and windows.
We have had the big ol' boxes with the garage doors setting in the garage at home for about 2 months. We packed them onto the trailer along with all the white vinyl trim and weatherstripping. We also hit Menards and grabbed about 80% of the windows. The plan was to install the garage doors, completely and hopefully get to installing a window or two. Yeah...right.
I've installed a few garage doors over the years. I must forget how tedious they are. They are like putting together a swingset; some assembly required. Fortunately, both the doors are identical. The second one moved along a little faster.

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Yeah, with the trim work, caulking, and building the 2 swingsets, I pretty much burned up the 3 day weekend. Jeesh, it moved so danged slow. The upside? I was outta the sun and the garage area was nice and cool. Truth be told, though, it really was more of a 2 day weekend since we got there a little late and left a little early. At least I can walk away from the garage doors knowing that they are completely done and ready for siding to run up to the brick moulding. Amen.

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Brettski,

Where did you get the protecto seal? Is it something you picked up at Menards? Hang in there you will make it before the snow flies.

It was one of those "this must be my day" kinda things....
I knew I wanted it. I called Protecto Seal and they told me that Menards carries some of their products. What they don't have, they can special order. So, I go to the Menards that is close to where I work. They look it up on the computer and the kid says that they have it in stock, but it's marked up for clearance. I'm looking over his shoulder and can see the unit price: $2.99. I told him that anything for $2.99 is not the stuff I seek....way too cheap. We go on the search in the store anyway. When we find it, it's 25' long rolls tucked back in this rack, all dusty. Best part?...they ARE marked at $2.99 for each roll. Yeah baby, gimme all of 'em.

Dang Brettski, you're really rolling along. I know that you have a way to go but you sure have come a long way already.

I love it when you happen upon a deal like that.

Vinyl window clinic
Jeesh, what a PIMA.
Whatever happened to a tube of good caulk, a handful of roofing nails, and done? In order to maintain the mfgr's warranty, the installation must be done per spec. Spec now includes religious use of sealing tape...and the only type I can find happens to be Protecto Wrap. Oddly, when I called their tech. support to make sure I fully understand installation, that's the brand they recommend. There's gotta be something passing under the table from Protecto Wrap Co to the window mfgrs (or at least to Jeld Wen). When you start adding up all the windows I have to install, we're startin' to talk miles of tape. OK, a few hundred feet. Just another Ka-ching in the receipt file.
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We got the service door installed this weekend. We also installed 8 of the 9 windows for the first floor. We could have gotten the 9th one in but the interior framing and sheathing right at that window rough opening took a pretty good dowsing of water in a rainstorm last week. We knew the subfloor installed for the 2nd floor would have leaks, but I didn't expect (or, at least I hoped) one of the areas of water penetration to be right at a wall. Anyway, the framing was soaked. That's not so bad. The OSB wall sheathing also got pretty wet. That's a little bit of a bigger deal. We're gonna allow this area to dry out before we proceed. The time saved by passing on this window was shifted to caulking some of the seams in the subfloor.
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Anyway...


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This one was taken late in the day, when the sun sets over the far end of the pond.

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This is pretty much the same shot, the following morning when the sun comes up over the trees behind us.

I know that you probably don't think so, but it's really coming along! Are you hanging (or going to) opaque visqueen or something else over the windows to keep prying eyes out when you aren't around? That is until you get the inside window coverings installed.

I'm thinkin' Cheepazz $2.99 roller shades that will probably remain installed for a long time.

Are you going to insulate the floor of the second floor?

Sounds like my kind of window covering, and in my price range to boot!

That's another one of those "hmmmm; let's make sure we have options to consider".
We have not completely ruled out polyisoanurate (icenyne) foam insulation. It would put a huge dent in the budget, but the resulting product would be absolutely awesome. That would allow us to insulate all the walls and the floor would require nothing. I'm not counting on this option, tho. If this was the actual house, I would get much more serious on a foam isulation system. That being said, this will likely wind up being a fibreglass insulation job with a plastic vapor barrier. Since I don't plan on heating the entire garage, it will dictate insulation in the second floor framing. This will also provide sound insulation. Besides, we will be required to separate the garage area from the upstairs living space with firerock, so I will have to do all of the work in that area as permanent before I cork it up.

FWIW, my crawlspace isn't insulated and I notice a lot of air being transmitted thru the floor. There is one area that is about 12 sq. ft. that is still orig tongue n groove, everything else has 3/4" T&G subfloor over it. I will be insulating the floor, but I need to replace the old galv. water pipes with Pex first.

Brettski, you two are really rolling along, looks great, I hope the fall weather is good to you.

Brettski
That is a great looking jobsite.

Brettski
This is Otto where are you????

If I had known you where not comming I would not have made the trip.---

Sorry pal, but my fiscal responsibility has been pretty much committed to another pond project this year. I hoped you would understand...

Brettski, did you dodge most of the raindrops this weekend?

We hit Menards Wed night and loaded the trailer with 2 x 6's...again. It's time to head uphill.
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There will be 2 shed dormers at each side of the 2nd floor. The structure is 44' deep and the shed dormers are 36' of it. We fab'd the entire 36' wall while it was laying flat on the subfloor, including cutting open the window openings and wrapping it with the housewrap. Much easier. The wall jacks got put back to work and up she went.

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We framed out the opposing wall.

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The rain arrived and it was time to call it quits for this weekend.

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This wall will have to wait for the next trip. I imagine we will come back with another trailer load to 2-by stock to prepare for the end wall sections. I am encouraged by the thought that those 36' shed dormer walls are the final link to installing the roof trusses.
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...one more shot for reference to the dock and launch.

Brettski,

Great view, comming along nicely. What size chairs did you use on you rebar that is above your pex?

Thank ya, dap.
We poured the slabs 5" thick. The bar chairs are 2" high. The (criss-crossed) #4 rebar added another inch of height to allow 2" of concrete above the reinforcing.

I'm runnin' as fast as I can, but it feels like I'm in slow motion...
We got the other shed dormer wall up. Then, it was time to frame in the big inspirational motivator that I have been looking forward to; the picture window wall. It came off well. For a 21' long wall section, it weighs a ton and we haven't even sheathed it yet. It will get 1/2" plywood sheathing to impart additional wracking strength. The sheathing, house wrap, and installation were planned for the last day, but Mother Nature had a different plan. The night before, at 1:30 in the morning, we were awakened in our tiny 120 sq ft temp house by the roar of the wind. Holy smokes! This was way more than I expected based on weather reports. The cold front came in with a vengeance and I had those 2 shed dormer walls (36' long/each) propped up with two 2 x 4 braces. Worse than that, the braces were on one end and in the middle. We removed the 3rd brace at the end where we had just framed the picture window wall. Into my drawers, grab the flashlight (no electricity on the sight), and out into the wind in the pitch dark to attach more support. It was a very special event. We were blessed and the walls made it thru the night. Me too.
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The next day was going to be the installation of that "oh so important" picture window wall. Yeah...right. With a high wind warning on NOAA weather and gusts up to 40 mph, we decided it might not be the best decision. Instead, we stayed low and installed the last window downstairs, the door locks on the service door, and a number of odds and ends. The wall will have to wait 'til next weekend.
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I'm so glad that you enjoy stress free weekends Brettski (that's sarcasm by the way). Dang my brotha I'm still amazed by the scope of this project.

Bski your ship is really looking good and starting to sail. Very high quality craftsmenship as usual. You thru me with that foundation. They just don't buildem like that down here in the south. If I had to go down 4ft with the outer walls I think I would have just went another 4 ft and made a basement. I guess thats why many homes in the north east have basements. We don't have frost issues down in these parts. Pier and beam foundations are constructed very similar to what you did with your slab foundation.

I bet you gonna miss putting that balcony on the front like you originally planned. Man what a view from the top.

Progress !!! You are going to love those windows. Sun , the view , the fresh clean smell with them open , much more. Did I mention lots of windows ?

Keep at it and thanks for sharing the trip. When fall gets here be sure and post a pic of the fall colors and the vivid blue sky over the water from the second story.

ewest is right, you are going to love those windows, plus they will provide a lot of motivation for the big house.

As always first class--

All these pics were taken early in the morning as the sun was coming over the trees behind the structure.
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The picture window wall is up. Installation day was pretty windy. Thankfully, the wind was blowing in from the pond side. The two 4 ft wall sections that create the gambrel portion of the roof framing were quickly attached at each end of the wall section to stabilize it.
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Three 5 ft x 5 ft sliding windows will fill out the wall section. That's gonna be a fun window installation. (rolleyes)
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We framed out the last wall section. I kept telling myself that this would be the easiest wall to install. Wrong. It was fairly simple to frame since it only carries one 3' x 5' window, but it gets complicated by the stairway opening. Complicated? Yeah, cuz we have to rip open the rain protection, install the wall, then re-install the rain protection. Sounds simple 'til ya have to do it. Man, do I want a roof on this thing.

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Dski looks up, likely wondering when we get to install those big windows.

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I shot a short vid clip. The living space on this floor is about 1100 sq ft.

Thanks ! I see color in the trees and note the sky color in the pic with D'ski. What is the ETA for the roof ?

My more recent targets had the roof installed by Halloween. Now, considering progress, I think a roof by Halloween is going to be more of a trick than a treat.

Nah, you can do it. Just wait for the week of Indian Summer and take that as a vacation!

Dski had the weekend off. She had some silly girlie thing that she committed to...a wedding. I took my hokey-pokey dancing shoes to the pond for a solo gig. Although I never really stopped, it seemed like I got nothing done.
I did load up the truck and trailer again, but this time it was predominantly plastic.
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About 4 years ago, I found 2" x 20' PVC conduit on Ebay and put 1600 ft of it in the garage at home. It is required for a large portion of the buried electric line coming in from the county road. Yessirree....I think (hope) the time is quickly approaching to bring in power.
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I finally got my excavator to come by. He is part and parcel to the electric installation since he has to take out about 20 trees of varying sizes that are just too close to the driveway for the trencher to navigate past. This weekend, tho, he will bring a truss lift and help me to move a pile of lumber to the second floor.
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B'ski I trust that you continue to keep the primary rule intact. I know you recall that " every time you go to LNP you should stop all activity and thought and take at least 15 min to enjoy and contemplate its majesty ". Trust me it will energize your soul. Acknowledge with pride that which you have built but be in awe of the splendor of that which is being built all around you by the master builder.

Wise words Eric. It is easy to get caught up in projects because of a time crunch and forget to take a moment to remember why you own the property in the first place.

It sounds all mushy but I worry about you Brettski. Please be careful when you're at LNP. I'll deny these words if you ever try to quote me. After all it could be a rogue moderator that edited this post.

Furthermore, I'd like to point out that the myth that the tax code is complicated was formulated by the International Accountant's Conspiracy to sustain our workloads. It's really so simple, anyone could do their own taxes in about 10 minutes.

Taxes in ten minutes--tell me more

Wow, we're really slipping mentally. We don't recall ever thinking that let alone writing it.

We think the barriers that separate our various personalities is weakening. Normally we do a good job of keeping to their own neighborhoods but lately we have been exploring each other's neighborhoods.

Stanley, the one that prepares taxes, is a mild tempered, well spoken, analytical type that avoids confrontation and won't look you in the eye when you speak to him. Although a nice guy, Stanley is not someone you would hang out with. He is somewhat devoid of humor and tends to over think things. Fortunately he is a good bean counter and earns the living for the rest of us. Most of our clients know Stanley.

Most of you know Rodney, and you commonly refer to him as JHAP. He's funny, relatively quick witted and very easy going. Most people like Rodney, the ladies see him as non-threatening, the guys trust him and enjoy having him around. He's affectionate, quick to laugh and an all around good guy. Most of the posts on this site are written by Rodney.

And then there's Mick. Mick is the one that is the primary force behind the GSA, is quick tempered and foul mouthed. Mick use to love the martial arts tournaments, there was nothing he liked better than watching opponents bleed. Mick is dark and brooding and ironically speaks with a Brooklyn accent. Mick appears and disappears in an instant. Sometimes only detected by a darkness that flashes across the eyes of either Stanley or Rodney. Mick was the dominant personality in our youth and now appears less often, but when he does he is more vicious than he use to be. Lately Mick has been into guns. All of our run ins with the law have been because of Mick. Mick would rather cut you than shake your hand.

We suspect that someone is messing with Rodney's posts but we can't prove it. If we do find out who it is you better hope that that Mick doesn't find you. He's drawing pictures of torturing you. He hates you. He hates you bad.

Scarey.

to quote a wise dirt mover, "just how much money do you have, Brettski?"

We nix'd the third floor and decided to start working on a roof.
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It has been an incredibly difficult summer for both of us. We latch onto whatever bit of inspiration we can find.
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Color me inspired...and I needed a shot of that beautiful view. Jeezo Bski, I can't believe the scope of your projects...truly top notch. You're lucky you don't live closer to me or I'd be begging for you to lend your vision every weekend at my place....

I hope all is well!

That beauty is taking shape.

For inspiration we used to sit on the front porch or the back deck at the end of the day with a good cigar and a glass of brandy, pretending we wondered what the poor people were doing.

We didn't smoke so I think the brandy and cigars were symbols of our success.

That, Sir, is a great view.

You saved the spot with a better one for the big house, right?

THAT LOOKS GREAT--KEEP UP THE GREAT WORK--DO NOT GET DOWN ON YOURSELF OR YOUR WIFE-

Keep in mind IT IS ALWAYS HARD UNTIL IT GETS EASY.

The good news is that you will have years to enjoy LNP. A couple of years from now you and Donnaski will be having your morning coffee looking out over your pond and realize that this is entire property was transformed by your vision and hard work. Pretty amazing when you stop and think about it.

I agree and point out you will also realize that both you guys and LNP were transformed by a higher vision.

It always darkest just before dawn , but when that first clear and transforming light arrives you know all is right in the world. See it in your pic!

I think the Three Stooges said that.

The darkest hour is just before the dawn

Meaning
There is hope, even in the worst of circumstances.

Origin
This is one of those improving proverbs that are the stock in trade of the contemporary glut of self-help manuals and talking therapies. The darkest hour has long been used figuratively to mean 'the lowest ebb' and there are many such examples of it in print dating from the late 1700s.

The English theologian and historian Thomas Fuller appears to be the first person to commit the notion that 'the darkest hour is just before the dawn' to print. His religious travelogue A Pisgah-Sight Of Palestine And The Confines Thereof, 1650, contains this view:
It is always darkest just before the Day dawneth.
The source of the proverb isn't known. It may be Fuller himself, or he may have been recording a piece of folk wisdom.

In 1858, much later than Fuller of course, Samuel Lover attributed the notion to the Irish, in Songs and Ballads:
There is a beautiful saying amongst the Irish peasantry to inspire hope under adverse circumstances:- "Remember," they say, "that the darkest hour of all. is the hour before day.”

http://www.phrases.org.uk/meanings/darkest-hour.html

Okay.

What Curly said was "It's always darkest, just before you turn on the lights."

Brettski:

I saw a close-up of the building on the Asial Ladybug thread and noticed that you haven't taped the overlapping seams on the housewrap. I was under the impression that all seams were supposed to be taped for a good vapor barrier. What am I missing?

You're not missin' a thing...and neither are we.
I have worked with Tyvek, Typar, Owens Corning housewrap, and now Gorilla wrap. After a couple of jobs, I have found that the tape is not only WAY over-priced, but largely not much assistance in the big picture. IMO, it is a money-making add-on for the building products manufacturers and distributors. If you examine a tape job after a couple of years of freeze/thaw, you will find that the perfect seal that occurred when you applied it is now not so perfect. If housewrap is applied correctly, the overlaps will shed the water without any further assistance. If one believes that applying tape will help to seal out air infiltration, have them explain what's going on along the bottom edge at the foundation and where the siding stops.

True. I got a great deal on the tape, so it was used. I wonder what it's shelf life is, because I still have some rolls left over and it'll bbe a few years before the pole barn gets started.

Sample #1 for colors/finishes

White downspouts? Reds and blues fade the quickest........

I like it tho!

I am terrible with color selection. There, I said it.
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Like all things in selection, we have to narrow the field. We know that the garage doors are going to be white (already installed anyway). All the windows are white vinyl, so I plan on using white PVC trim around all the windows to make them "pop"...and...the PVC will be maint-free. The soffits will follow suit: white.
We know that we will be using the LP Smartside prefinished siding. They offer standard and premium colors. They can also mix any custom color (only in a solid color), but there is a significant upcharge. We don't see the need for straying beyond their standard and premium colors:


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I am still uncertain as to who I am going to go to for the standing seam metal roofing. Menards is my only experience from some smaller projects, but they are not necessarily the best choice. They do, tho, offer one of the best varieties of color...so we will use them to consider roofing colors:

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Narrowing the field further on the siding, we like:
Seal (solid standard color)
French gray (solid standard color)
Mahogany (premium color)
(we don't have an actual color sample for Maple or Redwood, but it's on the way from the mfgr. I am actually counting on Maple to be "the one"...we'll see)

We have pretty much nix'd cedar as being too "orangey", but could be convinced otherwise given the correct corresponding color combo. Their use of names is unfair. When I hear mahogany, I think of dark brown and get turned off. When I see the sample, I like it.
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We want to remember a couple of key factors:

• it should blend with the surroundings and compliment; not stand out
• it will someday be the secondary building to a much nicer house structure; it should not dominate the 2
• but...since the "much nicer house" is many years down the road, we want to be able to enjoy it right now for what it is by itself

Regarding the roof...
I really want to avoid having the standard "emerald green roof" that is plastered all over the countryside on the majority of buildings. I suppose, tho, that there is a reason. It works well with alot of the siding options. Actually, we really wanted to try and work the burgundy, but it is awkward with the siding colors we like. The sample house I provided in a couple of posts above is my best creation with a design program to duplicate: Mahogany color siding with the Emerald green roof.
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(also, and this creates havoc with color assistance, different monitors create a myriad of differing shades. For instance, the house color model I created was done on a different PC. I used the actual 6" square color sample I picked up from a vendor and matched it to the PC screen custom color creator. Now, it looks different/darker on this PC)

Simple and basic. Grays , and darker greens go well with white trim. I would want to see the material in the outside light first. I like the " blend with the surroundings " idea best of all.

well bski, since you were so helpful helping us select our colors , this is what i will recommend for you:





did i mention we had a blue roof?

at first, i dont know, i wanted green....., now i actually kind a like it....

those pics really dont show the house color well i need to take some new ones for that, but suffice it to say they bright happy colors that surprisingly blend well w/ our landscape.

that may be your biggest decision....blend or standout?

edit post......this pic actually shows how a blue roof can blend in......at least i think so,

u r the man!

Brettski,

I know you do allot of research and from what I've ready, you've researched everything that you have in this house pretty thouroghly. Why are you using Smartside Siding? Is it a budget consideration?

Eddie

Are 4 ibuprofens the same as 1 Motrin 800...?
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Truss day was a killer. (this pic was taken the following day)

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We used folding truss spacers. The best $40 I have spent so far.

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Tuesday was rain day, but we donned the rain gear and pushed forward. We spent the day making sure all the trusses installed yesterday were plumb, square, and perfectly aligned. This was helped by a couple more rows of truss spacers and adjusting the strongbacks used at both gable ends. Then, to wind down a lousy day, we installed the diagonal bracing at the tops of the trusses to lock down the work.
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A couple of parting shots; time to go back home.
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My original plan was cementitious siding; Hardy board or similar. During research, I bumped into the LP Smartside product and was sold. It carries the same 50 year warranty. It is produced similarly to the advantech subfloor by use of a controlled OSB substrate mixed with a polymer resin type bonding glue. It is considerably lighter to handle. It cuts and works with all the basic carpentry tools (no cement dust or special blades). It has the same surface texture as the cement board. It comes in 16' lengths (as opposed to the 12' cement board; less seams). It can take much more impact than cement board.

It's a tough decision cuz I haven't worked with either one of them, but unless somebody can tell me differently from experience, the LP product seems to be superior to cement board.

Here, Hardi and Certanteed sided homes will appraise just below brick. Smartside will appraise the same as T1-11, and other wood siding type products.

You are correct about it being lighter and that you can work it with regular wood tools. It's OSB, so it cuts and works exactly like OSB. The finish looks nice at first. Might even say that it's very hard to tell from Hardi or Certanteed. The problems are in wear. Being OSB, it is susuptable to the same issues that happen to OSB. The edges expand and come apart.

I've only seen it used a few times and thought it looked nice. The guys who installed it, liked how easy it was, but joked about how they would never use it in their homes. One guy told me that he used it because Hardi causes cancer. He's a nut, and while he can frame a house, he's smoked too much ganja in his life and I tend to nod my head when I talk to him and ignore what he has to say.

Hardi cuts real easy with a proper blade. It nails on real easy with a coil nail gun, and it paint real good. I've done a 2,2000 sq ft homes by myself, so it's easy to install.

Before buying it, I'd go talk to some builders in your area and see who has used both. Get some first hand opinions and then decide if you want to stick with Smartsiding.

Eddie

we did our house in certainteed lap, and like eddie says, it takes paint unbelievably well. it does not shrink or swell so any pre-paint caulking stays tight also. the guys who i had install it said it was the only product they'd use on their houses. the one issue i observed is you have to take care in nailing, get too close to edges and it does crack. our house is ~2500 ft, and i dont think they used more than half a dozen or so blades.

Yep. Single physically hardest thing I've ever done was placing a truss.

But, hey, they're up.

Interesting post, Eddie. Thanks.

This would be a main concern...for obvious reasons. I was under the impression that it was manufactured with the same impervious glues that Advantech uses. No?

Different climates, different types of homes and I'm sure quality of builders will all come up with different results. When Hardi first came out, there was allot of resistance to it. I for one refused to use it and only wanted cedar or PT wood. Obviously, I've changed my mind on it and now consider it the very best product available for what it is. Rock and brick are still better, but Hardi is cheaper to buy, cheaper to install and it looks great. For mid range homes, out buildings, additions and accent, it's the best product out there.

The question you have to deal with is how well with the smartside hold up, and to what degree of maintenance are you willing to put into it for the cost savings of using it instead of Hardi?

For the amount of money that you will be spendng on siding, it's worth a few hours time to go talk to some builders and suppliers which is better and why it's better. Reading what the manufacturer says is a good start, but in reality, they are only going to write what some marketing expert has come up with to sell the product. Reality and marketing are often two differnt things.

Good luck,
Eddie

Great progress B'ski. Back on schedule for the roof?

Yes and no....I think.
The original plan hope was a roof in time for trick or treat. Now, the goal is turkey day.
We now schedule according to major holidays.

Just like back in elementary school! (Remember classroom calenders with cartoon holiday pictures?)

Wow another weekend of fantastic progress, in the rain no less!

We are oh so close to being completed with the rough framing. Besides 4 small wall sections in the four corners of the upstairs, we are pretty much set to begin laying in the roof sheathing.
The fly rafters were a special treat to install. We managed to do so from the inside. They overhang by 2 feet, so there were some seat-of-the-pants acrobatic events. They're done, and turned out great.
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I am dying to get the windows installed throughout the 2nd floor, but I gotta keep my eye on the roof prize for now.

Wow, looking great, Brettski! It's been fun watching your progress and it seems as if the pace of your progress has absolutely increased exponentially in the past few weeks. Good luck in getting it nailed down prior to winter setting in - looks like your odds are pretty good!

GO BRET GO

Very impressive. You're framing skills are excellent. Some of those cuts are pretty complicated, and it looks like you got them in perfectly.

Are you going to put soffits in? I wont matter on the side, bump out that you have, but I'm curious how you will vent the attic. It's going to be fun on the ladder doing it, or will you rent a lift?

I'm also wondering how you will get the decking up ther on the roof. I pretty much avoid doing two story work like that, but have a few times and hate it. If you have to do it by hand, it's a royal pain.

Are you installing the shingls yourself? Again, getting those bundles up there is the hard part. If you are doing it yourself, pay the extra to have them deliverd to the roof top. Cheap money when you have to haul them up on a ladder!!!

Eddie

I have always worked material up from the first floor through the trusses in those situations.

It's always good to have a two-story ladder placed on the outside before you put the last sheet down.

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Brettski, I hope you have a good set of magnets for your boots! Those metal roofs might get a bit slippery with the water/snow. Are you going to install any of those little dams that prevent the snow and ice from sliding off the metal roofs?

I have a continuous ridge vent on the house here, and I was amazed at how much heat came out of the attic when I put in gable vents. It lowered the upstairs temp by a good 5* during the summer.

Oh yeah....and a couple more details related thereof.
I did cheat a little bit on the shorter rafter tails at the shed dormers. Knowing that I had to cut over 50 of them, I laid out some Rube Goldberg jigs in the basement at home and used the radial arm and band saws to run them production style. I took the completed set to the job in the back of the truck.

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This one might have proved out to be the most valuable.
I can use, and understand, the rafter square for rafter layouts, but it's a process for me. Instead, I searched the www to find a rafter program. Of course, it had to be a freebie, so my search results were very limited in scope and ability. Then I found easyrafters.com They offer a 30 day n/c trial, and you do not have to give up a credit card. It was the only program that I could find that was not only free (somewhat), but comprehensive in it's ability to do just about any type of roof (including gambrel) and was relatively easy to use and understand.
If I were a carpenter and I was going to be doing more than 1 roof, I would pay this guy for this program. It rocks.

I think you might convince Moe or Curly to get up on a wet metal roof, but even I have a few more marbles than that. Right, Theo?
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I have found that the painted metal roofs are completely free of any manufacturing oils. Heck, they better be....they're finish coat is paint. Anyway, the key is a good pair of rubbery tennies and a damp towel at the base of the ladder to wipe the dust off the shoe bottoms.

In So. Cal. I helped a guy put on tile roofs for some side $$. We left a job in Lakeside because it was drizzling and we weren't exactly comfortable up on the roof, considering it was a 2-story built into the side of a hill. We finished papering the roof and got the heck out of there. The next day we climbed up on the roof seeing that the roofing supply co. loaded the roof for us. We saw a perfect set of "ski" tracks going right off the roof on the downhill side. It turns out that one of the guys loading the roof thought he could get by with the worn tennis shoes. The dampness combined with the slightly sandy paper = a good ski slope. He landed in the soft dirt on his feet not 5' away from the pile of scrap lumber. When we saw him, he had new shoes on! The ground was soft enough so he wasn't hurt except for all the crap that he had to take from the other workers!

Reminds me of my Dad, he was an engineer, we used to joke with him that his motto was measure seven times cut once.

It's not the quantity of marbles that causes Theo and I concern Brettski.

the size...?

... or is it their density ? -

WR

While their size and density is also an area for concern, it is more along the lines of the lack of physical attachment to anything.

How in the world did I ever begin talking about Brettski's marbles?

dunno, but please stay clear of the marble bag

Once again I must say great job!

Dry me in!
We spent this weekend concentrating on drying in one half of the roof. I can thank Rockytopper for recommending the 5/8" plywood for the roof sheathing. We trailered in 64 sheets to do the job. No biggie, until it comes time to put 'em where they belong.

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We ran outta time and never got the lower corner roof sections decked. I had enough daylight left to lay in a couple of sheets of felt paper over the corner section that is over the stairway opening....trying to keep out as much rain as possible.
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One final shot at dusk....time to go back home (again)

Dude, you're gonna be enclosed in no time. It's all being out of the wind and rain and snow after that.

You are in the exterior home stretch now. It’s good to have a roof over your head.

Cleanest jobsite I have ever seen, Brettski. You two are doing a great job. If we lived closer we would be over there swinging hammers with you. Thanks for sharing.

Hopefully you are stopping often to take a good look over the lake and all you have helped create.

Nice garage. You guys really are my heros.

This project has become the highlight of my Mondays and Tuesdays (of course that could also be a commentary on my lack of a life). Dang Brettski I can't believe how much you get accomplished each weekend!

"Dang Brettski I can't believe how much you get accomplished each weekend!"

I will second that. I am looking forward to seeing what kind of vehicle will go into such a beautiful garage!

Haven't seen the Datsun name in quite a while.....

You could prolly fit about 4 of those in there, Bski.

We went thru 55 sheets of 5/8" plywood to sheath both sides of the top roof section and the shorter roof below the shed dormers. Oy!

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The rain held off only long enough to just finish taping in the seam below the shed dormer, where it meets the roof.

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Then, we dodged the raindrops and shifted gears to prepare for a new player on the team.

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We're pulling in 400 amps underground, about 2000 ft m/l (I will get the final tally very soon when the power company sends me the pre-payment invoice). Can't wait.

Whoo Hoo! No more generator!! It started raining before first light here. I was able to install the 10 windows on the back porch between the raindrops. Finally, no more visqueen for the winter!! Each window is roughly 48" x 48".

You'll have it buttoned up before winter for sure.

Why so much power? 400 amps is quite a bit of power, and with everything that you've said about energy efficiency, and the size of the home, I'm curious why the extra expense?

Eddie

It was one of those no-brainers suggested by the power company field tech that has been working with me for the past 5 years as we moved toward this point.
Since we plan to have another major structure on the building site (well off into the future), good planning would include plenty of power....just in case. We discussed 2 services at 200 amps each, but that would require 2 electric bills every month. Since I don't need to put each structure on it's own meter, he suggested just putting in one service with 400 amps. The upcharge to do so is $225 at the time of installation. After that, the monthly service fee is the same as any other 200 amp residential power feed. That's why Dski and I put in the 200 amp disconnect right next to the meter box we installed. The meter base has 2 sets of lugs: one will go thru the wall to the panel for the gar/apt, and the other set will go to the disconnect and terminate, waiting for the day that we can tap it and run it over to the next structure.
Good insurance for $225.

Finish the roof then .... ?

Not yet...
That last pic above is as far as we have gotten. We have the 4 corners to sheath and paper along with some other nippin' and tuckin'. The metal roofing is ordered and planned to be a high iron substitute for the Thanksgiving turkey.

I never liked turkey anyway.

[/quote]... waiting for the day that we can tap it and run it over to the next structure.
Good insurance for $225. [/quote]

Yes, very smart move and good planning.

Eddie

What are you going to do while you wait on the roof or next after the roof ?

install the upstairs windows, then siding.
I'm hoping the snowmobile will pull the trailer full of siding.

How many square of siding? The way this winter is starting out, I think you'll be relatively snow free 'till January.

The short days are killin' me for productivity; 10# of nails in a 5# sack. It is dark o'clock at 5:00 (at both ends of the day). We get up every day (that we stay overnight) at 5 am just to squeeze out every minute of each day.
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We got the load of metal roofing to the jobsite.

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We got all 4 corners of the lower gambrel roof sheathed and dried-in. We also filled in the small interior wall sections at all 4 corners. We are darned close to being buttoned up, save the gable peaks at both ends.

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I only had enough time for house pics after the sun goes to bed, so the camera flash was working overtime.

Oh, and btw...
The power company guru stopped by on Monday. He had his boring contractor with him, sizing up the power installation run. He sounded pretty confident that they were gonna start trenching this week. Wahoo!

Trust me, you're doing great.

I agree with Theo. Once you get power then there are no time limits - you will then be 5 lbs of nails in a 20 lb sack.

the devil's in the details...
Wow, more newfound respect. This time it's for sheet metal workers.
The easy part is laying in the metal panels. Once it's laid out squarely, we found a rhythm and rocked. Constantly moving the ladders sucked, but it's the price for admission. I really thought we would surely get both lower roof sections knocked out this weekend. Then...the trim. Man, does that go slow. Not doing this kinda stuff on a regular basis didn't help. Nip...tuck...snip...screw. Jeesh, it definitely qualifies as "right when I'm good at it, I'll be done".
Anyway, we got one lower roof section completely done and started laying in the roof panels on the opposite side when the rain arrived on Sunday. If we can get 2 decent days, we should have the other lower roof completed. Strangely, the upper roof (which is by far the most real estate) will probably go fast since it's all panels and very little custom trim cutting. Yeah....right.
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Oh yeah, we finally succumbed to selecting the dark green. It's the only color that worked for us, particularly since it was important to have it blend in with the surroundings.
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What color siding to go with the green roof ?

We are still wrestling with the entire siding decision, but if nothing completely turns my direction, it will be prefinished Maple, with the corners and frieze boards in "accent" maple.

Don't discount the paisley.

If you decide on paint I vote match the dock. If you want a different color repaint the dock to match the barn. Looking good Bski.

The maple would look awesome with that roof.

Ask your Wife which color she likes the best.

Dave very very wise advise.

The boss picked out the color combo and (begrudgingly) approved the funding.
There were 11 instances this past weekend when she wanted to shoot me for not paying somebody to put the roof on.
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I got a good boss...

Hey, you've got a weekend to go, right?

yeah....to finish the lower gambrel roof sections. Then it's up to the big chunk. The big chunk should go quicker, tho, since I can do most all of it while standing/walking on it.

It's looking really good! They are calling for snow starting this weekend here......... I guess Winter is finally here.

Only 11 times? I'd say you planned this project out pretty doggone well!

A tip on installing metal roofing.

Over the distance of the roof, it's real easy to get out of alignement. Just a small amount near the beginning can lead to a big problem by the end of the run.

I make sure the first panel is dead plumb and aligned exactly where it needs to go. Put a tape on the oposite end of the wall and measure that panel to and bottom. Make extra sure it's right.

Then every other panel, measure it top and bottom from that first one. You can put one screw in to hold it in place, but don't put an more then that until you have it right.

Eddie

I would add that alignment to the eaves is preferred over alignment to the rake.
Since we did the actual construction of the framing and sheathing, I know how square it is. We took great care in keeping the eave line true. Knowing this, we used the Pythagorean theorem to square the first panel to the eave line. The results have been rewarding.

When working shingles over felt paper, we always marked out placements and alignments with yellow kiel (plumber's crayon) to help get things in the right places. Perhaps that would help with metal as well.

Brettski:

Were you able to get it closed up (roof finished) before the storm hit this week?

Fortunately, the wind direction will blow the felt paper away from the pond. Unfortunately, I will probably have a mess to deal with.
The lower gambrel roof sections are finito. The upper are likely becoming naked CDX plywood right now.

I thought one side of the upper was done.

Naked AND slippery!

don't remind me
we're goin' back there this Sat a.m. (again). I will have alternate contingency plans for production. I'm doin' a pretty good job at stress control. I operate with the "it is what it is" state of mind.

I really like this. I have a house design quite similar. Different roof lines and profile but about the same.

One thing I am considering is an elevator, for Mom and Dad, plus me, when things start to go down hill.

A weekend of blessings...
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Unbelieveable from our viewpoint.
Last week (during our absence), we had severe winds for a couple of days in a row. Based on local weather stations, the pond project was seeing sustained winds around 25 - 30 mph and gusts upwards of 50 mph. The only protection we had on the top roof sections was 30# felt paper. Yeah, I used alot of button cap nails. In fact, last weekend (2 days before the predicted wind party), I knew the gusty forecast and put in a mess of staples along the lower edges of every row of the felt paper. It was my last ditch effort to save what was certain to be a lost cause.
Before we left to go back this past Saturday (early) morning, I packed 3 more rolls of felt paper along with another big box of plastic cap nails. I knew we would be doing some repairs. In my mind, I hoped that only one side might be destroyed; the side exposed to the prevailing winds.
As we entered the gate and started the trek thru the woods to the pondsite, my stomach started doing flip-flops. When we arrived at the jobsite/pondsite, we were shocked.
Nothing...absolutely nothing. That is to say, nothing happened. The entire roof was still black. I unpacked our stuff and went thru the routine of making camp, then headed over to the apt/garage, all the time looking up and muttering to myself "I don't believe it". I just knew that it had to be the other side...the side that got pounded. I walked around and found the same "nothing". Totally black. Ultimately, after we got into production gear and I was able to get up on the roof, it was absolutely unscathed. Not even a rip. Unreal.
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So....
We got to work. I pulled a jetline from one gable peak to the other gable peak, tapped in 3 nails in a large right-triangle, and used my favorite Pythagorean theorum to set the first panel on each roof section. Let's rock.
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Oh yeah, the next blessing...
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So, how are we gonna get those panels up to the roof? I had 3 or 4 contingent plans, most using designs by Rube Goldberg. In the end, it was Donna-ski that stepped up and knocked it outta the park. We stood there (in the 25 degrees and breezy wind) and discussed my crazy options. She finally told me to put up the ladder and get my arse on the roof. Huh? Yeah; one ladder for me and one for her. "And just exactly how do you plan to get them up there?" She told me not to worry about that; just worry about installing them. Ooo boy...I'm a little uneasy...but I gather my stuff and hit the roof.
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She carried each one of 78 roof panels, one at a time, up the ladder under her arm. One arm held the panel at the center like a tight rope pole and the other arm held onto the ladder as she climbed. Folks, let me tell ya. It was over the top impressive. Wind? Sho nuff! She would stop, just like a Flying Walenda, and pull the panel tighter until the wind died off enough to continue her climb. At the top, she would spin the panel like a big airplane prop until it was nearly vertical and I could grab it. I should mention that 58 of these panels are just short of 16 feet long. An absolute show of perserverence, strength, and agility. I am one lucky hombre.
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We spent all day Saturday setting panels and got about 1/3 of the roof done. Saturday night was rain. Sunday morning too, but that was OK cuz I needed to spend time wiring the electric service at the meter. The secound half of Sunday was back up to the roof. All day Monday on the roof yielded a nice final result.
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...and the next blessing
This is the one that really counts. It reminds me to never forget that there IS a higher authority that calls the shots.
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I have spent many, many hours on that roof. I always talk to myself to review all the rules and methods of production to maintain safety. I work without a net, so focus is critical. The roof slope on top is 5-1/2:12. For those unfamiliar, 12:12 is 45 degrees. Our slope is barely less than 1/2 that. It's not unmanageable for walking, but anything steeper than 6:12 begins to get dicey for walking on. I take great care to make sure my tennies are clean and wiped. I watch how I walk cuz tripping is only done by dead men. There are a couple dozen stupid, tiny mistakes that one can make that would mean virtually nothing on terra firma...but...do it up there and it's 911.
Our roof, at the peak, is about 24 feet tall. At the edge (at the shed dormers), I don't remember the exact numbers, but it's around 18 feet tall, give or take. Add in the ground slope and, well, you know.
This last day it has been cloudy and windy all day. There is a front that is due in sometime this afternoon. It's late in the day, we're both pretty tired, and I'm at the peak with the ridge cap trim. My squeaky clean tennie bottoms are gripping this painted metal roofing like the human fly and I feel confident...at least for awhile. Within seconds, I look down and can see tiny mist droplet, no bigger than the pointy side of a pin. So few, that I can recall seeing the spaces between them. I decide it's time to call it a day and pack it in. One step and my foot slides...my other foot slides...and I'm going down! Both feet kick out downhill and I get ready for the 16 foot slide followed by the 20 foot fall. Instictively, I reach up and somehow...somehow manage to get a couple of fingers over the top of the ridge piece that is installed with about 1/2 the necessary screws. I stopped, pulled me self up, and sat down on the ridge. My heart is about to blow outta my chest. Dski peers up from the top of ladder and asks what just happened. I excitedly explained. Now it's misting a bit harder and I'm slipping into panic mode. I've gotta negotiate 16 feet of slick roof and still somehow get onto a ladder that is set at the most precarious angle. I test my traction: none. It's like wearing roller skates. Once I leave the peak, I have nothing left to stop me except my shoes. I take off my shoes and socks to see if my bare feet are any help. Nada. I try wiping the roof with my socks, but it doesn't seem to help. Aw, jeesh...the wind is kicking up, the low gray clouds are rolling over the tops of the trees, and I can't think.
Dski tries to calm me down, and says she has an idea. She gets a 6 foot straight edge ruler and a clump of paper towels. She climbs to the very top of the ladder and leans up the roof. She pushes the paper towels with the straight edge. I hook one hand over the peak of the roof and reach down with one leg/foot and put a toe on the clump of paper towels. I scooch back up to the peak and prepare my descent.
I start by making sure my gym shoes are dry on the bottoms by using the paper towel clump. Then, I put the clump under one foot and use my foot to wipe the panel off and set the other foot onto the dry spot. It sticks pretty good. OK, it's time. I have to let go of the peak and take my chances. Now my heart is racing. If I get one little slip on the way down, I won't stop until I hit gravel. Oddly, this is when the blessing becomes apparent. I duly note that the misting has halted and the breezy, cold winds are helping to dry the areas that I foot-wipe. One foot length at a time, switching the wad of paper towels back and forth between feet, I somehow manange to get to the roof edge. The transition to the ladder was death defying, too, but I finally made it down. Visibly shaken? Yeah...my hands were shaking and I'm sure my face was white as a ghost.
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We both said an extra prayer of thanks over dinner when we got home.

Brettski:

Thank GOD everything came out O.K. I'd of hated to haveta make an unplanned trip to the city.

The place looks better and better every weekend. Are you planning on putting any snow stops on the roof over any areas that you'd be walking under during the winter? I don't know if that's the correct terminology for them, they're the "L" shaped pieces that are put on the steel roof to keep snow/ice from sliding off the roof in critical places.

All that's left is to get the 2nd floor buttoned up for the winter? Then it's to concentrate on the electricity?

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A simple safety line would have been wise !

Looks great. You could easily make this into a novel. Brettski Beats the Odds.

So what is the plan of attack going forward?

Ewest:

I thought of that as well, but until this morning, couldn't figure out what he could tie it off to. Then I realized he could have pulled the truck to the other side of the building and tied the safety line to the hitch, up and over the peak.

I'll bet that put a couple of grey hairs on him!

How come it sounds so easy when it's in text?
I have 11 windows to install, the exterior sheathing at both gable peaks, and.....
(see the next post)

I gotta go up on the roof and finish the rake trim and vented ridge cap. (arrgggh)

(text corrected)

Don't tell me you're pulling your hair out while you sleep!?

Dang Brettski, I could just feel the adrenaline rush just reading that. Sometimes we get lucky, some times not. Figure out some safety ropes please.

That being said, once again I marvel at your progress Bski. I think we both chose excellent spouses!

Since you gotta be working up high for a while yet, don't forget those aluminum ladders get pretty slippery with any ice or snow....

Maybe you could rig some sort of pully system or anchor off of the gable end that you could tie the safety line to before you get the siding on the outside of the house? Then take it down when you put up the last piece of siding.

Regarding safety lines, take a look at some of the safety harnesses or vests that they have for deer hunters that hunt out of a treestand. There have been injuries caused by falling with just a safety belt.

POWER TO THE PONDMEISTER
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7200 volts, some 2000-plus feet underground thru 2" conduit

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to a transformer located about 75 feet from the structure

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400 amps run thru a trench from the transformer, soon to be hooked into my Saturday morning project of wiring the meter box and auxilliary disconnect

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and thru the wall to the breaker panel. "Oh look, Dski...our first little circuit at LNP. Cute little bugger, ain't it? That 5 year gestation period musta been a killer!"

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(edit; many thanks to bbjr for critical electrical engineering guidance)

My first thoughts were thank goodness he choice standing seam. Those screw heads can ouch on the way down.

RockyT...always able to find the silver lining

Very impressive.

Did you use copper or aluminum? If you used aluminum, be sure to coat the ends with an anti oxident.

Eddie

That is a good heart pumping story. I especially liked the happy ending.

Lookin' great Brettski.

A wet 3/12 metal roof is bad enough. You didn't even have any fastener heads to walk on!

We went to the job this weekend with the hopes that I could get back up on the roof to finish trimming it out. I am very concerned to get the ridge cap on, gable to gable. We were only able to install 20 ft of the total 48 ft on our last attempt. In the meantime, any water that hits the roof at the peak can/will seep down behind the metal panels. In the short term, I don't think this will be a huge issue, but I still want it corked up.
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Upon arriving, it was snow flurries as expected and forecasted. It never stopped all weekend. All roof activities were officially cancelled.
That's not all bad cuz the alternate project is also a huge step of progress.
We brought the truck, packed with 150 feet of 1.250" PVC conduit and 100 feet of 1" conduit, along with all the fittings. 500 feet of 6 ga and a suitable length of 8 ga wire completed the kit.
When the electric company was out last week, during our last day of installing roof panels, the ditch witch trenching rig was on site finishing up the main power installation. I caught the operator on the side and worked a deal to have him cut another trench between the garage (starting right at the same main service that he just finished installing) and running over to our 10 x 12 cabin home. It worked out great.
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4 days later, in the flurries of snow, Dski and I laid in the conduit and fittings and pulled the wire. We now have 60 amps into our little temporary living quarters. This really up's the ante for our stays. No more generator...YeeHaw!
It will be the final link to all the other underground wiring we installed last year. We will reverse the wires coming in from the generator shed and send the utility power back to it for lighting and what-not. The wiring out to the covered dock will receive the same AC power benefits. It really ties together all the projects that we have been working on for the past 4+ years.
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The only "mess" that I had to leave hanging was the entrance of the new conduit into the 10 x 12 cabin. We had to pull up short with the trencher because we were close to the existing underground conduit. There is about 15 feet of hand digging to be done that I just don't have the time for right now, particularly on the cusp of winter.

We will wait until spring when the ground is softer and the weather is more cooperative...and I try to find a day to fight the rock hard clay with a pick axe and shovel. We'll back out the wires and finish the run directly into the shed. In the meantime, tho, keep the inspector away and enjoy the freedom of utility power.

Is the house wired and power available/on ?

I have done nothing to wire the gar/apt; no time. The breaker box is hot, tho, and ready for circuits. The only thing holding me back is time.

Having at least one working circuit in the house might be job one.

got...on a very small scale

That is a HUGE milestone! Congrats!!!

Just as soon as the frost leaves the ground is the easiest time to hand dig.......

It's getting close to a month since the last update on the house.

Are you still working on it? or are have you stopped for winter? Did you get all the metal on the roof before the snow started? I'm looking forward to pictures of that roof, and how you managed on all those tricky angles. Not a simple roof by any means, and I'm sure with cold, wet and freezing conditions, it might be impossible to work on it until spring time.

Eddie

Hey Eddie; thanks for checking in.
We got everything onto the roof except some gable rake trim and 2/3 of the ridge cap. After I nearly slipped and fell during ridge cap installation, the weather went south north and I haven't been able to get back up there. I checked in at metalroofing.com and asked the experts what they thought about the potential of getting some rain and melted snow behind the panels because of the missing ridge cap. It really had me worried. They said that if the felt was in good shape, there should be no problems. For the record, the felt was in great shape.
We haven't been back to the pond project since the week before Christmas; too much snow and our 2 x 4 truck with street tires couldn't handle the badly beaten driveway thru the woods. It appears, tho, that we are heading back into the high 30's/low 40's temperatures and no precip for this weekend. I'm planning my first 2010 trip and hope to get back up on the horse and ride.

Why not work inside and leave the roof until spring. Wire up the bottom so you can be more comfortable. Break up the work with a few snowshoe walks and wildlife observations. Stay off the ice as you don't need any more breaking through the ice events.

I want that roof done; finito! After that, we have to get the exterior protected. That includes installing 11 windows, trim, and siding. Once we get to that point, we can actually cool our heels a bit, take a deep breath, and take a walk thru the woods.

Be sure to use that safty rope and put on warm cloths.

I ushered Donna-ski into 2010 with her first trip back to LNP. It's been 3 weeks off for her; last trip just before Christmas. Her excitement was...well...containable. Working outide in the middle of winter in the midwest didn't help. At least I picked out a weekend with temps in the 30's. That, and the new Sorels Santa brought, punched my winter ticket to ride with my helper.
We went there with the plan to get back up on the roof to finish the trim and ridge cap. The weird weather had a different plan. The melting snow combined with the above freezing temps created fog and saturated atmosphere that kept the roof wet (and slippery) for most of the time. Scratch that idea; I now know better.
We weren't wanting for other things to do, and I knew there was one other project that I have not been looking forward to. The very tops of the gable walls needed to be sheathed and house-wrapped. So, we knocked it out.
It was very slow going, up the ladder, down the ladder, repeat. We basically ran out of ladder height (24 footers) as I moved across the gable wall and got to the center. These center zones required standing on the rung just short of the top and laying face flat against the wall to keep from falling backwards. Yeah, more precarious work demanding concentration and good balance, complicated by heavy insulated boots, snow and ice. I moved slowly and took my time. Only one boo-boo. At the very top of the ladder, I dropped one section of sheathing. It went straight down and stuck into the semi-frozen ground, like a chip into dip, and just stood there like some kooky OSB sculpture. It just missed shearing off the electric meter. I climbed down, pulled it out, and it was unscathed....so up it went again, but this time to be permanently glued and nailed.
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Any way, this little bit of work at the gables was a small amount of real estate, but a big milestone. We are now 100% dried in.


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Filling in these peaks creates a different feeling when we go inside and upstairs to the living area. For those of you that have been to this point, you know the feeling I speak of. You stand there and look around at this new empty shell and even though the walls are bare naked 2-by stock and the ceiling is nothing but roof trusses right up the roof sheathing, your mind sees much, much more. It reminds me of my first treehouse...just a bit bigger. It's all about having a cool fort. It's a guy thing.

Congrats on getting it buttoned up! Now a torpedo heater will make working inside bearable.

Next weekend doesn't look any better for outside work.

Quite another milestone, B'ski and the Mrs.
Tell us about the wrap install. Is it all done after the siding is placed? Are those a roofing nail with plastic washers holding it? From a dumb non-carpenter here.

What is next ? When do the upper windows go in? That step will make working upstairs a little brighter but may slow things down a bit. Stopping to watch the outside goings-on can get in the way but it makes life more interesting. Take time to smell the roses - its about the journey so don't rush. Trust me the trip will be easier and more enjoyable with power/heat and light if you take time to let it be.

Handling housewrap can be a PIMA, Burger...particularly if there is any wind. If you start attaching it kinda crooked, there is no forgiveness; it doesn't "bend or stretch" to straighten out and will run out to the other end crooked (kinda like laying carpet). For this reason, the easiest way is when the wall section is laying flat. Hanging it by wrapping or attaching after the wall is vertical is a challenge that requires patience. An extra sets of hands is a must.
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The nails are exactly that; button caps or plastic caps. A regular ring shank nail with a cheap galvanized coating that is poked thru the center of a 1" diameter soft, flexible, flat plastic button.

The windows have snuck up the priority list and are very near the top, Ewest. Our first priority continues to be completing the roof detail stuff, but that gets bumped until the conditions are absolutely ideal (read this as dry and minimal wind).
Another project that has ascended the priority list is the soffits on the gable ends. The lower sections of a gambrel roof design are very easily exposed to wind driven rain. This situation would also allow water to get behind the housewrap. Installing the soffits would eliminate the potential.
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Having just completed utility power installation and not having to use a generator all day (and night when it's cold) has yielded a construction atmosphere that we have not yet experienced. It's quiet. As we work, we can hear hawks screach, the pileated woodpeckers whoop, and barred owls hoot. For now, this is our subtle reminder of the reason we are doing this.

Another amazing weekend of progress Brettski.

Thanks JHAP
My construction lobe is slightly enlarged and pressing on my ice intelligence lobe. All I could think of while I was on the ladder was how cool it would be to take a walk out on the pond. Staring down, I looked and noted having both boots on. . I felt the rush of confidence that a smack addict has just before he leaps off a 20 story building to fly.

And here I was thinking that you had missed the "ice intelligence lobe" graphic. Turns out you were just ignoring me.

I'll bet that it's an optical illusion, but my biggest fear from looking at that pic is worrying about the bottom of the ladder slipping out.

Yeah, wrapping vertical walls by yourself are fun.

Let's hope that Brettski's life insurance agent doesn't look at this site, otherwise I'm thinking a premium increase would be in order.

Where's your ladder buddy Brettski!? Are we going to have another "Stupid,stupid,stupid" thread started by you here soon?

Hey Bski - how much air blows through the gorilla wrap at the window/etc. holes?

2 big ol' OSHA-approved screwdrivers, pounded into the semi frozen ground behind the ladder feet.
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edit; you ain't seen nuthin'. Often, the camera-gal is right up there behind me, handing me a nailgun or something else I either forgot, couldn't carry, or dropped. Makes me think of the 3 stooges skit with the triple bunk beds)

Virtually none. That's why I screwed plywood panels into the openings on the larger window openings; to resist higher winds from pushing the G-wrap into the opening.

Brettski is getting safer, look at the rig he started with.

Take a parachute up that ladder just in case?

Brettski:

Its been several months since I've popped in for a visit to the forum .... man oh man, have you been a busy young lad!

My congratulations to you and Diane on the excellent progress to date.

Its really something to see how encouraging passing a little milestone can be isn't it?

Keep up the good work, you've got something to be very proud of going on there and who knows ... maybe we'll drop in to see your fish someday when I fully retire.

All the best,
Lee

Shhhh, Donnaski doesn't know about Diane.

Oh and don't be such a stranger Lee!

I got an email from my insurance agent. Our homeowner's insurance company wants to do an inspection of the garage/apt. I told her to let them know it's nowhere near completion. They want to do 2 inspections; one during construction and one when it's done. Jeesh.
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So, I spent this last weekend tightening up the nuts and bolts. There were a number of little structural things that are just fine for now, but might get a crooked look from an inspector. No problem; they needed to be done anyway. Stuff like additional support under point loads (read this as a couple more 2 x 6's glued and nailed to the existing support). Also, all the windows needed one more 2 x 6 header piece (I only put in 2 pc during framing, just to save some time while we were racing against the clock). Anyway, it was a relatively warm weekend with temps into the mid/upper 40's, so working in a sweatshirt was a nice change. Also, and this is a biggie, it was raining on and off so it was VERY nice to have a roof over our head while we puttered along.
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Part of adding detail framing members includes adding a corner piece for attaching drywall at all the wall corners. Upstairs, there are 7 of these corners (the 8th is in the stairwell and of no immediate concern). Anyway, I want to insulate and seal these corners airtight before we bury them with the 2 x 6 stud. Enter foam-man.




The higher temps and Donna armed with a heat gun helped the the expanding foam to react correctly and fill the corner voids. Next trip, we will trim the excess and attach the corner stud.
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It also dawned on me that the inspector might be interested in fire protection. Since we installed the main pipe for our dry hydrant some 4 years ago, we never terminated it with any fittings. I decided to put on a 6" threaded female fitting. This will allow total flexibility to add or change the hydrant fitting. I will have to reach out to the local fire department to find out what size fitting they use and make a corresponding hydrant fitting purchase.

Hmmm, that's interesting the insurance company wants to do an inspection. Is that because you're building it yourself?

I don't think so. I don't believe that fact has gotten that far yet. I actually wonder how they will react to to DIY. I already reviewed their questionaire regarding a fireplace/woodstove. It leads me to believe that they will be looking for a licensed contractor. We will see. It might be time for a new insurance company.

My sister and bro-in-law ran into that same problem with a wood stove that was on the enclosed back porch. It was in the house when they bought it, and a few years later the insurance co. said "get rid of it or we won't be able to insure the house for the same rate". They got rid of the insurance company instead.

Hmmm, I'm wondering then about all of the homes out there that have wood burning stoves. Based upon what I see driving around Northern California there are a ton of them. Do they all pay an inflated insurance premium because of the wood burning stove?

Or, worse yet, are they aware of the clause buried within the policy that excludes damages caused by an improperly installed woodstove ("improperly" based on insurance company standards)

Winter has finally triumphed. We have been unable to return to our project now for 3 weeks. The beat up driveway combined with snow cover creates an impassable situation for D-ski's 2 wheel drive pick-up truck. I did get in for the last trip by myself and did some "stuff". This included presentation of a dry metal roof that allowed me to "climb back on the horse that (nearly) bucked me off". I got the rake trim installed at one gable end and another piece of 10' ridge installed. Not to be totally outdone, the roof put one over my bow when I allowed a couple of crumbs of snow to sneak up in a crack of my gym shoe. Somewhere near the peak, it melted and created just enough moisture to put one foot back into a slide and scared the crap outta me....again. I got to the point where I would change my shoes every time I came down the ladder; roof shoes and everywhere else shoes. It sucked, it went slow, but it was sure-footed when I really needed it.
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Anyway....
I wanted to check in. It's been a few weeks. It's kinda funny, but when I started this thread, I said that I was gonna put all our updates on the LNP website. Instead, as it turns out, all the update details wound up here; on the Pond Boss website....and our LNP site kinda went dormant. Well, that's been fixed. I have been picking away at the LNP website and have come about as far as I can to bring it up to speed. It pretty much parallels all the stuff on this thread, perhaps a bit more organized. There are other details there, but it's just a re-mastering of the stuff that's already here.
It is one very long page with many pics, so avoid it if you are already bored with this project AND if you don't have high speed www.

Thanks B'ski. What is the plan from here on?

This weekend, a couple of hours are dedicated to calculating the required siding and trim. I have the price quotes, so I will take the 2 lowest and try to play one against the other for a final squeeze. Then we buy it. It will take about 2 weeks to get it ready for our pick up. By that time, we hope for driveway access (read that as melted snow) and the siding show begins.

Do you have a good winter pic ?

Brettski:

With the warmer temps and the sun out for a couple of days, most of the snow should be gone. Unless the weather has been vastly different there, you should have an easy time getting to the place.

A 4-wheel drive Willy's jeep with a small plow would really come in handy!!

From this season, nah...nuthin much to speak of. I am kinda holding back on a good "across the length of the pond, looking up to the building site" shot until we can manage getting the gar/apt exterior completed. Right now, I gotta honestly say that it could easily be May or June before I get to that point. I need to get back into a rhythm for 2010.

Go Bret Go

And take time to enjoy the journey as you go !!!!

Wow Brettski, that place looks great. My wife and I built our current house, took us two years. So I know what you are going through trying to get it done while working in the winter. It can be slow and frustrating but it looks like you are doing a great job. One thing that the building inspector told me when he saw all the TLC we put into it, when you get done you will have a house that you could never afford to hire built. From what I see and what I've seen in all your past projects your building will fall into that category. Those little things done right make a big difference. Also, remember to keep safety #1 especially if you ever work alone. All the money saved and satisfaction gained is not worth getting hurt or worse. Take care.

Thanks for the prop's, bz. It means alot to me...especially comin' from you.

10-4 and so noted.

Man, I lost track of the time off from the project. I think it's been 4 weeks...feels like months. I called my excavator pal a couple days ago for a report on how deep the snow might be out in the woods. He asked me if I wanted him to go over there. "No, you don't have to do that...that's crazy...I just want to know if it's over 3 or 4" cuz that will stop our 2 x 4 truck from gettin' in". He estimated that it was probably closer to 6" and noted that he was working on a job right now that was right around the corner. He never called me back. Dang it! Oh well, I packed it in and made the trip early Sat. morning. I expected that I was gonna be making the 1/3 mile trip in and out on foot 4 or 5 times to get my stuff in. When I got there, he was right...the snow was too deep...except for my driveway. That part was MUCH better, particularly since he plowed it with the bucket on the backhoe! Yeah baby! (wait until I get THAT bill).
I drove right in and unpacked. Good start for the weekend.
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Finishing the ridge on the metal roof continues to be my number one project, but I now know it has to be ideal conditions before I go back up there. This trip wasn't the deal; maybe next weekend. Instead, I switched to the interior electrical.
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I wanted to get power and some basic lighting upstairs. Before I can do so, though, I had to prepare the power source at the breaker box.
I want/need an auxilliary source of power. Over the course of many conversations with the field tech from the power company (as we prepared for the utility power feed), he reminded me that when power goes down way out in the country, it can be slow coming back up. As much as I would love to install a nice 12-15,000 kw propane generator with the automatic switch, the cost is way beyond our budget. Since we already have a decent 5.5 kw gasoline generator (the unit we have been using for all our electrical power needs up until the utility power was installed a couple months ago), I wanted to find a reasonable way to rig it for emergency use on our garage/apartment without running miles of orange extension cords when power goes down. The answer was this weekend's project.
I set a switching sub-panel directly adjacent to the main breaker box and ran an 1-1/4" rigid nipple between the two boxes.

Before I purchased the sub-panel, I called my inspector to make sure it was OK. I got the green light and picked it up on Ebay. You electrician guysez are already familiar with it. It was kinda new to me. At first, it seemed a bit complicated. After I got into it, it's a no-brainer project.
Starting at the main breaker box, a 60 amp 220v double breaker sends a power feed into the sub-panel and ties directly into another 60 amp 220v double breaker on the sub-panel main buss bars. The next step is to select which circuits in the building that I want to run during an emergency power outage. These selected circuits will tap their power feed from this sub-panel.
Here is where the generator comes into play.
Right next to the 60 amp 220v double breaker inside the sub-panel (the dbl breaker receving it's power feed from the main breaker box) is another 220v double breaker. This second unit is only 30 amps because it will be the point where I feed my 5.5 kw gas generator into the sub-panel. These 2 double breakers are next-door neighbors on the sub-panel buss bar for a good reason. There is a pivoting metal mechanical bar between the two power feed breakers that will only allow one of them to be turned on at once. Pretty cool, pretty simple.

In the above pic, only the utility power feed is connected. I have not completed the power feed for the generator breaker. It will consist of another rigid pipe coming off of the sub-panel and running out to one last smaller outlet box. The outlet box will have an 220v outlet that will marry up to the 20 foot pigtail cord that will run to the generator output. If a power outage does occur, I push the pigtail plug into the generator, push the other end of the 20' pigtail into the outlet next to the sub-panel, wheel the generator just outside the garage door and close the door down over the pigtail. Fire up the gennie and go back inside and flip the breaker with the protective rocker arm.
Hopefully I remembered to keep fresh gasoline in stock (along with Seafoam...right Rainman?).
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After this little project, I tapped my first 2 trunk line circuits and ran them over to the living room and kitchen area of the upstairs. I got in one circuit of 5 outlet boxes and some lighting for the upstairs. Finally...no more long extension cords.

Good idea and nice work Brettski.!! (as usual)

So now you can turn on the upstairs lights at night and take a pic of "lights on" so we can see.

Nice work Brettski! I would think that a 5.5KW generator would run quite a bit of stuff.

thanks for sharing. Never seen that device before, but, of course I'm not an electrician.
Myself, being overly safety concious, not necessarily for myself, but more for protection of equipment; I would not leave the 'anti-bucking protection' to that device, but would not fire up and plug in the gen. until I did the manual switching.
It is my nature to be skeptical, cynical, etc. I would not depend upon the device to be break before make. I'm sure it has all kinds of testing, safety certificates, etc..but it's just too easy not to take a chance.
Re: working on the roof. Go get a safety belt, sling a rope over the roof ridge and tie it off down below on the other side. No questions, just do it!

When I first received the unit, I kinda assumed that the rocker would toggle the other breaker when the first breaker is flipped. It doesn't; the geometry and force required just doesn't happen that way. Instead, it is nothing more than a safety lock that won't allow both breakers to be on at the same time. Each breaker does have to be manually "flipped".
I do like and agree with the idea of flipping the breakers first, then plugging into the warmed and operating gennie set. I would back off most all the sub-panel circuits so the sudden load doesn't shoot the hissing pin at the Canooten valve on the mumbling shaft.

I see your technobabble generator is already on line.

Rubber boots and gloves first ?

Guess where I was this weekend...


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I am pleased to report that the long awaited break in the winter weather yielded a couple of very nice days. I took off work on Friday to take advantage of the blue skies and 40 something degree temps and got the ridge cap completed. I also got the opportunity to screw down the ends of every panel (2 screws zipped into the ends of each 16" wide panel, just above the drip edge). The only thing left is 4 short pieces of rake trim, one at each end of the shed dormers. Although I wanted to get into it, they are another somewhat complicated fabrication to get them installed correctly and water-tight. I want to call my contact at the factory and quiz him on correct fabrication/installation. In the meantime, tho, we are buttoned up. It was creepy getting back up there...real creepy. I was a bundle of nerves, but took my time and measured every step. Unfortunately, I will have to go back up at least one more time to install the boot for the plumbing vent stack.


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Sunday turned into a rain day. It gave me a reason to go upstairs and work a bit more on the rough wiring. I don't even have the bank of pond-view windows in yet and I'm outta control on creating lighting options for that area.

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I HAVE A QUESTION FOR Y'ALL.
I need ideas for drip control. The roof design puts water dripping and hitting grade 8" away from the building. I really want to minimize or eliminate the splash. Over time, it will beat up the bottom row(s) of the lap siding. I don't want bushes. I really think the simple fix is gutters. I am familiar with the run-of-the-mill house gutters at the big box home centers, but the mounting brackets won't work with the gambrel design and pitch. Here is a view from underneath the eaves, taken at the corner of the structure.

The distance from the wall to the outer point of the rafter tail is 8". A white vinyl vented soffit will cover the opening. How would one attach a gutter to this design?

as i read down through this b'ski, i had a gutter opinion until that last shot.

our gutters were installed first, and the roof panels were cut so they didnt have a drinking problem hangover. i chose seamless gutters w/ a gutter guard that has performed really well and requires almost NO maintenance.....one of my goals. but i'm not sure how this would work in your application.

"It was creepy getting back up there...real creepy. I was a bundle of nerves, but took my time and measured every step. Unfortunately, I will have to go back up at least one more time to install the boot for the plumbing vent stack."

heed previous post.........Re: working on the roof. Go get a safety belt, sling a rope over the roof ridge and tie it off down below on the other side. No questions, just do it!

I agree with Burger !!!

What about pea gravel on the ground under the drip line ? That plus grass should do the job.

Assuming LNP is in groundhog country, use fairly large and coarse (like 1" on the minor axis and 2"-3" on the major axis) limestone all the way around the building, not just on the drip sides. Whistlepigs don't like to dig through this, and it will keep them from burrowing under the slab.

Houston....we have a problem!
For all the planning and preparation that one ham-and-egger DIY jockey can do, I just (literally) bumped into a problem.
I knew right from the beginning when I was designing the structure that the stairway to the second floor was gonna be a booger. There are a plethora of details that are all linked and affect each other. I wrestled with the calculations and knew that some of the final stairway design was gonna be a bit less than ideal, but it would be functional and should do what it's supposed to do.
I'll try to paint the picture...
Let's start with the upstairs floorplan. The red outlined area in the upper right hand side is the stairwell and the subject zone of the design issues.

It looks like this from the upstairs, looking down.

another perspective at the top of the staircase


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This was the first questionable decision I made when I laid this staircase out. I am putting a door right at the top of the staircase. There will be no landing just outside the door. On the way up the stairs, when you get to the top step, the door will be right in front of you, one more step up. When you're going down the stairs, as you pass thru the door, you will be stepping down to the first step downhill. I knew this when I laid it out and knew it was a less than desireable design. Why did I do it? Well, like I said...a host of facets that all intertwine and link together. In the end, in order to get the biggest bang for the buck in upstairs square footage usage, I had to put the door there. I was going to move the door further in and put it at the end of the hallway leaving a nice landing in front of the window, but that would cut off the cross-ventilation that the window will provide. In the end, if the building inspector doesn't like my current plan, this is likely what I will have to do...but I don't wanna. In this area, I am still open to some other outta the box ideas.
Moving on...
The amount of rise and run of the stairs left me no options for the staircase. In order to maintain proper stair height and tread, I had to run the stairs down to a landing, then turn it away. I got the first set of stairs installed, along with the landing.

I should'a moved the service door back by another couple of feet...oh well. This little flaw is insignificant and doesn't bother me. It will work just fine. At least I installed the service door with the proper direction of swing.
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I was so happy with the way the first set of stairs turned out. Jeesh, what a crazy math equation. Compound stair layout sucks. Anyway, it looked great, so I took my first short walk.

I'm just shy of 6'-3" and that beam is comin' really close to my head. On the way up, I miss it without ducking...barely.

When I'm comin' down, tho, it's a problem (not because I'm walking backward, JHAP).
This is the problem. I never considered it. I thought that the 9 foot tall walls downstairs, coupled with the 6" high concrete curb walls (effectively making the downstairs walls 9'-6" tall) would provide all the clearance I would need for the staircase. Wrongo!
I can't change the riser and tread dimensions enough to make a difference and still maintain code for a proper stair tread. If I drop the landing by one stair, the upper stair run will push out too far onto the landing and leave a small area to turn. It would make the landing too small for code. I don't know that there is anything (short of an elevator) that would solve this one.
I'm gonna call my inspector this coming week to see what he thinks about this situation. If he says "no go", I really have a conundrum. If he says he doesn't really care, I believe that a helmet might be in my future. At 5'-2", Dski couldn't care less.

On the bright side, you are unlikely to get taller as you age.

How tall is the inspector.
Sorry I couldn't resist, how about a circular stair case.

Foam rubber; after you DON'T call the inspector and discuss it.

I have another suggestion afer the inspector passes it.

Have D'ski do the walkthru with the inspector.

Hey, you did call HOUSTON.

Use the stairs to go up. Install a pole to slide down.

Bski, how would the head clearance be if you dropped the elevation of the landing one (or 2?) steps and extended the length of the upper stairs by one (or 2?) steps. I think this would necessitate moving the door at the top of the stairs 90 degrees to the right, giving an upper landing with the window and closet access as you discussed above.

Comments:

1. Best flow through ventilation would be with the stairway door open to draw air up through both floors, cool in at the bottom and warm out at the top. But perhaps you will want to exclude shop/garage odors some times, so I can see where wanting access to the window without having the stairway open comes from.

2. There are two places in my parents' old house, the bottom of the stairs and the entrance to my Dad's workshop, where I learned to duck as I reached 6'3" in height. I hardly ever hit them after I got out of my teens. (Of course, I didn't live there much after my teens, either.)

You'd trust any of these three around a brass pole?

My first choice would be a too small for code landing. Second would be as is. Third would be , as Burger and I keep telling you , a safety harness and rope tie off and swing down from the upstairs window.

I was thinkin' more on this one last night. Then, I found the national codes for stairways.
Rockytopper can correct me if I am wrong...
The only way I can gain the height at the headbumper is to drop the landing by one step. This would extend the upper stairway run by one more step. I do believe that it will be close, but it should maintain about 38" of landing.
In the pix, the lower stairway treads are 42" wide. They would narrow down to 36" to correctly ascend to the now smaller landing. At 36", they are the min tread width allowed.
Having the landing lower by 1 step does provide a bonus WRT the lower stairway. It makes it 1 less step, thereby moving it back from the service door by 9".


Regarding not having a landing at the top of the staircase, I picked this one up from the code.

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If the alteration to the landing does work out, I pick up 8" of height at the headbumper for a total of 77" clearance. Code is 80". The building inspector is (about) 72". It's worth the gamble.

Bski I'm not sure what rise and run you have. One way to fix the problem is to use the landing itself be part of the stair case and instead of just turning 90 deg you turn 180 deg with the stair case assuming you have the space to do this. Refer to this link of my floor plan http://www.pondboss.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=9017&fpart=3
to see what I’m talking about. I also wanted to make the most of my square footage so the stair cases were limited in space.

That may be the best advice you've ever given here, Eric.

How about a winder.

Thanks for checking in, RockyT. A winder would be the next option if this one doesn't play out.

I would have never suggested something that stupid. Here are more intelligent solutions:

Bilateral leg reduction.

Cut a "head clearance" notch in the cross beam.

Place a hard hat rack at the top and bottom of the stairs.

Forget what your mom said and always slouch when walking up the stairs.

At the appointed time for inpection I could give the inspector a personal tour of your property wearing only my neoprene brazillian cut cod piece. Fear and loathing goes a long way toward speeding up a home inspection.




Hey I earned $157.00 at the first Pond Boss due to the brass pole in the bar. Of course I was being paid in dollar bills to stay away from the pole but heck it all spends the same.

Brettski:

I think you have a clear direction with a contingency plan in place. I'd go the drop the landing with a winder back-up plan route.

with JHAP and the codpiece a reluctant 3rd option.

I would send you back into the 5 jungle-like acres of Black Locust trees where all the woodpeckers reside. Once they got a good look at the tour guide, it would be like a remake of a Hitchcock thriller.

Easy Virtue? Skin Game? The Man Who Knew Too Much? Spellbound? Stage Fright? I Confess? The Wrong Man?

We went to the project this weekend expecting the gnarly winter weather reprisal that had been predicted. I had the stairway reconstruction on top of the priority list. We were pleasantly surprised to find that we could work between the light raindrops and continue to work on the exterior....our prime focus for this spring. Since we had a week of dry weather leading into this weekend, it means the gishy mud had dried out somewhat and eased maneuvering around the perimeter of the building. We broke out the ladders and started work on the upstairs windows.
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Sometime last summer, I kept my eyes glued to Craigslist for a scaffold plank. Not only did I find a great expandable aluminum plank, but the same guy had a pair of nice aluminum ladder jacks in his trunk. The price was right. I have never used either item before, so I was nervous as a cat on a tightrope. In the end, it was one of my best decisions.



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There are a total of 11 windows on the second floor. Three of those are the 5' square picture windows that look out over the pond. As I type this, they remain uninstalled. Yep; took the easier road, but we did manage to get all 8 of the smaller windows installed. We are pretty pleased with the results of our weekend output.



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Now that I am more familiar with the ladder/scaffold setup, I feel better equipped to mind-engineer how the 2 of us are going to handle the bigger windows. Heck, if the weather holds, we might take a shot this coming weekend.
Every time we get some inspiration, we try to share it. Having the ability to look out from our new perch was a very cool milestone.

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Yeah...gotta get the big boys installed...gotta

I have a feeling your progress will slow when you get the big windows in. I f the pond view is too distracting you might want to put the gorilla wrap back over them. So did you get the stairs resolved or are you saving that for later.

Neat video. I like the ladder/scaffold setup. I had never seen those.

I was unable to see the video, Was complaining of a invalid file sturcture.

Thanks for the window walk around tour. Nice water btw. Any spring "look what I found" events to mention ?

Just remember that those large windows will act the same as a sheet of plywood in the breeze, but the consequences of dropping one is much greater! It might make it easier to get them up there if you can remove the glass and take those up there one at a time. Even take the glass up thru the house once the stairs are completed.

For some reason these photos really put the size of this structure into perspective for me. Dang this place is HUGE. Thanks for continuously posting updates.

Never touched the stairs. Not enough time. Each window takes almost 2 hours to install, including moving and adjusting the ladders and resetting the scaffold. It goes slow for me. I move much slower when I'm "hangin' out there".
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WRT the stairway, we will drop the landing by one step and re-connect everything. The two upper 2 x 12 stringers will be scrapped as too short and replaced with stock that is one step longer. This is still pretty high on the priority list; Dski and I are both tired of climbing a ladder to get upstairs.

Other than the 2 kids on thin ice a week ago and a brim full pond, nothing exceptional.
Trapper Joe collected 13 rats last fall. I don't know how the population is today.
Kinda funny, we are finally seeing the falling timber we hoped for in the shallow wetland. The turtles were lined up on the first log that landed out in about 3 feet of water. They have good taste; a cherry tree.

lookin good just lurkin around

OK, I think we have a grip on the stairway dilemna...

As goes so many things in my DIY life, our stairway has forced me to live up to my motto: It ain't done right until it's done twice. As of right now, I think it is finally done right...or at least as close to right as I can get it.
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We completely disassembled it, altered pretty much all the dimensions, and reassembled.
This was the original issue:

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removing one step at the top of the lower staircase and dropping the landing to meet it yields the cure:
(or maybe wearing red makes one look shorter)

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The landing wound up being 42" square...not too bad. The lower treads are still pretty wide at 41" and the upper treads will be 38" wide. It think we're good to go.

[color:#003300] SHOW ME DA MONEY! [/color]
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Saturday was good weather, so we set our sights on the last 3 windows...the star players. Between setting up the ladders and scaffold stuff, moving it from window to window, and wrestling with 5 ft square slider window units, it took us all day. It was worth it.
(Unfortunately, since Saturday ran on for so long, we were unable to get pics until Sunday...the rain day)

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From the moment that I put the knife thru the housewrap and cut open the first window opening, I felt a new rush of inspiration. This was it; what all the work we put out was leading up to.
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inside, 1100 square feet of blank canvas
outside...

The house looks great, but the view is fantastic.

That is really exceptional and would be a dream come true for anyone! "Exceptional" is not even a good enough word. I'm speechless.

Somehow I am thinking this lil garage apt. will be a sufficient paradise for the 2 o' youse. As always, 1st class. Tell Donnaski, the burgermeister is most impressed.

Brettski. That view will never get old. You will be sitting there by the window looking out and the recurring thought will come and you will say "Man are we ever lucky" (It happens to me all the time)

Nice work

Great view Bski you did good.

Beautiful view Brettski. Will the details of the install be forthcoming?

Awesome!!!

Your view speaks for itself. And, to me, one of the amazing parts of your entire LNP story is that you created all of this where there was nothing but woods before.

Looking pretty dang awesome Brettski!

Awe inspiring view especially in the vid. Well done !!!! I have been waiting for that post by you. Thanks.

I recall this post way back among the many by your PB friends. Your early plan did have them anyway.

ewest
Lunker


Registered: March 08, 2005
Posts: 10006
Loc: Miss.
The more windows toward the pond the better. Air flow through the place when windows open. Sun and predominant wind directions. Trees nearby and shade. Easy access to the pond from the house. Just a few thoughts.
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BTW very nice looking water in the lake.

Sweet!

SUPERB !!! Tom (Note sig line)

Nice 3 day weekend. It was a small bundle of misc projects.
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We keep a small (tiny) tree nursery in our backyard at home. More like a garden; maybe 15' x 25'. It's fenced off with 4' chicken wire, mostly to ward off the rabbits. I buy the mail order bundles of seedlings for next to nothing and grow 'em out for transplant. 2 springs ago, we plugged in 25 river birch seedlings. I should'a plucked em' last spring after 1 year's worth of growth, but the LNP project won all my attention. Waiting one more year until this spring wasn't my best decision. Removing them was a bear. In fact, I had to leave 3 of them in cuz the taproot was too large and strong. In the 2 years that they were in our nursery, they went from a bundle of 25 sticks that I could hold in my fist to small trees with trunks that went from 3/4" - 2" in diameter. The 2-inchers found a permanent home within the nursery. The rest of 'em got bull'ed outta the ground with a shovel, wrapped in burlap, and transported to the pond project.
We created 4 clumps to separate the gar/apt from a picnic area. They got chicken wire protection, since the rabbbits are the least of my worries in the land of white tails.
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Each clump follows a run-off line created by 2 slopes that converge right where they are plugged in. We hope/expect that they will grow like weeds....assuming the deer don't mow 'em down first. The various crappy pole timber behind them are marked for removal by the backhoe when my excavator returns for the next set of excavation projects.
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We got an aluminum storm door installed. This project moved up the priority list quickly after seeing the amount of rain water that splashes up after falling from the short gambrel roof eave. Then...the stairs...they're finally done....kind of. We ran over to Menards and grabbed a gallon of porch/floor paint and Dski put the roller and brush to work while I goofed around running a couple more electrical circuits. I say "kinda done" cuz I'm holding back on handrails to facilitate movement of larger, clumsier objects upstairs. Also, I have to decide how serious I need to get with filling in the backs of the risers to meet the "four inch maximum gap" code.

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The siding and trim are due in this week. I have mixed emotions on that one. I'm excited cuz it is a really big step and I'm carrying high hopes that it will look great. But...by the same token, I am not looking forward to having to frame in 20 windows (11 of them at the 2nd floor) and installing 20 square of lap siding. Oh yeah...and the vinyl soffits and fascia, too.

Brettski,

Ever try roottrapper bags for growing out the trees? Suppose to create a great root system and make removal from the ground much easy.

Nice work. One thought on the trees. Consider not taking out all the trees in the pic behind the birch trees. You will want a couple of them ( hardwood with large potential or other you like)for shade .

We took advantage of a decent weather forecast and played out a 3 day weekend. Saturday was 7 am at the siding distributor with a loaded truck and an empty trailer. We were unable to take the entire load due to the overall bulk. Fortunately, the material was loaded in such a way to allow us to take all the trim pieces and 1/2 the lap siding. This, along with a bunch of caulk and some touch up paint, made the trip to LNP.

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We spent all day Saturday "getting ready". Our late start along with having to unload the trailer (to free it up for siding load #2) and other various preparation jobs pretty much killed the day. Sunday and Monday are reserved for production. Yeah...production.
Well, this is the first time I have worked with lap siding. It showed as we plodded along...a mistake here, a lousy measurement there. But, in the end, it came together pretty well.
We elected to go with the Louisiana Pacific Smartside product. This, combined with paying for the the best pre-finish we could find, pretty much broke the piggy bank. The payback...instant gratification.

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It's slow and arduous work, mostly because of windows and doors. Add in the fact that we are working with ladders about 1/2 way up and...well...we did the best/most we could.

Oh yeah...a question for y'all....
In the beginning, the plan was to trim out all the windows with white PVC; mostly for the low maint and long life. That plan changed after I discovered the cost. Also, the PVC really expands and contracts with the temp swings. This pushed us to trim out the windows with the LP smartside (as seen at the window in the pic above).
Anyway...the question: We had already laid in the garage doors with the white PVC brick mould and trim. Should we leave it alone...or paint it to match the window trim? If "yes; paint it", then how much? The brick mould? The brick mould and the casing trim? Or, the the brick mould, casing trim, AND the entire door?

That looks really good Brett. The finish in the picture looks just like red cedar after it has weathered for about a year or so.

I would leave as is. It matches the window.

Very nice look BTW.

I say leave it as is also. While it doesn't exactly match the window, it's really not that big of a difference, and unless you know what you're looking for, it doesn't show up as an "oops".

I'd be more concerned about paint peeling off of the PVC trim, or not getting the color the same as the other trim.

That'll really, really look good when it's all installed!

+1. It looks great the way it is.

I really like the looks of that siding Brettski, actually the overall place is looking fantastic!

after we priced out "fake trim" i went with regular old pre-primed spruce for all window and door trims. personally i like the white against the wood. in fact i'd a probably trimmed the windows in white too.

lookin great b'ski...

looks great. I wouldn't have noticed anything unless you brought it up. I would leave it. It matches the windows just fine.

Jeesh, I musta squeezed off a couple of miles of caulk already, and we just started. I guess I just never really thought about it since I have never worked with lap siding. It is my first exposure to OSI Quad caulking. Amazing stuff; might trump polyurethane caulk as my favorite.
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Anyway, we got a little further. I am very glad to be past the utility stuff and conduit feeds...it took alot of time, nippin' and tuckin'.
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We're just gonna keep pickin' away at the mountain, one piece at a time.

Wow, that's looking good!

Are you squeezing the calk out in a hand powered caulk gun? If so, I could arrange for the tool fairy to loan you an air powered one..... Just let me know what size the calk tubes are, I have a couple different sized ones.

Thanks esshup.
Got the caulk gun covered; thanks. I like the manual gun for detail and the 18v cordless (and air hose-less) gun for long straight runs.

Brettski, with the new forum design... It looks like you'll finally have a proper place to show off all your hard work.

Just in case you thought we have been goofing off for the last couple o' weeks, I thought I would check in and 'fess up....we were....kinda.
2 weekends in a row of no production at the pond is strange and really thru me outta my rhythm. The first weekend was rain, rain, rain, so I stayed home and spent the weekend breathing new life into my old ride; brakes and hoses. The second weekend was a planned stint to Idaho to see family; a very nice break indeed. Then reality set back in and we headed back to the project this past weekend.
Last spring (2009) we had our first experience with trying to get DirectTV reception thru the forest as the trees leafed out. And, about this time last spring, we lost our picture until the fall. Kinda sucked and MP3 player got a good workout. I knew that eventually the dish would be mounted permanently to the new structure, but we just weren't far enough along last year, nor had the time to spare to mount it. This past weekend, the picture started to fritz in and out, so I knew what had to be done.
There's really only one halfway decent place to mount the dish; on the fascia of the gable end. Since I only wanted to do it once, it means finishing the fascia before the mount. This was a job that I have been avoiding, simply because of the height and awkward balancing act. No matter, I was NOT going to go thru the summer again without satellite TV.

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Between this slow going project and tuning in the dish and running the new cable over to our little shed, our Saturday was pretty much shot.
We did manage to get some siding productivity on Sunday. It's all ladder work and moves very slow. Another reassurance that we made the right decision to use a pre-finished product.

Brettski, in the first pic it looks like you were only 5 courses away from having to install the facia anyway so I don't see any time lost on the project. It all has to be done to be considered "finished" anyway! It's looking great!!

Tremendous. Keep up the great work!

What is the gameplan from here ? Sounds like TV first , goofing around second , work maybe.

bustin hump, baby...
The sat TV is critical. It is about the only "plus" in the equation to offer Donna-ski. No Sat TV, no Dski...No D-ski, no progress.
We've got pretty much all the raw material we need to do the entire siding job already stored inside the structure. The plan is to keep picking away at the square footage until it's done. It's easy to look at it and say "heck, what's the big deal...this should be done in 2 or 3 weekends". Yeah...right.

It's either satellite or cable, if you're gonna watch "This Old Garage-Apartment."

So...why the heck is it taking me so long to get the siding up? Could it be a my constant battle with overkill? Nah!
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Every window is being framed with pre-finished 5/4 x 4 stock. The stock is painted and sealed on 3 sides; the face and both edges. I do have bottles of touch up paint, but I really want to take advantage of the factory finish whenever possible. To do so on the window frame work, I have to mitre all the corners. Besides, the mitred corner is a classier look.
We are using biscuits at every corner.

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Each window has a vinyl nailing fin about 1/8" thick. It runs around the entire perimeter of the window and is how the windows are nailed to the framing surrounding the rough opening. This fin protrusion creates an uneven surface for the siding framework, so we have to relieve the back side of every piece.

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Each siding window frame is assembled, one at a time, with glue and the biscuits and tightened together with a long band clamp designed for making pictures frames. We adapted it with another band and got a suitable length to encompass the entire 206" perimeter.

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Then....laying out the installation lines.
The housewrap is supposed to be semi-transparent to allow the ability to see the nailing layout marks on the sheathing it covers. This would theoretically allow me to know where every stud is located. It is imperitive that each nail used to hold not only the siding but the siding trim hits a stud. Well, this ability to easily locate the layouts thru the housewrap is sketchy at best. I can't afford to hit and miss, so we go ahead and use a chalk line and sharpie marker to re-create the centers of all the studs. While we are at it, we use a story board (an 11' long stick with layout elevations marked on it) to mark the tops of all the courses of the lap siding in numerous locations of the wall.

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This layout procedure takes about an hour and half, but makes the installation part go much easier. It's nice to have an easy-to-read road map. The window frames...well...they take a little longer. Oh, and btw, there are 9 windows on the first floor and 11 upstairs. The picture windows will be a chapter unto themselves.

Nice! Do it once, do it right. If you have a problem of the chalk washing off in the rain, use powdered concrete stain instead of chalk. It'll stay there for a long while.

already there; waterproof chalk
thx

We keep pluggin'....one course at a time
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It must have been brutal out there today with the heat and humidity, plus not being used to it.

Every weekend it looks better and better!

Now that is some progress. Is the bottom finished ? The top is going to be a challenge. Get that safety harness !

Great color scheme.

+1 on the safety harness..........again.

How and when did you learn to do all this stuff. Not selling iron.
Give us some background. I would give my left nail to be able to build like that.
You have a reliable, steady partner, too. Get the sat TV going.

My earliest recollection was toddler when my Dad gave me my own little hammer (no play on words here, Theo) and the cut-off scraps from the lumber stock from one of his own projects. I would nail the pieces together to make small "boats" and use the finish nails to make railings and other small wooden-block boat accessories. This might also explain my affinity for boating and BOW's later in life.
Some of the finest memories I have of my dearly departed mother are both of us sitting on the roof of the Eagle River cottage we were building as we nailed down the ship lap roof boards. I was prolly 12 or 13 at the time of that project.

I shoulda been paying more attention and helping my dad when he was sawing and hammering, sweat dripping down off his nose in mid-summer Miss., instead of going down the street and playing some kinda ball all the time.

I just went thru this entire post from the first page. Brettski, awesome job, but man you make me feel like a lazy bum, heh heh. I consider myself a can-do-er, always ready to tackle the task at hand, but I seriously want to know how you maintain focus? Do you take some sort of ADHD medication to keep that razor sharp focus on the next step?? I restored an old farm house and the sheer size and scope of the project often overwhelmed me to the point of helplessness many times over. Of course, I was single during most of it and spending time and money on fishing trips instead of weekend after weekend on the task at hand, but what you have done and in the time frame you have done it is something any couple can be very proud of. I was impressed by your dock building both in design and workmanship but this blows that away, very good job indeed!!!

Many thanks for the props, JoeG. The focus is relatively easy when taking it on in such tiny bites. The real tip of the hat goes to my tirelessly supportive and butt-kickin' better half, Donna-ski.
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We really hoped for 3 days in a row for productivity on this Memorial Day weekend, but M Nature had other plans. We got in 2 good days, finally tackling the fourth side of the first floor. The third day was a rain day, so we knocked out some odds-and-ends projects.
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Looks great. Love the attention to detail and your explinations as to why you do what you do. Makes it more interesting and informative.

Congratulations on your progress so far, and I'm looking forward to your future achievements in creating your home!!!

Eddie

Thank ya, Mr Walker. I do appreciate the bump.
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We are officially at the point of "all ladders, all the time". It sucks. We can't put up one stinkin' piece of anything without moving and adjusting a ladder...usually two ladders. Complicate that with alot of the work will require the ladder jacks and aluminum scaffold. If I had to guess, I would say that we spend 1/3 of our time just setting up. Add 90+ degrees, 99% humidity, and a consistent string of thunderstorms.
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OK...rave over (for now). I feel a little better. Thanks for listenin'.
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We finished up the "service door" side; finito.

We also set up the ladders and scaffold above the 3 picture windows. I did the highwire act again and got the white fascia covers installed on this end. The 2 x 6 fascia boards have been exposed to the elements now for about 6 months. They were fine. They're protected now.
Uh oh...I forgot the base for an exterior coach light at the service door. Dammit. I'll rig something in later, I guess.
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Bring the ladders around to the overhead door side and re-erect the scaffold. We get an official start on the 2nd story work. This was an important step as it gives me a "feel" for the PIMA factor. It was pretty high. We got a start on wrapping a window with trim, caulking it in, and setting some of the shed dormer fascia and soffit.

Where is the safety harness ? Good to see progress but you need to be accident free to enjoy the finished product.

I agree with Eric! We expect you to be at the next pbc not in the hospital!

Didn't you guys see the little wings on those tennies that Brettski has on? One "whoops" and they turn on, lifting him back up to the scaffold.

The weather man tried to scare us off again this weekend. No dice. Yeah, Friday evening did get nasty, but the balance of the weekend held together pretty well, albeit smokin' low 90's. I keep promising Dski we are gonna string together a 3 or 4 day weekend and get some production rollin', but the lousy thunderstorms keep marching thru the midwest every week....every 3 or 4 days. Anyway, we perservered the heat and humidity, got in a decent 2 days, and got a little more scaffold-type work done.
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One side has most of the fascia work done, along with vented soffits and the frieze board beneath.

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...and, a good part of the other side prep'd

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I'm very relieved to get the wood covered at the fascia. It has been exposed for quite a number of months. The real bugger is gonna be the 4 tiny triangular areas at the ends of the shed dormers. The smallest amount of real estate and the most "nip and tuck".

4-5 more weekends tops and you'll have the outside done.

looking good boss!

Great work. Is the inside (light and air) livable yet ?

Nothing inside except a couple of electic circuits to provide power to strategic areas within the structure. We are in a race to get the outside sealed up and weather-tight. After that, we can shift into another gear and get serious with the interior. We have been messing with the siding, trim, and soffits for a bit over 2 months. Based on the pace and difficulty of having to use ladders and/or a scaffold, I expect another 1-1/2 months to have the exterior corked up.
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(man, vinyl siding was SO much easier to install)

step by step, nail by nail...
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Every move we make is calculated based on need. In our case, need directly correlates to protection from the elements. The house wrap has done an outstanding job of protecting from the wind and precipitation, but the UV rays of the sun are showing some of the damaging effects. I am not concerned that we have gone beyond the point of no return on degradation....yet. But, as noted, each item of wrapping up the exterior is weighed against all the others for priority.
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This weekend was mostly dedicated to protecting the undersides of the gable ends. The lower gable sections are getting wet from the driven rain, and man...have we had the driven rain this spring. I have dreaded this project cuz it involves ladders and scaffolds at the highest of heights; a pain to set up and take down, and a strain on my sense of balance and focus. Completing boxing in these eaves, tho, includes setting the frieze boards that will frame the final push to install the lap siding. It sets the next stage.


Since we had the ladders and scaffold at this end, we framed the window at the 2nd story, too. Now, it's all siding to go at this end.
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We got the same accomplished at the other end, but no framing around the windows. That will be a project for the very near future. We did manage, tho, to complete the fascia and soffit venting along the shed dormer.

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We left the very bottoms of the gable soffits unfinished since that project is low priority for protection. We are now weighing out the next battle for the weekend over the 4th.

That is progress !!

How long do you think it will take to finish the one window end ?

Ya know, I stood there staring at it for awhile just before we left, deciding not only it's level of priority for completion, but also how long it might take to fill in with siding. The unfinished area is just about 28' wide along the bottom and about 15' tall at the center. I would like to believe we could knock it out in 2 days...but I don't know. It's all ladder work....up, down, up, down...

Safety first -- yes !!! Be sure to take time to enjoy the day - at least a few minuets. I suggest an evening stroll..

Brettski
As a long time lurker on this site I have watched your project with envy, nice job!!
I have a sugestion that will make you more productive and safer. Rent a man lift for a weekend, or even a week. They make ones that pull beyond a pick up now that work great.
I did it for some 2nd floor soffet work that was over top of a first floor porch several years ago, It would of been a nightmare with ladders & pics. I agree it wasn't cheep but after the job was done I never would have been able to do it in one weekend without the man lift, and the best part was there was it was easier on the body & no pucker factor. It was worth every penny of the rental. I was 10 times more productive.

d. o. ponds,
You are absolutely correct, and it would be an ideal situation, but there are a number of reasons that would preclude it's use....ie; the grade around the structure is extremely irregular and sloped, the ground is usually wet and often muddy, we really only work on the weekends so rental time would still be significant, blah blah.
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Regardless, thank you much for stepping forward and offering some great insight.

How to properly celebrate the fourth of July...
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Jeesh, more heat. Low 90's the whole weekend. Multiply that by all the skin protection we wear (hats, long sleeve shirts, long pants)...Oy!
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We continue to attack the highest level of UV exposure, so the "garage door side" shed dormer is next on the list. Our goal was to complete and finish the wide face of the dormer and leave the detail work at the small triangular walls on the ends.
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Having the soffits set and the frieze board beneath them was a big step recently accomplished, so the only thing left is completing the "picture frame" by adding the corner trim pieces. Then, all we need to do is fill in with the siding...yeah right...all we need to do.
One smart decision we made before we started this siding journey was purchasing pre-fabricated/pre-finished corner pieces from the siding supplier. They are 6" x 6" x 16'...and not cheap. So....it's important to get the first cuts right. I spent way too much time calculating the angles and dimensions, but they came out pretty darned good. Dski laid on 3 coats of touch up paint to seal the newly cut edges.

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We used a shorter story board to lay out the tops of each course of siding. This is done between each window along the entire length of the dormer.

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To provide further evidence of the details that slow us down, each window has a piece of aluminum flashing secured over the trim frame.

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Up the ladder, down the ladder, up the ladder.....
Before we leave, I find a view to provide the illusion of completion.

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But back up and turn the corner for the realization of how much further we have to go.

That looks great! Progress made. Yard is moving along too.

Man Brettski, I probably said this before but you couldn't afford to hire that building done given the attention to quality and detail that you put into it. It's gonna be great!

A quick review reminds me that 1 year ago, to the day, we just finished pouring the 2nd and final slab for the concrete foundation and flatwork. It's been a long year since that time, yet it feels like it passed by in 6 months.
When it's 93 degrees out in the baking sun, we will take a water (or gatorade) break every hour or so and set inside the lower garage portion. I let my mind go numb for a couple of minutes to re-kindle the mental and physical fortitude to go back out and do battle. During this time, I catch myself looking around at every stick of lumber, OSB sheeting, 28' long I joists and lam beams. I usually stammer out somethin' like "sum beach".

second verse, same as the first...
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The 2nd shed dormer is done. Well, except for the small end walls. It turned out good and knocks out the next segment of exposed, house-wrapped wall that needed protection.

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Next target is the gable wall at the electric utility entrance.

Just noticed that with both ends unfinished it looks like Its wearing a tin-foil hat .

Brettski,

That's awesome dude. Wow! What a project! I know what you mean by the heat. When my dad and I were trenching for eletrcity and building the shed last month we had to break a bunch. It's so humid here in Arkansas it's unreal. You can go outside and break a sweat just like that. Great work bud!!

Thanks RC....

you're next, my man!

Yes, looking real good, BSki! It will be nice once you get that outside all buttoned up and can get started on the inside without worrying about the weather.

Agreed, bbjr. This siding thing is really starting to get old, but I have no choice. IIRC, you laid in a huge amount of lap siding on the house you built. Did it move along quickly, or slow and tedious?

Admittingly, I subbed that part of the project out. We have a good siding guy that works on our houses, and he pays extreme attention to weatherproofing and details. Siding houses is one of my least favorite activities in the home building process, so I was not hesitant to have him do it.

For him, though, it was a slow and tedious process. He worked by himself (his 10 year old was with him to help when he could), but it took him over 8 weeks (6 days a week/10 hours a day) to finish the siding.

EDIT: Come to think of it, he lives in Illinois, over by Manteno. I'm not sure how close you are to that area, but if you don't feel like doing the gables, I can get you in touch with him.

Uh...I feel better, now....I think



too late...but thanks
(I wouldn't have it any other way. Dski would disagree)

Another Saturday/Sunday in paradise.
Some more low 90's, alot more humidity. That, and my legs are feeling the burn and the bottoms of my feet are starting to look like bird's feet from life on a ladder. Nothing that ibuprofen can't fix.
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Before:

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After:

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To look at it, it ain't much in a picture. To live it, it's like finishing a 5K marathon. I bet I was up and down the ladder over a hundred times. D'ski's knees are bum, so I try my best to handle as much of the climbing as possible. All those years and miles on the treadmill in the basement are paying back...at least for this old bod'.
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The real ace is being above the window. The special measurements and cutting at the top and bottoms of the windows is a real pain and takes the most time...and the most trips. There is one more special issue to deal with as we head for the peak. There will be an attic vent fan and louver framed in just below the peak. Yeah, more special cuts, and these are gonna occur well above the tops of the fully extended 24' ladders. Can't wait (rolleyes)

great progress b'ski.

devils advocate here....why not slap up the siding end to end the rest of the way, come back in and measure and cut out for the attic vent? the trim around the vent would hide any ugly cuts. some super stretch caulk around the vent would seal the deal.

i know i know, the lazy way aint yer way.....but i'm just sayin

Hey is that a beautiful lake in that pic. Sure looks inviting !!! Be sure to step back and look at the forest and not just the tree right in front of you. Hanging your bare feet in the water off the pier will do wonders for sore feet.