Guys,

Now that I moved back to the country, I realize I need a varmint rifle. The area is full of yotes and I also want to be able to scare my feathered neighbors away from the pond as well. I am looking for suggestions on what to buy. My property line is about 200 yards off my deck so I am looking for a gun that can reach out that far. The kicker is, in that same direction, I have neighbors about 3/4 of a mile away so I don't want a long range round. I am currently thinking a 22 shooting shorts or longs hollow point. I don't want to spend a bunch of money on the rifle and scope. Any suggestions on what to buy that will "get er done," not scare the crap out of the neighbors and not break the wallet?

Thanks!

Bill

You're wanting the ability to kill a coyote at 200 yds? Forget the shorts. If you're wanting a .22, I think you'll need a 22 magnum at least.

I want to a least scare the crap out of him. I am worried about a long range round. I have a 30 30 already. Would that be a better slow velocity round for the yotes at 200 and still not maime a neighbor at 3/4 mile?

17. Wsm?? 223?

Bill do you want to scare them or out them down. Even the lowly.22 will go a mile. Be sure what you are shooting at. I use a .25-06 for everything. Took out two yotes at 230 yards. Your thuty thuty is good for 100-150 yds. A .223 is a decent vermin round.

Bill, I love my 22 Mag for a lot of things, and I bought several hundred rounds back when everyone was buying, but today the 22mag rounds are hard to find. So whatever u buy, I would make sure the ammo is easily found.
Tracy

Pat, the 22 box says range one mile. I've never believed it. So, I just now checked some ballistic tables. The one I looked at said a drop of 163 inches at 300 yards when zeroed at 50 yards. I cannot verify this.

I love the Rem 222 that I had(now in my Grandsons hands). I remember shooting at a buck that I later ranged at 425 yards. I had zeroed at 100 yards. Aiming at the top of the shoulder, the bullet dropped at it's feet and didn't even scare him. Admittedly, I built the ammo and did the shooting so that is always highly suspect.

Bill, I would probably go with one of the 22 center fires or possibly the 24 or 25 calibers. But, if you're concerned about what might happen at 3/4 mile, look at ballistics tables before you buy.

Esshup is the real expert but has very limited internet access at this time. A week ago, he dropped a coyote at 863 yards. Yep, about 1/2 mile. Scott makes it all look easy.

It's a tough call. Getting the oomph needed to take a coyote at 200 yds while still limiting bullet travel is tricky.

If it were me, I'm not sure I would be willing to take the chance. Shooting towards the neighbors is not something I would feel comfortable doing.

Thanks for the inputs so far guys.

Thought about it and the longest shot would probably 150 yards as the terrain beyond that is tall grass prairie and probably would not have a shot anyway.

Sparkie,

There are a lot of trees between them and us but......I'm with you on the saftety thing.

I am not in a big hurry. I will leave this thread open for a while and hope for more inputs to consider.

Tony, I'm right there with you. Neighbors, neighbor's cattle, and neighbor's horses make any shot I would take difficult.

esshup's down here right now, and he recommended Barnes Varmint Grenade bullets for problematic critters. Any contact causes them to shatter, and that is of course if you reload. I'm sure he'll be back in circulation at some point, so he should have some great advice.

I am not a ballistics expert, but inside of 125 yards, my 77/44 all-weather bolt-action Ruger, using LEVERevolution ammo, is a tack driver. Without this expensive ammo it is pretty poor. Its my deer gun. Beyond 100 yds you need to compensate for some substantial drop. Its almost like carrying around a 22. Love this gun.

http://www.ruger.com/products/rotaryMagazine7744/models.html

http://www.hornady.com/store/leverevolution

A couple before pics from the trail cam. (Life is good!) Date is obviously wrong.

I love my 6mm round, but would never use it toward a neighbor's property. If I were shooting into a hill, ok. If properly tuned, most of the current high-speed centerfires could do head shots on a yote at 200 yds.

I would second the advice to use a highly frangible bullet.

Another option is to go big and slow. I use a .44mag in a rifle for deer. That will do 150 yds but is dropping. It will be crawling along the ground before 1200 yds.

Don't forget budget guys. I want to stay under $500 if possible.

Bill, do you reload? Do you have a Contender frame?

Buy a single-shot rifled barreled 12-gauge slug shotgun, site it in, and know your range. Cheap but your shoulder will keep making payments:)

I keep two varmint guns readily available, well, actually three.

At the house I have a single shot 12 guage. It is mostly for noise, but it is also good for varmints in the garden. It is hard to miss with even small varmints like tomato eating chipmonks.

I also keep a 22 readily available at the house and one in the barn. Both are extremely similar tube-fed semiautomatics. One is my original 1958-59 J.C. Higgins Model 31 with a scope. The other is a Marlin Model 60 with the same model scope as on the Model 30. Both are dead-on accurate when sighted-in with 3-4 shells from a new batch of shells. I mostly use CCI Long Rifle shells.

IMO, 22 shorts are almost useless beyond about 25-30 yards. They are slow and they drop real fast. I've got a decent .177 air rifle that out performs a 22 short. It actually makes a pretty decent squirrel gun.

I've used a friend's 177HMR. If I were younger and I had more varmints to deal with, that is what I would pick today.

YS,

Nope, don't reload. Have lived in the city for the last 40 years. Guns I still own are down at the farm in Indiana. I don't want to bring everything up here cause that would leave my brother-in-law unarmed. Guns I would consider bringing are my old single shot 410 and a 1956 Lever Action 30 30 (This one has only had 3 rounds fired thru it).

Rah,

Considered a 12, but after they put the plate in my neck, the Doc said that would be a real bad idea.

Catmando,

Shorts are worthless. Long rifle too long a range? How about 22 Longs?

Bill
If you have a lot of woods between that is safer. But you still have to know what you are shooting at and the range of the critter. With bullet drop if you are shooting at animal on the ground and you miss more than likely it will bury in ground , or ricochet away into the trees . Even a smoke pole can go a long ways

Pat

Bill
I had a neighbor that shot my Rito 6I6 Black angus bull standing about 150 yards inside my pecan orchard. He was shooting across his pasture. Glad I wasn't hunting down in there. Just food for thought.
Dale

.22 long rifle won't have the oomph and wind is a problem. Plus the soft lead bullet will tend to ricochet vs. bust up in to fragments.

For 150 yds or less, I'd look at the .17 HMR. Yes, it will blow around in the wind, but I think hitting a yote in the lungs at that distance will still put them down. They are accurate too. Savage makes some pretty good packages - gun, scope, scope mount, etc. all in one.

12 ga slugs will bounce for a long ways too, plus there's the pesky recoil thing.

Or, get a .222 or .223 and use the Barnes Varmint Grenade bullets if you can find them in a store. They will break up in teeny, tiny pieces just by hitting a grape. Google Barnes Bullets and see if you can find a video of how they work.

If you're worried about noise, purchase a silencer and apply for the permit, although just the silencer alone will blow your budget.

A .22 Long Rifle can shoot that far, but finding a gun that is accurate enough is a trick, then the shooter has to know where to point the gun because of the wind. Wind at that distance will blow a .22lr 6" easily. Yes, they WILL travel a mile if pointed up in the air..... A .17 HMR starts out much faster than a .22lr, but because of it's lighter weight it also drops faster, and it is a much more frangible round, breaking up easily, vs. a .22lr.

If the shooter knows the gun, has a good rest, and can read the wind, sub 1/2" groups at 100 yds are possible with the .17 HMR. I'd like to see that done with a .22lr!

Guess I just dated myself. Last time I bought 22 ammo you had 3 choices: shorts, longs or long rifles. I see thru wiki now that Longs are pretty much extinct! Next thing ya know, it will be impossible to buy a good 8 track player!

Bill -- Esshup won't steer you wrong. He knows guns and projectiles better than anybody else I know.


You sure caught my attention with this:



Buy your brother a cheap gun and take that one home.

I have a Winchester Model 94 30-30 carbine. It is the third one I've owned. It is my most favorite all around gun for serious and effective shooting at a distance, from ground hogs to deer.

As my eye glasses have changed over the years I have had to go with scopes on everything because I can only focus on the rear sight, the front sight, or the target -- but never all three.

Since mine is a Winchester it ejects from the top. The vintage Marlin equivalents also do. I have an offset scope using a commercial off-set mount that looks like this.



My post-1965 30-30 was drilled and tapped for this purpose. I believe most of the Marlins were also factory drilled and tapped. If yours isn't drilled, and most pre-1965 models weren't, I wouldn't drill it. It will drop the value of the gun. But, I believe most were drilled for peep sights that will go over the iron sights. I can still used a peep sight.

With a scope, the old (or new) 30-30s are very accurate and repeatable. They are light. They are rugged as a rhino. The cartridges are inexpensive. A box of 20 either 150 or 170 grain, on sale, runs $12-$15.

I've got a pristine Lafayette 8-track recorder/player. It also has the adapter to play cassettes. It is almost new. I think I got it just back a few years ago -- maybe 1976.

I'd be glad to trade it to you for that 30-30!

Guess the 30-30 has to stay. My uncle bought it for my dad's birthday in 1956 the year I was born. The birthday card is still in the case. My dad never fired it. I took it out in the early 80's behind the barn and fired three rounds at old wood fence posts still standing from when the fence went down probably 100 yards out. Took the backside out of all 3. Very very nice shooting gun. Cleaned and oiled it and put it back in the case. As far as I know, it hasn't been out of that case since.....Maybe it's time.

Edit: But that 8 track player/recorder sure is tempting! I've alwasy wanted one of those!

Thanks Scott,

I took a look at a couple of those .17 HMR Savage packages and they are right in line with what I was thinking. Question on range thou. You say they drop faster than a 22. So safe to assume they won't go 3/4 mile if fired at a target 2 or 3 feet off the ground? Any thoughts on the 30-30 as far as range and accuracy at 150 yards?

Bill D.

The .17 HMR is a really nice varmint gun. Its not good if your into cleaning for the fur. It can really damage a racoon or coyote unless you find the head.

The 30/30 on the other hand there will not be much left. A body shot on a coyote is a quick death. The 30/30 will travel much much farther and be less effected by wind. Our .17 is really effected by wind. The bullet is really light compared to the 30/30. 30/30 center fires are expensive compared to the .17 HMR rim fire.

There is now a .17 supper win mag that is rim fire and has more punch but it is new and was very hard to get amo a few months back. This would have been out choice for coyote gun but the difficulty getting amo put the damper on that. The HMR is still doing the trick.

Cheers Don.

How's the recoil on a .17 HMR? Any worse than a 410?

It's lighter than a 22 mag, no recoil at all just loud

I'd rather have a .22 mag it's not effected by wind like the 17 is

I guess to be fair to this discussion, I will throw one more option into the mix.

Keep in mind the criteria. Budget less than $500. Relatively small recoil. Range - the round must not be a concern at 3/4 mile but not be in the dirt at 150 yards.

So...what about a 20 gauge with slugs? I am thinking at 100 yards slug will drop maybe 6 inches and at 150 yards maybe 12 to 18 inches? Thinking, as long as you took a couple shells out of a new box of ammo and test fired them to get the idea with that particuar ammo what the drop would be at 150 yards .... I know it will not have big penetration power or great accuracy but, would it get the job done and not be a danger to the neighbors?

If you don't like recoil you won't like a 20 ga with slugs. Depending on what style of shotgun those have a good wallop on both ends. At close range they are deadly. I had a single shot H &R that would stomp your a$$.

I know what you mean. I shot a 16 gauge Mossberg back in the 70's my buddy gave me. I owned it a week. Then I understood why he gave it to me! Beat the crap out of ya even with a good recoil pad. Made a 1100 12 gauge feel like a BB gun. I was thinking a good 20 would not have that kick.

I gave that 16 to a guy at work I had a real dislike for!

Go to a gun show and look around you can find some deals if you know what you're doing

Funny Pat. Should be pretty obvious by now I don't!

Least I didn't say that! LOL

Very few shotguns have the effective range that you want. I expect that the 16 gauge had lightweight wood that transferred the kick to your shoulder.

I have a 28 gauge single shot that kicks more than my Grandsons Quigley 45/120. I despise that shotgun.

At that budget, are you planning to use open sites? IMO, there is nothing worse that cheap glass.

I was thinking I would buy a rifle scope package. Would rather not spend all the budget. Lot and lots of things to do around this new place and all cost money!

I'd still go with the 17 HMR package deal from Savage. Recoil is no worse than the .22lr, noise is a bit more, but nothing like a shotgun or centerfire rifle. IIRC you can get a .17 HMR package for under $400 if you shop around.

All bullets drop at the same rate when fired from a gun. I forget the equasion, but it is the same for all falling objects. So, the faster that a bullet travels, the further it will go before dropping the same distance.

Google "drop chart" for any specific cartridge, but make sure that you have the same zero - say 100 yds. Here's one for the .17 HMR.

http://gundata.org/blog/post/17-hmr-ballistics-chart/

If you want more answers, download any free ballistic calculator that you can find on the internet. Use a 100 yd zero for all the data, and look at the different cartridges/rifles, etc.

Here's one. ballistic calculator

FWIW, a .17 HMR drops 3" at 150 yds, a .22lr drops 11" at 150 yds. Both sighted in at 100 yds.

Also, you have to look at ammo availability since you will be buying ammo and not "rolling your own". See if you can find .22lr ammo in the stores...........

esshop - That is really good info. I never thought about it in those simple terms - Speed is your friend if you judge distance poorly (I finally bought a range finder and place yard markers near my stands). Your simple observation makes me think that a .243 would be a much better deer gun for me than a 3006. Thank you!

Bill, on the package deals the scope is generally of questionable quality.

I would go with a budget Leopold before a high-end Bushnell any day. You can get a new VX-1 3-9X40mm under $250.

Esshup,

That calculator is very useful! Thank you! Looks like both a .17 and a 22lr will be in the dirt well before 500 yards.

Dave and RAH,

Thanks for the scope inputs. I will definitely keep it in mind when I buy!

Get SNEAKY! Ground blind set up so that the neighbors are not a problem. Reduce your shooting distance so that the .22lr can be used for a head shot. Get a varmint call. Yotes are willy critters, (Hah!), but at my place, Florida Panhandle, I can call a couple in every week to within 30 yds and dust 'em off with a my AR with a .22lr upper and a reddot zero magnification optic. All of a sudden it's kinda fun having them around!! I've also got a Remington 870 pump shotgun, the black one with the open cylinder bore in 20ga. There is an after market stock for it called a Knox Stock that has a recoil reduction feature that really works when shooting buckshot and slugs. I don't think it would make an effective long range solution, but from the ground blind it would absolutely destroy them.

Bill you should compare the .22 magnum not the .22long rifle, two entirely different cartridges, scope - 3x9 x 40mm Leupold is a great scope that will last a lifetime

.22LR is going to have between 3 to 4-1/2 feet of drop at that range(sighted at 50yrds). I can tell you from experience that you will be trying to compensate for an equal amount of windage as well.

I am looking at a lever action Henry with a walnut stock (it can be chambered for 22lr, 22mag or .17HMR so that is not a problem). Does anybody know if Winchester or somebody else has a similar lever action offerring? I can get the Henry right around the $500 budget.

Edit: And before you ask why I want lever action the answer is, cause I like the look and feel. My old man brought me up watching westerns. Can you imagine the old "Rifleman" TV series if he was shooting a bolt action from the hip?!!!...It will also be a nice match with my lever action 30-30 in a gun case.

Bill,
You could get the 22LR Henry and a decent scope for right around the $500 you're wanting to spend. Shooting the CCI Stinger 22 ammo you're looking at about 1650fps with a 30gr bullet, if I recall correctly. That's getting out there, but might not quite have the reach you're looking for. I taught my kids to shoot with a Henry 22 youth model...really great little gun, fairly accurate and will last forever,I'd buy another anytime.

Again if I'm remembering, the 22Mag and 17 HMR are going to be significantly more expensive---with a good scope you'll go over $500, but you'll also gain a lot in distance as many have noted.

Don't know about Winchester, but Browning makes an extremely light, beautiful 22lr LA in several grades...the lowest will set you back over $500, so probably not an option.

If I get diagnosed with a terminal illness in the next couple weeks, I'll send you my Marlin 1894c in 218 Bee--that is the perfect varmint gun.

I don't know what Winchester offers currently, but I have a model 9422XTR lever action that I purchased many years ago. It's a fine shooter, and undoubtedly one of the smoothest feeding rifles I own. It's chambered for 22LR, but it will handle any combination of shorts, longs, or long rifles.....throw all the rounds in a bucket, reach in and grab a handful....and that rifle will feed them unerringly.

It has accounted for literally hundreds of squirrels. I do find it a little heavy, however.

Dun need one that bad man! Looking forward to seeing yer posts for a long time! I appreciate yer input though!

Yeah, that stuff happens when you start to get old Buddy. Trust me, I know! I'll use the deck railing to support it

Browning used to make a lever action with a very short throw, AND the trigger traveled with the lever.....no pinching your fingers with that one. Don't know if they are still that way or not. I second Yolk's opinion, though..very fine rifles.

My pretty recently acquired one is still that way. Browning definitely marches to the beat of a different drummer sometimes, the BLR and Tbolt configurations come to mind....but produces a really high quality product.

Real wood stock? I guess I am old school but, I like real wood not a plastic.

Bill -- by now, your brain must be like a class 5 hurricane swirling inside your skull.



For now, it might be best to get a lever-action Daisey Red Ryder BB gun. Get a 1/2 pint "milk carton" of BBs. Together, the combination won't come close to breaking your budget. It won't even hit a coyote in the eye at 200 yards.

Load it up with 200 projectiles. Take it down to the pond with an empty plastic soda bottle. Throw the bottle in the pond and start plinking. Let your mind wander before you make the next step.



Ralphie

Bingo!!

I actually still have the old BB gun from when I was 8 years old, wood stock, sounds like very sound advice!

Just joking. Actually, I got the response from PBF I had hoped for. Lots of opinions and reasons why. Now, it is up to me. Just like when the forum gives advice to a member about his pond or anything else. The inputs are there as food for thought but, at the end of the day, it's yer decision which, IMO, is one of the reasons why this forum is still going after all these years and growing.

Ken,
That's classic stuff! LOL

Just to close the loop....After looking at all the posts and PMs one more time, I am going middle of the road, Henry lever action chambered for 22 Magnum....as soon as my dang FOID card arrives!

Thanks for all the help guys!

What's an FOID card?

IMO A way for Illinois politicians to fund their expensive getaways!

Serious though, Illinois requires a Firearms Owner ID card to own/buy a gun or ammo.

Obviously you do not have it yet. How long has it been since you applied?

Well since ya asked....I mailed in the application March 3rd. Got it back March 12th stating they no longer accept paper applications after March 9th. Their letter postmarked March 8th. I appled online March 14th. Now waiting. They say will be 30 days.

I feel sorry for those of you who live under the communist flag. Maybe someday we can all enjoy the freedoms that those of us in the free states enjoy.

Bill D, I love my 22Mag Remington simi auto but the shells are hard to find. If u have a problem locating soma ammo send me a PM and I will let u have a box of mine. Maybe trade out a YP trip as I have never caught or had one of the famous YP sandwiches, that I hear of here

Tracy

Thanks Tracy,

That brings up a good point. Maybe I will wander a couple of the local places that sell ammo to make sure that is not going to be a problem.

If yer ever up around here, stop by and I will hook you up with a YP sandwich! Hopefully, some of my original stockers will be pushing 9 to 10 inches by this fall. Assuming they are still in there. I've never wet a line in my pond so not sure what's in there!

Bill good call on the 22mag. I would definitely go with the Remington semi as well and a nice scope. Shoulder strap and your off. Don't get any one with the flat straight clip grab the ones with the role clip that when in place sits flush with the bottom of the gun.

The boys 17HMR has the straight clip and one 22 we had did. If happen to be sitting the gun on the clip when shooting she will jam the next round if semi and can be difficult after time to get the next in with a bolt action.

Cheers Don.

P.S. I really like the 20 gauge rifle barrel with a sabot slug. Stopping power of a 12 gauge but less kick. They are $$ for each shot. Our deer hunt here is shotgun only. I hunted first with a single shot Russian 12 gauge with rifled slugs and that thing kicked like a mule. The gun was super light so nothing to hold her back but my own shoulder. The pumps like the wing master has weight to them so the kick is not as bad.

Welcome to IL.

Suppressors were mentioned- No Go in IL, at least for now. Check back in a few years, that may be changed.
We just got SBR's (Short Barrel rifle's) approved, with a few extra hoops to jump through. Thank you NRA, ISRA (IL State Rifle Association) and all others involved.

FOID, enacted in 1968- needed to even buy/posses ammo and firearms, for residents. Even airguns over .18/700 fps. We even have some towns that prohibit air guns completely.
If you visit from out of state and plan to shoot here, bring lots of ammo or have a local buy it for you. Even if it is legal for an out of stater to buy ammo (limited exceptions to FOID act) most places won't mess with it. Or just cross back into a free state to re-supply.
And remember IL does NOT honor any other states CHL/CCW (Concealed Carry), except in your vehicle.
And most non-residents can not even pay for an IL CHL yet.
But it is getting better.

22 Mag ammo- Good luck, I don't think it has really come back into stock yet. But I haven't really looked for it lately.
A quick search of some ammo search engines turned up a few mail order options (like 2 or 3) 35-50 cents per round plus shipping and a walmart search turned up none local to me (Kankakee Co).
You can get any of the major handgun rounds for the same or less than that (9mm/40/38/45)

I would seriously rethink the rimfire option as I don't see ammo really coming back into NORMAL stocking for another few years. Too much pent up demand, too many people that haven't even shot any for a couple of years because of cost/availability. When it start becoming more available we will be buying it all up.
I love my .22's, but with only a few thousand rounds on hand I haven't shot it in a few years, I keep my stash for students and kids. And some of those I gladly paid $45 dollars per 500 for when things were really bad. I got caught with out a good stock on hand, and then we got CCW and I started teaching classes for it.
I can reload centerfire handgun for less than I can buy .22's for.
It's gotten a little better, but still is scarce or expensive.

If you are set on a lever action, a 357 would fit the bill nicely, but may be out of the budget.
The Rossi's get mixed reviews, still may be worth a look.

Please be careful with your shooting, We had a neighbor put a 40 cal round through our classroom right above one of my instructors head. He had just sat down a minute before. Round ricocheted off of frozen ground and traveled another 150 yds before punching through the wall.

Bill, what area of N. IL are you in?

If you are not too far away (Kankakee Co) I can keep my eyes open for something that might work for you.

Although the only lever I have found recently at a cheap price was a black tactical thing.
Not my cup of tea, even if most of my guns are black and plastic.
A lever action should look like a cowboy gun, for me at least.

And keep an eye out on Armslist, you may find a local deal on there, it can happen.

Hey Matt,

I am in Boone County. I was looking at Henry's cause they are still wood stocks. Very disappointed in the quality I see now compared to my 1956 30-30 lever action. The new ones look like toy guns.

On ammo availability.....I was at Cabelas near Chicago yesterday looking thru their ammo out front and saw no 22 Magnum rounds so I asked the guy at the desk. He had some behind the counter. He said they keep the hardest to get ammo behind the counter. Apparently, 22LR is the one they have the hardest time keeping stock. His explanation was it is one of the least expensive rounds to shoot so everybody uses them for target shooting.

Bill,

From personal experience, the newer 30-30 lever actions, particularly those that are still considered Winchester 94s, may not be built like the pre-1964s. But, they are still pretty good guns. They are built a little different. Most manufacturers moved to chemically-coated stamped-steel in the 1960s that doesn't take bluing. They have hollow vs., solid roll pins. But, they are still pretty darn rugged and solid.

A couple of years ago I got to borrow a friend's Henry classic lever action 22LR. Like the Winchester 94s, these aren't the guns of the 60s and before. But, I found it to be very well built, very rugged, and very accurate even though it was sighted for my friend's vision, and not mine. I still ended by going with a Marlin Model 60 .22 semi-auto. But, that was me wanting something nearly identical to my old JC Higgins. I love it.

By the way, we cleaned out my 92 year old father's-in-law closet last weekend. He passed away in December. I resurrected a Daisy Red Ryder that I gave him as a gift many years ago.

Don't over think this whole thing. Find something that is comfortable and that you like.

I love classic old rifles, and even a few classic handguns that are fun to look at, fun to shoot, accurate, and just plain fun. Not all do the jobs I need done. I also really don't want anything that has a clip -- too easy for my ADHD mind to lose.

I'm happy having a good 1300 fps .177 pellet air rifle for quiet squirrel/chipmunk elimination, decent 22 semi-auto center fires with tube feeds for general purpose varmint removal, lever action 30-30s for getting dinner, and 12 gauge shotguns as all around pest use. My gun safe has a number of other things, but they very seldom ever get used.

I don't know what it is like in you part of IL, but I've found a lot of really nice rifles and shotguns at farm auctions in our area. The wood may look beat up. The metal may have lost its bluing, or other coating. But, if the barrel is clean and un-rusted inside, and the mechanics work reasonably well, they can often be gotten for really good prices. Parts are still reasonably available for rifles and shotguns that are well over a 100 years old.

You just need to take an experienced friend to the sales. I've got some really wonderful old Damascus steel barrel shotguns. I no longer re-load, so I no longer dare shoot them. But, they sure are pretty. youjust have to decide on what is really useful.

Ken

Thanks Ken.

Your comments bring me all the way back to when I was 14 and my dad brought me that old 410 he picked up for probably $5 somewhere. To anyone else, it was a rusty beatup piece of junk. I worked hard stripping that gun down and bringing it back to life. Now, 45 years later, it is still a beautiful gun. Maybe it is time, I follow that old plan and bring a discarded piece of history back. I will start looking around.

Thanks again!

Bill

I have a closet full of shooting irons. Most, like me, are considered classics or at least vintage. All of the closet queens are WWII era. With the exception of the Swedish Mauser, the Win model 73 in 38-40, and the pre 64 Win 30-30, all are 30-06.

I recently traded 100 pounds of lead ingots got an old Marlin Model 10 single shot 22. It takes up less room than the buckets of lead and allows me to shoot tree rats with Calibri's. I still have about 100 lbs of lead wheel weights waiting for me to get bored enough to melt down.

I also have 7 or 8 pistols of different calibers but am not much good with short guns. Most are 40+ years old and go from 22 through 45 ACP.

I very rarely shoot these guns but none are for sale.

I recently bought a Ruger American in 270. I had a scope around that I put on it and it shoots pretty well. I don't anymore. I can't really get used to the idea of plastic clips and stocks. I know they are called "composites" but to me they are still plastic. I still prefer wood and steel. That is the only new in the box gun that I have bought in many years.

With the exception of the 22's, I reload everything. When I got the 270 I bought new dies, brass, bullets, etc. That gets expensive. I have many thousands of dollars in reloading gear and components. Someday all of this stuff goes to my only Grandson who hunts and likes to reload. I started teaching him when he was about 5 years old. At that time he sat in a deer stand with me. He had his BB gun and I had my 30-06. He got to take the first shot and if it wasn't a clean kill, I had to finish them off with my 30-06. His Mom, my daughter, just bought him a Quigley 45/120 with a set trigger. That sucker is heavy but doesn't kick much. I tried it but can't get used to the set triggers. Like me, he's a gun junkie.

I've known for some time that I have way too much shooting stuff.

It is spring cleaning time in the basement.

As I was inspecting and doing a final cleanup on guns that were not properly put back in the locker over the winter, I laid these on the floor. I guess all could be considered varmint guns.

If I were a varmint, the scariest would be the one at the bottom. Big barrel -- same size outside dimension as the double-barrel 12-gauge at the top of the picture. That thing could shoot your eye out! It is a genuine Daisy Red Ryder.

The one below the double-barrel always looks scary too -- it is a .177 pellet gun that cost me about $25 with the 4x scope from the old Cummins Tool company. At 30 yards it is darn accurate, and will go right through a squirrel.

Sweet !!!! I bought a Western Feild semi auto 22 with a 4 power in 67 fro $40. I've fired thousands of rounds through it and it broke two days before Squirrel season last yr. I'm gonna try ta get it fixed but don't have my hopes too high.

If you have neighbors you are worried about shooting towards for safety reasons, have you thought of trapping the yotes? You'll reduce their numbers much faster and with less issues than shooting may bring you. Course you also have to be sure your neighbors dogs and kids are not running around your property as well. But you will clean those pesky critters out quicker trapping than shooting. As for the feathered friends, buy some popper shotgun blanks. They shoot no shot, only a primer or powder load noise. Just some additional thoughts.

I would recommend that you get a nice AR rifle in the standard .223 caliber. It will shoot 200 yards accurately without any issues. It will kill coyotes with no problems. It is also very effective against deer sized game. It is also a great platform for defending against angry looters...which can happy almost anywhere these days.

That would be my advice to you.