The last week or so my PS are building spawning beds around the pond. They are clearing spots and protecting these areas, but I haven't seen any spawing going on. They are really colorful and agressive during this period. I suspect the spawn will accure any day now that the full moon is upon us.

The fry of last year are over an inch long and growing. I hope the trout will feed on the new spawn, or I'll be over run with Pumpkin Seeds.

Scruffy -- can you get us a picture of a spawning colony?

Dave,
Went out to the pond to get some pictures and found the water is now cloudy. Not sure if I could get a decent picture. Once the water clears again I try, only hope they will still be on the beds.

The pond has been dropping like a rock since we have gotten to the summer heat cycle. I even lost one of my trout yesterday. I'm afraid to take the water temp, it's got to be in the 70's. The one good thing is the shallow well is still working, as of this morning. It only puts out a gallon every 2 minutes and that's not much to cool things down.

Scruffy -- it's really tough to get a good spawning bed photo. That's why I asked! Ha! Good luck with the heat. Mother Nature is still in charge, isn't she?

Had some time at the pond today so I tried for the photos on the spawning beds. Not very good, the water is covered with pine pollen, but here they are.

Scruffy those are great photo's of PS's on their beds, I hope the temps. stay cool enough for your trout. How much has your water dropped?

It's been dry here too but I just checked the radar and there's lots of T-storms west of us, we could sure use a couple inches of rain.

AP,

If our 'T' storms are any indication that are headed east toward you you'll get plenty of rain! We've had two lines of storms come through with at least an inch each!

Sure hope so, the last 2 weeks all the wet weather has gone south of us.

AP, the pond has dropped about 4 feet. I lost one trout about a week ago after a 90+ degree day. The rest seem to be holding up. Just got in from feeding them and the water temps are making them hungry.

I sure hope the storms show up, I need water bad. The pond looks like late August water height. My well timer also just bit the dust, so I'm now unable to add the cold water to the pond from the well.

Any suggestions on a low cost repeat cycle timer would be appreciated.

Here's one similar to the one I have for 110V, if that's what your pump is.
http://www.amazon.com/UPM-Marketing-Prog...0457&sr=8-7

For all the fish ID experts, is it possible that the first photo of scruffy's PS. is a longear sunfish, the ear flap seems pretty long?

AP,
I'm pretty sure it's a PS, might be the distrotion from looking through the water. The long ears, I don't believe have the bright colors of a PS?

BTW, I put the new pump timer in today so the well is up and running again. Haven't taken the water temp, but the trout are still active, even though the water is down 4 plus feet. We've been getting showers off and on but really need a lot more water to raise the pond level.

Yeah looking at the photo the ear flap looked real long but your right about distortion when photographing thru water. I've got a PS guarding one of two spawning tubs in the mini-pond.

We got about 3/4 inch rain total from the last 4 days, did you get much? Maybe the next 2 days will amount to something.
Is that well pump running on 110 or 220v?

It's been raining is small amounts around here most storms past to the south of us. We are supposed to get a 1/2 inch or so today, but will see?

The well pump is 110 volts. I had a digital timer on it for the last three years. It was something I picked up used. I called the manufacture and they said it was to old to repair. I went on line and found a replacement from a hydroponic supply house that is a good replacement. Shopped around for the best price and it was a 1/4 of the price of the old timer when new.

I program the well from 1-2 minutes off and 30-60 seconds on, depending on the water height in the well. I only get about a gallon of water per cycle that is sprayed over the pond surface. Can't keep up with the leak, but it puts cold water into the pond.

I also purchased a new air pump, like the one you use, from the same supplier, at the same price you paid. All I need to do before winter is to put in the larger air line to my soaker hose coil. The line is 3/8 ID and I plan on using the tie wrap sand filled hose idea to hold it down. The pond is only about 4 feet deep now so using the air to cool it down might not be an advantage. I am still running (24/7) the waterfall submersible pump which is drawing water from the bottom of the pond to increase the DO.

AP - describe your spawning tubs??

Scruffy that little Ecoplus air5 is a great little air pump, this is my third season using it, and runs nonstop all winter.

Your Trout might get a break tomorrow, they're predicting heavy rain, keep your fingers crossed.


Dave I have a 1400 gal. mini pond with a liner so I put 2 plastic oil drain pans about 14in. diameter in the pond filled with river sand and gravel.
The 10 PS's I put in wintered in my 100 gal. RAS, now I'm hoping they'll spawn in the small pond.
There's a male guarding each pan now.


Here's a link to the photo's of them as I transferred them last week.
http://forums.pondboss.com/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=218753#Post218753

Here is the rest of AP's info



http://forums.pondboss.com/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=218877&page=1

1

2

3

4

5

6

7

8

9

10

I believe the males are numbers 3,4,5,9&10.

Great tub pics, AP!! I've used those for SMB and seen them nest on them. However, have not used them for sunfish. I'll have to steal and save your pictures and save them for teaching??

Thanks also for that link. I missed that thread, so appreciated the link.

AP, Thanks for your link, I also missed that thread. Nice photos also.

There seems no easy way to sex the PS other than aggression or disstended bellies. Both male and females are very colorful. My PS had to build their own nests. "The old fashion way".

BTW finally getting some rain, although not down pours, but cooling off the water temps. I hooked up the air pump to the old air line last night, (figured it won't freeze up now) to add more DO to the water since it is so low and dirty.

These pictures in this thread are great. We had cold weather and I was able to do some salvage flooding on the pond ahead of a cold snap so we can ice skate again....

But the warm spell and seeing the bottom in the shallows makes one want to plan for the spring spawn. I like these spawning 'tubs' in this old thread. What is the source or origin of these?

I was thinking, could I buy some cheap food grade barrels on craigslist? They about give them away. I would go for probably the 30 gallon size in plastic. This place also has some cool looking 15 and 30 gallon steel barrels. Never saw those before!

plastic and steel barrels for spawning beds

I could cut them up. The bottom of the barrel makes a good sized 'tub'. I should make the sides what, 8"?? 12"?? fill with gravel and place them in the shallows and dig them in the ground a bit? But with one barrel I can cut the top and bottom, but then there are probably 24-30" left for the middle section to be cut into 2 maybe 3 more hoops.

Do these middle hoops HAVE to have a bottom? Or can I just place the rings in the pond and fill with gravel? Would a simple piece of vinyl tarp work for a bottom so the gravel won't disappear into the pond bottom?

Other ideas for make shift spawning beds?

How high off the bottom is too high?

I know the PS, RES, BG etc can probably just as easily make their own in the shallow sandy areas too.

I have RES only but was thinking of trying a few PS as well if I can source locally.

And one last afterthought if I may, I see i can source 'nonfoodgrade' 55 gallon plastic barrels easier and more cheaply. Is the diameter of the 55 gallon size too large? If so, I could take the 'hoops', cut one side and overlap to reduce diameter and still use them that way perhaps...

55 gallon barrel diameter is a good size for sunfish spawn nest sites. Often the sunfish will create a nest depression about twice the diameter of the length of the fish. Extra diameter space is not a disadvantage.

Nest height of 6" to 10" is probably an ideal height. Experiment with several heights and report your results.

The nest does not have to have a bottom to it, although when placed in a very soft bottom a higher rim would be an advantage. Fill the cylinder with all the same size gravel or use larger gravel/stones in a bottom layer to minimize the top layer from sinking into the soft bottom sediment. the advantage to nests with bottoms is the nest with gravel could be moved if needed.

IMO nonfood grade materials are okay for nest rims if the material is thoroughly washed & rinsed.

BG and PS nests are similar. Look at any of the BG bed threads for info. Be sure to locate any beds away from where silt will wash in on them.

CC-This look familiar?


Got a bunch from a place on Maple Island by me.

I have a number of 30G closed top plastic barrels that had Sunny Delight or Dr. Pepper concentrate in, that are going to be in an auction this spring, but if you want a couple, I'll save them out for you. White are SD and Blue are Dr.P. Been rinsed out really well with the best well water quality in the state of MI.

Also have a bunch of the same but 55G that I made planters out of. Those are going into a large roll off dumpster for spring clean up. You can have those if you like.

Groenink's in Nunica usually has a good supply of barrels for less money.

JKB,
Thanks a lot for the kind offer. Let me see what size I decide to go with and then I'll see what is close by me. Don't hold them back just for me, when it is time for your spring cleanup I may not be ready so just give them to someone or put them on CL or toss them.

I may end up doing something else spur of the moment too.

I think I read someone using kids wading pools as spawning beds. They would clearly be bigger than a 55 gallon drum bottom.

Bill, ewest, you mention some good tips. I theoretically could have some silt from run off from a heavy rain from the more sloped banks, but that risk is probably more or less even all the way around the pond. The grass should control most of the 'wash-in'.

What depth? And also has anyone figured out which side of the pond (N,S,E or W) is preferred? Just the warmest water side?

I've not gotten a good visual on my RES but was hoping that they were making themselves scarce in the deeper water. There should have been enough size on them to do a fall spawn last fall but didn't see any. I'm hoping like crazy that I see some spawn this spring. Either that or an unknown predator got them or I had a winter kill (selective) that I was unaware of along the way.

I've caught 1 - 1.5" 'sunfish' appearing fish in minnow traps so probably just be patient, be patient...

"that moment when you don't recognize the post or look at the post date and say to your self" "Is Dave secretly still alive!" Then say "Wait, Some one has to be hacking that name."

It took a minute but I got it figured out....


Cool stuff all the same.! Also I was concerned about PS spawning in NH this time of year

fishm_n, Yes, I had that moment too. I noted under Dave's signature line that Bob Lusk wrote a nice note to try to prevent folks from making our mistake. We still miss his input though!

I fixed the links in AP's post above with pics.

Here are the PS offspring from those fish shown above

A couple of things you might look into for spawning containers. I have not used these, but think they might work well.

One is a plastic hot water heater tank basin. The basin that keeps your floor from getting wet in case your hot water heater leaks. I think they make them in more than one size. Check the big box stores like Lowes or Home Depot.

The other thing I have thought of that I think would work well but it is not round but square or rectangle. It is the temporary concrete mixing tubs. I think they come in a couple of different sizes. Have seen them near the concrete stuff in Home Depot. They are used to mix up small batches of concrete mix with a shovel.

At the end of winter, if you can find any of the kids round snow toboggens (sp?). Probably too expensive unless they are on the discount rack when the snow season ends. Made of tough plastic.

What's about 12 inch plastic nursery pots? Cut the middle out and use the bottom and top for depth .

what is the best material to use making spawning beds for bass in a small pond (1/2 acre)?

For LMB - Small rock and sand away from where silt washes into the pond .

For SMB see this -- http://forums.pondboss.com/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=92626#Post92626


SMB on bed