While feeding the fish I decided to try to catch a few. A couple gills were 8-9 inches long but the last one I caught was a whopper at just over 10 inches. Unfortunately I didn't have my scale with me but had to be around a pound and a half. It bled a little during the process, hopefully its ok and I can catch it again.

Nice fish!

My experience is, if you see blood, odds are not good the fish will survive. Hope you have better results than I get!

Nice big hybrid!

Thanks. Its one of the biggest Ive seen come from this small pond.

What are you using to catch them?

That's a beauty.

Super nice hybrid BG. Do you know if it is an original stocked fish or a natural hybrid that was spawned in the pond?

Nice fish . Guys what do you see that makes that a hybrid ? I can't tell.. Were HBG stocked ?

Translucent orange margin on the opercular tab is what I saw. Can't really see the size of the mouth very well although it does not look overly large (for a HBG) in the picture.

Not a lot of other GSF characteristics. That is why I ask if it was from a stocked fish or a natural cross. Wondered if it might be from a HBG male x BG female showing only marginal GSF.

Pictures are so hard to tell though. It is sure a lot easier for me when I can have fish in hand. Then things seem more obvious. May be just the picture.

A fish I would be proud to have in my pond at any rate.

Yellow margins on pectoral fins and feint outline on opercular tab were my tips, but does look like a lot of BG genetics - could be f2 HBG/BG?

Nothing screamed 'hybrid' to me.

I agree - can't tell from what I see. A nice fish either way !

Standing pat on hybrid. Yellow on fins and red on opercular just say HBG to me.

I agree with hybrid determination. The gill flap is characteristic of hybrid, although the angle is a little hard to see clearly. The lower edge of the flap has a light orange margin. The back edge is very hard to see. Notice the yellow edges of the pelvic fins. Pure BG do not have yellow edges of the pelvic fins.

My RES tend to have a slight red tipping to the lower fin margins. It is more noticable in the small fish.

Who knows, maybe they are all hybrids.

I think this photo emphasizes the importance of "it depends".

I've never found a HBG blueprint that definitively provided a correct identification in every case. Some see this photo and struggle to see HBG, yet I see nothing but HBG in it.

CNBG can have white , yellow and/or orange on their fins and or tails. CNBG genetics have been shown (exhibited) up the east coast as far a Delaware. This led to early genetic misclassification.

I don't see red on gill flap just some blood. My guess is HBG but .. local adaptation is possible and a pond history would sure help.

What is the pond history?

Fish Fan should go catch some more "bluegill" and get better side view pictures.

That would be great !

In the mean time till he does, I caught a few today that might add to the discussion.

First one is a RES, I'm guessing female. But is it a "pure" RES or does it have some "other" in it??? The pectoral fin does not look all that long. The orange tab is not real big and distinctive on this particular fish, but it is a distinctively orange tab (unlike GSF which tends to be a translucent orangish). I still do not know what I am looking at as far as the pharyngeal crushers are concerned. Would like to see a picture of such. Looked in its mouth but could not identify anything. I know this fish does not look like my northern BG, my CNBG nor any hybrids that I know are hybrids. I would not consider it in great condition. It looks kind of skinny to me (compared to my other sunfish), but may be because of recent spawn.

For comparison purposes, the second picture is a similar size BG, the third picture is another BG with considerable different coloring than picture 2 and the fourth is a CNBG that earlier this year had been transferred from my sediment pond. All fish were caught in the same area within a half hour. The fifth and sixth pictures are of the same hybrid. I would normally say it was just a HBG, but the mottled cheek makes me wonder if it might have some RES in it. In the picture it does not show up clearly like it did in real life, but the opercular tab has a distinctive translucent orange around the edge reminiscent of GSF. RESxBG or RESxGSF or BG/GSF?????? Or just call it a mutt???? At any rate, I like it and it went back in the pond. Would not mind having a bunch more like it. I caught some bigger BG, but tried to use pictures of similar size fish.

I will say it again. Looking at these pictures is a lot tougher than looking at the fish in real life. Things that stood out to me as I inspected each fish did not necessarily show up as clearly in the pictures. The coloration change (within less than a minute) of the hybrid would almost make a person think it was pictures of different fish.

Incidentally, all caught using a cane pole from the bank (wife has family reunion tomorrow and fixed up a bunch of cane poles for the kids to fish with, without letting them loose with my good rods ). Had to test it out to make sure it worked! Caught about fifteen fish in thirty minutes so low tech works.

I'll take a stab at it, snrub.

First pic, female RES.
second and third pic, male northern BG.
fourth pic, male CNBG.
fifth and sixth pic, male hybrid GSF x BG. Or BG x GSF.

Oops....that's what I get from posting early.

fifth and sixth pic, RES x BG...or BG x RES. No GSF that I see.

Thanks Tony!

The one thing that threw me (among many things that throw me) about the hybrid is it has a translucent border to the opercular tab. It does not show up in the picture very well and it not only is the GSF'y translucent orange but it also has black pigment mixed in the border (which makes it especially not show up in the picture like it does in real life). The first picture faintly shows it best.

The mottled cheeks sure made me think there might be some RES involved. That is the only original stocked (I assume it is an original stocker by the size) hybrid that I recall looked like that one. The thirty or so others that I have caught look like traditional BG/GSF.

Will take a stab later . Was the camera in stretch mode ?

I ran across a good comparison-image on another forum and thought it might be of interest here....

That body pattern and coloration looks very much like the hybrids I am getting out of my sediment pond that has both CNBG and RES (as well as a few GSF).

It is like the green flecks of the GSF are incorporated within the vertical stripes of the BG. That pattern/coloration shows up vividly in my 2-3" fish that I catch in the minnow traps. It has stayed evident in the 4-5" fish as they have grown. About 6" is as big as any I have got so far.

The reddish/orange translucent ear tab border also prevalent. Mouth size about half way between GSF and BG.

I was hoping for RESxGSF but it is likely they are CNBGxGSF or reciprocal.

That's my take on the top four, in line with you Tony. I am curious what characteristics on the bottom fish hint at hybridization to you. Looks like BG dominant to me, I also don't see GSF in it, what RES genetics do you see?

It does not show up well in the picture. And I know from my reading on this forum that color is not a reliable indicator.

But the fish had the mottled cheeks just like my RES do. And you can not see it on the opercular tab hardly in the picture (look at the very last picture and you can see it faintly towards the lower edge of the tab) but the border has a translucent orange border. It is not bright and it has black pigment mixed in so it is hard to see in the picture. All my BG have solid black opercular tabs. All my GSF have translucent orange borders on the tabs. All my RES have solid orange or red borders. That fish has a translucent orange border with lots of black pigment mixed in so it is hard to see in the picture.

Those two things, the non-solid border on the opercular tab (green fishy)and the mottled cheeks (not like GSF bars, but like the RES cheeks) are what make me wonder if it is not a RES/GSF/BG mut of some sort. Whatever it is it is a pretty decent fish and I would not feel ashamed to have a lot of them like it.

TJ, I see three characteristics that I think indicate RES x BG hybrid. Most noticeable to me is the splotchy, mottled cheeks. Very common to see that on BRES hybrids in our ponds. The overall coloration is also a match, the dark green along the back, and especially the long run of copper on the breast and sides, reaching nearly to the tip of the pectoral. And I think, although the photo doesn't show it very well, that there is a bit of an outline on the opercular.

You have a lot more experience with BRES than myself, I know the F1 lepomis characteristics are highly variable.

Wow, didn't realize this thread got revived lol. I'll try to get all the questions answered. It was caught on a 3'' shiner that I was trying to catch some of the bigger bass in my private pond. I had quite a few shipments of bluegills delivered in the last few years and the guy mentioned that he had hybrids mixed in with the bunch.

Another pic. Most of the ones I took are about the same angle.

Hybrid. Nice one.

The next above picture has a better side view of the fish. The boarder or light colored margin outside of the dark portion is now more apparent on the view of this hybrid. The pectoral fish is also too short for a pure strain BG.

Above fish

Ocular flap structure = hybrid

pec fin = possible/probable hybrid

mouth can't see

color = not male but iffy

size = adult

fin structure = fast growth/near adult

? female HBG = rare

Lot of guessing here.

snrub's 6

WAG work here

1- I have never seen a RES look like this. Does have some RES traits.

2- BG mostly with other genes as well (pec fin looks HBG)

3- BG male

4- CNBG male

5 & 6- BG (likely CNBG) possible/probable RES mix

Every time I look I see something different - I think.

I should've elaborated on my opinion a little. BG x GSF hybrid, appears male.

Clarification...
Referencing fishfans photo.

Ewest thanks for the input.

Concerning #1 it is possible that it could be a hybrid of some sort. It does not look exactly like most of my other RES, although I can not say I have caught a huge number of the adults so I do not have a lot of references to go by. The pectoral fin looked a little short for a RES to me. But the orange tab was definitely of a solid nature and not like any GSF tab border I have seen. The most numbers of RES I have seen are the more recent ones stocked in my sediment pond and they are all still pretty small. They are also in a more turbid pond so their colors are usually washed out. I hope to get to observe a lot more RES adults in the future.

On 5 & 6 here is where it gets interesting. While it is true I have CNBG in my sediment pond and I have also transferred a few hundred of the original and offspring CNBG to my main pond, this fish is way to big/old to be a part of any of the stocked CNBG. This fish has to have come from my original stocking from a fish farm in Kansas (Wallace) which I can not imagine would be using CNBG genetics. It would be from the same stocking that the pictures of the BG in pics 2 and 3 were from.

Just goes to show, what first appears to be a pretty simple task, IDing fish genetics is anything but simple.

Again, thanks for the input. For me in my novice approach I unfortunately focus in on the few traits I am somewhat familiar with (such as the orange/red tab = RES). I know you guys with lots more knowledge and experience also focus on additional traits I don't consider. When you explain what you see, that helps me start to look at those additional traits.

What I see on 5 & 6.

Ocular flap structure is RES like not BG.

Face mottling is RES

Fins are CNBG - see light edge on pelvic fins

Lateral line structure (body shape is CNBG)

Nose (just above eye structure or where the helmet starts)see the double line of scales (2 with about 1/2 inch between) where the copper bar goes - this is classic CNBG.

It appears there's quite alot that goes into identifying the exact type fish. I haven't set out to catch any gills since this one was caught but maybe over the weekend I can try to catch some more of the bigger ones. They are gluttons with the 2 kinds of pellets I feed them.

Definitely a lot of variables. Factor in the natural diversity due to geography, water clarity, time of year, etc, and it gets real complicated real fast. Then make an allowance for personal interpretation - we don't always see the same things. That's why I don't place all my eggs in an online fish identification database. To be sure they are a great starting point, and more often than not they will head you in the right direction. And the PondBoss forum and mag is at the top of the list. But I still think the best way to learn for yourself is to run a few thousand fish through your fingers.

Gill rakers are a big plus on id but are not shown by folks asking "what is this".