Sodium bicarbonate and salt according to the chart in this link.
Just as I suspected the WHO has overrated the danger just as in mercury in fish.
https://gmoanswers.com/studies/iarc-classification-glyphosate?utm_source=outbrain&utm_medium=cpc
Folks may find the paper at this link helpful for context. Even water is toxic at high enough levels.
http://www.pnas.org/content/87/19/7777.full.pdf
Your going to get the EPA types stirred up with that article.
What criticism of glyphosate from the EPA do you think is off base?
Your going to get the EPA types stirred up with that article.
EPA types meaning those folks who care about the environment, have lived in the woods and about the land their entire life instead of transplanting there by choice in recent years, enjoy hunting, trapping, and fishing, can identify plants that are edible vs. those that most certainly are not, can walk up behind you and tap you on the shoulder before you're aware that you're not alone in those woods, and want nothing more than to be able to drink clean water and breathe clean air, and are doing their best to provide for their families by working with their hands and their backs everyday?
Those types are aware that what they do on their own land may indeed affect the properties around, and downstream from their own. And that matters to them, because they were raised believing that it's about more than just themselves. They were taught to appreciate, to respect, and to care about the environment..."take care of it, and it will take care of you."
To those types, being a good steward of the environment is more than just a statement tossed around on a forum. It's not something they do only when it's convenient, or easy, or just when it doesn't interfere with what they WANT to do. It means something.
Silly EPA types.
What I always wonder is while the immediate toxicity of Glyphosphate may be low, what do the plants produce upon dying?
It is being noticed by some bee-keepers that their bees seem to be getting sick in correlation with roadside glyphoshpate applications. Perhaps when the plants are in their death throws, they produce toxins to try and fend off an external threat like some will do upon an insect attack, and this reaction is the real threat?
Just an observation, no grounds in actual science or studies. Just thought for discussion.
What criticism of glyphosate from the EPA do you think is off base?
I wasn't aware the EPA was even mentioned in the link I posted. Maybe I missed it?
EPA was not mentioned in what I read from Cecil. Many who read comments and reports from agencies lump all of it into EPA who is basically a regulatory agency. Drinking too much good quality or even distilled water each day can kill you. It is up to each person to make the decisions of what to eat and how to live.
Pond Boss is a product of those with a financial interest in ponds. Should we take it with a grain of salt?
Good point but when a company spends thousands of dollars to get their product tested by an independent lab so they can legally use it, you can't just ignore that.
Of course they will defend their product. Would you expect them not too?
Everybody wants to knock technology but if we had to go back to the horse and buggy days they wouldn't want to do it.
I was merely pointing out where the website originated from. Place what stock in it you will.
This one is getting close guys !
Pond Boss is a product of those with a financial interest in ponds. Should we take it with a grain of salt?
I do. I sincerely mean no offense, it's just that I don't believe in absolutes, or the final word. Speaking for myself, I make mistakes, I make corrections, and I continue to learn. Nothing is set in stone. What is accepted practice today may be deemed ridiculous by tomorrow's standards. And that includes ponds and pond management.
Yesterday we all knew that HSB had no place in a pond setting. Today, we know better. Today, we advise that crappie are a poor choice for small ponds. Tomorrow, we may well be recommending them as routine practice. No absolutes. Always look at both sides, and never take an answer at face value without asking to see how they did the math.
Get a second opinion, do more research, ask more questions.
Just a friendly give and take among those that use the product. The WHO rates working the night shift and art glass as equally carcinogenic.
What happens to those who work the night shift at the art glass factory???
What is the difference (define)between a conservationist and an environmentalist ? See sprks posts page 1 and above and work from there. This is a concepts test and one for thought.
I always considered enviro's to be a more radical incarnation of conservs'.
Guy's, I respect your right to publicly voice any opinions on anything. But to continue to cuss and discuss any topic that has no resolution seems silly to me. To me, these last few months don't represent the still great forum I chose to join, nor is it representative of the forum that I choose to annually contribute too.
Basically, I'm tired of this chit. Somebody text me when we get back to fish, family, and fun.
Later, Al
So Al...how are your Tilapia doing?
What cussing?
The truth be known I thought this could be an interesting discussion as we've been hearing how bad glyphosates are supposed to be. I'm sorry if it offended anyone.
I always considered enviro's to be a more radical incarnation of conservs'.
Wrong Spark - The Enviro's were a series of cameras and cam corders launched by JVC a while back. I have one and if you can get this dialed in, which I think it takes an 8 year degree, it's rather stunning on video, audio and pictures, but too complicated for me. Give me a one shot Kodak or my cell phone.
I'm tired of mixing chemicals to spray fence lines several times a year. Spent 3 hours today with a crew cutting and spraying the fences.
The glyposate we get now seems less effective....doesn't last but a month or two regardless of the advertising.
If it wouldn't corrode my pipe fences I would use NaCl instead of glyposate. NaCl will stop growth for a decade or two.....and its all natural.
Glyphosate only kills what it hits. It has no significant residual in soil.
Not to hijack the thread, y'all seem to be having fun, but I've been using Reward I think it is for the last few months on my fence lines and it works pretty darn good. Takes a bit longer to work(maybe 3 weeks)than Roundup but it seems to last. Goes farther too.
OK, back to your regularly scheduled programming, didn't mean to interrupt.
+1 FWIW When I was growing up on the farm we used to spray areas we wanted to be void of vegetation for a good while with a product that I think was called something like Paraquat.
Al, please know that I have nothing but the highest respect and admiration for you. I also greatly respect and understand your decision to step away. I've been there, and done that myself.
Certainly the forum flavor has been different for awhile now. Am I to blame for that? I really don't know. Have my actions contributed to the off flavor? Most likely. There have been discussions, debates, and arguments, and sometimes the separating line gets pretty blurred between the trilogy. However I don't think that's reason enough to dispense with the exchange of opinions and/or information. As I see it, it comes down to respect. Respect for opinions other than our own. We don't have to agree, but we should be able to discuss intelligently without resorting to nastiness. In my opinion, that's been a sticking point as of late.
You know, we've been packing up around the house here lately, boxing up the incredible amount of stuff one accumulates after some years. This past weekend I tackled my bookshelves...thousands of books and magazines. I came across an old issue of PondBoss, from way back. I vaguely remember ordering this particular back issue years ago, long before I joined the forum. It was something to see, just a few pages folded over and stapled together, not so much a magazine as a pamphlet. I think it was black and white, maybe grayscale. Comparing it to the glossy, much thicker and professional-looking current issue was like the difference between night and day. They were both certainly PondBoss, but the evolutionary journey was undeniable. Somewhere along the way, change was deemed necessary. The risks were evaluated, and a chance was taken. Tentatively perhaps, and probably not all at once, but gradually and carefully.
I guess that's where I see this forum. To be sure I don't have any financial stake in this place, nor do I bear the burdens associated with maintaining the thing. I'm simply a member trying to help out when I can, peering in from the edge. But what I see, or what I think I see anyway, is that same, inescapable evolution that shaped the magazine, occurring here.
I know that some probably view the forum as a respite from the rigors of daily life, and I get that. Certainly I hope that fish, family and fun will always be central to the success of PB. And I believe it will. But the world is changing quickly around us. If we choose to remain static, are we actually becoming stagnant instead? Should we ask the hard questions, discuss the difficult issues, debate the volatile decisions that have the potential to affect our ponds and our way of life? I absolutely think so, but recognize the necessity of maintaining respect for all opinions, not just our own viewpoint.
That's where I think we need to focus our efforts. Tolerance.
Sorry guys, it's called eraser, not reward.
I'm tired of mixing chemicals to spray fence lines several times a year. Spent 3 hours today with a crew cutting and spraying the fences.
The glyposate we get now seems less effective....doesn't last but a month or two regardless of the advertising.
If it wouldn't corrode my pipe fences I would use NaCl instead of glyposate. NaCl will stop growth for a decade or two.....and its all natural.
Spray Sahara and you should have control for at least 6 months.
Plutonium lasts even longer.
Yeah, but I bet Sahara is cheaper!
Yeah but the PPE needed for plutonium is much sexier.
Plutonium lasts even longer.
Yeah, but I bet Sahara is cheaper!
Not if you steal it, which you'd have to!
Think of the fame you'd achieve and the free room and board for the rest of your life!
And your neighbors would love you after they moved out!
Think of the fame you'd achieve and the free room and board for the rest of your life!
All 26 minutes of it....
Naah. Max security prison not death penalty.
