Greetings All!
For the better part of two years, we've been talking about improving the website.
All of you are vital members...and to that end, I want your input.
We have several missions.
1) Increase paid subscriptions to the magazine. In order to get where we need to go, we need to add 750-1,000 subscribers each year for the next 3-5 years.
2) Organize the information that people seek. Right now, we offer the magazine and a few books and videos. We want to add selected articles, podcasts and videos. We are thinking some of this stuff should be free, some of it should be e-books, e-articles, etc. for pay.
3) Increase the profitability of the website for the owners. Right now, we are thinking of offering a mix of free articles, free videos, podcasts, etc. But, we are also thinking we should offer paid memberships that include a subscription to the magazine and access to the e-products.
4) I don't intend to change this forum. There are so many things I like and a handful of things I don't like. I love the fact that we are all family. I love the fact the forum is completely warm and family friendly and chock full of great information. The things I don't like are: the forum isn't 'search friendly', especially for newcomers looking for specific information; I don't like the fact that too many threads are hijacked. I also don't like it that we don't have a good form of social media where members can build their own page...right now posting photos is a royal pain. (That's the main reason I don't blog often.).

So, here's where I'm going.

I want feedback. The website will improve over the next two or three months. We plan to add some exciting things, especially content. We plan to improve our search engine optimization.

Sunil has suggested many times that we offer a "donation" tab for people who want to support the site. I've been on the verge of doing this several times. But, I would rather have members who pay a little and receive something of more value.

My specific questions are:

A) What are your opinions of paying a nominal annual fee to be a member of the forum?

B) Would you rather have a copy of the magazine in the mail, or an e-magazine?

C) If you got the e-magazine, would you stop subscribing to the printed copy?

D) How to you feel about having a free membership that has limited access to content? This may be a "read only" version of the forum. It may mean being able to access some articles, podcasts, videos, but having to pay for selected e-information.

E) Then, a "small" membership fee that has access to all the content, some of which is 'pay as you go', such as some of the e-information? This includes all privileges of the forum, including posting.

EE)Or, a "gold" membership, where you can have access to all the website, along with a "members only" forum where you get specific advice to specific problems from the top pros in the industry? This membership also includes a subscription to the magazine.

F) Finally, how much is this stuff worth? What should someone pay for a "medium" membership and what would you expect to receive. And, same question for the "gold" membership.

Feeback please!

I really like a lot of what I have just read. This forum already has so much to offer and with the added ideas, if they come to fruition should not be free. I'm just gonna sit back for a bit and see what others have to say though...

I'd like to add a bit to what CJ said. Personally, I prefer the print copy. While it isn't as searchable month to month as an electronic copy, it sure makes reading it in certain rooms of the house easier. Also, the Luddite in me prefers print for longivity. (I don't give away my copies)

I like having an actual hardcopy of the magazine for "portability" to my preferred reading spots.

Regarding the "dontate" thing I've brought up before, look at the link below: 1) The upper right corner of the forum page has a Paypal donate tab; 2) The second from the last thread is called "ICW Hall of Fame" where those who donated are credited.

http://www.ibanezcollectors.com/forum/index.php

Bob, regarding your comment about paying members receiving a little more, I fully understand, but want to make certain you know how much you've already given just by creating this forum.

I do suggest changes to the Pond Boss home page. When a newcomer arrives at that home page, it is not easy to know that the forum exists. I think the main page should offer (3) very, very clear options: 1) Go to the magazine and facilitate purchase; 2) Go to the merchandise page and facilitate purchase; 3) Go to the forum.

Make posting photos here more user friendly. A photo here is worth more than a thousand words. Talk to skinny bass about search engines and marketing the site, that is his deal.

It's really not hard to post a picture here though (in my opinion).

Well, since I just got on now, I wont wait to see other inputs.
Excited to see the new options being thought about.
As a thread hijacker, I feel somewhat uneasy with a suggestion post right off the bat. But, it being a free public forum and ideas have been asked for, here goes:

Bob, you may remember my long time complaint re: living in Tx, and a Tx written mag. being delivered in an untimely fashion. I am a former subscriber because of this. I just have a mental block against this issue. I have said I would pay for expediting, but realize that for a very few subscribers would not be possible.
If you are planning on upping the effort to gain new subsribers, I suggest an expedited alernative to getting bulk delivery from Pa., to TX, Ca., Az., Ak. etc. Same distribution point, but a step up in delivery rate. I am not familiar with the USPS options, but feel there must be some.
Second possibility, multiple dist. point. Haven't a clue if either of these is feasible, but you asked for suggestions.
Print and electronic options would suit me well. I cant comment on videos, pod casting etc....I spend too much time reading on the computer as it is.
As far as pricing, I am only the customer, whatever will make you all a decent profit for work input is your call.

1 If I had to pay to be a member on the forum I would still be money ahead because of all the good info. So yes!

2 E mag would save a ton of money and would be just as good with me. Having the Laptop on the throne might not be as convenient though.

3 yes I would stop.

4 Free read only members still have access to good info but you would still get them buying stuff through the site so I think its a good idea.

5 I think the small fee one should be "read and post" with an e- mag subcription

6 I am afraid of not being able to afford gold membership and missing the good info in the "members only" part.


I think I would be a gold member but choose the e mag instead of the mag.

Our wildlife federation send newsletters by email instead of mail and they saved around $15000.00 last year. The saving are huge.

I will let someone else give you a number on what its worth.

My name is Sunil, and I'm a thread high-jacker.

Burger, out of curiosity, which irks you more about the magazine delivery? Is it that the current issue of the mag is announced on the forum, and that eventually specifics are discussed, all prior to you ever getting your copy?

Just some thoughts from Nate:

Member page would be pretty cool. BigBluegill.com saves all the photos and stuff you post on the site automatically onto your members page. Donations is a very good idea. Also think that photo contests and other ways to get people involved in stuff like gaining new members with chances to win certain prizes like LL2 fishing trips, or a vertex aeration system or a sweeney or texas hunter fish feeder for various things would generate quite a bit of interest and subscriptions and participation

What are your opinions of paying a nominal annual fee to be a member of the forum? I would be very willing to pay a fee to have the ability to ask pond questions to the nations leading pond experts. That is invaluable for a guy like me who actively manages 1000's of acres of water and is likewise very valuable to Joe down the road who just manages his own 1/4 acre fishing and swimming hole

Would you rather have a copy of the magazine in the mail, or an e-magazine? Both: I like getting the mag, but also would love access to some of the many articles online for various reasons. Also I would be willing to pay for access to many of the articles of the past as well

If you got the e-magazine, would you stop subscribing to the printed copy? Nope. You could simply have the e-mag available as an accessory or feature or upgrade along with your print subscription, or make it so it is the same if not more profitable than the print and not worry about losing print subscribers.

How to you feel about having a free membership that has limited access to content? This may be a "read only" version of the forum. It may mean being able to access some articles, podcasts, videos, but having to pay for selected e-information. Great Idea!

Then, a "small" membership fee that has access to all the content, some of which is 'pay as you go', such as some of the e-information? This includes all privileges of the forum, including posting. Another great idea!

Or, a "gold" membership, where you can have access to all the website, along with a "members only" forum where you get specific advice to specific problems from the top pros in the industry? This membership also includes a subscription to the magazine. Yet another great idea!

Finally, how much is this stuff worth? What should someone pay for a "medium" membership and what would you expect to receive. And, same question for the "gold" membership. I dont think many forum members even realize how valuable it is to have access to so many knowledgable pond freaks from all walks of life. Consultation fees for personalized service like what is given away for free on this website typically run about $100 per hour or more. That being said, the information is what initially brought me personally to pond boss, but the entertainment and friendships is what keeps me coming back. If it was all down to business with question/answer and no thread hijacks I wouldnt read nearly as many threads as I currently do. Entertainment keeps me coming back everyday, information maybe once a week or maybe even once a month.

Paper copy for me. It's too hard to balance a laptop computer while on the reading throne.

I don't care who gets the first copy or the last copy of the mag, but we never discuss articles from the current issue here while they are hot, out of deference to the late receivers. It'd be nice if we could fix that.

How about a pay-per-post Forum, Bob?

No, it's just that I know you get yours before me.

Actually, the mag. is printed with somewhat seasonal emphasis. We already know it had to be written several wk. in advance. When delivery dates used to be posted on the forum, it became evident that it was not always due to the postman hijacking it. They would show up 2/3 wks. late. I do know that they have planes to deliver across country so a few days max. should be the spread in receiving the mag.
On at least 2 occasions, 2 or more wks. after you receiving yours I had to order one from Whitesboro, then one time, one came in the mail after I received the expedited copy.

I could go buy one at the new Bass Pro in the area, but I dont get out on the beltway in that direction often. I dont need to go to bass Pro, I have Stubby Steve's.

An e copy would solve some of the problems, I could look at the items that interest me the most, immediately, then peruse the hard copy later.

I thought about pay per post also and I think it would cut down on the info way to much. Pay per hijack would be good!!!

It's a pain in the neck. I should be able to copy and paste like most other forums. But instead I have to enclose it in an E mail, send the e mail to Omaha, tell him where it should go, and hope that it gets there. Then I have to write captions in a seperate post. I agree with Bob, I post a bunch of photos and a lot more if I did not have to go through that.

Then you would miss out on a lot of info. No one is ever on the same page, then,,, whoever reads the manuals! Some threads NEED to be Hijacked.

If it was all dry reading, I could send you a copy of NEC Code to cause the least amount of pain and keep you entertained. I have other options, but that would be cruel.

Web sites make money by selling advertising. Pond owners spend money. You do not need to re-invent the internet. Commercial enterprises will pay to advertise their services. Try other money-making methods at your own risk.

That is a lot of options and I am not sure I understand them all.

A few thoughts.

Is the goal lots of participation from many with the idea that a low % will subscribe or low participation with higher % of sales (Wal-Mart or Tiffany )

When I first go to a web site/forum if it costs or requires to much info I leave - not interested. So ease of initial entry is a key to finding new people.

If extra info is available for a small cost like a pod cast on special subject I don't mind paying for that.

Different levels of cost associated with different levels of product are a good option. X$ for the mag and X+ for extras like pod casts , access to back issues on line , direct line to a pro's opinion (email), and others.

Easy finding of info is key. The archives was our first attempt at that but most don't seem to go there. Part of that is that the FAQ section at the top covers stuff other than info. A bit confusing. Changing the names would help.

A searchable index to the mag issues as a forum heading may result in more sales of back issues.

I have no problem with the search function but others do. Sometimes I get strange results but can usually find stuff. Often though if one searches for a common theme like BG growth rate you get all the results for BG , growth and rate (so much that it is useless). Remembering key words in a thread are the most useful concept in my search attempts. That however for a newer member is not worth much as they don't recall the thread as they were probably not involved.

I also like a paper copy as it is mobile and not dependant on the computer or net. Having a member # for an extra charge which gives access to mags on line in a searchable format is an idea.

Posting pics is not so hard but it could be easier. I am highly concerned with 2 aspects of the pics. First when a pic posting member takes down the photos (either himself or because his host goes away) it greatly harms the thread. Second the failure of the host would destroy many of the threads here. Think of the effect if photobucket went away - out of business or started charging its customers forcing them to quit.

The Forum is a good sales platform for those selling services here (indirectly) but how is that quantified and is the cost made up by PB through other means?

A forum heading "pod casts" or "services" which take the viewer to a pay PB site with options is one idea. Keep in mind that many people don't use pay pal type services and others will not put a credit card # on line. Id theft is serious with many thousands of credit and debit card #s and pass words being stolen and used.

More later after some thought.

I will second that. Whats hard about uploading to photobucket and putting the img code in the post here?

My kids helped me post pictures here. i guess I am stupid. But my kids are not. By the way, this is the only blog I post on.

P.S. I post here because I like the quality of the posters.

Personally, as someone who has enough trouble paying his bills, I would be a little saddened for this place to cost money.

But depending on the cost I would probably suck it up. I value this site, more for entertainment and learning then to actually apply it to my own life at the moment, as I do not own a pond; but i really enjoy spending time on this site.

As a fairly newcomer, I read forum for several weeks before I joined and subscribed to magazine. I was gaining so much good info
that I felt I needed to support the ones making this possible. Every thing I have ordered or in the plans has and will come from the vendors on this forum. My thoughts are:
1. Access and reading of forum and archives to remain a free service, with a membership fee to gain full access to post and access to any PB sponsored media on site.
2. E-mag would be good in some aspects, but I still like my hard copy. Can see though that having magazine articles archived would be a big advantage.
3. Would a donation option(even on a trial basis) be a better and less cumbersome option than membership??
Lamar

I am not a business man, so I really can't add much to this. What I like may not and most likely isn't what the vast majority of what other people would like. In the end, there are two goals... First make money, second further the management of private ponds and small lakes.

I do however like the idea of semi formal on-line consulting that a "Gold Membership" would carry... If you had such membership, you had access to a set number of direct answer questions from known experts who would take the time to personally answer your question that would be viewable by other "Gold Members". People who are the true experts like Bob Lusk, Bill Cody, Mike Otto, Dave Willis, etc... For example you're a new pond owner from Ohio and are looking for stocking recommendations. You can get tailored advice from certified pros, other "Gold Members" can view this advice but not hijack the thread and take it on some tangent.

But I also like the "amateur hour" where guys like me can share their thoughts and ideas even though I am not certified expert. I think that is where most of us have fun. You don't have to be a certified expert to have some good advice and experiences to share...

Bob I am not too picky, but I like my printed version of the magazine so I can save the articles at home. I also like to be able to search the forum for info when needed.

I believe if a person subscribes to the magazine he/she should be able to use the online forum for free. If a person wishes to only subscribe to the forum they should be able to do so for a lesser fee than the magazine would cost, maybe 1/2 price or so. I bet a large percentage of forum only members would eventually become magazine subscribers and book purchasers as well.

Thanks for fixing the search function, this site has one of the worst ones I have ever encountered online. I have no idea how Eric manages to find the articles that he does.

Thanks for a great site and mag

I guess you are right. Just tell Bob Lusk he has it all wrong and should blog more often even though he feels like me posting photos is a royal pain.

I agree with ewest that you want to create a place where you can bring people in. The forum is what brought me to Pond Boss. After I was digging onto forums, I bought the magazine and a few books. If you cut people off with costs up front, they will leave. The will never discover what a great resource Pond Boss is.

Imagine in ESPN was pay to look at. I would go elsewhere. Now, if I want in-depth stuff, I pay for the "Insider," which is a subscription after I have been brought in.

I think the main page of the site needs reworking so it directs people to different locations. You can also monetize with Google ad-words and the like to bring in more revenue.

Just my quick two-cents.

At this point I would pay for the forums and the resources, but I would have never visited if I had to pay to get started.

Brian

I have to agree with Eric on most things he said. Would I have looked at this form if it would have cost me? No I doubt it. I would pay for it now yes! But at first right out of the gate no. Maybe you need to do something like a 45 day membership and then if you want to stay then you will have to pay a fee to continue. That way that particular person would have a chance to really see how good this site is and not be so quick to want to leave. I would not mind a donate tab as long as it was secure!!! I would like to keep my PB Mag! I like having the Mag it's easier to share with people. I have had a couple of people already ask me hey what are you reading. Well BINGO there you go that could be the PERFECT time to let them know what the PB is all about. The picture thing could be better for sure but it's not to bad. The search function is quite mysterious? It works somewhat but could also be better like Bob said. I am not a big fan of hijacked threads, I know a lot of you all may not be real concerned about the original question answered in the thread as you may have heard it a million times, but the person that was asking it asked it for a reason and wants an answer not someone rambling on about something else or something that does not pertain to the post. Being funny in a post is one thing that doesn't bug me as long as it somewhat stays on track. That really needs to be watched if your going to start having people PAY for memberships. A new person could get quite upset if they are paying for a membership and asking questions and someone is hijacking the post. This is just my opinion that's all and you know what they say about opinion's hey!

You couldn't charge me enough to make me leave.

I figure I've saved between 25,000-50,000 bucks by being a member of this site. Countless mistakes not made.

Bruce, I was trying to put some dollar figures together in my head earlier, but figured that even more important than the 1000's of dollars was the YEARS of mistakes not made. It would have taken me 20-30 years to get all this info figured out.

Bruce, n8ly,


Yes I agree with that as well and I have only been a member for 8 or 9 months, but that is easy to say now. Hind sight is 20-20. The catch is would a NEW person see it that way and pay something right out of the gate?? Not sure about that? It would be one of those try and see things.

"I guess you are right. Just tell Bob Lusk he has it all wrong and should blog more often even though he feels like me posting photos is a royal pain."

Stay civil, Pond Frog.

I also found the website first, then subscribed. I would not have stayed on the website if it was pay-to-enter and probably would not have become interested enough to subscribe. With that said, I love the magazine and love the website.

Do you know how many subscribers you can attribute to the website? Do you think that people don't subscribe because they get their information from the website? If so, allow everyone ninety days of free membership to the website. If they don't subscribe to the magazine, boot 'em off. Do you think that your consulting has grown because of the website or suffered? Is the website fueling the growth of the consulting and the magazine? If so, would doing anything that would cause fewer members to enroll actually slow the growth of either?

I believe that there are ways to make money off of the website without having it come from the members. Perhaps that is because it suits me. I don't currently have a pond, but want one. I probably could not justify paying to be on the website, too.

I tell everyone I run into with a pond about the website and insist that they subscribe to the magazine. I have yet to run into one person who has heard of either. You have a large untapped customer base with much upside, IMO.

I would read the magazine in e format, but would not like it as much.

Ditto on charging people for hijacking. (I would have paid once or twice by now, too.)

Hope this helps. Best of luck with figuring it all out.

Guys now is the chance to speak your mind. There is no right or wrong answer. Bob is asking for what you think and why so he can weight our collective opinions. Your opinion counts or he would not have ask.

Please state your opinion and not criticize anyone else's opinion. Everyone needs to feel comfortable speaking their mind freely.

I don't like pay sites. However, the majority of the members/posters here don't help financially support the Pond Boss organization thru mag subscriptions. Bob and Mike are paying for this out of their own pocket and I don't figure the site gets them any business. They are both way past that point.

I don't care for E Magazines or pay per post.

However, I think the hijacks are OK. They show a friends and family type atmosphere while the questions are still being answered. I wouldn't change that.

I would not mind an E-Mag option just because my eyes are stuck on a screen for many hours a day. However, I can see the problem that someone could print them out and pass them around thus loosing subscriptions.

Def. fix search engine.
Hijacking needs to be lessened greatly but let's not get too stiff collared.
I look to the mag. as paying my dues first. So I would keep the hard copy but would like an electronic esp. if they were easily searchable.
You can’t argue with better organization, it’s always good.


What are your opinions of paying a nominal annual fee to be a member of the forum?
OK, but I would prefer to have it included in a cost increase to Mag. subscription.

Would you rather have a copy of the magazine in the mail, or an e-magazine?
Both, esp. if the e-mags were search friendly.

If you got the e-magazine, would you stop subscribing to the printed copy?
No

How to you feel about having a free membership that has limited access to content? This may be a "read only" version of the forum. It may mean being able to access some articles, podcasts, videos, but having to pay for selected e-information.
Unsure. But the thought “Keep it simple” comes to mind.

Then, a "small" membership fee that has access to all the content, some of which is 'pay as you go', such as some of the e-information? This includes all privileges of the forum, including posting.
See above.

Or, a "gold" membership, where you can have access to all the website, along with a "members only" forum where you get specific advice to specific problems from the top pros in the industry? This membership also includes a subscription to the magazine.
I would like this best.

Finally, how much is this stuff worth? What should someone pay for a "medium" membership and what would you expect to receive. And, same question for the "gold" membership.
Not a clue. If you’re asking what would I pay .. a lot. My advise: charge what is needed.

I think it is a royal pain to post photos. Please be civil and don't tell me it is easy.

Take a breather... Is it really that big a deal?

I won't tell you it's easy, it's a piece 'o cake (if you have a photobucket account). But, I agree with you on the slightly increased difficulty part, plus I'd rather have them stored here rather than a 3rd party. I re-organized my photobucket account, and had to come back here and edit a lot of posts. That was a PITA.

It was over 2 yrs. before I ever posted pics. I guess it's not THAT hard once you have an account set up with one of he photo sies; you have stored jpegs in your 'my pictures' or whatever...but, you cant really think it is a breeze to do it.
I feel that Pong Frog has photos that would interest me, such as his varieies of Water Lilies, but he is not contributing. It could be MUCH easier. Just my opinion from and older, less tecky type. Yes. I am an electronic engineer, but dont feel like dillying with a computer to figure out things that should be simple. I also think the search function is pretty much useless. I have assumed that if you place + sign between the words, then only those words inclusive would be searched for. I have never been able to zoom in on even a handful of posts on what was originally an obscure topic.

I wonder how many visit, read, learn, and leave without posting or buying anything? Are they in the minority or majority?

It does definately take money to make this website go. It is very valuable if you have a pond and want some answers from people with experience. So, so many have never heard of it. The trick is to lure them, jiggle the bait just right, and then do a little catch & release - although no harvesting is allowed. I doubt any overpopulation will occur.

A) I would pay to participate. Information here is good stuff.
B) I want both paper and electronic.
C. Paper and electronic should be available to subscribers.
D. Pay for selected items is okay IMO. I've encouraged for a couple yrs now an online, pay for electronic back issue infor either by article or issue. I have all issues indexed, why not fully utilize it? Maybe also pay for other special items - video, themed information sets, etc.
E. Small or limited Membership is okay. Maybe 6 mo, annual, 3yr or 5 yr or life member?
EE. Gold Membership - Life member? One time fee?
F. Free introductory access for 7-30 days. Then charge maybe just to read, and another small fee to post and ansewer & questions. All these fees could get complicated & confusing, but could be simplified with a couple membership levels.

Increasing subscriptions. Why don't pondowners subscribe? Considering how many ponds are in the USA, the number os subscribers is way less than 0.5%. Is it they really don't care about their pond enough to spend $35.00 per year, or is it they don't get enough applied how-to-do-it information from the mag to make it worth spending $35.00 or is it they don't even know about the magazine? Probably some of each in varying amounts. Determine what bait it takes to entice average "Joe" pondowner to bite. Then tie up that bait and present it in an irrestible fashion.

I don't post many pictues because it is IMO a pain. I have slow dial-up internet, I have to go to another site to load, retrieve and then link a photo. Plus I save most of my pics for future articles to encourage mag readership.

A donate tab or address for sending a check for forum and/or Jesse West Foundation supporting Fishery research at So.Dakota State Univ. is a good idea. Secure payment is very important. I use electronic payment, but in today's world is any electronic account secure? Maybe a small one item, monthly online auction would help generate funds? Maybe auction or raffle an attendance fee / admission to the PB conference?.

Bruce's Bigbluegill sight is certainly nice as far as photo sharing goes. Not having to use a third party photo storage site is very nice. Some forums can get away with making photo adding more difficult, however this forum photos are invaluable and therefore the adding of photos should be an easy process, even for the less tech savvy. I know it took me sending Sunil a PM to figure out how to do it the first time...

I don't want to take this into discussion about the ease, or lack of, in posting photos, but I don't want to be misunderstood.

Most of the difficulties mentioned for posting photos are self-limitations, in my mind (ie/ slow connection, not using a picture hosting site, wanting things effortless). If Pond Boss has to actually host the pictures vs. just a live-link to the where the picture is stored, I have to think it will translate into Pond Boss needing more server space and then more cost to what is now a free site.

So posting a picture takes some minimal effort. Anything good takes some effort, and here, we're talking a few keystrokes at best. I agree at first, it is a new concept. But the pictures have to be stored somewhere, and that is what sites like photo-bucket are for.

I just don't see it as Pond Boss responsibility to make life effort free, especially at it's own cost. Those who do post pictures here put forth the effort, and we are all rewarded for those efforts. Those folks have taken the responsibility upon themselves.

Can I get a Golden Shriner and some green frog boots?

No, but how about Peroni?

If the forum stays free, I agree with it staying a third party photo server for said reasons. However, if it becomes a fee to use, then I think an upgrade me be called for. With one of those upgrades being on site picture storage and posting capabilities.

Oops!

sorry.

finally. What a pain!

another problem with it, is folks dont know the correct size for the image; then it causes all the posts to be outside the frame.

To follow up my original post.

I think what a few have said is correct: If the site cost money to start with, I wouldn't have become involved. That being said, now that I am involved I would be sad not to.

Would it be possible to sell ad space on the site? Currently I see no ad's and generally advertisers will pay for that space. This site probably gets enough traffic to keep some people interested in having ad space on it.

As far as picture posting, it seems pretty standard to how pictures work on forums. I don't think I have ever been a part of a forum where it wasn't necessary to host your photo's elsewhere and link them.
Maybe a video of how to do it would be helpful. If that is the case, I would be willing to make one for the site. It wouldn't be very difficult at all.

Thread hijacks- I can see how some people would be frustrated by it, but in my opinion it is what makes a forum interesting, is people letting their personality come out. I suppose if someone had a question they were very concerned about becoming answered they could simply note at the beginning of their post "Please do not hijack." I for one have grown honored to have my posts hijacked, as it makes me feel like a connected part of the group. Then again, I don't have any money resting on answers to my questions.

I suppose if it really is an issue, we could have a "Super Serious" forum, where we only allow for very serious answers and no fun? (no disrespect intended)

All in all, of all the forums I have been a part of, this is the friendlies, most informative, and most enjoyable forum I have found. On no other forum do I know of a group of people so willing to help one another on a personal level, be it finding a home for Mason, or praying for one anothers' families.

I totally understand needing finding a way for the forum to support itself better, I just think maybe there are better ways then charging for access to the site.

Thanks.

Screw third parties, I'm not into that. I just want to copy and paste right off my puter. It should be that easy. I promise I would post tons of how to and real life photos, of everything. No jokes or goof off stuff, but stuff I do everyday managing ponds, plus lots of fish photos and photos with kids and fish. In my humble opinion it would make the forum a better place.

Pond Frog, I understand what you are saying.

How much would you be willing to pay per year to have the ability to "copy and paste right off my puter."

Not speaking for Lusk, but I think that is one of the considerations he has to grapple with, and thus why he's asking that question.

Do any forums allow simple copy pasting? I don't know of any that do. Even the ones that have hosting on the forum website themselves still require you to upload to their server and then link there.

Photobucket does include a batch upload, where you can upload many photo's in one shot. I will be doing a video on uploading photos in the coming week.

There is a balancing act... No one is right or wrong here. However, web sites don't pay for themselves and the fancier a web site is the more expensive it is. Thus the more expensive a possible membership to it would be. I don't have an issue posting from Photobucket to the forum, but others apparently do. This is where the balancing act is.

Maybe the question is "are they even interested in what we are discussing?" If we use the input we have gathered on our Why Do You Own a Pond thread, it is apparent that there is alot of interest beyond the fish part of it.


A pond is a diamond in the rough. As pondmeisters, each of us hones the facets into that piece of compressed carbon to create a precious gem. Each facet that we hone gives the diamond another dimension, increasing it's value. A quality fishery is one facet, and the main thrust of Pond Boss. As a budding pondologist, I have taken measured steps to create the fish facet. I could only do it correctly with the guidance of the Pond Boss core moderator team. For this facet, Pond Boss was invaluable and I am grateful. I have many more facets to hone, though. They all exist above the waterline in the form of wildlife habitat, flora, and human habitat. Guidance regarding these facets is poorly represented within Pond Boss. Yes, Dan VanS does a great job with his articles, but I find most are larger in scope and don't relate directly to small time pond perimeter development. Yes, we see an occassional article about wood duck housing or similar, but nothing consistent and expanded in a larger category of wildlife habitat development.
To me, Pond Boss is 70% fish, 15% pond construction, 5% weeds and aeration, and 10% other. I don't care all that much about the fish. The pond construction is done, so that's behind me. Weeds and aeration are a non-issue. I don't know...maybe I'm lucky or maybe I'll have problems with that stuff later, but for now, that first 90% of the PB thrust is pretty boring for me. For me, it's all about life above the surface; that last 10%.
-
For the record, I subscribe to the mag. I have for 4 years. In all honesty, I never read it cover-to-cover. In fact, I can go through it in one hour and I'm done. I subscribe because I feel that, if nothing else, I owed at least that much to you guys for helping me along with pond construction and fish stocking. Like I said, I am grateful and will likely never be able to pay you back for that assistance. But that stuff is behind me and now I seek guidance and advice and comeradery on bird houses/nesting structures, critter stuff, flowers, grasses, trees, shrubs, boat docks, pavillions, fire pits, gazebos, and pond-side cottages or houses. You know, that other 10%.
I'll bet I'm not alone.

...being "new," I don't have any suggestions (I agree with most of what everyone else has suggested or commented on)....

I just want to say that I am a magazine addict :)!!! I buy tons of magazines on every subject you can imagine...so, I have experience on the subject! You should be proud with the beauty and quality of the magazine... the content and appearence are both impressive. Each issue is a whole new experience. I haven't seen any other magazine to match the quality. So.... it is well worth the price of subscription. You could most definitely increase the price of yearly subscription and I don't think many would complain.

I spoke with a very nice gentleman this week who has a 178 acre pond with many species of fish in it. He happened to see something on my site about bass being fed fish food.... he had never heard of that so I realized he didn't know about you guys. I was so PROUD to tell him all about you!!!! He couldn't wait to get off the phone with me and check you out!

Taking care of a pond is dag-on hard work...you have created a place for people to come together and vent, brag, and figure things out. You've created a community of individuals who are now a family..... and I feel they will help Pond Boss in any way they can for it to continue to succeed.

We're proud to be a part of it!
Stacy

Thank you Brettski, I appreciate what you wrote there... Although I love fish, I can understand your view point on where you would like to see at least a portion of PB go.

With regards to posting pictures. Most times you can just copy and paste image URL's without photobucket or picasa, if it is already online. That doesn't even register on any gripe meter around here.

quote JKB "With regards to posting pictures. Most times you can just copy and paste image URL's without photobucket or picasa, if it is already online. That doesn't even register on any gripe meter around here."

I just tried that with random photos of guitars. The 1st one had a URL of 12 lines. The next one I copied and pasted. The image was small and in the upper left hand corner of the page when I opened the link on this forum. An example would help.
I need more convincing.

When I found the forum I didn't join right away. I lurked for a while to see what it had to offer. If I had to pay up front I would have went elsewhere. Reading the forum, learning and laughing is what got me hooked. I thought well if the forum is this good I want to see the magazine so I subscribed. Then I thought if the mag is this good I want to see the books so I got them. Then I thought if the rest of this is so good I want to attend a conference and I did.

I did all these things because the forum was free and got me hooked. A free read only forum may have accomplished the same thing it's hard to say. I think making the forum a pay site would bring in more $$$ short term but hurt long term growth of the mag because people surfing the net for pond management would bypass the site. Plus how would locking the forum to paid members affect Internet search engine results. Someone typing in "feed trained bass" into google wouldn't get this forum as a result if it were pay to see. If it does become a pay forum then mag subscribers should get it included with subscription.

Regarding some of the other topics I still much prefer the portable paper version of the mag.

As far as growing the mag maybe try to work with those who advertise in the mag to see if they would include a flyer with their merchendise packaging. I think Bob metioned he did this with Game Fish Chow before but don't know if this is still being done or could be expanded.

Just look at my last two posts on this thread:
http://www.pondboss.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=205129#Post205129

One with the squirrel with it's head in a coffee cup and the other with the .224-.338.

Both were done by copy image URL and pasted by clicking "enter image" when making a reply. Just make sure you hit a backspace to eliminate the (http://) that is default. This should be deleted if possible by the exec's and causes a fair amount of problems posting pic,s.

Try it. You can right click on any pic on this site, copy URL, click enter image, delete the http stuff and paste.

Should be good to go. I do not have these pictures in photobucket or picasa, nor do I have them stored anywhere on the net, or even on my computers.

Now I am Theo! I am sure He is thrilled!

idigitalcitizen.files.wordpress.com/2009/07/radioactive_man_300.jpg

No bueno!

That actually happens more often than you might think. No problem in your case, certainly.

Not to call you out for your financial difficulty, Mikey, but just to say that this, in fact, would be the attitude of any newcomer to the forum. In order to drive a conversion to start more $$ coming into the biz, shutting the forum off from consumers is not the way (in my experience).

I think i've voiced this opinion on this forum before, but just to reiterate, instead of making newcomers pay for what is most certainly the best attractor of new customers, it would be better to have other perks for subscribers (to the mag or the premium forum, whatever the case may be). This could be discounts on PB merchandise, access to the premium section, etc.

Making people pay to see or post in the forum I think would be a mistake in the long term. While some may still sign up, and certainly any lurkers who are that interested would initially convert, the rate of conversions from visits will drop drastically after short time. I'm not saying it still wouldn't be profitable, Just that there may be a more profitable path than a pay to post forum. At the very least, a pay to post, but free to read, with a blocked "premium" section that the average lurker cannot get into would be the most drastic change that would be effective (If the powers that be are insistent on blocking parts of the forum). The more that is free to access for the customer the better.

Exactly. This is the behavior of 99% of users on the web. cutting them off would be a HUGE mistake (please remember these are just my opinions).

This is a good, valid point. But in all honesty, the goal is to expand the readership, right? of both the forum and the magazine, and make some money off of it? Not all people interested in the pondboss community will be spending much money on their respective BOW's, so this might not be a draw for most people.

The costs, for me, would outweigh the savings. Look at people in my situation, i have a HOA to deal with that has a tight deathgrip on its purse strings. Would you want to lose me and the rest of the interested parties like me by charging up front?

Please excuse me as i go through this forum to make my case. I am very interested in seeing a profitable path for Bob, Mike & crew (vicariously the rest of you professional managers too...as it reasonably follows that the more interested parties on the forum means the more interested parties inquiring about professionals in the area to do electrofishing, seine, chemical treatments etc)

that's the key, as far as i see it. I don't know if this is in reference to the internal search, but the way I take it is to improve the visibility of the site on google, yahoo and ask geeves. as was stated in another thread, lead enough horses to water and some of them are sure to be thirsty. A disorganized, buckshot approach, maybe, but always a successful one.


I like this idea. I know a few forum owners who profit off of this. They don't get everyone to pay, but they do get a few. Adding it as a perk to subscribe to the magazine would be an outstanding idea.



[/quote]

does the site have google analytics? that would answer a lot of these questions. If not, it is free, and supplies a wealth of information about the visitors to the site. I've never seen it used on a forum, but the good folks at google could tell you everything you need to know about how to use it.
We are of like minds here. Unfortunately, I don't think that the concept of "juggle the bait" means take the lure away after a little bit,, even the fairly conservative 90 day trial membership i saw posted earlier(in this terrible analogy i am setting up the lure is the forum and the helpful folks on it).
in my mind that is the question that needs answering. and in my mind, that is the answer.

As someone who values the information on the forum but only sporadically posts, I thought I'd offer my thoughts on this topic. First of all, I suspect that charging for basic access to the forum will eventually kill the long-term development of the forum. This is covered above.

Second, I don't see any problem with charging for certain "premium" content. In my mind, this could include the e-magazine and/or additional articles/resources. Frankly, I would suggest removing the archives from the "free" part of the forum. Then, ask someone (?) to edit those materials into more user-friendly segments. This would become the initial "premium" content. Maybe portions of the books could be placed in the "premium" content as well.

I think most people would much more readily accept advertising than subscription fees.

Additionally, I would like to chime in along the same lines as Brettski. If the site moves to a paid site, I think its important to clarify the focus of the site. I very much value the information on managing fish. This is clearly the focus of the expertise of many existing forum members. However, there are many pond-related topics that really are not covered in detail by the existing materials on this site. Having recently built my pond, I am currently struggling with issues regarding the best marginal and emergent plants for around the pond, tranporting trout, building an outdoor patio/kitchen, and how best to build a walkway to get through some wet areas. There is some information on this site, but much of the information I've found comes from other sources. I think any move to premium content should be accompanied by a concerted effort to clarify the site's focus and perhaps expand the range of "premium" information available. If you Google "Ponds", you will see that most people interested in "ponds" are not actually focused on fish. If you Google "Fish Ponds," you will find that people interested in fish ponds are often focused on koi or other ornamental fish. I don't have a garden pond or a koi pond, but I do sometimes visit those sites to get information to help manage my "pond."


For my part, I would pay a subscription fee for the same reason I subscribe to the magazine--it will be worth it for me and I'd like to support a site that has supported me. I would not have done so at the outset. I like the print copy of the magazine, but am not wedded to it. I probably would not buy the print copy if I obtained an e-copy as part of a forum subscription or other fee.

Hope this helps.

A great point....reduce the number of lurkers, even, and ad space becomes less valuable. And honestly, it is much more likely to be a profitable venture to sell ad space than it is to charge for membership (basic membership at least).

and so that is where i stand. I haven't been here as long as the rest of you, but i fell in love with this forum by being able to participate. It also didn't take long for me to subscribe (it's a father's day present...)
Taking away the ability to participate, i feel, would be a large mistake. The majority of new users won't understand how awesome this forum is, and will not want to pay to post. Honestly, i thought i would have posted a line, talked to a few guys, and never come back.
As I am sure that i've annoyed at least half of the usual suspects at this point, you should all know that isn't true. I'm most likely here to stay
This forum has the potential to convert. It does. What that conversion is is up to speculation, whether it is a mag subscription, a new job for a pond management consultant on the site, a "premium" forum subscription, whatever. taking away the ability to participate lowers the site's ability to convert.
Honestly, I think that this place is awesome. All of you guys rock, and I couldn't have found a better place to talk ponds & fish. I even use this as my bragging board for fishing now.
But I almost didn't find it, which is what i think the real problem is. As another poster pointed out, the only thing that shows up in google is a 1987 dental hygienist award.
thanks for all of your time, patience, and all of your rockin' advice, even when green sunfish are involved.

I would be more than happy to lend my opinions on this end. It might be hard to get me to shut up about it. I'm irish, outspoken and longwinded. Sorry 'bout that.

I personally wouldn't mind since I've been here so long, and have gained so much. But, I believe it would severely restrict the addition of new members.


I would like both. I've done this with our local newspaper and with the Wall Street Journal. I get a lot of magazines, and in many cases I actually want them for the ads. Articles on-line are great. Technology is now at a point where copyright and sharing can be a lot more controlled.


Absolutely not.


As I said above, I think that paid access to the forum would severely affect new users. But, for access to articles, podcasts, videos -- no problem. I think that would be good business.


I think either of the above could work.


I have no clue. I don't think we have enough demographic information to know where the "pain threshold" might be. Having attended three of the conferences, I think that our members probably range from slightly above living paycheck-to-paycheck, to being very comfortable. To be viable and useful, we need that entire range of people.

I think you've hit on the main pet peeves about the forum -- posting photos and searching. One I'd like to add is that it sure would be helpful if we could see the postings while adding a new post.

My 0.02 about photos -- I probably post as many photos taken on a personal camera as anybody else on the forum. I do find it difficult compared to other sites where I can just click on it from my camera or computer. If I look at most of my neighbors with ponds, they are very computer limited. They are farmers, sales people, excavators, trades people, restaraunt owners, etc., where daily use of a computer is not required. Asking them move photos to another site, resize them, and then do a copy and paste is well beyond many of them.

As for hijackings and other subjects -- Sometimes the hijackings get a little crazy, and this may discourage lurkers from wanting to come in. I'm not sure how this could be controlled, other than we have to self-police ourselves. I wouldn't want to have to put the burden of controlling hijackings on the moderators. (Heck, they are as bad as the rest of us!)

As for non-pond subjects, I think that many of them fall into the "nuances" that Bob spoke about at the last conference, and also wrote about recently. I feel we need this kind of diversity as it relates to our homes and ponds. It keeps people coming back when the pond is frozen over.

Ken

Mr.Lusk, New folks like me do have a learning curve when we get on here. One good recomendation would be to have a section dedicated to fish suppliers. In other words if I live here and want to buy x fish i can click here to find the closest supplier to me. Every supplier can add their information for us to read and you can charge them x amount for the add. In return the consumer gets what they want, can ask any questions and expect to get great answers and follow up support all in one place. When a guy/gal brings up Google and types fish supplier you need to ensure your website is the first one brought up every time. Google charges you a bit for each "hit" but you get 24/7 coverage and many more people learn about your website. Which is the main problem that i see here where I live...i have not spoken to a single person that has ever heard about your magazine or website. I give my old mags to them (begrudgingly) so they know bout the mag and the website. Good luck.

He makes a good point with being able to find local services. what about a geographically based section of the site? just one page, basically a goolge map where subscribers can advertise their pond management businesses? that would bring more pond managers and business owners to the site, and through them, potentially their clients too. A small charge to advertise would likely lessen the amount of you consultants who want to ad, especially in the beginning while conversions are low. But it is a good idea. Paid ads would be a good place to start, but SEO would be best in the long-term. Pay per click ads have certain costs, and if you aren't converting to the course you like, it can become a drain on your finances. However, that being said, i doubt (compared to other niches) that fish stocking and pond management are very expensive Kyewords to bid on in google adwords or yahoo paid, wherever. I'm not a ppc expert, so i may be biased to point out the downsides (cost), but SEO will get you to the top for your chosen keywords without the daily costs.

I like the idea about geographically searchable suppliers. I still don't have a good answer for anybody that asks me who to use to dig a pond in this area.

I seriously doubt that I would have come here if it was a "pay to play" place. Now that I see how great a place this is, I would. How much? It all depends.

I like the idea of the "ask an expert", for a fee, but there is a LOT of great information on here for free.

But, I'm assuming that a lot of the stuff that's being tossed around here would put a resource drain on PB, maybe so much that a person would have to work on the site full time for a while to get it dialed in, which would cost $$.

I like the archives for the amount of material that is there. The archives answered a lot of my questions without having to burn up bandwidth re-asking the same questions. But, I didn't search, I just started reading and reading.

Bob, TSC has fish food, pond dye, etc. They have a small, but targeted magazine rack. Have you looked at places like that to put the rag on the shelves?

None of the pond owners that I've talked to in person has known about PB. Most are not computer savvy, so for them print would be the way to go.

Just like Brettski said, it isn't just about the ponds, it's also about the stuff above the water as well.

As a side note, I found an arborist forum because of the chainsaw search. over 46,000 registered members, going on 2 million posts.

I am new, and so it was only recently that I realized the scope of the site. My initial impression was that it was only a forum. Maybe I'm not too observant. One thing that I am versed in is advertising and I really believe that it is the best avenue to take in terms of a steady source of sustainable income for the site. It takes some effort, but there are sponsors who would love the exposure that is available here. If you're not already, begin posting some of the videos to the social networking sites, ie. Youtube, etc. and then point them to the magazine and the forum. Advertisers pay close attention to the hits.
I am an exec. for a company that produces web and TV shows and listings for real estate companies. We are the largest of our kind and we are growing rapidly. Securing advertising for our productions is largely how we have expanded. I'd be glad to offer my input if needed. I really appreciate the value of the information I've gained and have put many ideas to work already on my body of water.

I need a Moderator to get in touch with me ASAP!!

jims place, I've sent you a PM.

Since I also publish a magazine, that has a website, that also has a message board I feel Bob's pain as we are facing many of the same issues. I would say though, that compared to what I do and what I have seen, PB gives away much more than anyone else. I feel that I could pretty much manage my pond(s) just by gathering information on this forum. That statement is not to dis the magazine, but rather to compliment the board. In fact, I would almost say that I subscribe to PB more out of a sense of duty to pay for something, since I don't pay for what I learn here, than actually wanting the magazine.
Bob, no matter what you do someone will complain. Like Bruce said the info is worth thousands, but still many will cry if they have to pay one red cent, and I think that you can see that in kind of a generational thing. Many times I've had people call me requesting a complimentary issue. When I tell them that single copies are $5, they act like they can't afford it, even though they must have thousands of dollars invested in the hobby and one issue could easily save them thousands.

Wow! I have to agree with esshup! If even part of all of what we are talking about gets done it's going to take a lot of time and energy from someone??? Sounds like the PB's profit will be going to someone they will have to hire to make all these changes and keep up this site. It's easy to talk about all of this but implamenting it is a WHOLE other can of worms!!!

I subscribed to the magazine because of the forum. It took me awhile before I subscribed too. Had the forum not been free, I would have moved on to another forum that was and I wouldn't be a subscriber, nor would I have purchased a book.

There seems to be a fair amount of Pondboss Magazine and book promotion within the forum and other pond related forums I’ve come across. This time of promotion is more valuable than any that can be purchased.

I probably won't pay for a magazine unless I'm getting a hard copy. Maybe I'm old fashioned but I feel the same way about books, music, and movies. Technology is changing though and it may be a good option for those who like it and wish to save some paper. IMO, virtual material must be a substantial discount to real…roughly 75% to be considered.

I will not pay to be a forum member. I think it would be good to give limited forum access to people who are not signed in as members. If someone is already signed in, they may be more willing to contribute to the forum and this would give the magazine a database of potential subscribers.

Additions and extras to what is free now would justify a fee.

Podcasts and videos are a little different. I’m aware that shows have been broadcast featuring Bob Lusk but do not wish to subscribe to those channels monthly for only 1 airing.

Posting pictures isn’t a big deal IMO. I’ll probably continue doing it as I have been even if another option is added.

hi bob,
i couldnt be more clear in my opinion than what DD1 says above.

however i ask you, is dave's assessment that you dont get that much business from the website true? have you tried to gauge increased business activity as it directly relates to new clients exposed to you through the forum, what about otto? surely he has moved some dirt through forum exposure, and have you recently asked yer sponsers (advertisers like todd overton, sue cruz, purina fish food folks, etc....) if they've seen a marked increase in activity if not sales as a direct result of the pondboss forum? for example, i wouldnt have known about let alone bought a vertex air station, or aquamax fish food otherwise.

im guessing yer business started, grew and survives off word of mouth...i cant think of a bigger word of mouth than this forum which i wouldnt have participated in if it werent free, plus, as a business/marketing expense it is tax deductible is it not?

getting the forum (and the pond boss brand) MORE visible through internet search vehicles would be the A1 priority in my mind.

and BTW, if you do institute charges, i will still love and admire you all the way from el dorado ca

to coin a phrase.....fish on......

died

Do what you need to do. Advertizing would me my first step.
I also came to this site from Bigbullgill .con. the picture links the personal page, the group are nice. As a first time pond owner there is no other place to get the RIGHT information then here. I'm here I going to stay here and if it takes a few buck a year to keep site up and running, tell me where to send my check.

I'm as guilty as the worst of us for thread hyjacking, so I'll be sure to keep that to a minimum from now on.

Burger made the comment that this is a "pulic" forum. It is treated that way and everyone is welcome, but the fact is, this is a PRIVATELY owned forum. We all contribute freely and the owners, Bob and Mike, pay the bill.

I think posting should remain free and a "donation" tab be offered. I would personally donate generously, for many reasons and not the least of which is the abundance of timely, accurate, and free information.

In lieu of a fully free forum, perhaps a full featured trial membership for those seeking help for a short period, sat 30 days. After the 30 days, the new members can choose to pay a nominal subscription fee of from $5-$20 annually with each $5 step adding more e-services, such as a current "Feature Article" from the current mag. Another step could include up to 2 back issue e-copies of the magazine, another step could include the pod cast, another could even include personal question answering and a subscription. That would be far more than the $20 stated earlier, but you get the idea.

Bottom line is that this site is so unique because of the willingness of all involved from top to bottom. It has grown because it is the best site, has great, stuff, and it's all free. A small cost in the beginning may lead to a huge price being paid in the end.

I'll pay and participate no matter what!

My $12.10 (adjusted for inflation)

I say you setup the donation tab first and or maybe a address where someone could send you money for a donation. Then make changes as you can with the extra money. I read earlier that we have about 5000 or so memebers of which about 1000 are active more or less. Well if you have 1000 of your 5000 members donate just 10 bucks that's 10 grand. You could start doing some real good stuff to the site and more with 10 grand. And if you actually got 2000 or so members to donate over a years time your looking at a nice profit for the PB mag and forum and you could do a lot of things to both with that kind of money. I can't speak for everyone but I think most of us could eventually through out the year afford to donate 10 bucks maybe even more. The key is numbers. The more people who donate the less you have to give.

I have been reading all the posts on this thread, and will state several opinions and observations as follows:
1: Got my A** chewed and handed to me on a platter on my 1st post,
but since that time have come to appreciate the comradie and banter
between the frequent posters as friends.
2. Realy liked the idea that I was able to lurk, read and learn, prior to joining and subscribing to mag(as much out of guilt for info I was recieving as anything-Subscrition and back issues which I have enjoyed)
3. Those of you based in Texas will never benefit monetarily from any direct connection with me and my lake in Georgia except through this forum and the PB mag.
4. Through this forum I have been in contact with Greg Grimes in my area and has helped me immensibly, and have supported him in products I needed and a beneficial consultation, would this be possible if it were a pay site for ads and posts????
5, Have been to # of sites online where they say X # of experts online to answer your questions, and once you go through all the info required they want a credit card to converse with me som I just log off and never go back.
6. Once you get to "pay for everything", do you get to if X get paid to answer A question, why don't I as Y get paid to answer Question B ????
7. Free enterprise system run on supply and demand, therefore cash flow and profit is the basis for driving that, so i agree some changes need to be made. Do the Resource Links get enough business off this forum/site that they would be willing to pay a small fee, would those of us that enjoy and learn prefer to donate, annual membership, or pay as you go.
8. For me, if I had found when 1st finding this site that I had to pay, don't know if I would have continued, probably not. But after discovering what was available more than happy to participate financially. What would work best for me would be donation even on trial basis, then if that didn't work go to annual paid membership with free read only. I'm fortunate enough that $50-$75 annually to do something I want is not going to interfere with my life, health or living, but realize there a lots of good people that that's not the case. But for me I'll try to do my part and help any way I can.

I have a question for you guys.

Let's assume the Forum remains free (as is) and with some of the improved functionality noted above (better search , different headings and ease of operation and pics). Further assume that if Bob adds pod casts , mag data base , or other out of Forum extras it will be optional and for a cost (on demand for a fee).

Then what are your ideas on how we grow this Forum and make it contribute to and along with the other PB business? I know Bob would be interested in any thoughts or ideas.

For this reason i don't think a trial membership then force to pay is the way to go. Most people will want to lurk for a while. a long while in some cases. I still say that if restrictions have to be put into place, the "premium forum" idea is the best. Let the amateurs like me banter and bicker all they want, it doesn't hurt anything, and in my case and lamar's, it convinces us to sign up. another good point, those of you on the site who stand to profit from people coming on and posting, will lose this if there is a reason to discourage people coming and posting. Now, this doesn't solve the problem for Bob et al, I understand, but it is a reason for pond consultants like G. Grimes to continue to support the forum, and a reason for more pond consultants to join. Also, this reinforces the need for the "geographic referral" page, which only presents itself as another source of income for Bob et al. People like G. Grimes (i'm not trying to pick on you in particular, just the above example) could pay a small fee for the ad, or commission to pondboss for business that came from the site.

Again, this is the general attitude of people on the web. They see these "pay to play" sites and think they are all generally scams, whether it is an honest venture or not. I can think of a few forums I signed up for hoping to get the answer to a question, then got jerked around and cancelled my subscription. After this experience, I doubt i would ever bother to find out if it was legitimate or not. most people will feel this way
I am one of these people, and came to this forum because i needed to know how to help a lake on a strict budget. I think alienating people in similar situations would be a detriment to all involved.

Ok, I think i have probably blathered on about my point enough.
like i said, longwinded, sorry.
-skinny

A) What are your opinions of paying a nominal annual fee to be a member of the forum?

I am not a fan of mandatory fee sites. Over the years I have belonged to a multitude of forums. From professional CPA type forums to car club forums. Some of them were smaller forums, some of them were huge forums. None of them required a mandatory fee. Several of them had a suggested donation. I completely understand the need to reduce forum costs and the desire to convert forum users to magazine subscribers and customers of supporting vendors – that makes good business sense. But IMHO if you require people to pay to view a forum you will drive away existing members and you will discourage new members.

One of the forums I use to belong to is a huge car club forum (I don’t belong anymore because I sold the car). This forum started out as a moderate sized forum and has grown to enormous proportions (over 100,000 members, over 9 million posts, averaging 25,000 posts per week). I started with the forum just at the time the site started growing exponentially (merely co-incidental, I had nothing to do with this growth). The “owners” of the forum could not keep up the cost of forum software and hardware upgrades – the forum slowed way down and began to frequently crash – the forum reached a crisis point. Several members, myself included, suggested a voluntary contribution system. Members were free to donate any amount over $10 that they wanted to. If you donated $10 or more per year the message “bronze supporter” appeared below your name. If you contributed $50 or more per year you were designated “silver supporter” and finally for $75 or more per year the designation was “gold supporter.” This system worked extremely well. The site received so much support that they were able to completely upgrade both the forum hardware and software. It became a sense of pride to become a supporting member. Much like the “I subscribe” message that appear here in signature lines.

It is my opinion, and of course this is just an opinion, if you require people to pay to belong to a site, you will significantly reduce the traffic to this site. If you ask for a voluntary donation to pay for the site I think you would be pleasantly surprised at how many of us would step forward and offer a donation.

B) Would you rather have a copy of the magazine in the mail, or an e-magazine?

I subscribe to both e-publications and to print publications. Personally I really like the magazine. I can read it when not in front of my computer. I work on my computer all day long. At the end of the day I don’t want to stare at the monitor(s) any longer. I’ve had enough of computer monitors for one day. A magazine I can read anywhere, anytime.

C) If you got the e-magazine, would you stop subscribing to the printed copy?

No.

D) How to you feel about having a free membership that has limited access to content? This may be a "read only" version of the forum. It may mean being able to access some articles, podcasts, videos, but having to pay for selected e-information.

IMHO limited access will mean limited forum growth. If you require people to pay to post then it is my opinion that many potential members will simply choose not to post. IMHO you will lose the potential member before you even know they are there.

E) Then, a "small" membership fee that has access to all the content, some of which is 'pay as you go', such as some of the e-information? This includes all privileges of the forum, including posting.
EE)Or, a "gold" membership, where you can have access to all the website, along with a "members only" forum where you get specific advice to specific problems from the top pros in the industry? This membership also includes a subscription to the magazine.
F) Finally, how much is this stuff worth? What should someone pay for a "medium" membership and what would you expect to receive. And, same question for the "gold" membership.

These last three (E, EE and F) are all related. Everyone’s idea of what a “small fee” is will probably vary, possibly even significantly. It is my opinion that if you require potential members to pay a fee prior to posting then you will significantly reduce the number of new members this site receives.

As far as a “gold membership” my answer is “it all depends.” How much would it cost and what benefits would be received.

Other issues:

Posting photos:
I have hosted a car website in the past. I paid for it personally. I did not have a forum attached so I cannot discuss any forum related issues – I simply do not have first hand experience or knowledge in this area. On my site I hosted all of the photos of cars, people, events, etc. Hosting photos is very expensive and editing photos is very time consuming. Digital cameras these days take photos that are massive in file size. In order to reduce the cost of storage, I had a submission requirement as to photo dimensions and file size. About half of the photo submissions complied with the requirement, the other half did not and I personally had to edit the photos. This took a ton of time and effort. With the growth of the site’s popularity I received more and more photos. I kept having to purchase more and more file storage. It got costly in a hurry.
I recommend against this site hosting photos. I will get expensive – fast. IMHO posting photos to this site is not that difficult. Like anything else it is a process to be learned but once learned it is fairly easy. Photobucket (the service I use) is free, so are several others. The archives describe in detail how to post a photo but if any member has a problem please feel free to ask again.

Searching:
I don’t use the forum's search button any more. To me is was frustrating and once I was taught the google site search function I began to exclusively use that. I don’t remember who taught me that tip but it was a member here and I find it an invaluable tool.

Thread hijacking:
Guilty as charged. I’m probably one of the largest culprits of this. I apologize if I have offended or angered anyone by hijacking their thread. I’ve said it before and I’ll say it again – If I ever make a post to your thread that you want removed please PM me. I will delete it. I won’t haggle with you, I won’t argue with you, I’ll delete it plain and simple.

I have heard over and over again that one of the primary reasons that people like this forum is the family atmosphere. A sense of belonging. IMHO part of that environment is humor. If this forum becomes a purely technical forum (you should read some of my tax forums, they make even me want to poke my eyes out) then, I believe, you will lose many people here. Members here post about births and deaths in their family, illnesses, good times and bad times. Could the forum survive without these posts? Of course it could. Would the forum retain a family feeling? I think not. People here care about other members and have come to know other members on a personal level – this doesn’t happen much with other forums or at least in other forums that I have belonged to.

I don’t have the education or experience to post much of anything meaningful to this forum. Several years ago I took it upon myself to be a member of the welcoming committee. I didn’t see that happening much. Someone would post a question and the question would be answered. On only very rare occasions would someone actually receive a welcome to the forum greeting. It felt too impersonal to me. So myself and several others began welcoming new members to the site. Sort of way of extending a friendly handshake and saying “Hi, I’m glad you’re here.”

Welcoming new members and providing some comic relief is all I have to offer to this forum. I humbly apologize to anyone that I have offended via a thread hijack.

In conclusion (good lord will this post ever end?):
Personally I believe that there are much better ways to make this site more profitable to the owners and vendors than to require potential members to pay prior to posting. I can honestly state that if I had been required to pay prior to a first post then I would never have posted. However if after posting I found I liked the site then I would make a voluntary contribution – I have done exactly that in other forums in the past.

As far as how to make the forum usage convert to profitable venture, I am certainly not an expert in these matters and so I shall defer to others in the mechanics of how that should occur to someone that is such an expert.

One suggestion that I have to offer is to put together packages of articles on a given subject matter and to sell these packages in a digital format. For example perhaps a package of 10 Pond Boss magazine articles on how to raise bluegill would sell for $10 and would be available in the “Pond Boss Store” tab.

I personally do not take any offense to a supporting vendor that uses this site to sell goods or services. To me this makes perfect sense. Us pond owners have a need, we post a question, a vendor provides a solution. Everyone wins. I certainly am not offended by any such interaction.

It has been my distinct honor to be a member of this forum. I consider many of you a personal friend. I have been supported by this forum’s membership in times of family tragedy and in times of joy. This has never happened to me in any other forum to which I have belonged. Regardless of what changes are made to this forum I sincerely hope that we are able to preserve the family environment that has been created here.

Search engines. broken record anyone? sorry, i really hope i am not making everyone hate the sight of my posts....
using a broad match to the queries that brought me to this site through google, google reports that there are 1590 searches monthly related to small largemouth, overpopulated largemouth, small largemouth bass and other key search terms.
Once you get those people to the site, then you can measure your traffic in google analytics and sell bigger, better ad space to the interested parties.

Second, you can sell solutions to these common problems (hence the last thread i started) via e-articles, e-books, print books etc. Not to mention selling other products like purina products, designs for making homemade fish habitats etc.

-skinny

DIED, probably shouldn't have said that because it is Mikes and Bobs business, not mine.

However, the reality is that the Forum members are about 99% do-it-your selfers.

Jeff beat me to it. That's what i meant to say.
Thanks
-skinny

You guys type and post too fast. with all these opinions being posted why not do an online survey incorporating these suggestion for a general consensus to guide the owners in the decisions they need and want to make. For me, agree with everything JHAP just posted.

Wow! What a flurry!
Let me offer more clarity from home base. First, I'm hearing everything you guys are saying.
I have no intention of making the forum a "pay" site. I like that old cliche' "If it ain't broke, don't fix it." The forum is where we'll put the "donate" tab and people can pay what they wish. We'll leave the forum as is...maybe add a few topics to help bring Brettski's wishes true.
We have several motives...
1) Increase our paid subscriber numbers.
2) Maximize search engine optimation by adding more content and learning how to better play that game. (skinnybass, let's talk).
3) We've not added content to the website. We offered a few books, videos, etc. and depended on the forum for content.
4) Fore newbies and lurkers, it's hard to find information...that's why I made the comment about hijackers. Personally, I think the hijackings are a big reason people actually read many threads. It's funny, entertaining stuff. By adding content, in the form of e-books, articles, podcasts, etc., we offer specific information. I think some of these topics should be free, but some of them should be sold.
5) It's the content that I'm trying to figure out how to market.
6) Advertising...I totally agree. This site is "mined" by several folks, several of which don't advertise...some do. I've heard some of the stories about the marketing of goods and services via pm's from this site. I like it, but I also think those sellers should make the situation mutually beneficial for those who facilitate the sale.
7) I also have an idealistic side. I truly believe it is our mission to spread the word to teach people how to be better stewards of our land and water resources. To that end, we need a bigger audience, and since we are in the information business, I think it's fair to benefit from this opportunity...at least a little bit.

Keep those thoughts coming.

Understand this:

We don't intend to make the current for a "pay" gig.
We do intend to increase paid subscriber numbers.
We do intend to add lots of content to the site, independent of the forum. Some of this will be free, some won't.

Thanks for the valuable input. We are definitely listening.

I like the ideas of polls, possibly for this thread itself, but for others as well. Other forums which have a similar lay out as this one have a poll option. This forum doesn't. The ability to post a poll where people can vote would be a nice addition.

i dont know dave, i thought yer comments were absolutely perfect, and it made me think about how does bob or anybody else gauge the amount of business they get from internet exposure ....which is the crux of this to my mind, i also had the same thought that most here are DIYs and use this forum to help, its an incredible resource.

i dont know, i may be way off base but my mind quickly condensed this to
a) is the real issue gaining another avenue of profit while hosting the best pond forum possible (which is admirable and i personally would support donation based changes), or
b) offsetting losses due to hosting the website assuming "pond boss" has not measurably grown enough as a result of the forum to absorb continued hosting a free forum (as a business/marketing expense)?

i have no ulterior motives, just a curious dumb geologist trying to understand better, and am honored to be here carrying a deep respect for bob and all he's done.

great post BTW jhap.

I'm picking up what you are throwing down, CJ. I like polls too.

Also the brag board could be expanded beyond the one thread for fishing 2010. There have to be tons of different fishermen here, saltwater, big bluegill, GSF, etc. There could be multiple threads for multiple breeds.

-skinny

Whew busy catching up from being out of town but read most of the post. I echo most thoughts. Bob know this but I want him to succeed not just do this out of the goodness of his heart. I just spoke with advertising editor of a big forum here in Georgia. He echoes Bob’s thoughts. It is even worse for him. He has guys come on the free forum and slam an advertiser of the magazine and recommend a non advertising competitor of a certain product or service. The advertiser then pulls his ad in the magazine. Sometimes he wonders why they run this forum. Bob sound familiar at all? He gave me many recommendations and Bob call me if you want his number, very knowledgeable.

Does the forum make money? So why does Bob spent money on running it? Question needs asking. Do you realize band width, etc. and the cost to run the “free public” forum. If you house pics here it cost money in more band width usage.
First I feel strongly as others do that paying for the forum will kill it. Extra service sure charge for that, great idea. I do not know the answers, Nate to me is a great guy for addressing some of these ideas (marketing). Geographical idea is good if pulled off. Lamar we do py to be listed in resource guide nto sure many folks know about it. Not sure I have ever got a call from it being listed for years. Maybe charge more but have it popup on banner, many ideas out there.

This forum is in front of tons of pondowners and is a valuable tool for both potential vendors (me) and magazine subscribers. I know I have asked about banner ads a couple of times but yet to find out how much it will cost me- Bob get gayle to send me this info?? Anyway I got this advice, get in touch with google at http://www.adsense.com It is free to add to this site and owners of this site get paid as folks click on links, extra income. One time setup fee from IT guy. And/or sell more banner ads. They can be placed on the forum sidebar ,etc not just on header. Right now not enough of this type material on here. Not sure it will work but I’m willing to view a free forum but “deal with” ads. I guess my point is… I’m a “vendor” and I think vendors need to be the one paying not the user of the site.
I like the extra gold level etc deal-just need to figure out what you get for that $. The site needs to be better utilized to sell stuff to then have it at least breaking even. How do you do it-you need a better brain than mine.

Ok since I started typing this and fielding calls about 30 more post so some might be repeat info.

Kudos to what Bob Lusk just said, put up the donation tab, I,ll check, credit card or pay pal minute its available. I have no commercial interest in what I do on this site, just looking for the WOW factor from my grandchildren, family, and friends when they fish my lake, and you made me realize my problem and are helping me on my way to fixing it.
Thanks,
Lamar

You bet. anytime. Step 1, adding permanent content independent of the forum, I see you've already got that one under your belt.

Rock Fish on!

Hey, what's this green stuff in my pond?

Good question. I think I have an overpopulation of 12 lb LMB. I catch them on every cast and can't seem to catch any bluegill under 12". I blame having too much information on the forum as well as the aeration system and feed that I purchased because of advertisers in the magazine.

To further answer the above question: My labs are starting to shed. Anyone know how to keep a dog from shedding.

6) Advertising...I totally agree. This site is "mined" by several folks, several of which don't advertise...some do.

Bob, shouldn't there be terms on here that people cannot be contacted by a third party for commercial purposes? As example, I may initiate contact with someone and enlist their services, but they could not solicit me. To use this site for their own commercial gain and not be an advertiser is unethical IMO. Perhaps this should be addressed in terms during registration.

7) I also have an idealistic side. I truly believe it is our mission to spread the word to teach people how to be better stewards of our land and water resources.

This shows in every issue of the magazine that I have read. As the forum grows the magazine grows. I have to think that your business and the business of advertisers will grow, too. At some point the laws of exponential growth will kick in.

How do you grow subscriptions?

Have advertisers include a copy of the magazine or a coupon for a year's subscription when they sell an aeration system. Have them throw a subscription card into every box they ship. Staple a card to every bag of fish feed, glue a card to every jug of water treatment, and paint your logo on Otto's machines, think outside the pond. Some may do it for free, some may ask for a trade or in kind agreement.

Pondboss is great but it is not Google. When you are one of the champions, be creative. Until then, imitate. I learned this in sports, and business. Do you pay to search via Google or do you see advertisements? We are a small group. Know what you don't know, and copy what others do better.

One thing you could put on a potential premium section of the website would be electronic versions of all the old PB magazines. You could leave off the last few years to keep people from dropping their current subscriptions and only relying on e-versions. I would pay more to have access to the entire library of old issues and I think others would also. I know you can order back issues individually now but much of that money goes to shipping and handling.

Edit: After reading thread again realized Cody already had mentioned this in an earlier post. However I was thinking one fee would get you the whole back issue library.

#10 blade on a set of Oster clippers. (at least the hair that falls out is MUCH shorter!)

If I use the donate tab would it be possible to register that event & send a reminder e-mail to donate at some point in time in the future?

Reguarding the hijacking. It's difficult for me to articulate, but here goes.
I don't want to see the cutting up & jokeing around to stop. I think it's good for the forum, & can be extreemly entertaining.
There have been times however when I was intrested in a topic of discussion when the hijack completely redirected & ended the discussion, or I got frustrated trying to pick out the few serious posts between the many off topic ones. I usually just stop clicking on that thread.
It's not an offensive thing as it is frustrating. Maybe it's just old age.

Take away their credit card?

I'm late to this party, my simple opinion.
1. Leave the forum alone, if it ain't broke don't fix it, posting photo's is not hard just takes a little effort.
2. Let's help spread the word about PB magazine with small brochures or business cards thus increasing circulation.
3. That's all I have to say.

simple and organized and let us forum family members help out for sure.

Dont recommend using google banners for ppc advertising on this site for many reasons, also could potentially revamp the resource center for better exposure to the paid advertisers, and definitely target the fish hatcheries and fish farms for this also!!! Fish Farms are way behind the times and are very hard for pond owners to find. The fish farms who actually take time off from raising and harvesting fish may not be too good or reputable, but they know how to market. It took me YEARS to find all of my 'local' fish farms. What I am getting at is the fish farms arent going to find you, you need to find them and I bet if you hit them up for a few bucks (during fish stocking season) they would sign up in a heartbeat.

Pond Boss Forum, Pond Boss Website, Pond Boss Magazine should all be incorporated together a bit more. When dealing with regular people, you need to make everything super obvious and super easy to see and click and read and comprehend. Your grandma should be able to easily find the important information for the forum, website, and magazine no matter what portion they are currently looking at, without asking any questions.

I love the idea of adding one or two categories for brettski, but dont add very many. I only have time to read the questions/observations and the pond boss family stuff to begin with.

When you get finished reading this, go back and read jeffhasapond's post. He is a genius, its just the rest of the world doesnt know it yet.

In no particular order:

1) I prefer a hard copy of the magazine. I still get hard copies of Grainger, McMaster Carr, Newark, Allied Electronics, etc. even though it's on the web. Sure, I'm killing more trees but it keeps tree farmers fed.

2) Increase search engine hits. Let's make sure this site is the hub for the pond world and everyone finds it.

3) Keep the forum free for many of the reasons mentioned. However, I don't think it is unfair to allow one to become a member, post and ask questions unless they are a PB subscriber. Given the breadth of knowledge and invaluable advice that is on this forum, I would think that anyone with integrity would be happy to splll $35 for a subscription/forum membership. If they aren't at least willing to do that, then do we really want them? Heck, most state agencies have free .pdf files on a variety of pond topics. Let a non-payer go there and/or browse the PB forum for free....but to be able to ask as many questions as you want on the forum and get a magazine subscription for $35 is the deal of the century. Lurkers can still lurk and learn but a magazine subscription should have it's privileges. In summary- the forum is free for everyone in the world to read and learn but you only become a member with the ability to post if you subscribe to the magazine.

4) I would be willing to pay EXTRA (above my magazine subscription fee) for access to a searchable database of all of the PB Mag articles. This is a huge set of information that has a lot of value. Very few would probably subscribe to this- but I can see the very serious pondmeister and other industry professionals paying the piper. As a member of the American Fisheries Society, I have full access to all 4 of their scientific journals on-line and it's a great tool for me. With some marketting, I bet you can get a lot of professional biologists in both the private and public sectors to join.

5) I don't like seeing other professionals pimping their services/products within the text of the forum either (I think you called it mining). This is just my opinion, but I think it is poor etiquette. I'm not saying this because I am upset because I'm not making a sell. I'm not on here to make a sell nor have I ever tried. I just think the business side should be left under the advertising section. The content of the forum itself should be about dissemination of topical knowldege (more on this later), not trying to sell a gadget. Let the consumer browse the advertising section and let the vendor advertise. For example, how many times has the topic of aeration been covered? Let each advertiser write a one page review of why their's is the best, put it in a .pdf format under an aeration tab and let the consumer decide by calling them directly, finding their local dealer, and heck, maybe put a product review section as a stand alone link & resource? As this site evolves, I like the idea of having a searchable products page and a geographic pond consultant page. The possibilities about the appproach to take are endless. I think this will increase your revenue.

6) Lot's of hi-jacking occurs as well as non pond related topics. What to do? Well, I have mixed feelings. The hi-jacking does tend to give the site character. I've had lots of laughs along the way. Recently, we learned about the well-being of Nate's little baby and learned that Deaner passed away. These things are important to know. I also like hearing about Brettski's projects and JHAP's misadventures. It's part of what keeps me coming back. My only gripe is that it's tough to wade through some of the hi-jacking when I'm searching or trying to follow an informative thread. But I can live with it. This is another reason why I would like to see a searchable database on the articles with access to .pdf files of each article/individual mag. For those not interested in the non-pond related stuff on the forum, then they can pay a little extra and go straight for the article database.

7) I think it's time for a facelift, so Bob I thank you for soliciting our opinions and keeping us involved. I think with the right approach, you can be profitable/more profitable with this site. You should be. You deserve it. Your magazine is one of a kind. I tell all of my customers about it and I know some have subscribed. A friend of mine made the comment that it was stupid for me to have a customer subscribe because it would push my services out of the equation. I think the opposite is true. They (my clients) see ideas and we discuss them as a team. If anything, it increases their interest and drives more business to me. The magazine is great for the entire industry and we all benefit as it grows.

8) From someone who makes their living in this industry, please allow me to throw this out there: have you ever thought about pulling all of us industry professionals together as part of some organization or stand alone forum? This could have a lot of merit and we can learn a great deal from one another. I'm just thinking out loud but as you develop a new approach to the mag and forum, I think somehow rallying the professionals in the industry could also prove useful.

A lot of good reading in this thread, so much so that I don’t know where to begin. I’ll try the beginning and go from there.

Sunil and Eric both made excellent points in this discussion. Eric and his “ease of entry” and Sunil’s comment about the homepage. I was directed to the homepage on three separate occasions before I finally found the forum itself. From the homepage, I got the initial impression that it was all about merchandise and, like any consumer, I was not prepared to make a purchase without knowing the product and was not ready to go through the “work” of learning about the product. Turns out the product was free.

And that brings me to the consistent theme that it appears Bob has addressed. I do believe a free forum is necessary to the short and long term success of this product and service. So I am very happy to see it will not be interfered with because it appears as if the initial goal of obtaining an audience and beginning to charge for services were two conflicting purposes.

I can only imagine if this site was a “pay to play”. I would not have signed on either. That’s pretty scary to think about because I would not have discovered what has become my favorite forum on the web. I am a member of a number of message boards ranging in a variety of topics and this one boasts BY FAR the most knowledgeable and friendliest members of any I have come across. First of all, the specific knowledge you obtain is tremendous. But we all know that. Not into my 20th post on this site (estimate) did I have a fellow member PMing me introducing himself and wanting to be a part of my project. I have never, and will not hold my breath to ever experience again, seen that kind of passion towards this obsession we kids in grown up shoes call ‘pondmeistering’. I only hope to extend that kind of welcome to others as I further my knowledge of the subject.

I’ll echo many of the sentiments throughout this thread in that, I know what this service means to me. I know even before I have water in my hole in the ground, the money I have already saved. Knowing this, I will subscribe to Pond Boss, in all capacities, regardless of what Mr. Lusk and Mr. Otto choose to do. However, taking into account the previous two paragraphs, I am grateful the free aspect will remain available to future members so they can have the access I have appreciated.

I suppose by now I have answered Bob’s question ‘A’.

Shortly after I joined, I had emailed Bob regarding the not-so-user-friendly search function. So I am very happy to be seeing that addressed and so many other members sharing my opinions on this as well. A search function will always be more difficult for new or infrequent members, but there are certainly better options out there and I am excited to see what they come up with.

I suppose, since my handle was mentioned, I can comment on the photo posting suggestions. In previous threads, I was just trying to help quickly with a simple solution. If I had a picture, I knew how to post it and was willing to help out a fellow forum member by doing that for them. I did not realize how frustrating it was for them or that they had many many more pictures they wished to have posted onto the forum. If I'd known this I would have shown them how to do it. It really is easy, just takes a little practice. Since it was my mistake before in not 'teaching a man to fish to feed him for a lifetime' I will do so now… and try not to be such an enabler in the future.

Go to an image upload webpage, like Photobucket (photobucket.com). Create an account (really easy). Open an album and go to this page...



Click 'Choose Files' to find a picture loaded on your computer and upload it. It will upload automatically. Once it's done, you'll have the option to name it, tag it, whatever. Do that if you want (I never do) and go back your album. You will see the picture there, a thumbnail. This is what it will look like...



See where my cursor is? You hover over that one that starts with IMG, click it so it's highlighted. Copy it (CTRL+C). Then go to your post and paste it (CTRL+V). And there it should be... That's all I ever do... Hope it helps. And actually this is an older tutorial I did on another message board. Photobucket is even more user friendly after a more recent upgrade to the process. But in any case, I appreciated being of service PondFrog and encourage you to familiarize yourself with Photobucket. I think we all would benefit from pictures you could share with us.



I think MikeyBoy brings up an awesome point, and one further elaborated upon, in this thread. Personally, I would not have found out about vendors such as Stubby Steve’s, Vertex, etc. were it not for Pond Boss. But it could be more, I’m sure. And these vendors appear to be just as generous as their customers. I have received two boxes full of Stubby Steve’s samples from Stacy and hope to have some valuable testimonials from either myself or friends soon. I have handed them out to friends and strangers alike. And with Gayle hooking us up with business cards to spread the Pond Boss name, 1 will become 2, 2 will become 4, 4 will become 16, and that’s about where my mathematically challenged mind will stop and just assume you get the idea.





Relating MikeyBoy’s, essup’s and RC’s ideas, I love this. I’d also go so far as to offer a Q & A for vendors to access by subscription to free potential customers. Imagine the tool that would be for consumers and the potential for gaining new customers for our valued vendors. Great ideas.

Regarding having to choose between a hard copy magazine versus an e-magazine is like saying I have to choose which kid I like more. Both have their places. I love the hard copy. Gives me something to hold and I will always appreciate that and continue to subscribe. But I think the idea of an “e-zine” is something to build on. Maybe even give “e-ziners” a discount, since it’ll save Pond Boss publishing costs. And encourage e-zine subscriptions by promoting their promptness. No waiting for the mailwoman fishing big LMB through the ice.



Awesome. Obviously, there are going to always be a ton of people out there using search engines and if Pond Boss can get their name on that list, and hopefully near the top, that would mean more exposure.



I liked this idea when I read this too and glad it’s actually proved profitable. I think adding perks might be a direction to entertain when going further with this. Something like this or what Sports Illustrated does and give small gifts to subscribers. Little things like that might really get those new subscribers off that fence and in the yard. And was it Eric who suggested a lifetime membership, one time fee? I like that too. Makes it more “exclusive”.



You definitely stick around skinny B. You have contributed to this site from the first post.





Regional suppliers? That would be HUGE. Great idea and definitely one I can see utilized by all kinds of pondmeisters. Detailed categories and searches will easily encourage extensive navigation by this forum’s members.





Yeah, I have to think this will take a pretty substantial commitment. After reading this thread and gathering all of these incredible ideas and wonderful suggestions, I think it would be an advantageous endeavor. This person or group of people could drastically change the landscape of pond management. Help all of us gain access to even more information, more networking, more customers.



JHAP, your posts have had me LOLing more than anyone else’s on any other forum. And I rarely LOL. You pull back on your comic relief and I will die a little bit inside.

I think in conclusion, I’ll echo a great many ideas. First of all, to encourage new members, and keep older ones, keeping it simple is the best way to go. Offer the free services as you always have, but certain encourage, and offer easy access, to those areas that Pond Boss can find themselves a profit.

I like the donation button idea too. I think that should be on the free forum we all enjoy so that any of us can utilize it. Might even consider multiple options to donate. Like if you like a suggestion or advice, have the easy clickable option to drop a couple dimes in the plate to show your appreciation.

While I think keeping the forum free is a great idea, I think making some archives, past articles, podcasts (I’m a HUGE podcaster), videos, instrumentals, etc. accessible only by payment or advanced membership is a spectacular idea. There’s the great information we get for free, but additional information at a nominal fee would be great for everyone.

I like the idea of “gold membership” or the idea of advanced membership options. Let the consumer decide what they get and make sure the quality of the product is worth their investment.

I also liked the ideas about rewarding subscribers. As I mentioned, small gifts to subscribers, but also further access as well as additional incentives like detailed user profiles. Being able to post your profile with specifics about your pond, who you are, etc. Again, a little more exclusive option to allow your customers further integrate themselves into the Pond Boss family.

So that’s my long winded list of thoughts, opinions, and general rambling. I think Bob and Mike are certainly thinking in the right direction and I absolutely love that you have decided to ask us, the consumers of your product, for their suggestions. That tells us a lot about you and I hope our responses here have told you a lot about us.

I like the emag Idea, print copies cost to much to send to me. With emag I would not ask for a print copy.

I think the free access to the forum should be read only. I also think full access should be for all subscribers, either print or emag. If you have the mag and the forum there is almost nothing else you need, so I am not sure what multi level membership would be for.

I find pictures no problem, but the search is a serious negative. Hijacking is part of forum life. Curtailing it might make the site look unfriendly, in my opinion. I just had one of those brilliant thoughts, if there was a box on each message that indicated that this post is not for archival purposes, then disappeared after non activity of the thread or in so many days? Well not maybe so brilliant.

This forum is one of the most pleasant I have ever been involved with, due to the personality of Bob, I suspect.

There is no lack of participation on this thread. I took the time to read everything posted thus far. I do not own a pond, so I don't subscribe to the magazine, although it was my doing that Dwight first got started with a subscription for a Christmas present and the rest is history for him. I do love to fish ponds, so my interest in this forum is great. The donation idea is a good one, but I would not restrict the use of this forum to posters that don't buy the magazine. I think if you had a donations tab, you would get more money for your hard work. Thanks.

The non-search friendly problem, and many others, can be taken care of by using different forum software. There are many good, free forum applications that are far more feature rich and flexible than UBB Threads. Some of the forum software includes polling capability. Free forum software is supported by online communities not unlike the Pond Boss forum, and support is excellent.

A huge "THANK YOU" to each and everyone of you! I wanted input and have heard you, loud and clear.
This gives me some great direction. We're in the planning phase and I'll let you know what's next! Exciting times are coming. Much needed improvement of this site.

Bob,

I am going to contact you through since you are interested in improving the site.

I have experienced great success in search engine optimization.


I have quite a few suggestions (Advice is free of charge. I actually want to help this community grow, rather than siphon money from pond boss' pockets like an overwhelming majority of professional SEO's).

If you are looking for more traffic, I can help you make it happen. It won't happen overnight, but it will happen.

ouch. There are those of us who aren't evil, you know....


(kidding of course ... ;))
Check your PM's, Gflo.

I like emag but think both should be available. This is personal preference and I am sure many will want hardcopy. I would not want the hardcopy if the old emags were reachable and searchable. I believe, as others, that at first I would not have paid, but now after benefitting from PB forum, I would. So you will have me if you charge Bob, and if you don’t, I will make donations. It will be nice to have search and picture posting facilitated.

I have not been able to read all the responses to this tread, so forgive me if it is repetitive, but the optimization of search engine words could probably be improved, and there are services that provide this. I know they cost and would hope you can get one that does the service efficiently and cost effectively with good return. I am sure there are members here who know more about that than me. Anyway if more people find PB site, then ultimately more will subscribe to the mag.

By the way why someone would not subscribe to the magazine after having experienced all there is here in the forum is not within my understanding.

Fish on all PB'ers

My comments are relative to search engine optimization (SEO). I don't know gflo, so this is not a critique of him in any way. I also don't know much about SEO either, except to know that it works.

The following is merely an example, but I think illustrates how it can work. As background, I own a wholesale distributorship of electronic items. 75 % of my sales are to people who sell through the Internet. The other 25% are retail shops of many varieties. When I started the business in 2001 one of my first customers, and the biggest for the first year or so, was a web site that sold around $25,000 of our products per year. The owner of that business was pretty agressive, so I thought, and did a good job of representing our product. Then that owner sold the business to a young couple. The husband worked full time and only spent a few hours a week at the new business and the wife worked on it in between raising two kids, PTA, etc. After a year or two of $25,000 plus or minus of annual sales they hired a SEO firm who worked with them to get their word, and our product out there. What they did I don't know. What I do know is that it worked. That husband and wife couple's sales of our product last year exceeded $300,000. Therefore I know it works, at least for retail, and I bet it would work in "selling" Pond Boss to many more people.

I know this couple spent a few thousand $$$ getting everything set up, but they are being paid back daily.

Bing

No, Gflo should be listened to carefully, hence my joke about most of us actually being evil.
There are a lot of SEO's that are complete scam artists. very much so.
Many people get out there saying there is some magic potion or a "make it happen" button that will solve all of their problems, and sometimes the client will see a lot of success really really quickly. But in the cases Gflo is talking about, that success usually turns sour.

The people that Gflo and I are referring to are what we call "black hats" in the SEO world, and usually signing up with them leads to tragedy for a business. I Have a client now that hired a black hat, and he is just now (2 years later) not banned by google. Completely banned, like, not allowed to appear at all.
I say often, very often, that rule #2 in SEO is "content is king". Nobody ever asks me what rule #1 is. But in all honesty it is very simple:
Don't piss google off.
life without google on the internet is very difficult and not profitable. He (which means I) basically had to beg them to let him back in. And he still doesn't index for a lot of the terms he should, products that his factory makes that other retailers sell, he's around #50, while they are @ #1. it's sad, this is the punishment google doles out.

So when Gflo says look for someone who has a genuine want to help, he means it, and he is right. I completely agree, honestly. He is talking about all the schmucks out there that give me a bad name.

This SEO that the couple in your example hired is what we call a "white hat" or sometimes "gray" (depending on their tactics and the popular lingo of the day). Guys like that are good.

I, and I assume Gflo, only approve of "white". There is no magic button, no potion, no incantation that will make the google gods pay attention.

oh....also....PB is looking for cheap (I assume). White hats know they are good, and they are expensive. Some of you may remember in a previous topic how i suggested an SEO, but wouldn't want to subject bob et al to my ridiculous rates.

A cheap SEO is usually either a black hat or just a nice guy (like gflo).

That makes me a jerk in most cases, i guess.

Theo, you seem to be loosing bandwidth!



Have you been talking to JHAP!, or, was that a thought on your own part! Notice the green!

Jiminy jillickers!

I am just trying a few things, so don't mind me.

Well, I was gonna get cute and repost your lil guy with the hammer and caption it "burger on high teck".

I copied it to my pics. I opened photobucket. I spent 15 minutes fartin' around on the site; never saw the previously easy to find "upload" option. WAY to convoluted of a site for me now.
Any suggestions for another site, or how to upload pics now?
I mean, I never found it!

OH! That Guy!

Burger,

I never left the site to do that.

It ONLY works with GOOGLE CHROME as your web browser.

Firefox and IE DO NOT have the option.

Plus, there are a million silly to serious things you could add to your post.

I have not been successful, but have been trying to get a "James Bond" type cartoon redhead wearing GSF Scales (all very tasteful), that could be the Natasha counter intelligence agent for the GSA. Gotta love the accent! and who needs Borris at this point. Yeah, James Bond

I'm sure JHAP could help you out with the details. Anything to promote the GSA.
I gotcha about the diff web browsers capabilities.

My point was to gripe(who, me?) about not being able to even upload to photobucket anymore. In earlier times, you just went to your album, the option 'upload' was there. Click it, it opened your pictures folder on my docs. and you clicked the photo you wanted to upload. If you have an account, try it. It is not the same anymore.
Same thing with any web site. I cant even pay my ATT Uverse acct. balance. Cant find a link to open the invoice. Links say like'manage my acct' but just want to sell more junk.

I can vouch for the merits of the Eastern European honeys. I had to struggle to stay focused repairing an HF SSB Transmitter the other day on a Latvian ship; with a 20 something 3rd mate(female) long dirty blond, capri pants, tight sweater, etc., in charge of the radio station. Strange, she was very interested in my troubleshooting techniques.

It's a curse.

I suppose there is nothing more alluring to a lady than ground beef.

You are the burgermeister.

cheezboorger, cheezboorger, cheezboorger...
no fries, cheeps

And it is only Tuesday

No coke; Pepsi.

mea culpa. a thread that has so much content about hijacking, so the hijacking begins.

you guys are awesome. Now i get to comment on this part to. I love it. the hijacking should not stop. the humor and bantering offered therein is what makes the personalities and friendliness of those involved stand out, and shows how much of a family atmosphere is really a part of this forum.

i understand the point, though, of wanting to find info easier without a green sunfish discussion every six posts. What i don't understand is that i tried to bait the GSF people like 8 times this thread, and nobody hit the lure. i must smell funny or something. anywho...

personally i think the publication of easy-access information elsewhere on the site will make the commonly sought info easy to research, while allowing the hijackers to continue hijacking to their hearts content and our mutual amusement.

I think i have covered everything at this point, right? let's see:
-SEO
-i don't shut up
-i smell funny
-SEO
-No paid forum
-SEO
-I don't shut up
-oh yeah, i'm always in front of a computer and would prefer a digital copy of the mag. my dad though, who i got the subscription for, would prefer print.

For anyone who doesn't like photobucket. Tinypic is an option. It requires no membership.

See Posting Photos with Picasa.

thanks, ya'll. I will try others.

"What i don't understand is that i tried to bait the GSF people like 8 times this thread, and nobody hit the lure. i must smell funny or something. anywho...


Dont awaken a sleeping giant.

Bob, I'm not going into the business part of your question but only about increased readership and participation.

I do know there is a connection between the PondBoss Forum and the Texas Fishing Forum, where I sometimes participate.
http://texasfishingforum.com/forums/ubbthreads.php

It’s cluttered but well organized. I ignore all categories except fly fishing, ponds and fish species topics. I believe that our PB forum could be organized in such a manner.
There is a lot of advertising but doesn’t causes me a problem.
PondBoss ad is a very eye-catching.

My $.002 cents worth.

I have not been able to find a forum for landowners wanting to share ideas on developing wildlife habitat on their land, not only for hunting and fishing, but also for non-game animals. Perhaps this presents a business opportunity for this site to expand? More visitors means potentially greater advertising revenue. Just a thought...

There is a simple answer to this is that the GSA is smarter than to hijack the boss's thread.

But don't think for one moment that we haven't noticed your blasphemy.

That SEO thing we have been discussing may be the newest PB abbreviation. However, since I don't know the true definition of it, I'd like to expand on my praise of it being responsible for my customer's huge increase in sales. I am sure also what they did, and what PB must do is have an informative well organized website that is easy to negotiate, make comments on, attractively display "products", etc. Having PB pay for search optimization, pay-per-click, etc. and having someone arrive at your site and not find what they are looking for won't yield long term results.

Pond Boss has the content, the finest expert advice in the world, a relaxed easy user group, etc. Now I think it is a matter of getting viewers/readers/customers, etc. who will pay enough of the bills to keep this thing growing.

Bing

Spot-on, Bing.
Bounce rates are a huge consideration. Generally, if someone lands on your site (there is some debate about the timeframe) you have under 10 seconds to get them to act. If they aren't convinced, they "bounce" off the site. Remember that if they are coming from google, they just saw at the very least 9 other options to get them what they want (much more than that if you aren't on the first page).

The links on the side of the homepage need to be improved for visibility to reduce the bounce rate. Also, the forum does need to be easily searchable, or in the case of an archive database, it needs to easily provide the answers needed quickly and accurately.

Bounces=bad.

I agree with Bing.

I will try and draw up a new "proposed" site structure in an easy to understand format with explanations for each step.

This takes a considerable amount of time / thought and number crunching, so I may be done with it by Sunday, but it could take me until around next tuesday / thursday (I have an Organic chemistry and biochem midterm coming up, so I won't be able to knock it out as quickly as usual)

I'll start thinking about very manageable, easy to use shopping cart options as well. Ones that look a little more aesthetically pleasing, but should integrate well, and won't cost an arm and a leg.

But for now, I'll get working on a site blueprint. I'll more than likely talk shop with skinnybass and see what we can come up with in our spare time (sorry for volunteering you). It sounds terrible, but it is kind of fun to work through the logistics.

Most everything you guys are suggesting is ideal, the real work is what has to go on behind the scenes to 1)Get the traffic 2)Convert that traffic 3)If failing to convert that traffic, bait them with a "free" digital product offer to get their email, so you can convert them later.

It is pretty simple, and it can be done. We just have to tweak the blueprint a bit. Now I am excited.

I understand that no one has elected me or forced me to do any of this stuff. You might not even want me to, but I'm going to do it anyways I'm stubborn.

Gflo - Organic Chem-yuck! Biochem is pretty cool. What's your major?

I volunteered my help long ago. Just be warned. as a professional SEO, I am most likely evil and will try to siphon your money. Not PB's money, your, personal money. (muahahahahaah!)
I actually like that moniker. Nobody's ever issued a warning about me (or associated me with a group of people to be warned about) before. Thanks for that, i'm running with it.


same here. let's rock n roll.

I'm an animal science major.

I can't stand organic chemistry. It drives me crazy. Biochem on the other hand, I love it.

If I can relate what I am doing to an organism and a physiological process, then I am golden.

The O-Chem is just a bunch of chemicals in a jar to me. I have lightbulb moments every once in awhile about how it can be useful. For example, it finally made sense to me how to make "crack" cocaine from pure cocaine. I guess thats not all that useful unless I went on to become a drug lord.

Biologists routinely report some of the highest levels of job satisfaction. Stick with it!

They also report the lowest incomes of all science disciplines lol!

This thread has officially been derailed.

Guess I have to sign up for photobucket. Boooo.

I think you'll like it Michael. Seriously. You're a smart dude. It'll be no sweat and I really can't wait to see more pics from you. Let me know if you need any help getting it going.

Gflo - It depends how good you are. There are always good jobs for those at the top of the game. These days, you will likely need a PhD though.

Frog - I had my kids help me with photobucket and

I think its not about smarts but rather an attitude that folks could specd a little more time creating intuative designs for their sites.

If you need a hand with it you can always call on me.

Pause, reset, I think I will try Picasa. Convoluted messing around does not appeal to me. I have to get this done ASAP as my plate will be overflowing soon.

I have been awful busy of late and haven’t spent much time on the forum. I haven’t read this whole thread so I am just going to “wing it” with my thoughts.

A) I am willing to pay a fee to be a forum member though accessing the forum should be free for basic browsing/reading. Free access gets people interested and that produces magazine subscriptions and new forum member.

B) I want the printed magazine (it is too beautiful not have a hard copy) and also want all of the back issues of PBM available on line for searching, browsing, etc.

C) An e-zine would be a bonus offering and not a replacement for the hard copy.

D) This would be the free membership with no posting or other member benefits.

E) The mid-range membership should include a PBM subscription. If you aren’t committed enough to contribute 35-50 bucks to the cause you should remain in free-land.

EE)The high-end membership would be the only membership with full access to on-line past magazine content and the special stuff you mentioned.

F)Basic membership: free
Mid-range: $50.00 including the magazine
High-end: $100.00 including the Magazine.

You could have a contest to come up with catchy names for the membership levels.

I am late to the party, hopefully it isn't over!!

"I am late to the party, hopefully it isn't over!!"

Well, Dwight, we tried to drag it on as long as we could waiting for you, but JHAP got too drunk and started telling everyone he loves them, so we had to call the whole thing off.

Dang JHAP! A little control please!!!

got that Lance Link thing goin'

Bob, I would like to see "archived" Pond Boss articles in PDF format available to current paid subscribers. An example would be "feed training SMB", "all male BG ponds", or "weed control". These archived articles could be organized in similar categories as they appear on the forum. They could also be referred to in discussions on the forum.

Make these "archived" PB articles pay per view for non-subscribers and free for current subscribers. It would be an incentive for new forum memebers to subscribe to the magazine.

I love the hard copy of the magazine so keep sending it. One thing I will say is that I have a hard time remembering which issue something was printed in when I go to look for it. A digital archive of past articles that have appeared in the magazine would be nice.

It seems to me that Mr Cody has periodically done an article index like you are asking for.. Here is one from a few years ago.

http://www.pondboss.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=110229#Post110229

Bing

With the advent of the Internet most of us, my self included, use Google, Bing (no relation) or other search engines for research on subjects we want information on.

I got to thinking about that in relationship to this site getting more hits. I thought up several "searches" that are directly related to the articles in the magazine and this site. They were Pond Scum, Pond Algae, Leaking Pond, Fish Management, Boat Docks, Stocking ponds, Stunted Bluegill, Fixing Leaky Ponds, Bass Pond Management, Farm Pond Management, etc. These topics are what Pond Boss articles as well as many discussions on the forum are about.

I went to Google and Googled each of them. As background most people who try to use Google to draw someone to their site say that if you are not on the first page of the search, and often not in the top three, no one will find you.

In none of the above topice did Pond Boss, articles in PB, etc. come up. Some of these searches had "our" advertisers in the top three, or certainly on the front page, and many of our advertisers had paid ads there too. (Google, like other sites sells paid ads that are highlighted on the right hand side of the screen).

I conclude from all of this that if someone doesn't already know about PB and just Google for help in gaining knowledge, fixing problems, etc. they won't find Pond Boss referenced.

Many of us know that incorrectly using chemicals in ponds, inproperly installing aeration, etc. are huge problems and the subject of much discussion on the forum.

So, to me at least, this strengthens the need for Search Engine Optimization.

Bottom line, we have more "no BS" info. to share here than anyone else anywhere. But those folks looking for info. don't know to come here. They often get good information from companies selling products but they also often get sold a bill of goods, (or some wild hybrid that doesn't live up to expectations).

Bing

I found this site Google searching on a product which was mentioned in the forum.

Bing drops a truth bomb once again. The kinda sad thing is, with the frequency that you use this site, google should have seen your cookies and delivered a page or 2 from PB at the top of your SERP. I think with some special attention to SEO during in the midsts of the redesign Mr Lusk started this thread with, Huge improvements can and should (most certainly will...but rule #3 is there are no absolutes in SEO) be made.
For the record, the most common theory states that 80% of users are satisfied with the first page, and each page you force a user to click to, another 80% of the remainder of users are lost. Start with 100 users on page 1, on page 2 you only have 20, page 3 you've got 4 left, etc etc etc.
The big caveat with counting on that theory is that a page on page 2 is 50% less likely to convert than on on page 1. so, by page 3, you've only got a 25% chance of your normal conversion rate. Average conversions (for a really good site) are under 2%, which leaves a .5% rate in an optimal situation if your site is on page 3 of the SERP.

boom goes a truth bomb.
Rule #2, content is king. PB has the content. Mr Lusk should be king.
-SB

Those that said our beloved thread, "Pond holding water...success notes" needs Cliffs Notes could weigh in here, but I love every bit of all the threads. This thread is an extraordinary example of intense passion the runs in the members of PB forum. I am proud to be able to read it witness the diversity of thought it displays. Simply amazing.

I've been away from my computer and just started reading this but, I'm good with most of what has been suggested.

I like the paper mag but I could give it up if it helps keep the costs down and the quality and frequency of the articles on the website goes up.

I would absolutely pay for a membership for this forum/website but would probably not pay for both the print and the web version.

Good on you, Bob!

If you Google "sunil small fathead" you will find at the top of the page: Taking Orders - Pond Boss Forum.

Think about it.....

I haven't had the chance to read through the entire thread, but I thought I would just add my own two cents.

I really like the print version of the mag, BUT I would have no problem switching to an electronic only version IF I had access to a searchable archive of all past PB articles. I would probably pay a little bit more for that luxury too.

This is the way so many publications are starting to go. I think PB would be wise to do so also. Even major newspapers are going this route this days.

The forums should remain totally free. It's how I came to find PB, and it's the reason I subscribed. I came to realize the value of PB Mag AFTER I became involved in the forums. Without the forums, I would have had no idea PB mag even existed. It's the best subscription recruitment tool you have, particularly for the younger folks out there. Further, think about this. If you had all the PB articles online, subscribing members would frequently link to them in forum threads, giving further incentive to new forum members to subscribe, so they can see them too. Again, a FREE forum and the members who participate in/on it are your best recruiters.

I would prefer the printed magazine. I like being able to sit on the couch and relax with the old Pond Boss mag. I think many of us sit in front of computers all day and can't wait to get away from it. Sometimes the old way of doing things is still better.
I would still buy it if the price went up little bit.

Dang good ideas in here.Im triing to catch up on what I missed being gone for awhile and there is just so much to catch up on.Any suggestions on which thread to hijack first would be appreciated.

SEARCH? What Darn internet you guys been surfing on? I Haven't been on any forum and I do mean none that have a search that works. For that matter even google sucks for the most part. Just try to find pondboss without using the term "Boss"

The single best thing I like about this forum is when a newbie post with a question someone always tries to help with an answer or directs them to how to find the answer. On so many forums I join the first reply you get even just introducing youself is "Use the search engine before you ask us". This is even before a welcome comment is made.

If I was going to change anything I would change the Home Page forum link from "ask the boss" to pond boss forum or ask the boss forum. When I first found this site I did not even realize it had a forum. It was about 6 years latter I happen to stumble up on the forum serving the net not thru the pondboss home page.

I could help with the finding pondboss without using the term "Boss" part. :)!

zing! gflo...check your pm's

What other keywords would you shoot for besides pond? any suggestions you have for longer-tailed keywords?

I am a subscriber and new pond owner - I find the advice on here just great. I personally would pay for the continued paper magazine as THEO said for the throne value alone...

I would also pay for a bundle option of being able to get the paper magazine and read/post on the forums as long as the cost is reasonable.

I think you have some good suggestions and I think most of us all find the site as a very valuable reference. The key is maintain that balance of cost/value and I think you will.

just my two cents.

Bob,Your #1 mission on your list was to add 750-1,000 subscribers to the magazine. I've been to hospitals, dentist, gynocologists(sp),pediatrition(sp),doctors, attornys and other professional offices where I've never seen a Pond Boss Magazine.

Why not put a couple %? off coupons in each subscribers magazine to take to their favorite professional office (especially where they are waiting on their wives) to try and bring them aboard.

It really gets old looking at womens magazines waiting for her. Anyway, just an idea........

A) What are your opinions of paying a nominal annual fee to be a member of the forum?
Answer: Not sure, but I would probably not pay extra.

B) Would you rather have a copy of the magazine in the mail, or an e-magazine?
Answer: Definitely a copy in the mail!!

C) If you got the e-magazine, would you stop subscribing to the printed copy?
Answer: No

D) How to you feel about having a free membership that has limited access to content? This may be a "read only" version of the forum. It may mean being able to access some articles, podcasts, videos, but having to pay for selected e-information.

Answer: Don't like that idea. ESPN.com has the insider pay area of their site and don't even consider paying extra for it. I feel subscribing to the magazine should be worth something if you start charging to use the web site. I also think it'll be harder to increase your subscribers if you start charging more for everything.

I'm not sure if it has been mentioned, if not.
PLEASE add a spell checker in the responce box!
Nothing worse than having no access to a word that
you cant spell but you need to get your point across.

I have a spell checker in myne... I wonder why yours doesn't? If a word of mine is misspelled, it gets underlined in red.

CJ are you on a mac?

Nope, a Dell. The sticker shock has kept me from buying an Apple, but with all the issues I have had, I am dropping the cash for one next time.

and to add to rockytopper, the first time I saw "ask the boss" I thought it was going to be a place to email LUSK, a forum was the last thing I was expecting

well when I post on my friends mac, it has the red lines in the response box, all other computers I have used do not. Although I have not tried on a dell that i can remember

Not sure why mine does not have it????

None of my systems do. It would be a nice touch even if just an option.

Yeah mine doesn't do it either and I have a Dell D630? Fairly new laptop. Not sure why some have it and some dont? Maybe a setting somewhere??

Maybe i am spoiled by outlook at work where you just click on the spelling tab and walah! I know some other forums i go to have a spelling tab in the "quick reply" section.

I have spell check on my HP with Vista.

Guys I believe the spell checking is more of a function of the browser that you are using than the computer or the forum software. I use Mozilla Firefox as a browser and have added in a spell check feature. This helps to keep spelling errors to a minimum. Mozilla Firefox (with the added spell checker) underlines misspelled words as you type them.

That is what I use, so I guess it is Firefox that gives the added spell checker...

All I know is I thought I was a fairly good speller until I started using a computer. Then I found out I suck at spelling. Darn English language has so many inconsistent words and rules!

Hey here's an option i would like to see:

How about being able to post an avatar for each post by pulling it from your browser? I do this on all the other forums I go to.

I mentioned previously about having a spelling checker put in during the forum modification to help with the spelling issues but have not seen one as of yet. Maybe its comming?

Spellcheck is not a feature available on this software version, sorry. JHAP and CJ are right, it's more of a browser function.

What I can say is if this feature becomes available I make everyone aware. And, while I understand the value of spellcheck, I can promise NO ONE judges any posts with grammar or spelling issues - it's all good!

TJ,

What about being able to post an Avatar?

Bob is putting some thought into how he wants this to look...I anticipate this launching within the next couple weeks.

How about the ability to post poles... Another forum I go to which is based on the same software as this forum has the ability to post poles and allowing other members to vote on things you are curious about. It can be very interesting.

I think this function may exist...let me swing it by the Boss.

I was thinking of a pole type thingy myself today. Has the magnetic flux of the earth shifted

BTW: Thingy, has been added to Google Chrome browser as a word in the spell checker as of this post.

No more squiggly red lines

Nice job with the article in the May/June '10 mag, Dan VanS....decimated the critique.

TJ,
Did you find an answer to the problem of have to scroll back and forth when reading. It' like a large picture was posting. Maybe it's just a setting on my end but it sure is a pain in the rear.
Thanks

Thanks for letting me know, Cisco. I've escalated this issue on numerous occasions to UBB - the company that engineered the software, and they keep claiming to have addressed the issue. I will do this again, right now.

Can you verify your browser version for me? I think we've narrowed it down to IE 7 - if you are using something else we've got more browsers for them to address. Please let me know ASAP - and thanks for your patience. Lord knows this has been a frustration for me too.

TJ

I just upgraded to IE8 TJ. not sure why but i did. I had the same problem on IE7 also. It didn't do it before all the upgrades to the site unless someone had post a large picture. Great job on all of the modifications to site!!!
You are appreciated!

Adding the "Recent Posts" and "Newly Uploaded Images" features on the right sidebar has increased the width of the page and has caused some users with smaller monitors to need to scroll in order to view the entire website. We are going to attempt to make the post area more narrow in order to fit the entire page even for small monitors, thus ensuring everyone is happy. Will address tonight.

Thanks TJ. I can actually change my screen resolution and see the whole page. I just can't SEE the whole page. It has something to do with the eyeballs getting old.

I have got the same scroll bar issue.


I'm using Mozilla Firefox and my main monitor is 24.5 inches and I'm running it at 1280 by 1024 (aspect ratio of 5.4:1).

Jeff/all;

While this issue is minor, it's important to me to fix. Jeff could you send me a screenshot of what you're seeing - UBB is starting to think I'm crazy and I need some evidence/support of my issue.

Screen shot directions:

Ctrl + Print Screen

then to accessories

Click Paint program

Then Ctrl + "V"

Email to me please:

tjhudson@hudrix.com

THANKS!

Well, you are a little crazy...not because of this, but...

Email sent.

I thought we got rid of the stars ?

Eric

Bob wanted to acknowledge those who made donations to the forum. I believe he'll be addressing the forum regarding this as soon as his schedule allows.

Sorry for any confusion it created...

TJ

Perhaps this tutorial will be of some help on this issue.
Significance of Stars

Bob;
A: No Fee
B: Hard copy - definately
C: I would not read an e-copy
D/E/EE/F: Against any fee's for the forum; believe it would cut participation dramatically


If we're looking for financial gain from the forumn, maybe go with a classified section and charge a fee for that. Ot have an advertisers section and put a fee on them, but I whole heartedy think we should leave the forum open to the general public for free. I'd rather see my dues go up a buck or two......

Thanks for the opportunity;

Joe Gandarillas

This forum should always be free. I belong to several others who pay for the forum by advertising, memberships to a club, etc. This should be no different. Keep the magazine subscriptions separate.

I found Pond Boss through a google search online. I immediately requested the magazine, coffee Mug, hat, and one of the books as a Fathers Day gift. My Daughter has now renewed my subscription three times.
I really enjoy my time on this forum and have gained loads of info and assistance. I would hate to see the forum go to a "pay site" and think this would definitely kill it. I thought subscribing was helping to offset the costs?

If not, then I would be willing to help out where I can. This could be in the form of a subscription increase or something like that.

As for the magazine, I would still like to receive that in hard copy.

Thanks

Rattletrap2, good points. The actual magazine subscriptions don't go too far in helping cover costs of the forum.

When we all consider what we've gained from this forum in information regarding our ponds, and the friendships that we've built, the value goes so, so far beyond the $35.00 or so for the magazine.

If you can spare a few bucks, use the "DONATE" tab in the upper right hand corner.

I'm not sure this is the correct topic for this comment, but I would like to see the pond size/s added the each members profile. That way anyone responding to their question can have a little more background information and not have to each new reader ask for the pond size or location.

I agree with those who are against paying for the use of the forums.

That is a slippery slope.

I've seen in the past where "successful" forums start charging money, then the "family" splits, someone just starts another free forum, and now there are two groups of ppl that used to be one.

While I don't want to speak for Lusk, I think they are past charging money for the extensive forum priveledges at this time.

Can you make the magazine monthly, and charge a LITTLE more. Maybe do some specialty bi-monthly issue that are season realated for an extra charge..

Publishing the magazine monthly is very expensive and circulation is not large enough to warrent monthly publication. Also the editor is too busy with other things to put together monthly issues. Readers will have to survive on bi-monthly issues and hopefully each issue will have enough good info to carry readers over for two months. Use the PB Forum more if you need regular "fixes" of Pond Boss info. There is a tremendous amount of information in the old forum posts - read through them.

Make posting pictures here more user-friendly. The picture here is worth a thousand words. Talk about low skinny on search engines and marketing of the site, which is his story.