Tried to keep snow of in strips like I usually do vs. a diffuser in shallow water and this year I'm worried. Went out to blow some snow off again today and took a D.O. reading. Just sitting there in the water below the ice the reading was below 2 ppm. However I was able to get it up to 3+ ppm by swishing the sensor back and forth which is what you're supposed to do. Since I don't alway trust my meter, I did a manual test with test kit and got 4.75 ppm in a hole that had been open for about an hour. Not sure if D.O. would diffuse back into it due to the differential and the reading is a little high. Last week readings were about 1 ppm higher.

So to play it safe I cut a big hole in the ice and set my 1/2 hp aerator into it. It's not really pulling up deeper water but I'm hoping it creates a massive hole in the ice. I've got it tied to the dock so I can pull it in any time.

Anyone else up north having concerns? We've had quite a snowy winter up here and I wasn't able to remove any for at least a couple of weeks due to thin ice and slush under the snow. I also had a lot of massive blooms of filamentous algae before ice up.

Yeah, I'm worried.

Theo,

Are you removing snow or running a diffuser to keep some water open?

I'm expecting the worst, but hoping the trout will survive.
Pond has dropped 31 inches, but the aerator is keeping a 2x10 ft. hole in the ice, running nonstop now.
There's 39 inches of snow on the ground and it was below zero a total of 18 days in january, but winter's almost over.

Sorry to hear that guys. I'm hoping for the best for you all.

Old pond has it's windmill aerator set in 3-4' of water for the Winter, Cecil. I'm not really worryied about O2 in it (just bad weather supercooling events like we had Feb-March last year).

I keep telling myself the new pond has a very light load of fish in it and very little accumulated organic sediment. The last look I had at the ice, before we got more snow, showed it to be pretty milky (i.e. I don't think clearing would get any light through). I'm keeping my fingers crossed; which is about all I have time for given some family health issues right now.

We have several above freezing days with rain forecast at the end of the week. It'll be lousy weather for everything else, but could be good for the ponds.

I've done my best too but the concern is growing. Ponds froze over mid-November. Haven't had any open water since then. We've have had record amounts of snow.

I've shoveled and shoveled and been out there with the snowblower. I just came in from clearing off some more windows in the ice.

Two of the three ponds are 20-25 feet deep and only 3 years old so I'm hoping for the best. I've already lost a bunch of fish in the third pond. It is only about 7 feet deep and needs to be renovated. I only use it to toss extra fish in and it was probably over stocked so I'm not that upset about that one.

I just hope the 2 larger main ponds don't totally crash on me. Hopefully the thaw we are supposed to get this coming weekend won't be too late!!

Chuck

Cecil, I have been monitoring D.O. amongst other things on a weekly basis this winter. Saturday (the 31st of January) the ice was 24 inches with a few inches of melted and then re-frozen snow on top. The ice is pretty much clear.

D.O. averages 10.5 ppm from 1 ft down to 13 feet. At 14 feet drops it drops to 7.6 ppm. The fish are quite active below the ice (video checking). My current assumption is that the relatively high D.O. keeps them active even though we are a long ways into this winter.

Good for you Dwight. Looks like the diffuser really pays of for you. After this winter I will be using one again along with keeping the snow off. Whenever I think I'm smart enough to control things the Good Lord pounds me into reality. LOL


Hoping the best for the rest of you. My surface aerator cut a hole in my pond about 20 by 30 feet. I'm going to move it to another part of the pond and make another one.

Chuck have you checked your larger ponds with a DO meter? I have the same problem as Cecil, we got a foot of snow when there was only an inch of ice on the pond so there was no way to clear it off, and that was two months ago. The ice is very cloudy for the first eight inches. Total ice on my pond is about 14 inches.

I now have over half the pond cleared off and I have been hoping the last few sunny dayd have been helping. My pond is only a year and a half old and no where near full capacity, so I am hoping things are ok. I caught a 7 inch bluegill the other day but fishing was slow. Gonna try again this weekend with real bait (waxworms) and if things dont pick up I will be real worried.

I am getting phone calls and reports of lots of fish dying this winter already. It has been the most ice and snow that I can ever remember.

I'm not too terribly worried. I've only had 6-10 inches of ice with maybe 1-2 inches of scattered snow. The fish have been active, so I think we're OK. Warm weather forecast for most of the rest of the week.

My DO readings are about 10 right under the surface and never get lower than 6 down deep.

About time you got a break Bruce! Good for you.

How much snow have you had on the ice? Max I've had is about 4 inches.

Max snow we have had at one time is 4 inches, but since early December the cycle we have had is a couple inches of snow, melt a little, freeze, snow, melt a little, freeze, snow, melt, snow, freeze, melt, freeze, snow, etc.

We would have tons more ice if it wasnt for the snow, but the ice would be much clearer!

I went ice fishing on Friday at a pond. (not Bremer Pond) The water clarity was only about three feet, minnows very lethargic on the hook, one perch the hole day. From all this talk of DO, I am wondering if it is low in that pond, and the fish are very inactive. Usually a good place to ice fish. Ice about 20 inches thick, with not much snow on top.

Rex - I probably should get the meter out to either confirm or deny my concerns. Even though they are deep, they are only about 2/3 and 1/3 acre each. I've got upwards of 10+ inches of ice so I'll have to break out my little 1" spade bit to get thru. I think I can get the probe down thru a small hole. If not I'll break out a mattock. No ice auger here.

Since the ponds are 3 years old I was gonna start some serious culling this year. I don't believe they are over populated but I could tell last fall the native BG had lived up to their reputation of high fecundity.

Hopefully nature hasn't done the culling for me already!!

Chuck

Chuck,

Make sure you move your probe back and forth as per directions or you will get a lower reading than it really is. I believe you are supposed to swish the probe back and forth 1 foot per second?

I'm cautiously optimistic. I was finally able to get the lid lifted off of a cage I have large bluegills in. I saw no morts and no fungus and they look good. All my caged fish are alive except for one perch and that may be one I netted out of the cage a month ago and put back. My logic is if the caged fish are alive, even if D.O levels got dangerously low in deeper water, the free swimming fish would have come up in the water column to higher D.O. levels. I have my fingers crossed!

I may have lucked out by the skin of my teeth on this one and caught it before I would have lost fish. Next year diffusers in all the ponds running on the shallow ends of the pond in conjunction with removal of snow!

Cecil,

I don't have any aeration going in the pond, just the circulator that keeps a small area around the Barge open. The open area is less then one percent of the pond surface area.

Are your efforts with the diffuser opeinng areas helping with your D.O. issues? I hope so!

Same effect really don't you think? IMHO A shallow water diffuser is not a big oxygen producer but a circulator that keeps some water open during winter.

Additionally you have some good deep water in your pond vs. mine which probably helps. I get the impression your pond is not as eutrophic as mine either. I've had a lot of fish in that pond far above a normal recreation pond. At one time I had 400 largemouth up to almost 6 lbs. in this 3/4 acre pond. That's a lot of poop! Mine has a muck layer and can get a lot of Chara going up to three feet thick on the bottom. This stuff dies off every year and creates quite a bit of decomposed biomass.

I've noticed a lot of people call the diffuser systems we use aerators. To me aeration is small part of what they do, and in reality they are more of a pond mixer than anything else don't you think? And in winter set in shallow water they pretty much just keep water open.



My Kasco 1/2 hp surface aerator (the one that shoots water up vigorously with a propeller) is now worth it's weight in gold. The $800.00 price tag last summer smarted but I'm glad I got it this year. My former perch supplier said you never know when it could come in handy. He was right!

Cecil, do you think a bubble hose might do a better job transferring O2 than a diffuser in addition to keeping an opening in the ice.
I had read that it does, thats why I'm using one, but I'm not sure it's true.

Given the same volume of air being putting out, smaller bubbles means more oxygen transferred into the water. It's all about surface area.

Based on my experiences in small troughs, smaller bubbles also circulate water better than the same amount of air in big bubbles.

Thanks for the info Theo, their gonna need all the O2 they can get this winter!

If I didn't know better, I'd be questioning the existenance of global warming.

Be careful Jersey, that sounds like heresy.
The thought police may come after you.

Cecil,

I too use a Kasco 1/2hp. Great minds!!

But yours is in a horizontal position for circulations?

I have a 3/4 hp. (Insert gorilla sounds here)

Well excuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuse me!

Actually the 1/2 hp is too big for my small ponds which is what I got it for originally. It stirs up the bottom a little. I'm glad I got it now for this emergency situation. I'm gong to get one of those 1/8 hp deals in the future for possible emergencies in the smaller ponds.

What surprises me is D.O. is only 7.5 ppm in the open water that is 35.2 F. I would think it would be close to saturation with it being open and moved by the aerator. But I'll take what I can get and 7.5 is excellent compared to 3.5!

I have an 80 watt air pump (insert hummingbird sounds here)
That's only about 1/10 hp Right?

If you're lucky.

Mine is adjustable for varied circumstances.

Adjustable Circulator

No one will ever accuse you of under engineering anything Dwight.

Impressive.

Dwight, that's a real neat setup you built.
I'm the lazy type, so I would just strap a trolling motor to the dock and connect it to a power supply. (which I did try last summer).

Here's a pic of the surface aerator on the biggest yellow perch and bluegill pond running on the left. Cages are attached to the right side of the pier. The aerator created all this open water simply by running it and pulling to the left as it melted the ice. Once air temps are above 32 F. the ice gets eaten up fast. In the single digits and teens not very fast.

D.0. levels have risen from 3.5 ppm to 7.5 ppm at last check in open water down to at least 8 feet. Water temp only varies 1/10th of one degree from the surface at 35.3 to 35.2 at 8 feet. I am surprised that D.O. levels aren't higher and temps near the surface aren't lower. Snow was completely blown off with a snow blower except for the small section in the foregound where it was taken off in strips. I was running out of daylight and had three more ponds to go!

Thanks for posting the picture, Cecil. Very nice opening.

It's a very, very, very, beautiful sight compared to the feeling that I had killed all my fish and lost a few years of growth and all the money I invested!

Conversely my trout pond has oxygen levels near or at saturation at 13.0 ppm. I remove as much aquatic vegetation from this pond as possible twice a year and drain the pond every two years. The pond is also quite deep for the size with consequently a large volume for the small surface area. Shows you what a difference that makes.

Glad to hear your ponds are doing well Cecil, I know what a bummer it is to lose alot of fish.
I'm heading up to the pond in a little while, and planning on starting up the pump to get some fresh water in the pond.
I'm still not real optimistic about the outcome, even with the aeration this winter.
Talk to you all Later.

The thought police come after me all the time.
They never find anything.

My biggest pond is now at 10 ppm.

You might be surprised what the aeration did for you. Keep us posted!

Cecil and All;

I hope my warm weather heads EAST in a hurry to help you all out. Good luck.

One question - I was looking online at DO meters and man do they range all over in price from $150 - $800. Any recommendations for a pondmeister on brands and models that work well for you? Any idea the amount of $$ I should be prepared to part with?

Thanks in advance...I'm hoping for a quick thaw for you all.

TJ

I would recommend YSI products. Thats what I use at work. We have two 85's and one 55. I don't know how much they cost but I are easy to use.

Thanks Chris - the 85's are 1200 and the 55's around 800. I'm not typically one to cut corners and sacrafice quality - but I think I need to look at more economical models!

YSI has a model DO2000 for approx $250.00 with a 30 ft cable or $225 w/ 12 cable.This meter is considered their Economy meter. It measures DO and temp. I have not used this model as our model 55 has been very reliable but as you state they are expensive.

I'm with Ted on that. If I had to do it all over again I would not spend $800.00 on a meter. Many times I trust a good ol' Hach kit or LaMotte test kit over my meter anyway. Even with calibration, membrane change etc. my YSI is reading about a half a part ppm too high compared to the Hach or LaMotte test kit. I may have bought a lemon. Of course you can't test the water column all the way down with a Hack or LaMotte test kit.

Not sure what others think but I would seem a Hach or LaMotte test kit would be all you need to test for D.O. drops in an ice hole. If D.O. is less than 6 ppm in your hole it may be time to crank up the diffuser.

Here's what I use in conjunction with my meter:

http://www.aquaticeco.com/subcategories/2805/LaMotte-Test-Kits-Dissolved-Oxygen

I agree with Cecil. If you only need to test water DO at surface a few times a year then strongly consider the inexpensive chemical kits. Deeper waters can be tested for DO with the chemical kits but ideally the water should be collected at the depth desired and without bubbling. Bubbling the water as a jar or collecting bottle fills adds oxygen to it. Collecting deeper water without bubbling the water has to be done with some sort of unique sampler, although it can be relatively simple and inexpensive or more complex and cost $100+.

The meter DO samplers are convienient for depth DO samples and usually pretty accurate, but you pay for that convenience.

I am using a YSI EcoSense DO200 to monitor temp and DO throughout the winter.

Thanks all, this sounds like good stuff - I've never seen anyone comment on DO meters for the average pondmeister like myself [although threads excape my search efforts regularly] and it sounds as if one can get away with a $200 investment. We should have a "recommended prodcuts" page for the average pondmeister...sounds like th YSI is everyone's choice for quality.

Now, will anyone think of a plausible version of the truth to provide the wife to explain the $225 charge on my CC? I will provide a free DO test at your body of water for the most convincing story.

TJ

TJ,

Are you coming to the convention in September? Lusk tells me it will be the mother of all conventions when it comes to hands on stuff like water quality testing etc. Heck I'm even going to set up an RAS there. And I here there will be onsite electroshocking and interpretation of data, aging scales etc.

As far as what to tell your wife? I'd tell her if your fish die you will be very very hard to live with. A meter will keep you on top of things to keep them from dying!

When I thought I had killed my fish in one of the ponds my wife told me later she purposely steered clear of me. I'm not abusive in any way but I sure can get grumpy!

Heyo Cecil - Try the TRUTH? Hmmmm...so simple, so crazy, it just might work! You're right - if she thought I had go through this entire process AGAIN to restock the ponds, she'd probably agree the DO meter is a nice insurance policy.

I am in Lincoln, NE - and the conference is just a stone's throw away - so yes I am planning on being in attendance.

Good deal!

I still say you could get by with one of the manual test kits. They are a lot cheaper and actually kind of fun. Once you get experience with them you can already tell how much dissolved oxygen just by the color after adding only the first two or three reagents.

teehjaeh57 - I'm using the YSI DO200 with 30' cable. My ponds are about 25' deep so I had to go with the longer probe.

I am not a pro by any means but felt it was a reasonable investment. I bought it a couple years ago.

It is a "Bill Dance" edition of the DO200. It is yellow and came with a video of Bill Dance and his narrative on using the D.O. meter to find fish. For what ever reason it was a bit cheaper than the regular DO200. I think I paid in the range of $350-375 for it. It works perfect for my purposes.

Chuck

All;

Cecil and Bill are giving me very fiscally wise advice - stick with the kits for the amount of use I'll be demanding. However, I have this childlike penchant for things run by batteries...and the YSI CO 200 I priced was around $225.00.

I will keep everyone in the loop as to what I end up doing. Thanks again for weighing in.