Hey,
We're trying to strengthen our baitfish and sunfish population in our 1.5 acre LMB Lake.. I've noticed that over the last year since April/May 2012, our LMB population has suffered (LMB over 14" were all getting very skinny, and we started catching mostly small LMB, less than 10"). I tried to harvest as many smaller LMB as I could, but it probably only amounted to about 50-70 of them for 2012. I should also mention, no aeration in this pond...yet... It's also an old pond, 30-50 years from what our neighbors have told us.

I'm thinking the skinny bass issue likely stemmed from 2-3 things:

• Weak baitfish and sunfish population (probably a number of different reasons)
• Overpopulation of LMB. In late 2011/early 2012, me and my father brought in 30-40 mature LMB(1/2 lb to 6 lbs) to try and mix up the genetics... After joining pondboss and reading alot, I've decided that this was an awful idea, considering the baitfish population.

That's a general background... now for the subject of this thread:
We don't have much natural aquatic vegetation in the pond.The cover for baitfish and sunfish consists of:

• Grass in the late spring/early summer once the water rises back above it
• One 20 ft section of an old dead log and branches (only cover when full)
• Willow tree with lots of dead branches and roots (only cover when full)
• Man-made cover: pallets with pine tree standing up, rock piles, and 2 PVC Trees. We've placed the man-made cover at different depths from 3 ft to 8 ft deep, since our lake fluctuates a good amount throughout the year (about 6 ft).

The lake is surrounded completely by trees (see pics), and is in sort of a bowl. I haven't had a water test done, but I've heard somewhere that runoff from all the leaves can cause high acidity and keep vegetation from surviving in the pond.
My questions are...

• Should we pursue adding some sort of aquatic vegetation? If so, any ideas on where to start?
• Should we continue adding more man-made cover

Thanks, Nate


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Dock w/ trees stuffed underneath


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2013-5-13 My father with a LMB, looks healthy


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Winter picture of lake from runoff entrance


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Winter picture (pallet with trees + rocks).
Also, see runoff stream entrance at end of cove, and trees up the hill surrounding lake


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2012-5-28 Me with Skinny LMB 2.73 lbs

Nate, you got a beautiful setting there. Lots of nice photos too. It's kind of slow here today, so I will ramble a bit here, and maybe over the next week you'll get a lot of good pro opinions of what to do.

I think that the number one suggestion you will get here is that you need to cull some LMB. Lots easier to remove LMB to start getting the forage back into shape, rather than anything else. With 1.5 acres, you can't hold to many pounds of bass, (I will go out on a limb here and say 75#?). You added probably its total carrying capacity with the new ones, it might have been good to remove the same amount that you added.

Are you saying that the water level fluctuates by as much as 4' thru the year? That would be another reason the forage fish struggle. Every time the water goes down, the big fish have a smorgasbord. What percentage of the surface area has habitat, man-made or otherwise? I think It's recommended that there is aprox. 25%.

My thought on adding natural vegetation is that it might be tough because of the water levels. It goes from floods to droughts in a lot of the areas you want cover.

Have you been keeping track of weights-v-lengths of all fish caught?

--- would you also say that it is 1.5 acres when full or at the low point?

Nathan -

The pond looks absolutely beautiful. But, because of your location, I assume your pond changes levels quite dramatically over a couple of years. Plus, I'm not sure I'd want to diminish the beauty with much water vegetation, except maybe for some flowering plants and floating islands in certain parts of the pond where they can live during drought or flood.

Because of the pond size, I assume you probably have reasonable spawning areas, but not enough hiding places. The structure you put in sounds like a great start. However, I would give serious consideration to even more structure with pathways/runways to the spawning areas.

The last photo, of the very skinny bass, makes me think that particular bass had eaten something it shouldn't have -- like a rubber worm. The 7th photo makes me think they are getting reasonable food, just not enough.

I think you'll get a lot of other thoughts on this situation. We've got a lot of really experienced pond bosses here on the site. After a week or so, it will be time to condense the ideas. Mine is just one opinion.

Ken

Good ideas from BGK and Catmandoo.

Here's my take. If the water level fluctuates every year, you have to manage the pond as if the water stayed low continually (regarding to fish numbers per acre). Because of the fluctuating, plants won't survive. Floating islands and cover in deeper water - 20% of the pond should be cover (surface area). Put in cover that is dense enough for small fish to swim into/thru but won't allow the larger fish to do that.

Don't just take out the small LMB. Print out the Relative Weight chart in the archives, and remove the LMB that are under 90% or so RW.

I agree with Ken in that LMB has something blocking it's digestive tract.

Thanks for your replies!

Yes. Probably 3-4 feet of depth on a normal year from full to lowest point. This last year, it dropped about 6-7 feet from full

At low, probably less than 5%. At full, 5-10%... It's hard to say. I agree, there definitely needs to be more cover

No. I will begin tracking these again for the fish that I catch(I did it for a short time but lost my records). Also, it's sort of difficult when other family members don't all chip in on tracking - I'm sure plenty of you know the feeling. Also, I am not able to fish often, its limited to about 1 weekend per month(I live/work in DFW,TX)

It is approx 2 acres when full, approx 1.5 at low. Maybe 1.3 acres after last summer severe drought, it got down to about 6 ft below full.

Thanks, I thought that something was terribly wrong with that one... I should have harvested it and investigated its internals -- I'll keep that in mind next time! I haven't done it before, but I guess this would be good practice on other harvested fish to see what they're eating

Thanks, we'll have to keep adding more and more... We have a bunch of pines we can go chop down around the property. We've put some smaller ones in standing up but I think laying them down, slanting into deeper water or connecting to other structure/spawn areas will be good.


Thanks, I'll have to look into the floating islands a bit more -- I've seen them but haven't looked into how to build them or costs. The cheaper the better if possible! Would it be best to keep these near the center of the pond? or anchored out maybe 20 feet... or just let it roam freely?

Thanks, I'll start including this methodology for harvesting.

Here is the satellite map with a few comments added. In the image, the water is probably 2-3 feet below full

Pic. 8 area...Plant some grass....Plus you may want to think about putting some muck eating bacteria in your pond to help keep up with the decaying leaves.

Yeah, I've thought about some grass in that area... maybe we'll spread some seed.
About the much... It doesn't seem like we have much muck, at least in the shallows... but it does get muddy.
I'll try to take a sample for muck in the deep with a PVC pipe

That feeder in number 5 is that a dear feeder modded for fish in the pond?

Cheers Don.

Yes Don -- it has been largely unsuccessful.

It's been removed from the pond area for now... going to have to repair the thrower. It got jammed or something - I think some of the food got moist. I can't remember what we put in there... Guessing dog food...