Just thought I would post my results using Sonar One to control Hydrilla. After I got up off of the floor and restarted my heart from the price shock, the preliminary results are in. The Sonar One worked like a charm . Ten days after the application the Hydrilla looks like a wasteland. The big question, to be determined, is how long the control will last. IF,and this is a big if, it provides the control that Sepro states, it will be by far the best money I have spent to date.

Ron

Gates,

Keep us posted. If I can scrape together the money I may try it next year for Sago Pondweed. Any ideas if using a dye in conjunction with it will effect it's effectiveness?

The use of pond dye with a Sonar treatment will extend the life of the chemical since sun light degrades all chemicals.

I know of someone that used Sonar in front of their house to treat Eurasian Water Milfoil. The one application worked for 3 years before it started encroaching in that area. (no, that someone isn't anyone related to me)

Here is a two month update on the Sonar One treatment. The hydrilla is non-existent in the pond. The Sonar did not seem to bother any of the shoreline trees. Some of the trees are directly on the edge of and the willows are in the pond, therefor obviously drinking from the pond. Very few of the shoreline grasses had some discoloration. Overall I am very happy with the results so far. I just hope the control will last!

Good for you. Seems worth the expense when you consider other chemicals you may have to apply over and over again! I'm definitely going to apply it next year. I wish it was effective against Chara though.

How did you apply it? Do you have to spray it around the pond or will it spread by natural diffusion?

Cecil:

As much water flow that you have going thru your trout pond, would copper sulfate work, or would it be detrimental to the trout? I know it works on Chara in ponds & lakes, but it must be applied before the Chara gets established (applied before it gets 4"-6" long) or it isn't as effective.

Cecil,
There are 5 different pelleted versions with different release options. I used (Sonar One) from the professional applicator side of Sepro. It was very easy to apply. I used a hand held, the kind that wraps around your arm, grass seeder. It worked perfect. I choose the pellets because of my pond situation. The pond is spring feed at a 10gpm flow. My thought about the pellets were as follows:

1.)They allowed exact placement for the more intense areas.
2.)They put the chemical where it needed to be
3.)The type I choose released the chemical in stages. It was like a time delay release. For example 33% would release in day one, another 33% at day 4, and the final 33% at day 7. The %'s are just for example, but you get the idea. This was a concern do to the flow of my pond and the possibility of a rain purging the chemical.
4. With pellets I could go back and hit the remaining areas very easily with out having to treat the whole pond.

The active ingredient (Fluridone) will disperse through out the pond on its own. I basically stayed away fro my outfall figuring it would migrate that way through the water and indeed it did exactly that.

The restrictions on Sonar are extremely minimal and Sonar is very friendly to the environment and to humans. The whole concept is pretty simple, it blocks photosynthesis in the plant.

If you decide to go with it I will be more then happy to provide you with a contact person at Sepro that was extremely helpful. I guess for the kind of money they get for this stuff they ought to send a guy out with it.


Esshup,
My label specifically states that it will not control Chara.

Scott,

I don't apply any chemicals to my trout pond. To risky as trout are very sensitive especially to copper. The sonar will go into the big pond in the front that no longer has any flow going through it.

Thanks for the info Gates. I'm probably going with the same product under a different name Whitecap. Yes I was aware it didn't control Chara. I will try and keep the Chara at bay with Aquashade. I'm curious to see what I've got this winter when I do some peering under the ice as I've been using Aquashade in the biggest non flow through pond. The Aquashade should have broken down considerably by winter so I should be able to see the bottom as the water is normally gin clear when not using a dye.

Cecil:

The pond in front is the one that has the Sago problem, right? The Chara is limited to the back one?

Correct. I used to have some Small pondweed ( Potomogeton pussilis) in the trout pond but don't see it anymore.

I may also get some grass carp and put them in the front pond. I can always shoot at them if they come at feeding time. Or catch and release them like George says.

If you put in the grass carp and they get outta hand & you want them removed I bowfish for carp in the Spring, so it'd be an easy control method.

Hi guys, just wondering, I am from South Africa and I just wanted to get a rough idea on how much sonar one or aquathol will cost. As i have a huge problem with hydrilla in my dam. thanks

I used Whitecap for a very bad case of watermeal in my 1 acre pond two years ago. It cost approx. $600 for a quarts worth. This was a liquid (looked like milk) and was applied in 4 spots, 8 oz per. Bye, bye watermeal!!!!! Great product!

Dylan - beware that fluridone (the active-ingredient in Sonar, Avast & Whitecap - all are priced differently) is seldomly used for spot-treatments. The entire body of water must typically be treated to achieve a lethal parts-per-billion (ppb) concentration for an extended period of time (45-90 days). Even Aquathol usually requires 48+ hrs of contact-time at a lethal concentration to achieve decent results. So, be sure you know how either product fit your scenario before investing any bucks.

Dylan-What size water body you are looking to treat with the Sonar? Also, does the pond flow much? Treatment would be best done in the spring as long as incoming water flow rates are reasonably low.

Just for clarification, Dylan is currently enjoying mid-summer (as in South Africa).

That makes sense, how many more months are left in the growing season?

Welcome to the forum Beasley!

Thanks, I have been meaning to join for a long time.

Here is my 1 year update on the Sonar vs. Hydrilla. The Hydrilla and Southern Naaid has returned. The amount of plants have been drastically reduced to an estimated 15% coverage. The biologist at Sepro informed me that Hydrilla spreads by fragmentation and by tubers(seed) created on the roots of the plants. The idea is to kill the plant early before it has a chance to grow the tubers on its roots.
The general consensus is that the Hydrilla plants that showed up this year came from the tubers of the plants that were eradicated last year. Therefore it may take a couple of correctly timed applications to bring it under control. In summation, if you are selling Sonar this is a good thing, if you are my wallet this is a bad thing!!!

It nice of folks at SePro to tell you what went wrong so you could buy some more. It's a timed product no doubt, on certain applications. And yes, those nasty hydrilla tubers can sit there dormant in mud for years, hiding from the Fluridone. My best time is right when it starts to emerge from those tubers, when they are weakest. And you really cannot spot treat very well, as it must get to the desired ppm in the entire body of water and sit there for 45-90 days to do what it is supposed to do. It does close to nothing to Willows. I cut cut them down to the ground and paint stumps with Tri. As far as Chara, you almost have to copper it.

Well off to mow coontail, cattails and bulrushes. The kind folks at Jenson Lake Mower gave me a four flat shaft to test. I have a few ongoing contracts so mow and test sounds good for a Saturday to me. Drag all the boys along for some pond fun, blackberry picking, and fishing afterwards. Last soiree before they head back to school. Thanks for the Sonar writeup.

What would you have preferred the SePro guy to have said?

Our products cost way too much.

I am not a big fan of chemicals and will go to extremes to avoid using them. Having looked at numerous other chemicals Sonar seemed to be the safest.There is no doubt that the cost will collect your attention. I believe it is a cost vs. benefit analysis. The reasons stated below made the cost worth it for me.

1.)The restrictions on Sonar are extremely minimal.
2.)Sonar is extremely friendly to the environment and to humans.
3.)Application is very easy.
4.)There are virtually zero negative effects to the pond.
5.)You can call Sepro and someone(a live person)answers the phone.

I personally believe it is the closest thing, depending on your parameters, to a silver bullet for Hydrilla.

Before anyone asks,no I do not sell, represent or market for Sepro. Just a guy battling Hydrilla!!

Ron

OK Mr. Ringing Endorsement. Here is what I will do. I will substitute the word Sonar with Fluridone. Then I will wholeheatedly agree with 1-4. With #5, that is why you have a forum like this.

Then I have an amazing new word for you. WhiteCap AC.

And an interesting fact, not junk science. University of Florida's Center for Aquatic and Invasive Plants did not one but two studies on product effectiveness on guess what? Hydrilla. One a 26 week trial, another varying ppm concentrations. Guess what, at the end of the studies there was no significant differences found between WhiteCap and Sonar. But if you really like talking to people at SePro, do you have to buy Sonar to do it?

Come on Pond Frog you've got to pay for the environmentally friendly aspect just like the expensive Greenclean!

Strangely I've been saving up to buy a quart of Whitecap and apparently nature is taking care of the Sago Pondweed on it's own. The last of the Sago Pondweed is falling to the bottom of the pond smothered by filamentous algae as I type this. It's absolutely amazing. Perhaps the upper 80 degree water temps have something to do with it too?

Easy PF. Least you make all the PB sponsors/advertisers pull their business. You could just say it is expensive.

Our products work great and they sure are expensive!

I am a pond guy, and I have to use a Fluridone product. I inform the customer how expensive the product is. After I perform CPR to the cardiac arrested customer I have to add my hourly or job bid. It isn't a pleasant experience. In order to shave my expenses sometimes I look for a same result less expensive solution, whose product names won't be mentioned. I guess that is why I never went into politics, I am seldom correct. Fluridone products can be very effective eradicating hydrilla if you time it right.

WOW PF, you have a real break through here, I thought they were keeping the whole Fluridone thing a secret !!!

I believe the new amazing word would be Whitecap SC not AC, but its your show!


Mr.Ringing Endorsement

Good point Eric. Must post was tongue in cheek. Perhaps it's expensive because of the all the expensive testing that is needed to rate a product as environmentally safe.

It's expensive because they provide phone support to tell you to buy more. I'm not knocking SePro, or especially Sonar and Avast. They are excellent products. As a whole, Fluridone is the best but most expensive solution. I just responded to what someone asked what the guy should have said. It was tongue in cheek obviously.

One thing I always mention, no matter what the product and don't have to call SePro about is timing. I always say, hit those weeds when they first emerge and are at thier weakest. They are expending all that stored energy to get more stored energy. A lot of jobs I get to follow up failed results that was the key mistake. When using such an expensive active ingrediant like Fluridone, the last thing I would ever desire is retreatment.