Hey gang......old old member from back in '04........had to get a new name (old was BrianC).
Just started the construction on my new 1.5-2 acre pond. We are making great progress. We started with a clean bottom with some very large Sycamore Trees that had to be removed.
Before.... (6-24-10)
Started clearing on 6-25-10
6-28-10
Started moving dirt on 6-29-10
Started the core ditch on 7-1-10
Saving this big boy for the bottom.....
Pond layout.....
Welcome back!!
Looks like you've accomplished a lot if a few days. Do you have any concerns that the swimming area will be stagnant with it being removed so to speak from the main pond?
Welcome back!!
Looks like you've accomplished a lot if a few days. Do you have any concerns that the swimming area will be stagnant with it being removed so to speak from the main pond?
The swimby pond is for dog training.....
It's also one of the main entry points for watershed...
No, when we busted the small pond levee, I was hoping to pull the channel cats and other fish out......it was to deep. I will have to poison first, then stock. And no FHM's.......
7-8-10 update....
All is left is some fine tractor grading, seeding, and straw..........oh, and rain, lot's of rain!!
Congrats, BC1! This is an exciting time and I suspect everyone here shares your enthusiasm! Please be sure to keep us posted every step of the way so we can see how it all comes together with water and stocking. Have you shared your stocking plans elsewhere on the forum yet? If not, let us know what they are.
Great job! Glad to see it coming together for you!
Looks great! Be careful what you wish for. I said the same thing and 3 weeks later the reminants of Hurricane Ike rolled thru the area, dropping 12" of rain in a VERY short amount of time.
Thanks. I going to stock 750 bream (BG) this fall, and about 75 F1 bass in the spring. That's it. I know with the amount of loose soil and the silty clay in the bottom I will be fighting a water clarity issue. I had a few fish in the old catfish pond, and they are still in the impoundment along with whatever else was in there. I'm going to let the lake fill, wait a few weeks to see if it will clear on it's own, and if not, I'll nuke it with Alum. Without care for the existing fish (which I don't want) I can dose the pond at a pretty high rate without care for the PH. Of course, I'll monitor the ph level before stocking with bream. Thinking maybe I can kill the existing fish (not many) and clear the pond in one step.
Any thoughts on this?
Good thought on alum app.
What are goals Brain- if bigger bass put in bluegill redear and fathead minnows before fall if you get the pond right and half full or more. Also if bigger bass go higher on bream and light on bass. We are doign 2000 brm/50 lmb/acre. see the pic of the bass I just posted 1 year and 4 lbs. that is not typical- but cna see what you can do if stocked with those goals. Good Luck.
If just balanced pondn with good bream and good bass your numbers are good.
If you go that route then nuke the pond with hydrated lime first then follow with Alum about 24 hours later. That should help with the situation and leave you in a position to add some ag lime and stock. I would siphon the pond down as much as possible first.
why would I add hydrated lime before alum?? I'm not concerned with the PH, and would prefer to kill what is in there. I have read many times where folks had to do numerous applications of alum (ie: wasting money) because they did not put a strong enough dosage in the first time. Obviously, they were in fish sensitive conditions, which I am not.
The shallow water now, and the heat will probably kill what I have in there now, if I don't get some rain soon. But those dang channel cats can live in 6 inches of water...they are tough.
Stocking.......I'm using the Ms. St. EXT. service pond manual as my guide for stocking. They have recently updated this publication, and it can be found at MSUcares. Google.
I would love to get the bass in early, but everything I have read has said bream first in fall, then follow with bass in the spring. If not, then the bass will eat all the bream fry.
How can I do this differently, without blowing the budget?
Oh, and I want a balanced fun place to fish, with large bass, but not necessarily a trophy bass lake.
The hydrated lime will act as a fish killing agent.
The hydrated lime will kill the fish much better than alum , will offset the condition of the water once the alum is added and will leave the water in a condition that you can stock into. The ag lime will add buffering (alkalinity) which you most likely need given your location. All 3 together will help clear the water.
I know (they are friends) the guys who wrote the MS manual and who updated it. I have great respect for them as they are great FS and people. They are doing their job well. The material by definition is basic as it must cover without substantial risk of error the vast majority of ponds in MS . USDA and Co-Op Ext. are farm agencies and write/publish for ag/aquaculture purposes as they are charged to do. Depending on the goals and the situation the advice is to general. Even in its updated condition it is behind the cutting edge in pond mgt. For example I use it for general info but not for stocking guidelines for my pond to my goals and conditions. Also know that the basic info upon which it is based is from ponds used for food production (1930-60) as that was the charge (instructions) to the writers. It has been updated for recreation but has the same baseline. None of the private FS that I know use those guidelines as gospel. Instead they look to the pond in question and the owners goals and customize a plan to fit the circumstance. See Greg’s comments for an example.
Brian I think you missed something I said, you put the bream in this year but point was your better to get them in sept vs. waiting until the fall to stock them. They will grow some for you then next June put in bass.
If you want balance then manual is probably right if you want better growth lean toward more brm and less bass.
You do not have to do the 2000 brm/50 bass but going that direction vs. old 10-1 ratio as in manual will yeild the better bass growth you desire.
ewest well stated about purpose and direction of manual.
Just trying to help a brother out you can only do it right once.
Fairly new info from a large study in Ala strongly indicated that 3 years out 10 to 1 will not result in a balanced pond but one headed toward LMB overpopulation. These were recreational ponds with various levels of mgt. The key is the manual approach is based on harvest for food of substantial amounts of fish. Without that harvest at 10 to 1 you will get an unbalanced pond.Results of the study indicated at 15 to 1 you will likely start toward unbalanced in year 3 without mgt.
PB mag several issues back (Cutting Edge) discussed the study.
Gotcha, thanks greg.......and ewest.
So, what do you suggest? I'm leaning more towards the trophy bass thing, but not gung ho about going all the way with it.
My pond actually measured 1.2 acre per google, so I was of a bit. I only want bream and bass. I can feed, but really don't want to. I do plan on adding a bottom diffuser aeration system.
What to do?
Personally, I would prefer to feed. The alternative is sweating bullets to assure water quality is perfect and that all classes of forage are represented.
Think about this. At your pond size changes in direction are not real hard. Start with a balanced approach. You can feed the BG a little and that will help. But shoot for balance to start. If after you try that a while (year 3 or so ) you can change directions by fishing , seining and or traps. You could go either way - trophy LMB or trophy BG or stay balanced. If you like fast action and large BG you might go to trophy BG by letting the LMB overpopulate. In the mean time you can read here about what both offer. Either way you would start with FHs.
No rain..........none. Had one or two little short showers while we where building, now nothing........mud hole.
I suggest some redear to help reduce parasite potential. Hard to beat what you can get form fathead minnow production if going in before the bass. Might try to 1500 bluegill 250 redear and 60 bass based on 1.2 acres. You can never replace the loss of weight gain by overstocking bass or under stocking forage. Eay to correct too few bass just add more.
Thanks Greg, I'm leaning that direction.
Mud hole....... still no rain. It's rained around us a few times, but nothing........
So, should I nuke the existing fish now?
How much water do you have ?
Not much...
the less water you got the less rotenone (or other toxic agent) you gotta use.
Small pond we busted was 120' x 120' x 8' deep. Most of the water is still there, though it looks like about 6" or so has been lost to evaporation and lack of rain.
How much rotenone? And how is it applied?
Hey Brian, forgot to say welcome back.
BTW, how did you get that little ole stick out of the ground?
Little over a year later........water is up about 2' from the original pics.......last summers drought, plus a winter drought, plus extremely low rainfalls this summer leave me in this situation. Still haven't stocked any fish. I think we (me) under estimated watershed.......
No leaks anywhere that I can find, just loosing too much to evaporation and lack of rain. I'm sure the folks in Texas understand my situation.
Considering a well, but from what I have read, the low outputs wouldn't do much good to help fill it, but just help maintain water levels.
I'll try and get some pics up later.......
Sorry about your lack of rainfall. The good news is that when the rains finally come, your pond looks like it will hold water. Probably a silly question, but are there any flowing streams close enough to pump from?
I have a creek right next to the pond dam.......it's dryu now unless it rains. I have pumped out of it a few times with my 2" trash pump. It dumps into an even bigger creek which is very low right now as well. What is coming in right now, goes out just as fast.
Jus thinking the 2" pump would move lot more water. I moved a lot of water with a 3" pump reduced to a 2" line.
The Honda pump I have will pump 150 gpm......sounds like a lot until you do the math. It takes 3 hours of pumping to raise my water level 1". Now considering it costs about 3.65 an hour to pump, that one inch of water costs me $10.95.......plus the cost of the pump and hoses. So, if I had an unlimited water source, it would cost me $131 to raise my water level one foot. Not bad. Just don't have the water. We have had very few rain storms that have allowed me to pump. And, at most I have been able to pump has been about 2 hours before the creek level dropped.
Beating my head against the wall.
We just broke the record for days over 90 degrees set during the dust bowl years.
